Should I keep eating?

eatyourtoast

I'm 56kg and 161cm and a bit too bony for my liking. I'm trying to build muscle which technically means that I need to gain weight.

I have tracked my diet for three months now and I know that my daily maintenance is slightly above 2400 kcal.

I recently started learning different kinds of barbell lifts and I have been very hungry since then. I could easily eat 2800 kcal a day.

Today I "caved in" and ate two cream crackers with Marmite and low-fat cheese, a carrot and a bowl of plain oatmeal.

I have never bulked before but I'm kind of doing it unintentionally right now. Is this normal when transitioning to lifting heavier weights? And most importantly, will it help me get stronger if I eat when I'm hungry?

claireychn074

The only way to know is to monitor your weight and measurements over time and then re-evaluate. Lifting weights doesn’t burn that many calories purely as a workout, but having muscles and maintaining them does take more calories.

My daily TDEE is roughly 2.200, and I tend to work on a weekly average. I also get v hungry on heavy lifting days but I find my appetite tails off on my rest days. So I might have 2,600 one day and 1800 the next.

For reference, I’m also 161cm and 57.5kg - with a fair amount of muscle. I would personally slowly bulk on 2,400 every day, but on days I just NEED to eat, I do.

eatyourtoast

Thank you for replying. It helps me a lot to have someone with similar stats to compare myself to.

2400 kcal is what I've been averaging during the past three weeks. There was a day when I ate 4000 kcal and several ones where I ate over 3000 kcal.

My hunger has been bothering me so much that I had a nightmare about being so hungry that I ate a piece of plastic and had to get X-rayed twice (nonsensical dream).

I visited the doctor because I thought it was abnormal that I was eating such large amounts of food (and also sleeping poorly). My blood work came back fine but I had once again lost weight.

Today I have eaten 2772 kcal and I've been weighing everything I eat.

claireychn074

What are you actually eating? I find that I want to eat different foodstuffs when I’m in a really heavy lifting stage. So I naturally crave protein rich foods or big bulky carbs like jacket potatoes. If I eat lower volume foods I will stay hungry.

Your snack with the oatmeal and carrots sounds higher in carbs than protein. If you’re ravenous, try swapping for a hard boiled egg, a tin of tuna and some reduced fat mayo (it’s higher in protein) and see what happens to your appetite. If you eat carbs without protein or fat, you might just be experiencing a blood sugar spike then crash. The crash feels like you’re starving.

Other foods to try are milkshakes (watch the sugar content) with a chicken leg or handful of nuts.

You might still consume a lot of calories, but you might find that changing what you eat helps with the hunger. I try and have a protein shake straight after training as that helps with the hunger.

eatyourtoast

I follow a high-protein lacto-ovo vegetarian diet. The snack I gave as an example was rather atypical (so maybe not the best). I wanted to highlight the fact that I'm genuinely hungry (instead of eating my emotions).

I do get enough protein (over 120g a day) but I often consume huge amounts of fiber with the protein (40-60g a day). I have read that too much fiber can cause issues with absorption of certain nutrients but I don't know how it affects overall energy uptake.

I'm aware that I eat quite a lot of white sugar but I don't know what to replace it with since healthy carbs usually contain fiber also.

claireychn074

Okay, so I think you just need to monitor weight and measurements for 4-6 weeks and see what happens. The white sugar could be causing a sugar rush then crash but it might not - you might just be an outlier who needs those extra calories.

If after a month or so you’ve put weight on, then you can calculate your actual TDEE and work from that. I don’t know about fibre affecting nutrient absorption but usually people find fibre filling, and it’s v good for gut health. So keep going on that.

You might also find this is a blip and your appetite adjusts over time. Ultimately it will be about finding foods which are filling, meet your nutritional requirements and fuel your workouts. To be honest that is the holy grail and I don’t get it right even after 7+ years of tracking!

eatyourtoast

Seven years is a long time to have tracked calories. I hope I can stick to it for at least a year.

Anyways, thank you for taking your time to reply. I'm going to take my measurements and see where I'm at after a month.

For now I'll just honor my hunger. I think it's better for me than accidentally underfueling and not recovering.

sollyn23l2

eatyourtoast wrote: »

Thank you for replying. It helps me a lot to have someone with similar stats to compare myself to.

2400 kcal is what I've been averaging during the past three weeks. There was a day when I ate 4000 kcal and several ones where I ate over 3000 kcal.

My hunger has been bothering me so much that I had a nightmare about being so hungry that I ate a piece of plastic and had to get X-rayed twice (nonsensical dream).

I visited the doctor because I thought it was abnormal that I was eating such large amounts of food (and also sleeping poorly). My blood work came back fine but I had once again lost weight.

Today I have eaten 2772 kcal and I've been weighing everything I eat.

To be honest, if you're losing weight without wanting to, that's something you should look into with your doctor. Do they know you're continuing to lose weight even though you're not trying to? Most doctors would be quite worried about that.

eatyourtoast

To be honest, if you're losing weight without wanting to, that's something you should look into with your doctor. Do they know you're continuing to lose weight even though you're not trying to? Most doctors would be quite worried about that.

Yes, my doctor knows. I told her how many hours I was working, how much I was exercising and eating. She seemed to think it was a normal amount of food.

