Gym routine questions...

_KitKat_

The trainer at my gym has suggested I do 20 min high intensity elliptical ...then weight training...then circuit , and finally 20 more min on the treadmill. That was for 3 days a week. I have since changed my schedule and am going 6 days per week (either Sat. or Sun off). I am most interested in lifting heavy, and trying to figure out a good schedule for myself. I have been reading about cardio before weights, and most say its a no-no. The trainer said it is to get my heart-rate up before lifting. Would love other input because most of what he says doesn't match what I am finding when I read.
My idea was M,W,F heavy lifting full body with a 20 min cardio (really hate straight cardio, so if I can drop this, I would love it), T,TH,S 20 min. intervals on the elliptical then a 30 min. circuit with lighter weights (not girly 10lbs. but about 1/3-1/2 my normal lifting).
If this sounds reasonable, please let me know. Would really love input from some of the lovely ladies with great results from lifting heavy, or some nice built guys. Please feel free to adjust my thoughts however you think is right, just please explain the reasoning to me so I have a greater understanding.
I love the gym, I love strength training, hate cardio (bored and kills my legs). 6 days a week is doable for life for me...like I said I really enjoy working out. I do not want to injure myself, and would love some great before/after pics like some of the fab looking lady lifters. Oh-yeah, I budget 1 1/2 -2 hrs ( I prefer a longer workout) gym time per evening and really hate the idea of splits (have enough to keep track of as a mom) but if needed, I will do what it takes.

_KitKat_

Bump...could really use the help

pastryari

You don't have to do cardio if you don't want to.

Many people just do a quick 10 min cardio warm up before lifting and then a cool down afterwards. (and stretching, of course).

Look into a beginner lifting program like Stronglifts 5x5 or Starting Strength or the book New Rules of Weight Lifting for Women.

MichMunchkin

I can't help much on the routine per se....except to say that every trainer I've ever worked with has recommended that I do 20 minutes of cardio before lifting (and all the trainers at the gym where I work recommend the same thing.)

_KitKat_

I can't help much on the routine per se....except to say that every trainer I've ever worked with has recommended that I do 20 minutes of cardio before lifting (and all the trainers at the gym where I work recommend the same thing.)

That is exactly what he said, I just keep finding stuff about, doing cardio first lowers the impact of your lifting session. Also something about glycol, spelled wrong but something like that, the muscle energy you have.

You don't have to do cardio if you don't want to.

I want to because I feel some cardio would be best for me. I was just wondering if i could alternate days of lifting with days of cardio, so that on lifting days, i do not need to do any or is it best to raise my heart rate first?

vorgas

If you've read the reasoning behind weights then aerobics then this may be a repeat, but...

Weight lifting is an Anaerobic exercise (assuming you are lifting heavier than 20 RM). That means that your muscles use the glycogen they store in order to lift the weight.

Aerobic exercises (HR < 65% of max) uses oxygen combined with fat to fuel the muscles. Keep in mind, that once your HR breaks 50% your body is going to use some glycogen to supplement the process.

The question would be, why would you want to use up the fuel for lifting weights first? I mean, if strength is your goal? That's a good way to lead to form failure as you try to correct for a weight you feel you can lift, but lack the glycogen to really do it. What's the benefit of raising your HR above 50% before you lift? If endurance is your goal, sure, go for it. But not if you want to lift heavy.

When you do aerobics, your HR rises in order to push more oxygen throughout your body. This is called Volume Load. When you lift weights, your HR rises while certain vessels open and others constrict, to create higher pressure in the lifting areas. This is called Pressure Load. You can see this effect yourself by looking at your muscles while exercising. In cardio, you won't get any vascularity. But when you lift heavy, you can see veins throbbing and popping.

Both Volume Load and Pressure Load both have great cardio-vascular and cardio-pulmonary benefits. So what's the benefit of raising your HR through Volume Load before raising your HR through Pressure Load? Assuming you are warming up correctly on the weights (gradual increase in weight) then your HR will climb gradually just fine.

That being said, you want to be careful about doing too much cardio (HR > 65%) after you lift, because your body may begin to break down muscles to supplement the aerobic process (it's a pretty slow process). As long as you keep the total expenditure to under 60 minutes, though, you should be fine. Depending on the intensity, 90 minutes could work.

