confusing belly fat with loose skin?
Replies
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I'm not trying to be a smart *kitten* but what is resistance training going to do for loose skin?
Nothing. It's one of the standard MFP myths.
Well, while resistance training may not help the loose skin directly, if you build up the muscle underneath the skin it can greatly improve the appearance.
Yes. Like so:
This is when I'd lost about 65 or 70 lbs. You can still see loose skin (I was uber-fat for 20yrs, so it is what it is). However, there is also some definition, which really helps in the overall look. If I didn't have those muscles, you'd just notice the sag bag, because that would be all there is.No, its not a myth. You have a bag around you which is your skin. Increasing muscle will increase whats in the bag, smoothing out some of the wrinkles in the bag, the more thats inside.
Sorry, that is completely inconsistent with Commandments #2 and #3, which read "Heavy lifting will not bulk thee up, especially if thou ist a woman" and "Lifting helps you loose inches".
You cannot fill out loose skin if you don't bulk up, and if lifting tightens your core up ("listen to your measurements, not the scale") then it will create *more* loose skin, not less.
Oh give me a break, this is a completely asinine statement. I have not heard anyone state that women can't gain muscle at all. But, there is a HUGE range between gaining muscle and getting to what many would consider bulky (a look I like, but realize is not everyone's goal).0 -
Primarily this ^ but actually it might. Cytoplasmic remodeling is activated by various signals that we do not fully understand but for soft tissue and bone, it appears that calcium signaling (think of it as electric microcurrents created by the effort) impacts actually tissue organization. The calcium channel model is the state of science for bone remodeling, there are probable peptide signaling is soft tissues such demonstrated in recent neural re stimulation and growth induction.I'm not trying to be a smart *kitten* but what is resistance training going to do for loose skin?
Nothing. It's one of the standard MFP myths.
Well, while resistance training may not help the loose skin directly, if you build up the muscle underneath the skin it can greatly improve the appearance.
Tissue remodeling through effort is a thing. Plus, as you state, the underlying tissue is tightened making loose elements (fat and skin) appear tighter.
Or you can listen to Mr Knight and do nothing. Who knows - I only have degrees in biomedical engineering with biology research on tissue adherence (actin/myosin adhesion) from 3 top universities. Tissue responds to tension and effort - it's how we grow pockets of skin for surgery by placing balloons under the skin and placing them under tension by filling the balloon.
Sometimes I wish I was single, and your brain was a lady with very low standards.0 -
Primarily this ^ but actually it might. Cytoplasmic remodeling is activated by various signals that we do not fully understand but for soft tissue and bone, it appears that calcium signaling (think of it as electric microcurrents created by the effort) impacts actually tissue organization. The calcium channel model is the state of science for bone remodeling, there are probable peptide signaling is soft tissues such demonstrated in recent neural re stimulation and growth induction.I'm not trying to be a smart *kitten* but what is resistance training going to do for loose skin?
Nothing. It's one of the standard MFP myths.
Well, while resistance training may not help the loose skin directly, if you build up the muscle underneath the skin it can greatly improve the appearance.
Tissue remodeling through effort is a thing. Plus, as you state, the underlying tissue is tightened making loose elements (fat and skin) appear tighter.
Or you can listen to Mr Knight and do nothing. Who knows - I only have degrees in biomedical engineering with biology research on tissue adherence (actin/myosin adhesion) from 3 top universities. Tissue responds to tension and effort - it's how we grow pockets of skin for surgery by placing balloons under the skin and placing them under tension by filling the balloon.
This reminds me of how when I start workign after not for a long time there is a tingling or firing sensation I feel just under the surface of my skin. I agree with the answer I'm quoting and just want to add in layman's terms. Is it so hard to imagine that blood flow to the area or in general would facilitate changes in one's skin and muscle structure that would get the cells and skin underlayers to "activate" and work together to form a tighter meshing?
I just know that post baby #1 I of course had a little loose belly but I did aerobics and lift free weights and swam and all in all it tightened up considerably if not all the way. I know some friends who currently do none of those things and their bellies are still there. I know other women who only do the cardio things and they seem the most frustrated as theirs are still there as well. Come to think of it I"m going to share my past experience with them. Until this thread I hadn't really noticed that my lifting was probably the single most different factor that they are not doing that might help them out. My lifting wasn't even all that heavy relatively speaking and it was effective. I say relatively speaking because I'm the type that if I do something I want to do as much or as hard of it as I can and so I probably lifted quite a bit but it's hard to say since I kept no track of it. I don't recall. Just give it a try, what do you have to lose? You'll be stronger anyways, and it'll be fun.0 -
I'm not trying to be a smart *kitten* but what is resistance training going to do for loose skin?
