TDEE and BMR;tons of posts;still can't figure mine out!

jrwms714

HELP. I have read everything everywhere, including all posts and replies, but I am really math challenged and can't figure out what to do for me. I have been with MFP for 18 months. I am 5'0" and lost 10 lbs. before starting MFP, and now lost 26 more. My goal is to get to 130.

I have been on a plateau for 2 months, at 142. Not sure what to do. Using MFP's calculator, I am female, 67, 5'0", work out 5x per week (cardio on many machines, weights, bands, etc.). I put in lightly active but recently changed it to active. I am not even sure if that's correct. ( I no longer work and, although I am out and about during the days, I am fairly sedentary in the afternoon and evening.)

My BMR everywhere seems to come in at 1200, even at the current weight. I don't actually understand TDEE, but am using MFP's calculations for gym credit. In the last month I started eating back my gym cals, which I had never done before.

I need help figuring out what to do calorically until I reach my goal of 130. MY gym cals range from 500+ (cardio) or 200 (weights).
Please help. I am so close to my goal and am getting frustrated with this plateau.

Francl27

This might help you more.

http://scoobysworkshop.com/calorie-calculator/

I'd try the 'lightly active' setting. If you're using the calorie estimates from the gym, you're probably eating too much, as they tend to overestimate a lot.

yarwell

How much are you eating - have you set MFP to 1/2 lb per week ??

If your BMR is about 1200 and you put sedentary then your TDEE is estimated to be 1440. More activity it'll be higher.

jrwms714

I'm using the calories estimates from MFP database. I didn't put sedentary ... i put lightly active, given that I work out 5x/week ... was that correct?

jrwms714

I have been to the scooby site and am still confused. BMR is 1233, TDEE is 1912. Daily cals 1529. I put moderate due to the workout schedule I keep. So I have the numbers. I just don't understand how to use them. Sorry. I am just so bad at math, etc.

psuLemon

If you exercise for 3-4 hours, lightly active is right, 5-6 hours moderate is better. The bigger question is, do you have any medical conditions (PCOS, Hypothyroidism, or have gone through menopause) that could affect the outcome? Also, are you weighing and measuring your foods (food scale)?

jrwms714

Hi -
No medical conditions except hypothryoidism which has been treated and under control for years, with an annual check up. Menopause passed through years ago, which was part of the weight gain. Long past that now. Weighing and measuring foods? Yep. Sure am.

I exercise for 5 - 6 hours. So which is right - moderate or light? Also, you say that 1500 is accurate ... again, I am confused. Do I eat 1500 cals on days I don't exercise or is that the 1233? And when I do exercise, how do I do that calorie math, given the 1500? ... just so frustrated trying to understand this. Can you give me a formula based on these numbers, and pretend you are explaining to a 3rd grader b/c, honestly, in this area, a 3rd grader might know more. Sorry to be so dense. If I were still in school, there is no doubt I would have been given a math disability. I truly appreciate your patience and your help.

jak1958

Hi... MFP calorie allowances DO NOT INCLUDE exercise - it is based only on your daily activity without exercise. When using this calculation, you would eat back all or a portion of calories burned on the days you exercise.

Scooby is calculating calorie allowances INCLUDING exercise (TDEE). If you use TDEE do not add exercise calories back. So your TDEE is 1912 (this is what you would eat to maintain with your current exercise). The 1529 is your TDEE less 20% - this is what you would eat to lose.

Just two different ways to get there. Hope this helps.

jrwms714

Thanks again for your patience. If I have this right, then I eat 1200 on days without exercise and 1529 on days with? I have been eating 1200 on non exercise days and then adding exercise cals on the days I go to the gym. thus, I eat 1200 plus whatever I earn that day.
Still confused. Don't give up on me.

wild_wild_life

I'll see if I can help. 

Sounds like you want to lose 12 lbs. Let's say your TDEE is 1900. This is your daily maintenance calorie requirement. Since you don't have much more to lose, you can't lose as quickly as you did before. You can probably expect to lose between 0.5-1 lb per week at the most. To lose 1 lb per week, you need a 500 calorie daily deficit, or 1400 cals per day. To lose 0.5 lbs  per week you need 1650 cals per day. So a daily calorie goal between 1400-1650 would be best. You would eat this every day regardless of whether you exercised, because it is averaged over the course of the week. 

