Do "sugarphobes" also avoid drinking any alcohol?

ldrosophila

so if i understand this correctly, if you eat sugar, it's bad.

if yeast pre-eats your sugars and poops out ethanol, it's good.

so eating (drinking) yeast poop (aka ethanol) is good.

it's more like yeast wee than yeast poo. Poo is just undigested food that's left the body, (i.e. egestion), whereas wee contains the waste products of metabolic processes in the body (excretion). So ethanol is yeast wee.

so drinking from a bottle of booze is like having a colony of yeast wizzing in your mouth! :drinker:

the Gods truly gifted us with golden showers

VeganLexi

I like wine.

TheSlorax

Most of the people I know that actively seek out gluten free alcohols do so because they can't tolerate the gluten even in alcohols. The rest, well, it depends on what they're getting. Things like wine and sherry are often used for cooking, where being organic may make a difference in the resulting flavor profile.

I thought that about the gluten as well, but we've had to bring in more and more gluten free products lately and many of the buyers comment that they are buying it because it is 'healthier' and say they have no intolerances. Several have stated their belief that gluten free means the same thing as having no preservatives like MSG. :huh: A lot of people don't bother to educate themselves and just blindly purchase whatever is currently trending as healthy. We sell a crapload of the Skinnygirl products too, because they are low calorie. Few people notice that to be low calorie, they also have to be low alcohol.

skinnygirl is a ****ing abomination. I can make a better tasting margarita with tequila, lime juice, and simple (or agave) syrup for around the same calories as that bs. well, relative to the alcohol content I can make a better tasting one for LESS calories compared to what I would have to drink of skinnygirl to get the same amount of buzzed.

BrainyBurro

Why do you care what other people eat or drink?

why do you care why i care about what other people eat or drink?

JUDDDing

IN for experiments ingesting pure sodium...

Boom! :drinker:

Video or it didn't happen.

Sabine_Stroehm

Why do you care what other people eat or drink?

why do you care why i care about what other people eat or drink?

I don't, burro. just in to watch more badgering and mocking, or "educating" as it's called here.
:drinker:

susieoj

"Why do you care what other people eat or drink?"
^^ yes

Also, I don't think those who try to minimize their sugar intake are actually experiencing a phobia of the substance
sugar is amazingly delicious, but does anyone out there really think that consuming large quantities of refined sugar on a daily basis is beneficial for your health? Seems like another basic example of everything in moderation.
As for alcohol, I do also limit my consumption of alcohol. Going back to the whole calories in versus calories out mantra that pops up daily on MFP, most days I'd rather eat more than have a mixed drink but it's all personal preference.

BrainyBurro

"Why do you care what other people eat or drink?"
^^ yes

Also, I don't think those who try to minimize their sugar intake are actually experiencing a phobia of the substance
sugar is amazingly delicious, but does anyone out there really think that consuming large quantities of refined sugar on a daily basis is beneficial for your health? Seems like another basic example of everything in moderation.
As for alcohol, I do also limit my consumption of alcohol. Going back to the whole calories in versus calories out mantra that pops up daily on MFP, most days I'd rather eat more than have a mixed drink but it's all personal preference.

let's say my TDEE for the day is 4000 calories.

if i meet my protein goals (145g) and fat goals (55g), that leaves me with 2925 calories.

if i ate all 2925 of those calories as refined sugar (731g of sugar carbs), it would not bother me in the least. i wouldn't lose weight that day, but i wouldn't gain. my macros would be met. i'd feel fine. in fact, i'd have lots of ready energy to fuel my day.

i like sugar. it makes me happy. :happy:

Quieau

so Ben & Jerry's does not have calcium and protein? do the oatmeal raisin cookies from Subway not have fiber? you have not chosen "wisely", you have chosen based on the way you label foods as good and bad or healthy and unhealthy. there's a difference.