Nothing. It's one of the standard MFP myths.
Well, if it's not massive folds of loose skin, but just a bit of sagginess (like on the upper arms or on the thighs, even a small* pooch on the lower abdomen), then you can work to fill that space with muscle ... Between that and the skin snapping back on it's own (over time), one should end up with a pretty nice result ... Now if you have the aforementioned, massive folds, or your upper arms look like bat wings when outstretched, then surgery may be needed ...0 -
You are still very young and that is in your favor, because youthful skin will tighten up over time, if you can maintain a healthy weight. Young skin is much more elastic than skin like mine (aka "old lady" skin). My doc said to give my skin a couple of years to shrink back; it takes skin a couple of years to do that. Maybe not quite so long in your case. Doc did say regular exercise will help but I didn't have to run out and do P90X or something; just a regular combination of aerobic and strength workouts would be good for me. The hard part is keeping the weight off long enough to give the skin a chance to shrink.i am 23 and lost most of the weight in a year and a half
At any rate, give it time but continue what you're doing and add in some exercise on a regular basis. Decide on surgery only after you've given your skin a chance to shrink. You can do the surgery later if you still feel you need it. That's what I have decided for myself.0 -
Primarily this ^ but actually it might. Cytoplasmic remodeling is activated by various signals that we do not fully understand but for soft tissue and bone, it appears that calcium signaling (think of it as electric microcurrents created by the effort) impacts actually tissue organization. The calcium channel model is the state of science for bone remodeling, there are probable peptide signaling is soft tissues such demonstrated in recent neural re stimulation and growth induction.I'm not trying to be a smart *kitten* but what is resistance training going to do for loose skin?
Nothing. It's one of the standard MFP myths.
Well, while resistance training may not help the loose skin directly, if you build up the muscle underneath the skin it can greatly improve the appearance.
Tissue remodeling through effort is a thing. Plus, as you state, the underlying tissue is tightened making loose elements (fat and skin) appear tighter.
Or you can listen to Mr Knight and do nothing. Who knows - I only have degrees in biomedical engineering with biology research on tissue adherence (actin/myosin adhesion) from 3 top universities. Tissue responds to tension and effort - it's how we grow pockets of skin for surgery by placing balloons under the skin and placing them under tension by filling the balloon.
Sometimes I wish I was single, and your brain was a lady with very low standards.
This is the best thing I've ever read on MFP!0 -
For reference (which is not to say that everyone's situation is the same) my mother lost 100 pounds over the course of two years. She had 15lbs of loose skin removed from her mid section and arms.
The surgery was so painful for her that she decided never to have the loose skin on her lower body done.
As a side note, she always complains about her legs and says they are fat. They are not and I tell her so. It's just the extra skin. She still has a hard time mentally with her weight even though its been ten years and she's now underweight. I won't get in to how worried I am about her since it has nothing to do with the topic >.<0 -
pinch the skin around your belly and then pinch skin on the back of your hand. is the skin on your hand the same thickness as the pinch on your belly? If it is then it's loose skin but if it's not (which it probably is) then you have more fat to burn and/or muscle to gain
hey thats a cool way to know. good idea.0 -
Primarily this ^ but actually it might. Cytoplasmic remodeling is activated by various signals that we do not fully understand but for soft tissue and bone, it appears that calcium signaling (think of it as electric microcurrents created by the effort) impacts actually tissue organization. The calcium channel model is the state of science for bone remodeling, there are probable peptide signaling is soft tissues such demonstrated in recent neural re stimulation and growth induction.I'm not trying to be a smart *kitten* but what is resistance training going to do for loose skin?
Nothing. It's one of the standard MFP myths.
Well, while resistance training may not help the loose skin directly, if you build up the muscle underneath the skin it can greatly improve the appearance.
Tissue remodeling through effort is a thing. Plus, as you state, the underlying tissue is tightened making loose elements (fat and skin) appear tighter.
Or you can listen to Mr Knight and do nothing. Who knows - I only have degrees in biomedical engineering with biology research on tissue adherence (actin/myosin adhesion) from 3 top universities. Tissue responds to tension and effort - it's how we grow pockets of skin for surgery by placing balloons under the skin and placing them under tension by filling the balloon.
Sometimes I wish I was single, and your brain was a lady with very low standards.
