Deficit Deadlifts

TR0berts

I did a quick search, but didn't find the answer within the first 5 pages of search results. So, of course, the answer was probably on page 6... :ohwell:


I want to incorporate deficit deads into my routine, as my weak spot on regular deads is the initial lift off of the floor. My question(s) is/are how much should I start with? Is there a certain percentage of what I'd normally deadlift that I should use, or should I just start with 135 lbs and work my way up, so see where I'm at? My plan is to just use one of those (3' wide?) plastic step platforms the gym has in what I call the aerobics/stretching area as my platform.

TIA

JoRocka

start with the bar.

My warm up weight is 135.. but I ALWAYS start with the bar and do 2 sets of 8 as part of my initial warm up. See how it feels- go up from there. it's a pain to add 25's then take them off to add the wheel- but that's less of a pain than being laid up for a week because 135 shocked you and you torqued something.

one time I was doing drop sets- and for some reason I only had 25's on the bar flat on the floor... and I went down to lift it- and it was only 135 or so.. and I was like- CRAP THAT"S HEAVY... and then I realized it why it was so much heavier- it's like 4" or whatever lower!!!

start slow- it's easy to goon up your back doing deficits.

astronomicals

spinal flexion... no thank you... good luck...

I wouldn't do these for the same reason that I wouldnt do SLDLs...

IMO, if your deadlift is under 300 and you're having issues it's your form or your trying to move too much weight.... maybe 400 even...

ETA: If you look at the mechanics of the lever your body imposes on the weight, it should be apparent that the bottom position is the hardest part. You're probably trying to lift more than you should.

JoRocka

LOL we are always trying to lift more than we should...LOL that's kind of the point.

Although I concure- deficit's aren't my thing- I prefer regular ole deadlifts.

Although I do light weight single leg deads- mostly for balance. different ball of wax- to me anyway.

sluggz

Some things that have worked really well for me...
Lowering weight to 60% of training max (training max is 90% of 1 rep max) and doing speed sets where i try to rip it off the floor as fast as possible.
Super strict Good Mornings to build hamstring strength (your hams should be good and loaded when in the bottom of a deadlift)
GHRs
and lastly deficit deadlifts.
with anything, good form is required, go light to begin with and work your way up.

FrnkLft

For the record, a 3 inch deficit deadlift is quite a lot. You might find it too awkward at the bottom, since the bar will likley be pretty close to your ankles depending on how the weights are shaped at your gym.

If you want a smaller deficit, try standing on plates if it's stable enough. If not... I dunno.

OH, **** just thought of something! Load lighter plates on (do some funky plate-math) with 35s or even 25's as the biggest plate. That will do the same thing without needing to stand on a platform.

Damn I'm the man... so goddamn smart... :drinker:

ETA: If you look at the mechanics of the lever your body imposes on the weight, it should be apparent that the bottom position is the hardest part. You're probably trying to lift more than you should.

To this end, I would agree, the bottom position is always the hardest... it's not moving yet lol

Leadfoot_Lewis

OP - What exactly is the issue with the lift off from the floor? Is your back rounding?

TR0berts

The issue is that I hit a standstill a while back. I've since deloaded, but I feel like I want to cave during the initial lift. Once I get it off the floor, I have no issues, whatsoever.

I was reading through Wendler's Beyond 5-3-1, and one of the things he suggests is deficit deads - along with SLDLs, RDLs, back raises, reverse hypers, and good mornings. Looking at the options, I'm thinking deficit deads would be best for my situation.

FrnkLft

Yeah man that's good. Like I said though, a 3" deficit is huge though. Start light so you don't kill yourself, but try standing on some 45s first using maybe 50% of your max and see how it feels. No magic number for you, you just have to start relatively light and feel it out.

I can see how they would definitely help you with getting used to the start of the lift whether it's a true sticking point or not.

And just in case you're not doing it, make sure you are using your legs at first to get the weight moving off the ground, not your back. Keep the back solid, and basically squat the weight off the ground, finishing by pushing your hips through once the weight has passed your knees. I'm not hitting my 1RMs yet, but keeping this in mind has definitely helped me.

Leadfoot_Lewis

The issue is that I hit a standstill a while back. I've since deloaded, but I feel like I want to cave during the initial lift. Once I get it off the floor, I have no issues, whatsoever.

I do the same thing. First pull isn't that great but once I get going, I'm fine. Don't know if I psych myself out or if it takes a bit for the ATP to kick in.

I was reading through Wendler's Beyond 5-3-1, and one of the things he suggests is deficit deads - along with SLDLs, RDLs, back raises, reverse hypers, and good mornings. Looking at the options, I'm thinking deficit deads would be best for my situation.

I agree- train the movement. I like sluggz suggestion as well w/the speed sets (which I may try myself). I've honestly never done deficits so I can't give advice on something I've never done or trained. I usually find the bitterly slow process of deloading helps.