I consider B&J's "clean ice cream," although I prefer Haagen Dasz. I did *SAY* that I eat ice cream, so not sure why that's a point of contention? I don't think ice cream is inherently bad, but I avoid those with a lot of added ingredients that don't make sense nutritionally. If it's sugar, cream, etc. then I personally consider that "clean" although I know some will differ with me on that. Likewise, my home baked goods are "clean" in that the ingredients are all or mostly organic and there's nothing in there that I would deem "junk" or synthetic "faux food." I will not eat ANYTHING from Subway, because while the food may contain some nutritional ingredients, it also loaded with sodium, MSG and other stuff I want and need to avoid completely. There's no need to eat crap when cleaner, healthier, and more nutritionally dense versions of cookies and ice cream exist. I like to control the ingredients on something like that which I would consider a "borderline food." I find that when I eat higher quality sugar, it's more satisfying and I have no trouble stopping but eating stuff like Subway just leads to feeling malnourished and wanting more. That's due to both the absence of good nutrition and the presence of things like MSG and salt. Yick. If you like those things, more power to you, esp if you can lose weight and be healthy with that in your body. For now, anyways. Aging sucks.

It's personal choices, like I said. Others may prefer to get loaded on alcohol with their calories, I prefer to stick to things are more nutritionally dense and offer more "bang for the buck" in terms of overall health. I'm not a teetotaler on sugar, either. I just like the cleaner grade. Same with soda vs. water. Why swim upstream when I don't have to? The older one gets, the more these things matter. Livers and kidneys are very important to looking hot on the beach, just in a less direct way. :drinker:

TheSlorax

before I address anything you just posted, could you please tell me what your criteria for "clean" ice cream is? which brand or type of ice cream is "unclean"? thanks in advance for clarification.

jayrudq

I don't eat sugar. So I have enough calories for wine. Nothing inconsistent about that.

jonnythan

I don't eat sugar. So I have enough calories for wine. Nothing inconsistent about that.

I have some news for you about that wine......

hookilau

I don't eat sugar. So I have enough calories for wine. Nothing inconsistent about that.

Me too :drinker:

TheSlorax

so Ben & Jerry's does not have calcium and protein? do the oatmeal raisin cookies from Subway not have fiber? you have not chosen "wisely", you have chosen based on the way you label foods as good and bad or healthy and unhealthy. there's a difference.

I consider B&J's "clean ice cream," although I prefer Haagen Dasz. I did *SAY* that I eat ice cream, so not sure why that's a point of contention? I don't think ice cream is inherently bad, but I avoid those with a lot of added ingredients that don't make sense nutritionally. If it's sugar, cream, etc. then I personally consider that "clean" although I know some will differ with me on that. Likewise, my home baked goods are "clean" in that the ingredients are all or mostly organic and there's nothing in there that I would deem "junk" or synthetic "faux food." I will not eat ANYTHING from Subway, because while the food may contain some nutritional ingredients, it also loaded with sodium, MSG and other stuff I want and need to avoid completely. There's no need to eat crap when cleaner, healthier, and more nutritionally dense versions of cookies and ice cream exist. I like to control the ingredients on something like that which I would consider a "borderline food." I find that when I eat higher quality sugar, it's more satisfying and I have no trouble stopping but eating stuff like Subway just leads to feeling malnourished and wanting more. That's due to both the absence of good nutrition and the presence of things like MSG and salt. Yick. If you like those things, more power to you, esp if you can lose weight and be healthy with that in your body. For now, anyways. Aging sucks.

It's personal choices, like I said. Others may prefer to get loaded on alcohol with their calories, I prefer to stick to things are more nutritionally dense and offer more "bang for the buck" in terms of overall health. I'm not a teetotaler on sugar, either. I just like the cleaner grade. Same with soda vs. water. Why swim upstream when I don't have to? The older one gets, the more these things matter. Livers and kidneys are very important to looking hot on the beach, just in a less direct way. :drinker:

I looked up the nutrition facts for these Subway cookies you dislike so much.

Enriched flour, thiamine monotrate (vitamin B1), Riboflavin (Vitamin B2), folic acid (vitamin aB), sugar, raisins, palm oil, oats, eggs, water, molasses, salt, whey, baking soda, and cinnamon.

I do not see MSG listed as an ingredient, however I may go get a Subway cookie later to verify these ingredients. You know, for science. :smokin: Additionally, the sodium content is 170mg. I would be hard very pressed to say that they are "loaded with sodium".

I picked Subway cookies in my example because they are not high in sodium or even very different nutritionally from other cookies, even home baked. However, because of your feelings toward Subway food, you automatically dismissed the Subway cookie as not being "nutritionally dense" because you do not consider it "clean". In reality the Subway cookie is hardly different from what you bake at home (ok, your flour is probably whole wheat and the raisins/oil/oats/eggs are all organic, so certainly let me know how this all changes the nutrition of your cookies), but again, your personal bias has lead you to believe that it is "unhealthy" and a "bad" food choice. See how that works?