FR sent :laugh:0 -
Primarily this ^ but actually it might. Cytoplasmic remodeling is activated by various signals that we do not fully understand but for soft tissue and bone, it appears that calcium signaling (think of it as electric microcurrents created by the effort) impacts actually tissue organization. The calcium channel model is the state of science for bone remodeling, there are probable peptide signaling is soft tissues such demonstrated in recent neural re stimulation and growth induction.I'm not trying to be a smart *kitten* but what is resistance training going to do for loose skin?
Nothing. It's one of the standard MFP myths.
Well, while resistance training may not help the loose skin directly, if you build up the muscle underneath the skin it can greatly improve the appearance.
Tissue remodeling through effort is a thing. Plus, as you state, the underlying tissue is tightened making loose elements (fat and skin) appear tighter.
Or you can listen to Mr Knight and do nothing. Who knows - I only have degrees in biomedical engineering with biology research on tissue adherence (actin/myosin adhesion) from 3 top universities. Tissue responds to tension and effort - it's how we grow pockets of skin for surgery by placing balloons under the skin and placing them under tension by filling the balloon.
This gives me hope.0 -
You can't compare the skin in the back of your hand with the skin on your belly, lol. And I'm quite sure loose skin doesn't feel the same as tight skin either.
I have the same problem here, I can't tell if it's mostly skin, mostly fat, or both. But the way it hangs when I bend over... like two pockets around the belly button... that doesn't look like fat (even though I know there's still some in there!). I guess it will be easier to tell when I'm at goal weight.0 -
From some of the people I've seen on TV having skin removal surgery the loose skin that they're removing is literally just skin. It's almost paper thin and hangs like folded fabric. If you grab the skin and it's got something solid behind it, that's still more fat. The stuff they were holding up for removal did look very much like pinching the skin on the back of your hand. I probably watch way too much medical TV!0
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No, its not a myth. You have a bag around you which is your skin. Increasing muscle will increase whats in the bag, smoothing out some of the wrinkles in the bag, the more thats inside.
Sorry, that is completely inconsistent with Commandments #2 and #3, which read "Heavy lifting will not bulk thee up, especially if thou ist a woman" and "Lifting helps you loose inches".
You cannot fill out loose skin if you don't bulk up, and if lifting tightens your core up ("listen to your measurements, not the scale") then it will create *more* loose skin, not less.
Exercise is part of the recognized elements that modify superficial fascia that connect skin to the underlying musculature.
http://www.fasciaresearch.de/Schleip_TrainingPrinciplesFascial.pdf
If you are interested you can read up on the basic lab work to study this macro anatomy.
https://web.duke.edu/anatomy/Lab01/Lab1.html0 -
in all honesty it will take about a yr or two for most of the loose skin around the middle to tighten back up, like anything else in your body it is a living organ and it will change and adapt to outside stimuli.
Keep up with your healthy eating and exercise & be patient, it will go away eventually.0 -
No, its not a myth. You have a bag around you which is your skin. Increasing muscle will increase whats in the bag, smoothing out some of the wrinkles in the bag, the more thats inside.
Sorry, that is completely inconsistent with Commandments #2 and #3, which read "Heavy lifting will not bulk thee up, especially if thou ist a woman" and "Lifting helps you loose inches".
You cannot fill out loose skin if you don't bulk up, and if lifting tightens your core up ("listen to your measurements, not the scale") then it will create *more* loose skin, not less.
Exercise is part of the recognized elements that modify superficial fascia that connect skin to the underlying musculature.
http://www.fasciaresearch.de/Schleip_TrainingPrinciplesFascial.pdf
If you are interested you can read up on the basic lab work to study this macro anatomy.
https://web.duke.edu/anatomy/Lab01/Lab1.html
You, sir, woke up and put on your smarty pants this morning.0 -
I am 5 ft, down to 124 and I KNOW that what i have working on the muffin top is fat..I can grab a handful..it is not thin, it is pure fat..so I use Jergens skin firming on my belly EVERY SINGLE DAY and do heavy weights three days a week and it is slooooooowly coming off..it take patience, that is for sure!0
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Don't use the hand test. The back of your hand naturally has less fatty tissue than your midsection.
Which is entirely the point of trying to assess whether the "loose skin" on her belly is actually all, more mostly, skin, or actually a skin/fat combo.
Extremely lean people can have midsection bodyfat almost as low as the back of the hand.
