Exercise, mental health & diet

Jackedeakin

Hi all,

A bit of background, I've suffered for years with my mental health and just came off Sertraline. I don't regret antidepressants, but they stunted me from being able to exercise & also made me hungry all the time.

Now I'm off them, I've got back into exercise a bit (strength, cardio & yoga for flexibility), and I'm calorie counting a bit more (always been fairly balanced but do also indulge in things I like and still eat those things but perhaps a bit less now)

I used to be able to run 10k a few years ago, was so on top of things, I could eat 3-4 thousand calories and still be in a deficit. I'm not currently able to exercise so intensley so my calorie deficits aren't amazingly high, sometimes less than 100, sometimes 500 (which is fine), sometimes I go over a bit. I use exercise calories too, as long as I have a 500 deficit, that's my aim (not always achieved) if I'm too extreme, in my head I'll over eat.

Is it worth me just focusing on building up my cardio capacity so that I can torch more calories in shorter amounts of time (running, elliptical, maybe swimming and sometimes aerobics), rather than trying to focus too much on the calorie deficit side? I want to lose 3-4 stone (I weigh 15), but think considering my previous fitness capabilities, I feel I'll be able to do it all a bit more efficiently, but am I just being weak and wasting my time? Obviously I'm not as fit as I used to be, and whilst I want to lose weight, I also just want to be fitter & stronger.

PAV8888

Not knowing your age and seeing your weight (which I am converting to 210lbs) I would say that 10K runs would put a good amount of stress on your body.

Not a bad goal by any stretch of the imagination but you also have to consider that you are sort of failing the moderation test. i.e. seeking to be running 10Ks on a "frequent" basis is not exactly a moderate level of exercise. this doesn't make it bad. But it doesn't make it a great play either.

So... for what it's worth.

Increase exercise yes. BUT: Specifically consider exercise as your weight loss method? Especially settings up goals such as torch Calories and torch faster and burn through to create deficit? NO.

You are not teaching yourself long term skills. You are playing with (slightly) diminishing returns because as your fitness improves the same exercise will usually be easier to do and probably burn a little bit less though you will also be able to do more. And you are playing right into the injury/sickness/life interruption regain dialogue.

So consider what a normal weight active person with your stats will burn.

normal weight. Arbitrarily let's say bmi 24ish if you're a guy. Maybe a bit lower if you're a gal. Some other level within normal weight if you've already got ideas as to where you would like to end up at.

Active. Because it is a balance. You can't count on always being able to drop life and head for the mountains. So even if you end up being very active or more long term, for the purpose of this experiment let's concentrate on just active. That's a person walking about 10K steps in a day. So about a couple of hours of moving around purposefully in a day.

Figure out those calories. They won't be 4K. They probably won't be 3K. Learning to eat 3K or 4K and depending on activity to pull you through is something that COULD work... but it will only do so till the first or second injury, sickness or life event.

You will probably discover a figure in the 2000 to 2500/2600 range for most people (primarily gender driven)

Do try and see what life would look like with that sort of calories.
You will lose weight quite rapidly in the beginning by eating that.
And it will be good long term training to have multiple ideas on how you could live on that.

You can adjust down the road. Either the activity or the calories. But do yourself a favor and don't make this a one trick, exercise only, pony.

You need the whole tool-set at your disposal to manage to maintain down the road.

PAV8888

One exception to my previous.

If your past drug regiment increased appetite and you've now discontinued the drugs because your doctor and you have concluded that you no longer need them, your appetite may be expected to return to normal vs the previously increased state.

I am NOT a great believer of huge deficits because they sometimes do come with baggage.

If you want to start off this "getting healthy kick" by just eating to your new diminished natural appetite while increasing exercise to reasonably sane levels (like get a training guide or coach and figure out how many rest days you need between your 10K runs) or what have you, especially while you remain in the obese category where I am making the assumption you currently are--if you're very tall this may be an incorrect assumption.

Anyway. If you want to start by eating to new reduced appetite and training more... there is nothing wrong with that and it is probably one of the least side-effect inducing methods to lose *some* weight.

I don't know if it would be enough to help you lose 42lbs. but it may be enough to get you to a good start on your way there. And when/if the downward movement stops for a month or two you can reconsider at that point of time what else to do and how to proceed further.

tomcustombuilder

Your doctor and not random internet jockies would be a beter source of info.

AnnPT77

Jackedeakin wrote: »

Hi all,

A bit of background, I've suffered for years with my mental health and just came off Sertraline. I don't regret antidepressants, but they stunted me from being able to exercise & also made me hungry all the time.

Now I'm off them, I've got back into exercise a bit (strength, cardio & yoga for flexibility), and I'm calorie counting a bit more (always been fairly balanced but do also indulge in things I like and still eat those things but perhaps a bit less now)

I used to be able to run 10k a few years ago, was so on top of things, I could eat 3-4 thousand calories and still be in a deficit. I'm not currently able to exercise so intensley so my calorie deficits aren't amazingly high, sometimes less than 100, sometimes 500 (which is fine), sometimes I go over a bit. I use exercise calories too, as long as I have a 500 deficit, that's my aim (not always achieved) if I'm too extreme, in my head I'll over eat.

Is it worth me just focusing on building up my cardio capacity so that I can torch more calories in shorter amounts of time (running, elliptical, maybe swimming and sometimes aerobics), rather than trying to focus too much on the calorie deficit side? I want to lose 3-4 stone (I weigh 15), but think considering my previous fitness capabilities, I feel I'll be able to do it all a bit more efficiently, but am I just being weak and wasting my time? Obviously I'm not as fit as I used to be, and whilst I want to lose weight, I also just want to be fitter & stronger.