As you lose a bit more, you would do better to eat closer to the 1650 calorie goal, because it is better to have a smaller deficit as you approach your goal. 

When you are within a few lbs of your goal, you can gradually transition up towards 1900. 

The TDEE calculator is just an estimate, so your actual rate of loss may vary, and your intake may need to be adjusted, but I would recommend eating between 1400-1650 as a daily goal. 

jrwms714

Thanks sooooo much. Clear as can be. One further question: I go on vacation for a month during the winter or at other times for a week or so. Not often but when I do, exercise is minimal. Just occasional light hiking. Do I then revert to the 1200 BMR until I return to my regular workout routine?

wild_wild_life

Thanks sooooo much. Clear as can be. One further question: I go on vacation for a month during the winter or at other times for a week or so. Not often but when I do, exercise is minimal. Just occasional light hiking. Do I then revert to the 1200 BMR until I return to my regular workout routine?

If you go back to the TDEE calculator you used above, you can input your info for different levels of activity. Generally the calorie goal given there (the one where it says "daily calories based on goal in step 6") is pretty good.

For light activity, it gives you a maintenence of 1684. For sedentery, it gives you 1469. If you were on vacation and were still active, light activity would probably be the best choice. Taking a 250-500 cal deficit from that would leave you with 1200-1450 as a goal. I wouldn't go below 1200 though, and again I'd go closer to the higher goal if it was me.

As I said, these are all estimates and your specific maintenance needs could fall between two categories (because it's a bit subjective what is considered "moderate" vs "light" activity). So you will have to see how the scale responds to what you're doing and may need to adjust your goal up or down. Unfortunately as you get close to goal it gets harder to find that "sweet spot" where you are eating enough but not too much.

Hope that helps, I'd be happy to help in the future if you have any more questions. Good luck!

psuLemon

Hi -
No medical conditions except hypothryoidism which has been treated and under control for years, with an annual check up. Menopause passed through years ago, which was part of the weight gain. Long past that now. Weighing and measuring foods? Yep. Sure am.

I exercise for 5 - 6 hours. So which is right - moderate or light? Also, you say that 1500 is accurate ... again, I am confused. Do I eat 1500 cals on days I don't exercise or is that the 1233? And when I do exercise, how do I do that calorie math, given the 1500? ... just so frustrated trying to understand this. Can you give me a formula based on these numbers, and pretend you are explaining to a 3rd grader b/c, honestly, in this area, a 3rd grader might know more. Sorry to be so dense. If I were still in school, there is no doubt I would have been given a math disability. I truly appreciate your patience and your help.

The biggest problem you will face is people with hypothyroidism don't follow the TDEE methods. For the most part, they have a lower BMR than the standard deviation. In fact, most are 300-400 calories less than the standard person. Now, that isn't to say that you follow that trend, but what you could do is eat 1500 calories a day (I would suggest macro's around 30% carbs, 40% protein and 30% fats). Eat the same amount for 1 month while making sure you weigh and measure foods; so if you don't have a food scale, buy one, it's invaluable. With the TDEE method, you eat the same calories regardless if you exercise or not. I feel it's the easiest way of figuring out your true TDEE. Here is why:


Current, I just eat 2400-2500 calories a day.

Over the last 6 weeks, I have lost 6 lbs (average 1 lb per week: 1 lb = 3500 calories less or 500 per day.


So my current TDEE = 2400/2500 + 500 = 2900/3000.


So the reason I suggest just eating 1500 calories is it allows for easy math. If in 4-6 weeks, you average 1/2 lb per week than you add 250 to your number and that is your true TDEE. So if you want to speed up weight loss, then you cut another 250 calories to give you one pound per week.

jrwms714

I can NOT begin to tell you how helpful your two posts were. I thank others for their input. I just needed someone to take me by the hand and wild_wild_lif, you sure did! Thanks so much - and rest assured, I'll be in touch with my ongoing confusion.

wild_wild_life

The biggest problem you will face is people with hypothyroidism don't follow the TDEE methods. For the most part, they have a lower BMR than the standard deviation. In fact, most are 300-400 calories less than the standard person.

