TDEE and Fitbit

honeylissabee

I am working on figuring out what works best for me, and I am torn between a traditional 500-1,000 deficit method and the TDEE- 20 method.

I have a FitBit that I wear, and I like having the FitBit adjustment- especially since my activity is somewhat sporadic.

I am wondering if I calculate my sedentary TDEE and take 20% from that, if I can just use my FitBit adjustment to determine how much I can eat from day to day, or if the math won't work out.

What if I use a formula to calculate my sedentary TDEE that uses my body fat percentage?

Ian_Stuart

If your activity is sporadic then I would recommend the TDEE-20, with your activity level set at sedentary and AT MOST, eat back half of your calories. With a true TDEE setup you shouldn't eat back your calories at all, so unless you have a ridiculously active day, I wouldn't eat back any of the calories as basic walking around type activity is included in the sedentary TDEE up to a point.

As for the BF% question, if you know your percentage with some accuracy then it will give you a better number to use the Katch-McArdle formula for sure, but I don't think that changes the answer from above.

tanyatabone9

This is really interesting. I have been sticking to what MFP tells me to do, which is 1570 calories. But when I calculate my TDEE on http://www.fitnessfrog.com/calculators/tdee-calculator.html, it tells me that my TDEE is about 2500. So if I take away 20% from that, that means that I would be eating about 2000. That's a fairly large discrepancy. What would you recommend?

Railr0aderTony

If your activity is sporadic then I would recommend the TDEE-20, with your activity level set at sedentary and AT MOST, eat back half of your calories. With a true TDEE setup you shouldn't eat back your calories at all, so unless you have a ridiculously active day, I wouldn't eat back any of the calories as basic walking around type activity is included in the sedentary TDEE up to a point.

As for the BF% question, if you know your percentage with some accuracy then it will give you a better number to use the Katch-McArdle formula for sure, but I don't think that changes the answer from above.

This^^^

samammay

I keep track of what fitbit tells me I burn and average it out over a month and use that as my TDEE. Then I use the TDEE -20% method.

I personally dont like having calories added from fitbit. I prelog my day and that just screws everything up.

WalkingAlong

Kind of looks like you're getting the same advice you got as when you asked this yesterday.

I'm not sure how you can use the TDEE-20% method with the MFP/Fitbit calorie adjustment, since MFP doesn't use that method. TDEE method = Fitbit method.
Adjustment for daily activity = MFP method
It doesn't make much sense to me to use both at the same time. But try it and see what happens. You won't break anything.

Mokey41

Kind of looks like you're getting the same advice you got as when you asked this yesterday.

I'm not sure how you can use the TDEE-20% method with the MFP/Fitbit calorie adjustment, since MFP doesn't use that method. TDEE method = Fitbit method.
Adjustment for daily activity = MFP method
It doesn't make much sense to me to use both at the same time. But try it and see what happens. You won't break anything.

^^^ This. Just pick something and stick with it for a month or two. If it isn't working then reassess. Asking repeatedly and never getting started doesn't reap results.

honeylissabee

My activity level is really very sporadic. There are some days where I only get out of bed to go to the bathroom or make something to eat. There are also days where I am out shopping and walking around for hours PLUS doing a 30 minute workout. I would love to just stick to the TDEE-20% method without worrying about extra exercise calories, but I don't know how to do that when my activity level is so sporadic.

At the same time, the MFP method makes me a little nervous. It'll set me up to eat under my BMR, etc. It seems that the TDEE-20% method is safer.

Starting Monday, I'm starting a Leslie Sansone walking program that will alternate between 30 minutes of cardio and 30 minutes of strength training 6 days a week. The rest of my time will be ranging from sedentary to lightly active. There's really no stability there. When I go out, I am out for a few hours and try to walk around, but if I'm home I barely get up to do that 30 minutes of exercise.

If I set myself to be sedentary, but I'm really lightly active, I'll be undereating. If I say I'm lightly active, but I'm actually sedentary, I'll end up overeating.

Mokey41

You're making this way more complicated than it needs to be. Set yourself to sedentary. The days you lay in bed will offset that days you move. Nothing you described comes even remotely close to being lightly active.