I am still not sure why Ben & Jerry's makes the cut as a "clean" ice cream vs. whatever is "unclean". I will say this is the first time I have heard B&J's described as "clean", though.

SnicciFit

Speaking of sugar, alcohol and health...


http://www.mindbodygreen.com/0-11253/why-you-probably-dont-need-a-flu-shot.html


3. Reduce alcohol and sugar consumption.

Even moderate alcohol consumption suppresses the central nervous system, and therefore your immune system. Consuming too much sugar can suppress the immune system and make it more difficult for your body to fight off infections like the flu.

**disclaimer**

I don't care who gets the flu shot and who doesn't. I'm more interested in the ways to prevent illness (and increase immunity) overall without depending on the vaccine (it may not always be available and the effectiveness is questionable).

jonnythan

Speaking of sugar, alcohol and health...


http://www.mindbodygreen.com/0-11253/why-you-probably-dont-need-a-flu-shot.html


3. Reduce alcohol and sugar consumption.

Even moderate alcohol consumption suppresses the central nervous system, and therefore your immune system. Consuming too much sugar can suppress the immune system and make it more difficult for your body to fight off infections like the flu.

**disclaimer**

I don't care who gets the flu shot and who doesn't. I'm more interested in the ways to prevent illness (and increase immunity) overall without depending on the vaccine (it may not always be available and the effectiveness is questionable).

Just because it's on a blog doesn't mean it's true, even if the writer is an MD.

Quieau

I looked up the nutrition facts for these Subway cookies you dislike so much.

Enriched flour, thiamine monotrate (vitamin B1), Riboflavin (Vitamin B2), folic acid (vitamin aB), sugar, raisins, palm oil, oats, eggs, water, molasses, salt, whey, baking soda, and cinnamon.

Palm oil. And "enriched" flour.

I do not see MSG listed as an ingredient, however I may go get a Subway cookie later to verify these ingredients. You know, for science. :smokin: Additionally, the sodium content is 170mg. I would be hard very pressed to say that they are "loaded with sodium".

That's too much for a cookie, for MY plan. Perhaps your plan is more generous in that way. Sodium is not an added nutrient for me, but an added detriment. To each his own.

I picked Subway cookies in my example because they are not high in sodium or even very different nutritionally from other cookies, even home baked.

I add nutrition to my homebaked cookies. For instance, nuts, dried fruits, added protein powder, added fiber. While there may be nothing wrong with the Subway cookie for you, it doesn't provide enough nutrition to me to be worth eating a tasteless, mass-produced wafer that tastes like cardboard and has a lot of calories I don't need. Again, to each his own.

However, because of your feelings toward Subway food, you automatically dismissed the Subway cookie as not being "nutritionally dense" because you do not consider it "clean". In reality the Subway cookie is hardly different from what you bake at home (ok, your flour is probably whole wheat and the raisins/oil/oats/eggs are all organic, so certainly let me know how this all changes the nutrition of your cookies), but again, your personal bias has lead you to believe that it is "unhealthy" and a "bad" food choice. See how that works?

See above. Yes, whole wheat flour, organic, etc. when I bake at home. Not often lately, but still on the plan sometimes.

I am still not sure why Ben & Jerry's makes the cut as a "clean" ice cream vs. whatever is "unclean". I will say this is the first time I have heard B&J's described as "clean", though.

Because my definition of clean is more generous than some of the most hardcore, simply because I recognize that sugar is not inherently evil. I would think that you would AGREE with that aspect of my position. To me, "clean" food choices are defined just as much by what's NOT in it as by what IS in it. It could have spinach and onions and brussel sprouts in it, but if it's full of MSG and sodium, it's not clean to ME. I tend to be more generous and allow things like more natural forms of sugar (preferring unprocessed honey), fatty meats like bacon and even white flour, as I am willing to make concessions depending on volume and nutritional context). Not sure what else B&J's uses besides real cream and sugar, but I'm pretty sure they go for the highest quality ingredients with the least fake stuff like guar gum and carageenan.

