Suggestions for improving OHP

mommabenefield

... I stalled for the first time at 60lbs the other day and managed to push out 5x5 @ 60lbs yesterday, but I have a strong feeling i will stall at 65lbs tomorrow.

I do them standing and notice its really hard on my neck and back, by the time I get to the last set I am really struggling.

Anyway overall suggestions for this exercise would be very helpful.

Thanks :drinker:

FrnkLft

Don't sweat this at all, there's a lot of ebbs & flows in lifting. Think long term. Also, OHP is a bear... weakest lift for just about everyone.

The SL program (and most other programs too mind you) calls for a "reset" when you cannot finish a 5x5 with good form 3 times in a row. From your description it sounds like you might not have finished your last 60 lb 5x5 with good form. I would attempt 60 lbs again the next time and see how it goes. If it goes poorly - that's three attempts at 60lbs - hit the "reset" button and take it down 10%.

At 60 lbs, that means you should take it down to 55 lbs, or maybe even 50 lbs if need be (it's your training, you be the judge).

Resets are all about the "3 steps forward, one step back" mentality. It's an ego check, but it's a big part of training smart and improving strength long term.

JoRocka

There is a lot of bear wrestling that goes on with OHP. Use the cookies- load- and de load. Keep working it. as Ferny said... it's hard for EVERYONE.

edit- by cookies I mean the 2.5 lb weights

if you are still struggling- invest in 1 or 1.5 lb weights- they aren't expensive

mommabenefield

Don't sweat this at all, there's a lot of ebbs & flows in lifting. Think long term. Also, OHP is a bear... weakest lift for just about everyone.

The SL program (and most other programs too mind you) calls for a "reset" when you cannot finish a 5x5 with good form 3 times in a row. From your description it sounds like you might not have finished your last 60 lb 5x5 with good form. I would attempt 60 lbs again the next time and see how it goes. If it goes poorly - that's three attempts at 60lbs - hit the "reset" button and take it down 10%.

At 60 lbs, that means you should take it down to 55 lbs, or maybe even 50 lbs if need be (it's your training, you be the judge).

Resets are all about the "3 steps forward, one step back" mentality. It's an ego check, but it's a big part of training smart and improving strength long term.

Thanks that is helpful to hear that most struggle with it, at least that tells me I'm not being a pansy, I use the app to keep track of my logs and its telling me to +5 tomorrow, I may ignore it and try 60lbs again, I honestly don't think I could push 65lbs, so rather than waste the sets just do 60lbs.
I don't mind doing a reset if it ends up at that - thankfully my ego is sustained with my squats and DLs :laugh:

Thanks!:drinker:

There is a lot of bear wrestling that goes on with OHP. Use the cookies- load- and de load. Keep working it. as Ferny said... it's hard for EVERYONE.

edit- by cookies I mean the 2.5 lb weights

if you are still struggling- invest in 1 or 1.5 lb weights- they aren't expensive

hahah just had to say I love that descrip of the 2.5s .... forever imprinted in my brain as cookies:laugh: ps sooo not ashamed of needing the 2.5s they are my friends right now lol

cwolfman13

do what the program says to do. if you miss a few times, de-load and reset. OH press is the bane for most people. I didn't really make much headway until I moved on to Wendler's 5/3/1 and started adding a little assistance work in there. Also, the further you progress, the less linear the strength gains are...and if you're at a deficit you're going to stall out faster. You just have to keep at it.

mommabenefield

do what the program says to do. if you miss a few times, de-load and reset. OH press is the bane for most people. I didn't really make much headway until I moved on to Wendler's 5/3/1 and started adding a little assistance work in there. Also, the further you progress, the less linear the strength gains are...and if you're at a deficit you're going to stall out faster. You just have to keep at it.

Thanks It sounds like I should do some prep reading on Wendler's... I am trying to stay at a small deficit, so I am being realistic about the gains stalling out... I just never realized how much of a beast OHPs were if anything I thought I would struggle more with the BP if anything (WRONG!) lol

Any tips on keeping my form in check?
I dont think I'm doing it wrong persay but better to ask than to guess.

amberlykay1014

Any tips on keeping my form in check?
I dont think I'm doing it wrong persay but better to ask than to guess.

Yes, OHP is hard for me too! I try to focus on keeping my knees straight and glutes tight. Push your torso out so it's under the bar.

FrnkLft

I wouldn't switch to 5/3/1 just yet. That's the program I use normally (I'm actually using 5x5 right now though, coming off an injury) but it has you progressing much slower, and is not for beginners. It's for someone who has truely stalled out on beginner programs like SL 5x5 (you can't keep adding 5 lbs per workout forever).

About the SL 5x5 app, I love it, great app. It automatically logs increments up when you hit your sets/reps, and if you fail 3 times it will automatically drop the weight back down. When you realize that you might have completed a 5x5, but without good form (read: does not always have to be perfect, again, it's your training you be the judge), just fill in the last set with 4 instead of 5 reps (tap the honey comb twice). That way it won't increment up for the next one.