You can keep asking the same question over and over worded differently and the answer is going to be the same. Just pick a number and get started. Unless you NET less than 1200 for months you aren't going to be in any danger of the dreaded starvation mode. I'd err on the side of under eating if that makes any difference.

WalkingAlong

At the same time, the MFP method makes me a little nervous. It'll set me up to eat under my BMR, etc. It seems that the TDEE-20% method is safer.

As long as you eat over 1200 calories a day on average, virtually no authority (outside of this forum) would consider what you're doing remotely unsafe. If you're doing hard, 700+ calorie workouts daily, you might need to eat more. But for sedentary to lightly active, 1200-1500 isn't going to hurt anything.

I know it's hard for us 'black or white' thinkers. Don't make it harder than it needs to be. You don't have to hit some tiny calorie target every day that is both over your BMR but under TDEE minus 20% yet also includes eating back for all the time you spend shopping or doing a workout DVD. You will drive yourself insane. Pick a calorie goal in the 1200-1500 range, pick a steps goal over 5000, put on your Fitbit and carry on. Just my opinion.

I think trying to 'net' can be a recipe for disaster for people who get caught up in the details.

Amitysk

I have been wearing my fitbit daily for over a year. I feel as though it has a pretty accurate estimation of my activity level.

I set my MFP calorie goal to match what fitbit thinks I should eat every day (you can see on either the app on your phone or the dashboard from your computer) and then eat the excercise calories back that it estimates. If it looks like I won't earn any exercise calories that day, I will keep close eye on what fitbit thinks I have left to eat.

You could also set up your account with MFP to adjust for negative calories, that way you should be staying pretty close.

Hope this helps!

honeylissabee

It's actually interesting though. Most charts/guides say light exercise 1-3 hours a week make you "lightly active" so if I'm doing a 30 minute workout 6 days a week, that would make me lightly active by that definition. Personally, I wouldn't consider it to be "lightly active" but that's what it is defined as on the different websites I've used to calculate my TDEE.

And what about January when my goal is to do 30-75 minutes of exercise 6 days per week? The calorie difference between a 30 minute strength training workout and a 75 minute cardio session is going to be pretty significant. Is the TDEE-20% method better for those who have a stable schedule where their activities are about the same from day to day?

And the TDEE-20% thing also confuses me at times. If I'm sedentary, then my TDEE-20% may have me eating below my BMR. So, the natural thing would be to eat TDEE-15%. I am obese by all standards. I shouldn't be at the point where a 20% reduction is too much.

Koldnomore

Just set MFP tolightly active and lose .5/week and go from there. It's all estimates so you will have to play with it as you get closer to your goal weight.

I would suggest starting yourself a spreadsheet and keep track yourself for a while. If you gain weight eat less, if you lose too fast eat more. Everyone will be different so it's hard to say what will work for you aside from the generalizations. Just don't complicate things. If you are not comfortable with TDEE and I wasn't for a very long time either - for the same reason as you (too much varied activity) then just stick with MFP. Why mess with something that is working?

Mokey41

It's actually interesting though. Most charts/guides say light exercise 1-3 hours a week make you "lightly active" so if I'm doing a 30 minute workout 6 days a week, that would make me lightly active by that definition. Personally, I wouldn't consider it to be "lightly active" but that's what it is defined as on the different websites I've used to calculate my TDEE.

And what about January when my goal is to do 30-75 minutes of exercise 6 days per week? The calorie difference between a 30 minute strength training workout and a 75 minute cardio session is going to be pretty significant. Is the TDEE-20% method better for those who have a stable schedule where their activities are about the same from day to day?

And the TDEE-20% thing also confuses me at times. If I'm sedentary, then my TDEE-20% may have me eating below my BMR. So, the natural thing would be to eat TDEE-15%. I am obese by all standards. I shouldn't be at the point where a 20% reduction is too much.

