Losing Muscle?

susannamarie

Basically the body can liberate about 32 calories per lb of body fat, so it depends on how deep the deficit is and how much fat a person has....

I question this number. 1 gram of fat contains an average of 9 calories (kCal if we're being really precise). 1 pound is 454 grams, decimals aside. 1 pound (454 grams) of body fat is on average 87% lipid. 454g * 87% * 9 = 3555 calories.

They mean 32 calories per pound per day. I've seen 31 instead but close enough. IOW, you can get the whole 3500 calories -- just not all in one day.

Siansonea

So, if you're smaller overall, why would you need the same muscle mass you had when you were larger? Your body has less mass to carry around and keep upright, so wouldn't it need less muscle mass to do all that lifting and carrying? :huh:

susannamarie

So, if you're smaller overall, why would you need the same muscle mass you had when you were larger? Your body has less mass to carry around and keep upright, so wouldn't it need less muscle mass to do all that lifting and carrying? :huh:

First, losing muscle doesn't affect only the muscles that carry you around, but also muscles such as your heart, so avoiding excessive muscle loss is necessary so your body doesn't lose the necessary muscles with the no longer necessary.

Secondly, many people increase activity significantly when they lose weight, so the amount of muscle that was reasonable for the inactive obese person is still reasonable for the more active slender person.

Lastly, losing enough muscle can result in needing to lose significantly more weight to reach the desired bodyfat level/aesthetic appearance, resulting in needing to eat significantly fewer calories to maintain weight, which can cause problems with regain.

johan1585

ok just when i think i understand something i then get confused again..

i'm 242lb i have a 1000 cals a day deficit i burn on adverage 800 cals 4 times a week and i have gained a 1lb!
i was told this is because of muscle built from gym.... my body must of been burning fat as i have lost inches.. so is it right if you have a deficit and are using muscle then your engery source will be body fat especially someone of my size? would that also explain how i have put on weight....?

one confused little lady from the UK
p.s feel free to add and inbox to explain this more if you like...

Could allso be blood vollume increase

tigersword

Your body is constantly breaking down muscle tissue. During caloric maintenance, there's enough fuel coming in to repair all the muscle tissue being broken down. During a caloric deficit, there isn't. The larger the deficit, the less muscle, bone, and organ tissue can be replaced after being broken down. While strength training can help maintain a level of muscle mass during moderate deficit (by convincing the body that the muscle is a requirement for survival,) if the deficit is too large it's impossible for the body to make up the difference. Yes, your body dips into fat stores for energy purposes, however, like muscle breakdown, that occurs every second of every day, no matter how much you eat. Like muscle, if you are eating at maintenance, your body refills the fat stores that were used to maintain homeostasis. In a deficit, there isn't enough fuel to refill the fat stores. In a severe deficit, the body will actually swing toward prioritizing refilling fat stores rather than repairing muscle as a survival mechanism, as in periods of famine you can survive much longer with little muscle and lots of fat than you can with lots of muscle and little fat.

That's why small to moderate deficit plus some form of strength training tends to be the "magic formula" for long term success.

Derf_Smeggle

Basically the body can liberate about 32 calories per lb of body fat, so it depends on how deep the deficit is and how much fat a person has....

I question this number. 1 gram of fat contains an average of 9 calories (kCal if we're being really precise). 1 pound is 454 grams, decimals aside. 1 pound (454 grams) of body fat is on average 87% lipid. 454g * 87% * 9 = 3555 calories.

They mean 32 calories per pound per day. I've seen 31 instead but close enough. IOW, you can get the whole 3500 calories -- just not all in one day.

Ah-ha. I see what they were talking about now. Slightly confusing the way it was written.

Siansonea

So, if you're smaller overall, why would you need the same muscle mass you had when you were larger? Your body has less mass to carry around and keep upright, so wouldn't it need less muscle mass to do all that lifting and carrying? :huh:

First, losing muscle doesn't affect only the muscles that carry you around, but also muscles such as your heart, so avoiding excessive muscle loss is necessary so your body doesn't lose the necessary muscles with the no longer necessary.

Secondly, many people increase activity significantly when they lose weight, so the amount of muscle that was reasonable for the inactive obese person is still reasonable for the more active slender person.

Lastly, losing enough muscle can result in needing to lose significantly more weight to reach the desired bodyfat level/aesthetic appearance, resulting in needing to eat significantly fewer calories to maintain weight, which can cause problems with regain.