Do you think this is true even for people whose hypothyroidism is well controlled by medication? Levothyroxine should elevate BMR back up into the normal range. Too much can even mimic hyperthyroidism and elevate BMR above the normal range.

wild_wild_life

I can NOT begin to tell you how helpful your two posts were. I thank others for their input. I just needed someone to take me by the hand and wild_wild_lif, you sure did! Thanks so much - and rest assured, I'll be in touch with my ongoing confusion.

No problem! You got a lot of other good advice here too.

If you don't lose after a few weeks in the 1400-1650 range, I would reasses.

You may know this but you can set your own calorie goal under food/settings/goals/change goals/custom.

You don't need to log your exercise or eat any additional calories when you exercise.

psuLemon

The biggest problem you will face is people with hypothyroidism don't follow the TDEE methods. For the most part, they have a lower BMR than the standard deviation. In fact, most are 300-400 calories less than the standard person.

Do you think this is true even for people whose hypothyroidism is well controlled by medication? Levothyroxine should elevate BMR back up into the normal range. Too much can even mimic hyperthyroidism and elevate BMR above the normal range.

I suspect it will vary vastly on the individual and the medications they are on. What I usually suggest is what I wrote above but for better support, I would also suggest the groups. There are a few groups dedicated for those who have a thyroid issue. And in this case, post menopause group. From my experience, the people, even on medications, still generally have a lower BMR than usual and rarely follow the traditional TDEE. This is why I suggest eating the same calories daily for a 4-6 weeks and see the results and then back into your TDEE.

If you look at my estimated BMR and TDEE, my estimate TDEE would be 3250. But because my workouts haven't been as intense, it's more around 2900-3000.



http://www.myfitnesspal.com/groups/home/753-hypothyroidism-and-hyperthyroidism

http://www.myfitnesspal.com/groups/home/506-near-or-post-menopausal-group

wild_wild_life

The biggest problem you will face is people with hypothyroidism don't follow the TDEE methods. For the most part, they have a lower BMR than the standard deviation. In fact, most are 300-400 calories less than the standard person.

Do you think this is true even for people whose hypothyroidism is well controlled by medication? Levothyroxine should elevate BMR back up into the normal range. Too much can even mimic hyperthyroidism and elevate BMR above the normal range.

I suspect it will vary vastly on the individual and the medications they are on. What I usually suggest is what I wrote above but for better support, I would also suggest the groups. There are a few groups dedicated for those who have a thyroid issue. And in this case, post menopause group. From my experience, the people, even on medications, still generally have a lower BMR than usual and rarely follow the traditional TDEE. This is why I suggest eating the same calories daily for a 4-6 weeks and see the results and then back into your TDEE.

If you look at my estimated BMR and TDEE, my estimate TDEE would be 3250. But because my workouts haven't been as intense, it's more around 2900-3000.



http://www.myfitnesspal.com/groups/home/753-hypothyroidism-and-hyperthyroidism

http://www.myfitnesspal.com/groups/home/506-near-or-post-menopausal-group

I agree it's good to be aware that one's metabolism may be different from the figure the online calculators provide, whether it be due to difference in activity level, hormonal status, illness, or medication. Those groups sound like a great idea too.

leemchisholm

Don't go by any calculator. Record what you eat for a week or two to maintain your weight. This is your BMR.

Calculators always give me a lower BMR than what I actually am. Currently it seems 3000kcals is my base rate.

jrwms714

That was also helpful. I was not sure about customizing my goals. I am going to change my daily TDEE to 1400, b/c it has always been hard for me to lose, and now that I am close to my goal, even harder. I will try that for a few weeks. And if I don't have to figure in exercise cals, or eat them back, life gets easier!! If, in a few weeks, nothing moves, not sure what I will do other than scream HELP again on this post!

As to all the comments about hypothyroidism, I have been diagnosed since age 15 and my experience is that thyroid meds keep your BMR where it should be for YOU, esp. with annual checkups and blood work, but that the meds do not help you lose weight ... they just normalize where you are and then you need to do the rest. In other words, the disease slows the metabolism, the meds correct it, but the weight is still harder to lose and easier to gain.