Something else to think about. If you are obese and you calculate your BMR then it's probably wrong. BMR calculators are set up using averages of normal people. Once you get off onto either end of the scale they become less and less accurate because it's assuming you have a certain percentage of lean body mass based on your weight which in the obese is not true. An obese person can safely eat under their BMR because you don't need to feed the fat, you want to maintain your lean body mass only.

A 20% cut puts you low because you are sedentary so your general activity doesn't put you at much over your supposed BMR. You have to exert energy to accumulate a higher TDEE. The act of just being upright doesn't really burn much.

If you have this much time to put into worrying about how to track exercise you haven't even started doing yet then surely when you do get around to doing it you'd have 5 minutes a day to log it? The simplest way is going to be to use MFP as intended.

honeylissabee

Losing to fast doesn't exactly scare me. Trust me, if there was a way I can drop 5 pounds a week without eating too little (I do have a fear that I'll lose control if I eat too little for a while, and then eat enough one day; it's happened before.)

Honestly, I haven't really found ANYTHING that has worked long-term. I've lost weight here and there, but I haven't done it long-term. I've tried Weight Watchers, South Beach, Paleo, very low calorie diets, Sparkpeople, Myfitnesspal, cutting out chemical additives. Nothing has worked long-term, and I always gain the weight back. I've done a lot of trial and error... but next to no trial and success.

Typically, my efforts can be lumped into 3 categories:

1. Plans that I haven't been able to stick to long enough to see ANY weight loss
2. Plans that I've been able to stick to for a few weeks and lose less than 10 pounds- only to gain it right back.
3. Plans I've been able to stick to long enough to drop a significant amount of weight, but gain it right back because I'm unable to turn it into a lifestyle change that works even when things change (moving, new school, new job, vacation, holidays).

The only type diet I haven't tried is a prepackaged diet plan like Nutrisystem or Jenny Craig. I'm not interested in trying those ones. Even South Beach is a challenge for me. I can't enjoy any sweets/treats on it at ALL since I can't eat any fake sugar/artificial sweeteners.

My friend is looking at trying Ideal Protein. Since I can't eat most of their products, that's not an option for me.

I think I'm running out of things to try!

honeylissabee

It's actually interesting though. Most charts/guides say light exercise 1-3 hours a week make you "lightly active" so if I'm doing a 30 minute workout 6 days a week, that would make me lightly active by that definition. Personally, I wouldn't consider it to be "lightly active" but that's what it is defined as on the different websites I've used to calculate my TDEE.

And what about January when my goal is to do 30-75 minutes of exercise 6 days per week? The calorie difference between a 30 minute strength training workout and a 75 minute cardio session is going to be pretty significant. Is the TDEE-20% method better for those who have a stable schedule where their activities are about the same from day to day?

And the TDEE-20% thing also confuses me at times. If I'm sedentary, then my TDEE-20% may have me eating below my BMR. So, the natural thing would be to eat TDEE-15%. I am obese by all standards. I shouldn't be at the point where a 20% reduction is too much.

Something else to think about. If you are obese and you calculate your BMR then it's probably wrong. BMR calculators are set up using averages of normal people. Once you get off onto either end of the scale they become less and less accurate because it's assuming you have a certain percentage of lean body mass based on your weight which in the obese is not true. An obese person can safely eat under their BMR because you don't need to feed the fat, you want to maintain your lean body mass only.

A 20% cut puts you low because you are sedentary so your general activity doesn't put you at much over your supposed BMR. You have to exert energy to accumulate a higher TDEE. The act of just being upright doesn't really burn much.

If you have this much time to put into worrying about how to track exercise you haven't even started doing yet then surely when you do get around to doing it you'd have 5 minutes a day to log it? The simplest way is going to be to use MFP as intended.

My BMI is somewhere between 31 and 32. Yes, I know that's not the most accurate method of determining healthy body weight. According to my handheld body fat analyzer, my body fat is somewhere around 38-40% though I haven't calculated it in several weeks. Neither are best for determining that I'm obese, but I do know that I'm not super obese or anything like that.

Mokey41

At 40% BF you are morbidly obese so BMR really isn't an accurate number for you without medical testing.

Amberh82

I have been wearing my fitbit daily for over a year. I feel as though it has a pretty accurate estimation of my activity level.