But she's a general practitioner (not a sports nutritionist). That's why I turned to MFP where there are other fitness enthusiasts.

eatyourtoast

Update:

I lost 0,1kg in a month while eating an average of 2492kcal a day. All my body measurements have stayed the same except my shoulders which have grown 4cm in circumference. I can now do 5 pull-ups in a row (up from 3).

What's my TDEE based on this?

AnnPT77

If you've lost tenth of a kg in 30 days, that implies a cumulative calorie deficit of around 770 calories, or about 26 calories per day. Honestly, that's so far within the expected errors of estimation that it seems silly to base a TDEE estimate on it (false precision), but theoretically it would be 2492 + 26 = 2518.

If I were you, and wanting to maintain, I'd just stay around that same routine you've been on. If you do want to gain weight, and want it to be mostly muscle, maybe add 250-ish calories per day and see how that goes. That would be expected to add maybe a kg per month.

BTW, as your doctor says, I don't think that's a crazy-high calorie intake to be an active woman's TDEE. It's higher than the average woman, probably, but not extreme IMO.

You mentioned hunger as an issue for you. Still a problem, or has going up to 2492 improved the situation?

If it's still an issue, I'd be interested to know whether your protein and fiber intake is from foods, or supplements, or a mix (of what proportions). The nature of what a person eats can affect satiety, too, of course. If you eat a lot of sugar, that's not necessarily a big deal nutritionally in the context of adequate overall nutrition in other ways, but could cause some blood sugar volatility that might affect appetite. If so, increasing calories from fats and reducing sugar could be something to try. Maybe more nuts, nut butter, seeds?

I did have some issues with hunger around lifting, but timing some snacks around the workouts helped in my case . . . usually a small amount of quick carbs before, and some protein/fiber after, not a lot of total calories. Truth in advertising, though: I'm not a serious lifter.

(I'm also ovo-lacto veg, FWIW, and not dramatically different from you in height/weight at 165 cm and 61kg . . . feeling more slightly pudgy than slightly bony at that weight, though, personally, but that's a matter of body composition, not just height/weight. I'd expect you have more muscle mass than I do. I maintain somewhere around 2200, but I'm lots older than you, I'd bet (68). Your own experience data is much more reliable gauge of calorie needs than anyone else's experience.)

eatyourtoast

Hi, AnnPT. No, the hunger went away as I started eating more on a regular basis.

I was trying to eat around 2200kcal when I started to feel hungry. I had recently upped my calories because I was feeling run down and not getting stronger. It's as if eating more stimulated my appetite(?).

It always makes me happy when I see other vegetarians on here. I used to be vegan in the past but my diet wasn't healthy. The LOV diet is optimal for me (although I still wish I could be vegan).

I'm 27 right now but I don't think my age affects my metabolism that much. The biggest energy thief is probably my current job. I had my BMR estimated by my employer for about half a year ago. I think it was somewhere between 1300-1400kcal (so not exceptionally high).

Lietchi

eatyourtoast wrote: »

I had my BMR estimated by my employer for about half a year ago. I think it was somewhere between 1300-1400kcal (so not exceptionally high).

Out of curiosity: estimated how? Depending on method it could be fairly accurate or not at all.

eatyourtoast

It was one of those body composition measurement devices (InBody). I'm aware that they're not super accurate but it's probably closer to reality than not (I was a bit heavier back then).

Lietchi

The InBody scan is not necessarily accurate, indeed. And I think that BMR estimate is just based on your weight and estimated muscle mass (which isn't necessarily a an accurate way to estimate your BMR either).
You could still have a higher than average BMR
But anyway, it's not really important - the best source of info is what you already have: your weight trend and your actual food intake

AnnPT77

eatyourtoast wrote: »

Hi, AnnPT. No, the hunger went away as I started eating more on a regular basis.

That's great news!

I was trying to eat around 2200kcal when I started to feel hungry. I had recently upped my calories because I was feeling run down and not getting stronger.

Very sensible choice based on the situation.

It's as if eating more stimulated my appetite(?).

Very possible. It's also possible that eating more stimulated more spontaneous movement or other factors that increased calories expended, and that stimulated appetite. Bodies are for sure dynamic, in that calorie intake affects calorie expenditure, and the results can be surprising sometimes. Bodies are weird.

It always makes me happy when I see other vegetarians on here.

Have you joined https://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/group/145477-herbivores-of-mfp ? It's only lightly active, but there are various categories of plant-centric eaters welcome there, including those in our category.

I used to be vegan in the past but my diet wasn't healthy. The LOV diet is optimal for me (although I still wish I could be vegan).

I'm 27 right now but I don't think my age affects my metabolism that much. The biggest energy thief is probably my current job. I had my BMR estimated by my employer for about half a year ago. I think it was somewhere between 1300-1400kcal (so not exceptionally high).

I think body composition (muscle vs. fat) makes more difference than age. The so-called BMR "calculator" formulas that use body fat percent seem to ignore age. (See, for example, some of the formulas at https://www.sailrabbit.com/bmr/.) Of course the InBody made an estimate of body composition when estimating your BMR, too . . . but I don't know how it uses that in its algorithms.

It sounds like you're on a good course now. Best wishes!