FrnkLft

Man that's so cool, I didn't know other guys were experiencing this too. The very first rep is always a bear, and as I'm pulling I'm legitimately wondering if I could do another, but then I go on to do 10 lol It hadn't always been that way, but as you get along this phenomenon really comes into play.

It's not like the other lifts. But then, are you experiencing this while also pausing at the bottom? I wouldn't say that I do a full on bounce, but I do click the floor a little sometimes before moving the weight back up for another rep. Not for an advantage, I don't like bouncing, but more to keep a rythm.

pcastagner

You guys do realize this lift gets its name from the pull off the floor, where the weight is at a dead stop? They named it that because it's the defining characteristic of the lift.

Shawshankcan

What is your current deadlift?

sluggz

You guys do realize this lift gets its name from the pull off the floor, where the weight is at a dead stop? They named it that because it's the defining characteristic of the lift.

I don't understand this comment, can you clarify?

ironanimal

I use 50% 1RM Conventional, on leg day, after squats.

3 inches could be a bit awkard. I use 4 inches and my toes only juuuuuuust get under the bar up on the box.

koing

Man that's so cool, I didn't know other guys were experiencing this too. The very first rep is always a bear, and as I'm pulling I'm legitimately wondering if I could do another, but then I go on to do 10 lol It hadn't always been that way, but as you get along this phenomenon really comes into play.

It's not like the other lifts. But then, are you experiencing this while also pausing at the bottom? I wouldn't say that I do a full on bounce, but I do click the floor a little sometimes before moving the weight back up for another rep. Not for an advantage, I don't like bouncing, but more to keep a rythm.

This is because you can't build the tension in your trunk on the first rep. On the first rep as you lower the weight down and then continue to do your second rep your body is under a lot of tension already and the rep will be easier.

Speed work at 60% will help you out and more focus on staying tight as you pull from the floor. More hard ab work and back will make deadlifting easier.

Start with the bar and progress up.

Koing

TR0berts

You guys do realize this lift gets its name from the pull off the floor, where the weight is at a dead stop? They named it that because it's the defining characteristic of the lift.

I don't understand this comment, can you clarify?

I'm guessing it's a reference to the "touch-and-go" aspect of deadlifting for reps that some people apply? As opposed to pausing at the bottom?


Only on the 5 sets of 10 (anywhere from 50-70% of TM) and warmups do I do touch-and-go style deads. During the actual strength (5/3/1) lifts do I pause - for about 1 second.

koing - that's pretty much it, exactly. Once I've gotten the tension, I can keep it. It's getting it in the first place.

I like the idea of maybe using the 35lb plates as the base, as opposed to the 45s. That'll probably make it easier in that I won't have to worry about setting the bar down in a potentially bad spot if I get fatigued, like I would were I on a platform.

I'm not sure about the speed work. For deads, that seems like it might be an injury waiting to happen.

What I said earlier about being at a standstill isn't actually correct, now that I think about it. The last time I tested my 1RM on deadlift was back in March, I believe. I failed at the weight I wanted to reach, but lowered the weight and still increased it from the previous test. So, it wasn't necessarily a standstill - it just wasn't yet what I wanted. I'm almost tempted on Thursday (deadlift day) to just say screw it and see where it is now. As it turns out, I might just be overthinking it.

JoRocka

nah- doing a few quick reps isn't a crisis- it's like finishing your squat session with pause squats- just a great way to burn out- I do a very touch and go method with 135 to burn out at the end. love it.

I'm guessing it's a reference to the "touch-and-go" aspect of deadlifting for reps that some people apply? As opposed to pausing at the bottom?


Only on the 5 sets of 10 (anywhere from 50-70% of TM) and warmups do I do touch-and-go style deads. During the actual strength (5/3/1) lifts do I pause - for about 1 second.

I'd say I'm in the same boat- I usually will full stop and lift. I can touch and go with any weight up to 4-5 reps- after that it's a little slower. obviously.

sluggz

nah- doing a few quick reps isn't a crisis- it's like finishing your squat session with pause squats- just a great way to burn out- I do a very touch and go method with 135 to burn out at the end. love it.

I'm guessing it's a reference to the "touch-and-go" aspect of deadlifting for reps that some people apply? As opposed to pausing at the bottom?


Only on the 5 sets of 10 (anywhere from 50-70% of TM) and warmups do I do touch-and-go style deads. During the actual strength (5/3/1) lifts do I pause - for about 1 second.

I'd say I'm in the same boat- I usually will full stop and lift. I can touch and go with any weight up to 4-5 reps- after that it's a little slower. obviously.

I do the same, full stop with work sets, touch and go with 50-65% x 8-10 AFTER the work lifts are done.