I set my MFP calorie goal to match what fitbit thinks I should eat every day (you can see on either the app on your phone or the dashboard from your computer) and then eat the excercise calories back that it estimates. If it looks like I won't earn any exercise calories that day, I will keep close eye on what fitbit thinks I have left to eat.

You could also set up your account with MFP to adjust for negative calories, that way you should be staying pretty close.

Hope this helps!

This is what I do....however, I noticed that with the MFP adjustment, MFP was giving me 166 calories more than what fitbit told me to eat (which was 500 lower than what I burn each day so technically with MFP I was only getting a 333 daily deficit instead of 500 if that makes sensee) so I had to actually go in and manually adjust my MFP daily calorie goal down so that MFP and Fitbit "what I should eat" would match up....

honeylissabee

At 40% BF you are morbidly obese so BMR really isn't an accurate number for you without medical testing.

Well, since I'm unemployed, that's not really going to happen right now.

My body fat percentage is an estimate. I use a handheld analyzer, but I know I'm probably not doing my measurements in "ideal" circumstances, and it's my understanding that those things aren't the most accurate (though better than the scales that claim to measure body fat percentage).

And what about BMR calculations that take into account body fat percentage?

Ian_Stuart

I just flipped through your diary and you aren't even logging things right now. The one day that was fairly filled out was a bad day. Take your sedentary TDEE, subtract 20% from it and eat around that number. All else is nit picking.

Mojofilter

You're clearly frustrated from trying everything and nothing working, but you just need to pick something, stick with it and try not to over think it.

As you're wearing a FitBit so you'll pretty accurately know how many calories that you're 'burning' on any given day, just make sure that you eat less than that amount and you'll lose weight.
The bigger the deficit the faster you'll lose but the harder it will be to stick to so you need to find a balance, but even 1 calorie a day is small progress towards your goal.

Stay positive

For what it's worth I set my calorie goal to maintain my current weight and just try to eat less than that, some days I do it by 1500 calories and others (mostly at weekends) I eat all the way up to it, or anywhere in between. It keeps it flexible and I lose about a pound a week.

honeylissabee

Technically,I wasn't even logging. I've been trying to eat cleaner, and I WAS just logging my food in the note's section, but I've kinda gotten away from that in the past couple days. The "bad day" was just me playing around with the tracker features.

WinoGelato

I am working on figuring out what works best for me, and I am torn between a traditional 500-1,000 deficit method and the TDEE- 20 method.

I have a FitBit that I wear, and I like having the FitBit adjustment- especially since my activity is somewhat sporadic.

I am wondering if I calculate my sedentary TDEE and take 20% from that, if I can just use my FitBit adjustment to determine how much I can eat from day to day, or if the math won't work out.

What if I use a formula to calculate my sedentary TDEE that uses my body fat percentage?

If you are using a FitBit, you don't need the calculators. The Calories Burned through FitBit are your TDEE, especially since most of what you are describing you do for exercise fits pretty well with what FitBit is designed to track. So I would not use the "calculators" and instead go to your FitBit site, look at your average calories burned over a week, two weeks, or a month and that is your TDEE. You can then set your -20% calorie goal from that.

Alternatively, put the rate you want to lose weight into your FitBit goals (0.5 lbs/week, 1 lb/week, etc). It will automatically deduct 250 cal or 500 cal from the estimate of how many calories you will burn at the end of the day. Put the food you eat in MFP so that it synchs with FitBit but just go with the FitBit estimate of how many calories you have left for the day since it is dynamic, the goal you would put into MFP for TDEE-20% is static.

Good luck.

jonnythan

Here's what I find makes the most sense and works best:

Go to My Home -> Goals. Click Change Goals, then Custom. Make sure "Sedentary" is selected and hit Update Profile. Now go back to Goals and do Custom. Look under My Diet Profile and find "calories burned from normal daily activity." Take 500 off that number and enter that into Net Calories Consumed. Set your carbs to 40%, protein 30%, fat 30%. Hit Change Goals.