As to your routine: Don't forget that muscles need rest in order to get better. You don't build strength in the gym. You build strength resting after the gym So just be careful that you aren't working the same muscles on back to back days. Certainly not taking them anywhere close to failure, anyway.

40 minutes of lifting, followed by 20 minutes of HIIT is a great workout by any standard.

QueenBishOTUniverse

I alternate days between lifting and cardio. Days 1-3-5 I do my heavy lifting. I WALK for five minutes on the treadmill just to get everything loosened up, do a few movements (squats etc.) that I know I'm going to be doing later without the weight, to make sure everything is limber, and then I start lifting. My lift days usually run about 40 minutes from warm up to cool down.

I do cardio days 2-4-6, days 2 and 4 I do a 30 minute run, with 10 minutes of wind sprints in the middle of the run, day six is a long endurace run at a medium pace.

This is very similar to the basic training system my Lacrosse coach had me on in college, seemed to work well then....

_KitKat_

If you've read the reasoning behind weights then aerobics then this may be a repeat, but...

Weight lifting is an Anaerobic exercise (assuming you are lifting heavier than 20 RM). That means that your muscles use the glycogen they store in order to lift the weight.

Aerobic exercises (HR < 65% of max) uses oxygen combined with fat to fuel the muscles. Keep in mind, that once your HR breaks 50% your body is going to use some glycogen to supplement the process.

The question would be, why would you want to use up the fuel for lifting weights first? I mean, if strength is your goal? That's a good way to lead to form failure as you try to correct for a weight you feel you can lift, but lack the glycogen to really do it. What's the benefit of raising your HR above 50% before you lift? If endurance is your goal, sure, go for it. But not if you want to lift heavy.

When you do aerobics, your HR rises in order to push more oxygen throughout your body. This is called Volume Load. When you lift weights, your HR rises while certain vessels open and others constrict, to create higher pressure in the lifting areas. This is called Pressure Load. You can see this effect yourself by looking at your muscles while exercising. In cardio, you won't get any vascularity. But when you lift heavy, you can see veins throbbing and popping.

Both Volume Load and Pressure Load both have great cardio-vascular and cardio-pulmonary benefits. So what's the benefit of raising your HR through Volume Load before raising your HR through Pressure Load? Assuming you are warming up correctly on the weights (gradual increase in weight) then your HR will climb gradually just fine.

That being said, you want to be careful about doing too much cardio (HR > 65%) after you lift, because your body may begin to break down muscles to supplement the aerobic process (it's a pretty slow process). As long as you keep the total expenditure to under 60 minutes, though, you should be fine. Depending on the intensity, 90 minutes could work.

As to your routine: Don't forget that muscles need rest in order to get better. You don't build strength in the gym. You build strength resting after the gym So just be careful that you aren't working the same muscles on back to back days. Certainly not taking them anywhere close to failure, anyway.

40 minutes of lifting, followed by 20 minutes of HIIT is a great workout by any standard.

Thank you :flowerforyou:

If I am doing 6 days, can i just do cardio 1 day then lifting the next (with warm up lifts)? Also on cardio days is it ok for my muscle recovery for me to do light weight circuit for most of my cardio....really hate feeling like a hamster in a wheel...?

_KitKat_

I alternate days between lifting and cardio. Days 1-3-5 I do my heavy lifting. I WALK for five minutes on the treadmill just to get everything loosened up, do a few movements (squats etc.) that I know I'm going to be doing later without the weight, to make sure everything is limber, and then I start lifting. My lift days usually run about 40 minutes from warm up to cool down.

I do cardio days 2-4-6, days 2 and 4 I do a 30 minute run, with 10 minutes of wind sprints in the middle of the run, day six is a long endurace run at a medium pace.

This is very similar to the basic training system my Lacrosse coach had me on in college, seemed to work well then....

Thank you also:flowerforyou:

The info really helps.