How lean is extremely lean? What about average people? Or slightly lean people? Or moderately lean?0 -
This is one of those big things that my personal journey through weight loss has taught me. After I lost about 80-100 on my own I'm in the final stretch of my weight loss journey and am looking to get to around 18% body fat, which is about 7.5-11 pounds away for me. Listen, I have done research out the wazoo on this one. I even went to see a doctor, fearing the worst: That I needed a tummy tuck I couldn't afford. I was delighted when he said I have some excess skin, but would highly recommend lipo first. Do you know what that means? LIPOSUCTION MEANS FAT.
I've confirmed this online and with a friend who is a body builder, I have some excess skin, but I have a little fat left to lose.
People who tell you that they have excess skin which is more than 5-6mm thick when pinched still have residual fat. In that link earlier to Blue Eyed Betty, Yes, she has a good deal of excess skin, but she also has a HUGE amount of fat to still lose. As long as you don't have a super massive amount of skin left, It should tighten up reasonably so as your body fat gets down to a lower percentage. Yeah, this means that I have to work a little harder to get the jiggle off my middle. But I'm okay with that, because I'll get to have those rock hard abs.
Check out Sharee Hansen on Funeral for My Fat, this is a PERFECT example of actual loose skin instead of fat with loose skin, she shows her stomach in the video and you can clearly see it's just empty skin, and no more than a couple of millimeters thick. If you have 1 centimeter or more of pinch there, there is fat to lose. And I tested this theory on a place where I know that I have loose skin on my body, as well as on my dog who has yards of skin. (Sounds silly, but aside from fur their skin is still skin) It measured in at 4-6mm. Which is exactly where doctors on Real Self tell us skin should be.
So here is how you tell if it's legitimately fat or loose skin:
1: Does it jiggle? If so there is a 95% chance it's got fat inside
2: Does it have a thickness of more than 6mm? It's got fat inside.
3: Does it bounce if you push on it...probably fat.
4: Does it form a roll when you bend over? probably fat.
Subcutaneous fat is a son of a monkey's uncle to get rid of. It sits just beneath the skin. It forms to the skin and wobbles and sags just like loose skin would. Skin is a living organism, why in the world would it contract if it's still got some fat there keeping it ... fluffy.
To combat loose skin you might have or to prevent it:
Take Vitamin C
Take Fish Oil
Exfoliate EVERY OTHER DAY
Massage the area for thirty minutes
Use Kokum mixed with cocoa butter to protect that skin.
Do cardio, pick up heavy things and put them back down. Don't even worry about loose skin until you reach 18 percent body fat. Seriously.
Good Luck Lady.0 -
First off, congratulations on your weight loss
I too am 23 and have lost 100 lbs over the past 15 months. I would definitely start resistance/weight training. It's a great way to build lean muscle mass--the more you have, the more calories you will burn, especially during cardio exercises. I started my journey back in Dec 2012 and was a a PBF of 43% and now I am at 18%. I started out doing pure cardio and eating healthier but as I started loosing a lot of weight, I began resistance training. Thus far I've lost 102 lbs of body fat and have gained 6 lbs of lean muscle. I don't have any loose or sagging skin (I don't know if it has to do with genetics) but I drink a lot of water, moisturize my skin daily (my whole body) and lift weights. I think that has helped considerably.
As for breaking through a plateau, resistance training definitely helped me on that front. Also, to start losing those last few pounds, I began doing more HIIT workouts. I don't know if you go to a gym, but if you do, you should look into whether or not they have any cross training classes. Good luck with the rest of your journey! And congratulations again! 0 -
So going on the premise that women don't build a lot of muscle and this "bag of skin" we live in has a lot of extra play from a large weight loss then just how much muscle would we assume needs to be gained in order to take up the slack from a 100 lb plus weight loss? I still think the whole lift heavy to shrink loose skin is BS. It's just something to do to occupy your time while nature takes it coarse and redistributes skin cells. If it happens then it's attributed to the lifting, if it doesn't happen then what?
If it doesn't happen, then you've only managed to increase lean body mass, decrease body fat, increase metabolic efficiency, increase tissue tensile strength, increase bone density, decrease physiological stress, among other things. Darn. All that for nothing.
Favourite post of the day :flowerforyou:0 -
Stop trying to lose weight. Loose skin can rebound, but it can take up to two years. After that, what you have is what you are going to have.
Instead of trying to lose weight, get yourself on your maintenance calories, eat lots of protein, start lifting weights, and try to do some body recomposition. There may be fat there, but eating at 1200 is not going to get rid of it as you can't lose it quickly. Progress now will be measured by a measuring tape more than the scale. http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/1164025-loose-skin-the-real-deal0 -
I'm not trying to be a smart *kitten* but what is resistance training going to do for loose skin?