Oh, izzat so? I'd sure like to see the numbers we're talking about here, and rigorous scientific research about this, etc.

Siansonea

Your body is constantly breaking down muscle tissue. During caloric maintenance, there's enough fuel coming in to repair all the muscle tissue being broken down. During a caloric deficit, there isn't. The larger the deficit, the less muscle, bone, and organ tissue can be replaced after being broken down. While strength training can help maintain a level of muscle mass during moderate deficit (by convincing the body that the muscle is a requirement for survival,) if the deficit is too large it's impossible for the body to make up the difference. Yes, your body dips into fat stores for energy purposes, however, like muscle breakdown, that occurs every second of every day, no matter how much you eat. Like muscle, if you are eating at maintenance, your body refills the fat stores that were used to maintain homeostasis. In a deficit, there isn't enough fuel to refill the fat stores. In a severe deficit, the body will actually swing toward prioritizing refilling fat stores rather than repairing muscle as a survival mechanism, as in periods of famine you can survive much longer with little muscle and lots of fat than you can with lots of muscle and little fat.

That's why small to moderate deficit plus some form of strength training tends to be the "magic formula" for long term success.

Quite a claim. Evidence?

neanderthin

Your body is constantly breaking down muscle tissue. During caloric maintenance, there's enough fuel coming in to repair all the muscle tissue being broken down. During a caloric deficit, there isn't. The larger the deficit, the less muscle, bone, and organ tissue can be replaced after being broken down. While strength training can help maintain a level of muscle mass during moderate deficit (by convincing the body that the muscle is a requirement for survival,) if the deficit is too large it's impossible for the body to make up the difference. Yes, your body dips into fat stores for energy purposes, however, like muscle breakdown, that occurs every second of every day, no matter how much you eat. Like muscle, if you are eating at maintenance, your body refills the fat stores that were used to maintain homeostasis. In a deficit, there isn't enough fuel to refill the fat stores. In a severe deficit, the body will actually swing toward prioritizing refilling fat stores rather than repairing muscle as a survival mechanism, as in periods of famine you can survive much longer with little muscle and lots of fat than you can with lots of muscle and little fat.

That's why small to moderate deficit plus some form of strength training tends to be the "magic formula" for long term success.

QFT

tigersword

Your body is constantly breaking down muscle tissue. During caloric maintenance, there's enough fuel coming in to repair all the muscle tissue being broken down. During a caloric deficit, there isn't. The larger the deficit, the less muscle, bone, and organ tissue can be replaced after being broken down. While strength training can help maintain a level of muscle mass during moderate deficit (by convincing the body that the muscle is a requirement for survival,) if the deficit is too large it's impossible for the body to make up the difference. Yes, your body dips into fat stores for energy purposes, however, like muscle breakdown, that occurs every second of every day, no matter how much you eat. Like muscle, if you are eating at maintenance, your body refills the fat stores that were used to maintain homeostasis. In a deficit, there isn't enough fuel to refill the fat stores. In a severe deficit, the body will actually swing toward prioritizing refilling fat stores rather than repairing muscle as a survival mechanism, as in periods of famine you can survive much longer with little muscle and lots of fat than you can with lots of muscle and little fat.

That's why small to moderate deficit plus some form of strength training tends to be the "magic formula" for long term success.

Quite a claim. Evidence?

Open a biology textbook? It's very basic human biology. The body goes back and forth between being anabolic (building stuff) and catabolic (tearing stuff down) on a constant basis. When you eat, you shift into anabolic mode. Once the food is digested and partitioned, the body shifts into catabolic mode. Cells die by the millions every day (sounds like a lot, but the human body contains roughly 100 trillion cells,) when they die, they get broken down and depending on what they are, may be used for fuel, or may just be eliminated. How many of those millions of cells get replaced depends on how much food is eaten. The order they get replaced in depends purely on need for survival. That's why hair loss is commonly the first symptom of starvation and malnutrition; hair is important for UV protection from the sun, but not as important as skin, bones, heart, brain, and muscles.

As for muscle vs fat partitioning, again, depending on how severe the deficit is, the body may preferentially store fat and continue to catabolize muscle in a quest for homeostasis; muscle is metabolically active, and in times of terrible famine (the human body doesn't know "dieting" it just knows food is abundant or scarce based on how much it receives) muscle is shed so that the body will need less calories for homestasis. Strength training requires the use of muscle, which forces the body to hang on to it, as again, the body doesn't understand "exercise;" it just knows that the muscles are being used and are now necessary for survival and need to be maintained.