JoRocka

hahah just had to say I love that descrip of the 2.5s .... forever imprinted in my brain as cookieslaugh ps sooo not ashamed of needing the 2.5s they are my friends right now lol

I have no idea where that came from- we have been calling them that since I was in college- early 2000's. It's always stuck- it just makes me smile- I need a 45 and a cookie... or a 25 and a cookie.

And that's how I ask for a weight to- I always say "throw a cookie on there" or "add a cookie" I get some weird looks if it's some one I don't lift with normally. LOL.

Girl- don't be ashamed- I have 45's stacked on my DL... and then one little baby cookie on the outside- you know how fricking stupid it looks? It makes me bust out laughing every time- but I get stuck- so I add them. It is what it is. Anyone ashamed to use them clearly has never stalled before.

Any tips on keeping my form in check?
I dont think I'm doing it wrong persay but better to ask than to guess.

always good to do checks- even as you progress it's helpful to have someone coaching you- it's why professionals- guess what- they have coaches or lifting buddies too.
EVERYONE needs to be reminded to keep things tucked- lifted- shifted- gazing x- not stiff here bla bla bla.

You can do it yourself for yourself... video the lifts- do it progressively - do bar only - do light weight- heavy weight- compare 2 weeks ago- to current. Always helpful. Don't be afraid to post up here- or BB.com- or on nerdfitness- somewhere lifting friendly.

I coach people- and I still need a check. it's totally normal.

Also keep in mind- don't be afraid to throw a little engish on a weight and just do it- if the goal is 4 reps- and you did 3 shakey ones- don't always just quit because "oh my form is going"... sometimes you just gotta do it.

I stalled on 85 lbs- and my top set- I did one rep- and I couldn't do the second one- so I pushed pressed it instead.

ideal ? nope.
did it count? nope
but i still finished it.

You have to learn your body and do it safely... but men tend to lose form in favor of weight- where women show the tendancy to value form to a fault (won't add a weight because they feel shakey)

that's okay if you are a little shakey- nothing is perfect when you get heavy. Just be smart- don't blow your back out with super heavy weight- but don't just give up because you wobbled once... hopefully that makes sense.

mommabenefield

I wouldn't switch to 5/3/1 just yet. That's the program I use normally (I'm actually using 5x5 right now though, coming off an injury) but it has you progressing much slower, and is not for beginners. It's for someone who has truely stalled out on beginner programs like SL 5x5 (you can't keep adding 5 lbs per workout forever).

About the SL 5x5 app, I love it, great app. It automatically logs increments up when you hit your sets/reps, and if you fail 3 times it will automatically drop the weight back down. When you realize that you might have completed a 5x5, but without good form (read: does not always have to be perfect, again, it's your training you be the judge), just fill in the last set with 4 instead of 5 reps (tap the honey comb twice). That way it won't increment up for the next one.

yea no, not switching, just reading up is all I meant, .... Yea I like the app too great and simple, its just Mendhi hasnt invested any time in fixing it to run smoothly for the IPhone (even before IOS7 it was glitchy for me)

FrnkLft

Yeah I know, frustrating. Can't manually change the weight either. I had to log a bunch of fake workouts just to get the weights up to the level that I wanted to start at. He posted about the app problem however, he had to get a new guy to work on it since the old guy was unavailable to do the update. ETA unknown, oh well.

About Wendler, you should buy his book on Amazon. Get the second edition, excellent program for intermediate lifters. "Start slow, progress slowly, use compound lifts, set PRs."

cwolfman13

I wouldn't switch to 5/3/1 just yet. That's the program I use normally (I'm actually using 5x5 right now though, coming off an injury) but it has you progressing much slower, and is not for beginners. It's for someone who has truely stalled out on beginner programs like SL 5x5 (you can't keep adding 5 lbs per workout forever).

About the SL 5x5 app, I love it, great app. It automatically logs increments up when you hit your sets/reps, and if you fail 3 times it will automatically drop the weight back down. When you realize that you might have completed a 5x5, but without good form (read: does not always have to be perfect, again, it's your training you be the judge), just fill in the last set with 4 instead of 5 reps (tap the honey comb twice). That way it won't increment up for the next one.

yea no, not switching, just reading up is all I meant, .... Yea I like the app too great and simple, its just Mendhi hasnt invested any time in fixing it to run smoothly for the IPhone (even before IOS7 it was glitchy for me)

Agreed, don't switch it up just yet...there is still progress to be made. Wendler's program is much, much slower in terms of strength gains but you should definitely read his book...it is probably the best intermediate strength training/power lifting book out there and there's a lot you can do with it without violating the routine's most basic principles...it's very flexible.

SezxyStef

Don't sweat this at all, there's a lot of ebbs & flows in lifting. Think long term. Also, OHP is a bear... weakest lift for just about everyone.