The conversation started with whether those who are "sugarphobes" are also teetotalers. Although I don't think of myself as a sugarphobe (as I obviously still partake), I'm pretty sure most of the forum gestapo consider me one. So my response was based on assuming that I am considered more phobic than not, and that yes, some of us consider alcohol to be a total waste of an otherwise fine sugar calorie. Now, in a blood Mary in a tall glass of vegetables? I can justify that. On occasion. :drinker:

SnicciFit

Speaking of sugar, alcohol and health...


http://www.mindbodygreen.com/0-11253/why-you-probably-dont-need-a-flu-shot.html


3. Reduce alcohol and sugar consumption.

Even moderate alcohol consumption suppresses the central nervous system, and therefore your immune system. Consuming too much sugar can suppress the immune system and make it more difficult for your body to fight off infections like the flu.

**disclaimer**

I don't care who gets the flu shot and who doesn't. I'm more interested in the ways to prevent illness (and increase immunity) overall without depending on the vaccine (it may not always be available and the effectiveness is questionable).

Just because it's on a blog doesn't mean it's true, even if the writer is an MD.

It's just a topic of discussion. It's meant to be thought-provoking. As in, can I do more to prevent illness than just get vaccinated? Is there perhaps a better option for ME to prevent illness than the vaccination?

TheSlorax

Enriched flour is white flour. Palm oil is, uhh, oil, and I'm fairly certain most cookies have that. Both are not inherently evil.

Anyway, adding protein powder to cookies aside (personally, uhh, no thank you), I do not see where the huge differences, from a macro AND micronutrient standpoint, from your cookies and the Subway cookies lie. Yes you use "organic" products, but I'm sure you know that the label "organic" does not make the calorie or macronutrient counts better than food that is not organic. Right? As for whole wheat flour, the nutritional benefits to using that over white flour may not be as high as you may think, but I digress. By adding dried fruits and nuts you are actually raising the caloric value of your home baked cookies at the expense of adding more "nutrition". I'm not sure if that is your goal or not. It's hard to tell. Also... what health concerns do you have that make 170mg of sodium too high? Just out of curiosity.

I am still really confused as to why B&J's is ok. You say you are "pretty sure" they use the highest quality ingredients except that the Cherry Garcia flavor actually DOES have guar gum and carageenan listed as ingredients. http://www.benjerry.com/flavors/our-flavors#product_id=608 I checked a few others and they all have those two ingredients in common.

I don't consider you a "sugarphobe", because you obviously can't be that if you eat even "clean" cookies, ice cream, and raw honey, but I can say I am completely baffled by your stance on food and what is "healthy" and "unhealthy". To each his own though...

jayrudq

I don't eat sugar. So I have enough calories for wine. Nothing inconsistent about that.

I have some news for you about that wine......

No, not really. I choose what goes in my mouth. Cookies vs Wine. Wine wins, every time. There is nothing inconsistent about that in my mind.

Quieau

before I address anything you just posted, could you please tell me what your criteria for "clean" ice cream is? which brand or type of ice cream is "unclean"? thanks in advance for clarification.

To me, "clean ice cream" is that which is made with natural, preferably organic, whole ingredients that are minimally processed. Milk, cream, sugar, cocoa, etc. Once they start adding things like "guar gum" and "carageenan" (yes, seaweed but it doesn't belong in my ice cream), then it falls to "unclean" status in MY playbook. To you, it may be different. Because I don't demonize things like natural fats and sugars, they can still be clean as long as they are relatively pure (no additives for shelf life/profitability beyond the basic ingredients), minimally processed and in reasonable quantities. (EDIT: Example, organic vanilla ice cream with a little maple syrup and some chopped walnuts is clean eating to me. Snickers or oreos crushed into ice-milk made with a bunch of crappy ingredients is not clean eating to me, and not worth the calorie expenditure due to low quality of both taste and nutrition. Hope that helps.)

Purists may disagree and your mileage may vary.

MinMin97

I wonder if people who avoid eating pure sodium and pure chlorine also avoid eating sodium chloride.

Excellent question.

TheSlorax

before I address anything you just posted, could you please tell me what your criteria for "clean" ice cream is? which brand or type of ice cream is "unclean"? thanks in advance for clarification.