Nothing. It's one of the standard MFP myths.
Resistance training doesn't get rid of loose skin, but it makes the particular area look much better. Many weight lifting exercises, if not most, will work the core (abs) as secondary muscles. If you tone your abs any loose skin area on top of them will look significantly better, but how much better depends on how much loose skin you have. For someone who has not been weight training the difference can be like night and day. Don't waste your time with crunches. They are not very efficient. Just do weight training without worrying much about your abs. Throw in some core targeting exercises like planking if you like. If you do this consistently, over time you will be happy with the change in how your belly works. Take a before picture of your belly and check against it say once a month. You will see results.0 -
I'm not trying to be a smart *kitten* but what is resistance training going to do for loose skin?
Nothing. It's one of the standard MFP myths.
Well, while resistance training may not help the loose skin directly, if you build up the muscle underneath the skin it can greatly improve the appearance.
I would say that depends on how much loose skin there is. If it's very much at all, you won't notice a difference.0 -
My advice is similar to the earlier posters - don't rely on scale weight to estimate body fat - get the body fat properly measured to figure out whether this actually is "loose skin". Then decisions can be made from a position of knowledge.
This.
It just makes no sense to sit around guessing. Go get a comprehensive body composition test, and know for sure.
Nice idea, but there is nowhere around where I live that does such a test.0 -
what counts as resistances/strength training? does cardio kickboxing count? we do squats, pushups, punches kicks, crunches, planks.0
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This is one of those big things that my personal journey through weight loss has taught me. After I lost about 80-100 on my own I'm in the final stretch of my weight loss journey and am looking to get to around 18% body fat, which is about 7.5-11 pounds away for me. Listen, I have done research out the wazoo on this one. I even went to see a doctor, fearing the worst: That I needed a tummy tuck I couldn't afford. I was delighted when he said I have some excess skin, but would highly recommend lipo first. Do you know what that means? LIPOSUCTION MEANS FAT.
I've confirmed this online and with a friend who is a body builder, I have some excess skin, but I have a little fat left to lose.
People who tell you that they have excess skin which is more than 5-6mm thick when pinched still have residual fat. In that link earlier to Blue Eyed Betty, Yes, she has a good deal of excess skin, but she also has a HUGE amount of fat to still lose. As long as you don't have a super massive amount of skin left, It should tighten up reasonably so as your body fat gets down to a lower percentage. Yeah, this means that I have to work a little harder to get the jiggle off my middle. But I'm okay with that, because I'll get to have those rock hard abs.
Check out Sharee Hansen on Funeral for My Fat, this is a PERFECT example of actual loose skin instead of fat with loose skin, she shows her stomach in the video and you can clearly see it's just empty skin, and no more than a couple of millimeters thick. If you have 1 centimeter or more of pinch there, there is fat to lose. And I tested this theory on a place where I know that I have loose skin on my body, as well as on my dog who has yards of skin. (Sounds silly, but aside from fur their skin is still skin) It measured in at 4-6mm. Which is exactly where doctors on Real Self tell us skin should be.
So here is how you tell if it's legitimately fat or loose skin:
1: Does it jiggle? If so there is a 95% chance it's got fat inside
2: Does it have a thickness of more than 6mm? It's got fat inside.
3: Does it bounce if you push on it...probably fat.
4: Does it form a roll when you bend over? probably fat.
Subcutaneous fat is a son of a monkey's uncle to get rid of. It sits just beneath the skin. It forms to the skin and wobbles and sags just like loose skin would. Skin is a living organism, why in the world would it contract if it's still got some fat there keeping it ... fluffy.
To combat loose skin you might have or to prevent it:
Take Vitamin C
Take Fish Oil
Exfoliate EVERY OTHER DAY
Massage the area for thirty minutes
Use Kokum mixed with cocoa butter to protect that skin.
Do cardio, pick up heavy things and put them back down. Don't even worry about loose skin until you reach 18 percent body fat. Seriously.
Good Luck Lady.
I always wonder if massage doesn't actually stretch the skin - especially on the face.0 -
I am progressively loosing weight however my stomach doesn't seem to change much as I have a lot of loose skin from several years of gaining and loosing weight. I run and weight train but my stomach seems to not change much. I have pinched my hand and my belly fat and well they dont match so I know I have more fat to loose. So my question is can i loose or tighten the loose skin as I burn fat without having surgery? bc if my belly looked like my hand d he very happy.0
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