Here's my bias: I think the golden goal is long-term sustainable habits that help us get to a healthy weight, then help us stay there long term, ideally permanently.

Nowhere do you say you find cardiovascular (CV) exercise fun, mood enhancing, beneficial to happiness and well-being, generally life enhancing. Maybe you do, dunno.

Ideally everyone does enough CV exercise to be generally healthy - that 150 minutes per week of moderate activity, 75 minutes of more intense activity, or a proportionate combination, preferably spread over at least 5 days. (Some people don't want to, and won't. Their call.)

But beyond that, IMO, doing more ought to be out of happiness, not just about obligatory calorie burn.

On the question of action on the exercise side vs. the eating side, I think the efficient choice is going to be eating, always.

I've been very active for over 20 years, and my CV exercise capacity is pretty good. (I think it's absurd, but just as a metric, my Garmin says my VO2max is superior (top 5%) for my demographic, and claims my fitness age is 25. In reality, I'm 68. The "25" is crazy. But maybe that gives you a clue that I can work out reasonably hard without getting overly fatigued. (Overly fatigued is a bad plan for various reasons.))

So, in a moderately intense workout - one for which Garmin would claim most of the effort counts in the "75 minutes of more intense exercise" bucket - I might burn 400ish calories in an hour on a watts-estimated basis, which is pretty sound arithmetic.

I can eat 400ish calories in less than 5 minutes, I'd bet, and be happy doing it. To me, that makes managing eating (always in context of current activity level) the focus when it comes to weight loss.

My advice: Compartmentalize your fitness and weight loss goals.

Decide on your best, most enjoyable, challenging but not super-fatiguing plan to improve your fitness. Make realistic calorie estimates of that exercise.

Set a reasonable, moderate weight loss rate target, like 0.5% of your current weight per week, since you have fitness goals. (Very fast loss tends to torpedo fitness goals.)

You say you weigh 15 stone. That would be (for other USA-ians like me) 210 pounds, or (for people with sensible measurement systems) around 95.5 kilos. You want to lose 3-4 stone (42-56 pounds, 19-25.5 kilos). Given that, a loss rate compatible with a strong fitness program (that you'd want to fuel adequately) would be around a pound (or half a kilo) per week.

That would imply a calorie deficit of around 500ish calories daily. That's where you're currently aiming. I endorse that.

You can use TDEE method (estimate maintenance calories, average in exercise plans to get a fixed daily calorie goal), or MFP method (estimate maintenance calories excluding intentional exercise and log exercise when you do some). Do whichever suits you best. Subtract 500ish calories for the deficit to lose at the estimated 1lb/half kilo rate, and test drive that for a month or so. Then adjust based on results to hit the loss rate. (Calculators are averages. Experiential data reflects you as an individual human being, so it's a better estimate.)

While you're at it, strive to get decent nutrition on average, since that's the best support for fitness AND health.

Don't run your total life completely for weight loss. Balance your weight loss and fitness goals. (Me, I'd throw health in there, too - but that's your call.)

Obviously, this is all just the opinions of one random idiot on the internet, me.

P.S. To the bolded: The "calorie deficit side" isn't just what you eat. It's the balance between how much you move (daily life stuff plus exercise) and how much you eat. There isn't a "deficit side", if you ask me. There's maybe a calorie expenditure side, and a calorie intake side.

P.P.S. FWIW, I lost about what you're now shooting to lose, in my case roughly 50 pounds, and have stayed in that weight range for going on 8 years since. That's after being overweight/obese for around 30 years prior to loss. The benefits have been huge. I want that for you, too, sincerely.

elisa123gal

Maybe change your focus from how fit you used to be, and start where you are right now. Get that old standard and expectation out of your head. I say this, because I do the same thing. I keep comparing myself now to where I was before COVID..and how fit and strong I was then... and I'm not now. It sets me back focusing on what is no longer.
The best thing do to is to move forward today. So, eat healthy good foods below your calorie limit.. and exercise slowly and build up. Take your time and move forward. If not, you could continue to fall short or your ideal old self and you'll be frustrated.

Jackedeakin

tomcustombuilder wrote: »

Your doctor and not random internet jockies would be a beter source of info.

This is about lifestyle as opposed to anything particularly medical. I'm more than capable of using information sensibly & talk to my GP on a regular basis about most things.

Thanks everyone else for your replies.

Blueto88

Keep it simple. Don't worry about deficits and other indexes.

When I decided to lose my gut I simply focused on carb counting, nothing else. I got my carbs down, my exercise up, nothing drastic, but once or twice a day, including just walking. Over a few months I lost all my 'extra' weight without ever looking at a scale.

Now my carb intake is about back to about 80% of where it was without feeling like I'm missing out, and no weight has returned.

mtaratoot

Blueto88 wrote: »

Keep it simple. Don't worry about deficits and other indexes.

When I decided to lose my gut I simply focused on carb counting, nothing else. I got my carbs down, my exercise up, nothing drastic, but once or twice a day, including just walking. Over a few months I lost all my 'extra' weight without ever looking at a scale.

Now my carb intake is about back to about 80% of where it was without feeling like I'm missing out, and no weight has returned.

Keep it simple. Focus on calories. Don't worry about carbs unless they make you have cravings or have a medical need to reduce carbs or you eat far too many calories from carbs.