Garmin Epix Pro VO2 Max vs Training Readiness

jdouglasj99

I am 58 years old, and I have not been active since hip replacement surgery a couple years ago. But I've played tennis about 4 days per week this summer, and I usually get in 10,000+ steps per day. I'm still probably 15 lbs overweight. That sounds active enough, but I used to run 6 miles every day. Those days are over.

Anyway, I got a Garmin Epix Pro and it show a terribly out-of-shape 36 as my VO2 Max number. Garmin says the fix for this is more intensive exercise for sustained periods of time. But the watch always says my training readiness is just about rock bottom and that I need to rest for 60+ hours. But even when I take a day or two off from tennis (but I still walk my dog) it still stays in the red zone.

Thoughts?

AnnPT77

Your timeline isn't obvious, so it's hard to comment. That is, how long have you been trying to improve?

Firstbeat (which IMU is behind some of Garmin's metrics) seems to think 36 would be a "good" Vo2max for a 58 y/o male.


From:https://www.firstbeat.com/en/blog/whats-a-good-vo2max-for-me-fitness-age-men-and-women/

What is Garmin saying? I don't have Epix Pro, I have a Vivoactive 4 (VA4). This is the kind of display I get in Garmin Connect - do you have this, and what verbiage is it giving you? (Context: I'm F, 67, so Garmin's expectations of me are far lower for me than for you.)



I'd also observe that IMU Garmin estimates VO2max for/from only limited types of activities. Do you know what it's basing your VO2max estimates on?

I don't get the training readiness details with the VA4 model I have, but have read about them on the Garmin site. (That doesn't give me any intuitive insight, probably just enough info to be dangerous .)

Where are you seeing that Garmin recommends more intense exercise for sustained periods of time to improve VO2max? The Garmin article I could find was this one:

https://www.garmin.com/en-US/blog/fitness/tips-for-improving-faster/

It seems to recommend more what I'd expect: That some high intensity work will sharpen VO2max once a general aerobic fitness base is in place; but it implies that if de-trained, adding the high intensity work may result in under-recovery.

Part of my timeline question is about what stage you're at. Maybe I'm too conservative, but to me, improving VO2max is more of an intermediate to advanced kind of thing. In my sport (rowing), structured (periodized) training plans usually emphasize lower intensity longer duration workouts at the start (for weeks at least), then gradually begin to add intensity with a variety of stimulus levels and durations. (Usually very high intensity work would be short, or interval-oriented, and more of a sharpening thing in the later phases of the plan before the main target race(s).)

If your readiness score is low, consistently, I'm wondering whether you have the endurance base at this point. Do you have an endurance score from your device, or insight from any of the other training metrics available to you?

I haven't played tennis in years, so I may misperceive it. It seems more bursty and possibly intense in an interval sense already. Your steps-based activity is theoretically endurance work, but maybe not enough so for your current base aerobic fitness level to advance. Had you done very little for that couple of years before this summer, maybe just whatever steps are integrated in your daily life, or was there more?

Let's be very clear: I'm not an expert. I know a bit about training for my sport, which is a short-endurance kind of thing, and for which VO2max is important . . . and that's it.

Djproulx

I'm a 65 year old who has been active in endurance sports for a number of years. My current VO2 max is 40, Cycling VO2 max is 42. When fully trained for races, my VO2 max usually hits the low 50's. This is not easy.

@AnnPT77 has provided made some good information and asked several important questions:

1. How long have you been training ?
2. Regarding the Red Zone, that suggests to me that your current activities are not allowing you to shed fatigue sufficiently. So more time is needed. (Question: What is training readiness? Simply a measure of your readiness to engage in the next workout?). Is Tennis your only activity, or are you doing other things that could cause fatigue?
3. Where is Garmin suggesting more intense training? If only as a recommendation to increase VO2 max, my question is "Why do you care?" Is it for sports performance? As a marker for longevity? Some context would help me understand your interest.

My two cents based on your post:

1. You probably need more time to build up aerobic capacity. That will help "move" you out of the red zone faster.
2. Increasing VO2 max requires high intensity work. Most endurance coaches recommend no more than 20 percent of the training load be performed as high intensity work. The reason is that this level of intensity requires sufficient recovery, especially as the athlete ages. Here is a video example of how you might add some VO2 max work to you training.

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/IhEuefiLAso

AnnPT77

Djproulx wrote: »

(snip excellent comments from a guy who knows what he's talking about, and walks the walk)

2. Regarding the Red Zone, that suggests to me that your current activities are not allowing you to shed fatigue sufficiently. So more time is needed. (Question: What is training readiness? Simply a measure of your readiness to engage in the next workout?). Is Tennis your only activity, or are you doing other things that could cause fatigue?

(more snip)
1. You probably need more time to build up aerobic capacity. That will help "move" you out of the red zone faster.

I think this is key. Doing more exercise creates resilience, i.e., the ability to do even more exercise with less recovery time (or so Garmin's editorial comments on my body battery page keep telling me ).

The on-ramp piece of this is gradual build of general aerobic capacity and aerobic endurance. Explicit efforts to increase VO2max are maybe more of a frosting on that foundation cake.

I'm sure that you (@jdouglasj99) had really good general aerobic capacity/endurance when you were running 6 miles a day. That was then, unfortunately, and this is now. There may be some rebuilding to do.

I don't know about you, but at this age/stage, I think I can still do most things (at least those where I don't have some true disability as a barrier) . . . but the build will be slower, under-recovery has a higher cost, injury happens more easily from over-reaching, and injury takes more recovery time (during which de-training happens faster). Patience and persistence matter. YMMV.