Im4gin3th4t

I would suggest at least doing 10 minutes cardio prior to all of your weight workouts just to warm up your muscles and get them ready for a hard weight workout without the warm up you have a higher chance of hurting yourself. You don't have to do anything high intensity just something that will get your body loose and ready to work

vorgas

Thank you :flowerforyou:

If I am doing 6 days, can i just do cardio 1 day then lifting the next (with warm up lifts)? Also on cardio days is it ok for my muscle recovery for me to do light weight circuit for most of my cardio....really hate feeling like a hamster in a wheel...?

Sure. Just try to space out the muscles worked. Make sure your circuit training reps are high rep range, approaching 20 RM.

But don't discount the benefits of High Intensity Interval Training. You can knock out an 8 rounder in about 15 minutes pretty easily. It's great for increasing your VO2 Max, lowering your resting HR, etc. Using an elliptical machine or a stationary bike with arm motions is a great full body engagement. Swimming is another fun way to get in a HIIT workout.

As to warming up muscles before lifting to avoid injury: Just some light active stretching followed by a decent progression program is all you need. For example, if you're doing a 135 lb (45 lbs each side of barbell) deadlift as your main set, do 45x5 (barbell only), 65x5 (10 lb plate each side), 95x3-5 (25 lb plate each side), 115x1-5 (25 lb plate, 10 lb plate each side) first. No need to really rest between sets. Just the amount of time it takes to swap out the plates and a slight breather is all you need. It actively warms up the actual muscles you are using to do the lift and, more importantly, engages your muscle memory, so your technique on the heavy lift is more accurate. Much better for reducing injury than trotting on a treadmill.

A good way to tell if you've warmed up properly is that each of your primary sets are harder than the set before. So if you're doing the SL 5x5 program, and sets 1 & 2 are pretty tough, but set 3 and 4 is easier, then you aren't warmed up properly. Again, make sure you're doing warm-ups that actually engage the muscles you use. No amount of walking or jogging is going to warm up your lower back properly to prepare for a deadlift. It's also not going to engage your obliques properly to perform a heavy squat. And forget the chest or back muscles used when bench pressing or doing a bent-over row. Never seen a treadmill or elliptical that fires up the triceps anywhere near what a good bench series will do.

That's not to say you might not want to do a quick 5 minute walk and/or some good active stretching. If you're in the gym for 2 hours anyway you've got some good stretching time built in

_KitKat_

Sure. Just try to space out the muscles worked. Make sure your circuit training reps are high rep range, approaching 20 RM.

But don't discount the benefits of High Intensity Interval Training. You can knock out an 8 rounder in about 15 minutes pretty easily. It's great for increasing your VO2 Max, lowering your resting HR, etc. Using an elliptical machine or a stationary bike with arm motions is a great full body engagement. Swimming is another fun way to get in a HIIT workout.

As to warming up muscles before lifting to avoid injury: Just some light active stretching followed by a decent progression program is all you need. For example, if you're doing a 135 lb (45 lbs each side of barbell) deadlift as your main set, do 45x5 (barbell only), 65x5 (10 lb plate each side), 95x3-5 (25 lb plate each side), 115x1-5 (25 lb plate, 10 lb plate each side) first. No need to really rest between sets. Just the amount of time it takes to swap out the plates and a slight breather is all you need. It actively warms up the actual muscles you are using to do the lift and, more importantly, engages your muscle memory, so your technique on the heavy lift is more accurate. Much better for reducing injury than trotting on a treadmill.

A good way to tell if you've warmed up properly is that each of your primary sets are harder than the set before. So if you're doing the SL 5x5 program, and sets 1 & 2 are pretty tough, but set 3 and 4 is easier, then you aren't warmed up properly. Again, make sure you're doing warm-ups that actually engage the muscles you use. No amount of walking or jogging is going to warm up your lower back properly to prepare for a deadlift. It's also not going to engage your obliques properly to perform a heavy squat. And forget the chest or back muscles used when bench pressing or doing a bent-over row. Never seen a treadmill or elliptical that fires up the triceps anywhere near what a good bench series will do.

That's not to say you might not want to do a quick 5 minute walk and/or some good active stretching. If you're in the gym for 2 hours anyway you've got some good stretching time built in

Great info, just what I was looking for. Thank you again!