To me, "clean ice cream" is that which is made with natural, preferably organic, whole ingredients that are minimally processed. Milk, cream, sugar, cocoa, etc. Once they start adding things like "guar gum" and "carageenan" (yes, seaweed but it doesn't belong in my ice cream), then it falls to "unclean" status in MY playbook. To you, it may be different. Because I don't demonize things like natural fats and sugars, they can still be clean as long as they are relatively pure (no additives for shelf life/profitability beyond the basic ingredients), minimally processed and in reasonable quantities. (EDIT: Example, organic vanilla ice cream with a little maple syrup and some chopped walnuts is clean eating to me. Snickers or oreos crushed into ice-milk made with a bunch of crappy ingredients is not clean eating to me, and not worth the calorie expenditure due to low quality of both taste and nutrition. Hope that helps.)

Purists may disagree and your mileage may vary.

See above. Ben & Jerry's completely fails YOUR definition of clean eating.

QuietBloom

I wonder if people who avoid eating pure sodium and pure chlorine also avoid eating sodium chloride.

*snort*

jonnythan

I consider B&J's "clean ice cream,"

To me, "clean ice cream" is that which is made with natural, preferably organic, whole ingredients that are minimally processed. Milk, cream, sugar, cocoa, etc. Once they start adding things like "guar gum" and "carageenan" (yes, seaweed but it doesn't belong in my ice cream), then it falls to "unclean" status in MY playbook.

FYI, guar gum and carageenan are both in most flavors of Ben & Jerry's, including vanilla.

You're moving from statements that make sense to total nonsense. You're starting to imply that a few small amounts of some perfectly safe ingredients can significantly change the nutritive value of a food. Adding a little bit of guar gum to something doesn't suddenly make it unhealthy.

MuscleAndMascara

All I can say to this is... Octoberfest in AZ this weekend!! Woohoo!!

I will however be going to the gym in the am before i go.. just to make myself feel better haha!

QuietBloom

Sodium is not an added nutrient for me, but an added detriment. To each his own.

What?! Sodium is a critical electrolyte! We die quite rapidly if levels dip too low.

QuietBloom

before I address anything you just posted, could you please tell me what your criteria for "clean" ice cream is? which brand or type of ice cream is "unclean"? thanks in advance for clarification.

To me, "clean ice cream" is that which is made with natural, preferably organic, whole ingredients that are minimally processed. Milk, cream, sugar, cocoa, etc. Once they start adding things like "guar gum" and "carageenan" (yes, seaweed but it doesn't belong in my ice cream), then it falls to "unclean" status in MY playbook. To you, it may be different. Because I don't demonize things like natural fats and sugars, they can still be clean as long as they are relatively pure (no additives for shelf life/profitability beyond the basic ingredients), minimally processed and in reasonable quantities. (EDIT: Example, organic vanilla ice cream with a little maple syrup and some chopped walnuts is clean eating to me. Snickers or oreos crushed into ice-milk made with a bunch of crappy ingredients is not clean eating to me, and not worth the calorie expenditure due to low quality of both taste and nutrition. Hope that helps.)

Purists may disagree and your mileage may vary.

Clean ice cream is the kind that doesn't stain my shirt when I dribble.

QuietBloom

I don't eat sugar. So I have enough calories for wine. Nothing inconsistent about that.

I have some news for you about that wine......

But she's not eating it, is she? She is drinking it. :bigsmile:

BrainyBurro

before I address anything you just posted, could you please tell me what your criteria for "clean" ice cream is? which brand or type of ice cream is "unclean"? thanks in advance for clarification.

To me, "clean ice cream" is that which is made with natural, preferably organic, whole ingredients that are minimally processed. Milk, cream, sugar, cocoa, etc. Once they start adding things like "guar gum" and "carageenan" (yes, seaweed but it doesn't belong in my ice cream), then it falls to "unclean" status in MY playbook. To you, it may be different. Because I don't demonize things like natural fats and sugars, they can still be clean as long as they are relatively pure (no additives for shelf life/profitability beyond the basic ingredients), minimally processed and in reasonable quantities. (EDIT: Example, organic vanilla ice cream with a little maple syrup and some chopped walnuts is clean eating to me. Snickers or oreos crushed into ice-milk made with a bunch of crappy ingredients is not clean eating to me, and not worth the calorie expenditure due to low quality of both taste and nutrition. Hope that helps.)

Purists may disagree and your mileage may vary.

Clean ice cream is the kind that doesn't stain my shirt when I dribble.