The SL program (and most other programs too mind you) calls for a "reset" when you cannot finish a 5x5 with good form 3 times in a row. From your description it sounds like you might not have finished your last 60 lb 5x5 with good form. I would attempt 60 lbs again the next time and see how it goes. If it goes poorly - that's three attempts at 60lbs - hit the "reset" button and take it down 10%.

At 60 lbs, that means you should take it down to 55 lbs, or maybe even 50 lbs if need be (it's your training, you be the judge).

Resets are all about the "3 steps forward, one step back" mentality. It's an ego check, but it's a big part of training smart and improving strength long term.

Yah I had the same issue at 65lbs ...didn't feel my form was right....failed next workout at 65lbs but the next workout wham easy as pie, moved onto 70lbs it was great onto 75lbs...might not move up today as form wasn't "great".

No shame in staying at the same weight for form.

micheleb15

Girl- don't be ashamed- I have 45's stacked on my DL... and then one little baby cookie on the outside- you know how fricking stupid it looks? It makes me bust out laughing every time- but I get stuck- so I add them. It is what it is. Anyone ashamed to use them clearly has never stalled before.

This made me laugh - it's so true. I can never find them in my gym either, so I have to walk around and look for them - I cringe thinking about the day someone asks what I am looking for. I've got 2 45's, 2 25's and then 2 2.5's on my DL. Inside I die a little each time, but it works. My DLs are slowly creeping up.

explosivedonut

Slightly on topic: do you do an OHP standing or sitting? And where do I load up my barbell on my gym? I feel ashamed having to ask

mikemc620

One thing i have heard to increase the OHP and any other lift is to do more. That's it. Find another day where you can do it as an accessory lift. Lifting is practice, the more you do it the better you get.

FrnkLft

One thing i have heard to increase the OHP and any other lift is to do more. That's it. Find another day where you can do it as an accessory lift. Lifting is practice, the more you do it the better you get.

SL 5x5 doesn't have any assessory work. I guess you could add a Day 4 where you did some higher rep work, maybe 5x10 Bench, Squat, SL DL and Press...

OP, just as a note, you don't need to add a Day 4. This is conversational.

cookies

Cookies... gold. I'm going to use that with my GF. She's like a kid, she'll freaking love that.

Slightly on topic: do you do an OHP standing or sitting? And where do I load up my barbell on my gym? I feel ashamed having to ask

Ideally, you would do it standing. Standing however doesn't support your back the same way as sitting, and so you have to be more careful (focus on stiff core). Sitting is fine too though, but I don't see how someone could do this particularly well with a barbell, you might have to use dumbbells, which are hard to increase by only 5 lbs at a time.

mommabenefield

Slightly on topic: do you do an OHP standing or sitting? And where do I load up my barbell on my gym? I feel ashamed having to ask

i do it standing, Ive seen some do it sitting even on the smith machine, I just prefer not to jump from space to space as much as possible, so i stay in the squat rack area and do it standing, .... not sure i understand the second part but i load it about shoulder level in the squat rack and lift from there

mommabenefield

One thing i have heard to increase the OHP and any other lift is to do more. That's it. Find another day where you can do it as an accessory lift. Lifting is practice, the more you do it the better you get.

SL 5x5 doesn't have any assessory work. I guess you could add a Day 4 where you did some higher rep work, maybe 5x10 Bench, Squat, SL DL and Press...

OP, just as a note, you don't need to add a Day 4. This is conversational.


BTW cookies... gold. I'm going to use that with my GF. She's like a kid, she'll freaking love that.

Meh I just workout every other day, and try to make sure I have a rest between days,... I dont always get to work out on the weekends but i try at least one day. ... although the 'extra' day purposed for higher rep work is a good idea... *thinking*

explosivedonut

Slightly on topic: do you do an OHP standing or sitting? And where do I load up my barbell on my gym? I feel ashamed having to ask

i do it standing, Ive seen some do it sitting even on the smith machine, I just prefer not to jump from space to space as much as possible, so i stay in the squat rack area and do it standing, .... not sure i understand the second part but i load it about shoulder level in the squat rack and lift from there

You saying you did it in the squat rack answered my question! Thanks. I wasn't sure where exactly to do them.

FrnkLft

Meh I just workout every other day, and try to make sure I have a rest between days,... I dont always get to work out on the weekends but i try at least one day. ... although the 'extra' day purposed for higher rep work is a good idea... *thinking*

Stronglifts focuses on the 5 rep range, which is ideal for strength, but also has you doing a fair amount of volume along with it (not just 3 sets, but 5).

Higher rep work is better for hypertrophy, and can help with the main lifts as well (they are tough in their own right). Something like 5x10. Remember that you would have to drop the weight for the higher rep work. A good suggestion would be to do it with 50%-65% of your current 5 rep numbers.

That said, Stronglifts was designed to be done 3 days a week as programmed. I wouldn't mess with it right now, there's no need at all. Biggest mistake a novice can make, is trying to alter a program. You'll just end up spinning your wheels.