Now let Fitbit adjust that calorie goal up as you burn calories from activity.

Enjoy.

NRSPAM

Or just trade your fitbit in for a bodymedia. No guesswork. Tells you every calorie you burn all day, and it subtracts 500 from that, and automatically updates your calorie goal when you plug it up. :happy: Or, just set to sedentary and add exercise as you go, if you usually lay in bed all day and night, with the exception of exercise.

jonnythan

The Bodymedia gives the same style of data as the Fitbit. The Fitbit is less obtrusive and seems to be more accurate over time, judging by people who have calculated TDEE based on intake and weight change.

honeylissabee

I am working on figuring out what works best for me, and I am torn between a traditional 500-1,000 deficit method and the TDEE- 20 method.

I have a FitBit that I wear, and I like having the FitBit adjustment- especially since my activity is somewhat sporadic.

I am wondering if I calculate my sedentary TDEE and take 20% from that, if I can just use my FitBit adjustment to determine how much I can eat from day to day, or if the math won't work out.

What if I use a formula to calculate my sedentary TDEE that uses my body fat percentage?

If you are using a FitBit, you don't need the calculators. The Calories Burned through FitBit are your TDEE, especially since most of what you are describing you do for exercise fits pretty well with what FitBit is designed to track. So I would not use the "calculators" and instead go to your FitBit site, look at your average calories burned over a week, two weeks, or a month and that is your TDEE. You can then set your -20% calorie goal from that.

Alternatively, put the rate you want to lose weight into your FitBit goals (0.5 lbs/week, 1 lb/week, etc). It will automatically deduct 250 cal or 500 cal from the estimate of how many calories you will burn at the end of the day. Put the food you eat in MFP so that it synchs with FitBit but just go with the FitBit estimate of how many calories you have left for the day since it is dynamic, the goal you would put into MFP for TDEE-20% is static.

Good luck.

In all honesty, I have a love-hate relationship with the Fitbit adjustment. I don't particularly care for the instability of my daily goals. Suppose I have a really active morning, but a not-so active afternoon. The extra 300 calories I earned in the AM could disappear by the end of the day. That always stressed me out, but so does the fear of under/overeating. I've been re-thinking things, and I think in a lot of ways, just logging my workouts separately (using my HRM) would be easier since that 200 calories would be a stable 200 calories.

In all honesty, I haven't worn my Fitbit in several weeks. It broke and I just got the replacement.

I've considered using my Fitbit to keep track of my steps/normal daily activities in order to help me determine how active i really am, but i also have times when i doubt those numbers/calculations. It's not so much that I think the Fitbit estimates are wrong. It's the way they translate. A few months ago, I was taking a minimum of 11,000 steps a day. I didn't do any strength training. I just went on several short (30 minute) or a couple longer walks- mostly to, from, and around local grocery stores. If I broke a sweat, it was because I did this in August. It was all very leisurely walking. Sure, I was getting 11,000 or more steps a day, but when you look at definitions that describe "hard labor" and "body building/construction", I didn't meet the "active" criteria.

Yet, my average calorie burn according to Fitbit WAS comparable to the moderately active and very active TDEE numbers on Fat2Fit Radio when I put in all of my into the calculator.

I think all the different data and information scares me. "Eating below your BMR is bad, but you should still go with what MyFitnessPal says to do even though they give you a 1,200 calorie diet."

And on top of all of this, I'm torn between using MFP and Sparkpeople. I'll admit, it's easier to log prepackaged and prepared (restaurant) foods on here. If I make a recipe that uses 2 cans of canned, diced tomatoes, I can put in "one can" on the nutrition label." Even on Sparkpeople, I still use MFP to look up restaurant foods, etc. The data here for that is just more accurate.

But generic food is better here than on Sparkpeople. I was looking for sugar today. Just plain, granulated, white sugar (I was seeing how many calories were in a recipe). If my diet is supposed to be primarily based on real, whole foods, then perhaps Sparkpeople would work better for me. I also am tempted by their calorie range compared to a single, set number.

I've used both sites with success, and there are certain things I like and dislike about both.

Mojofilter

Seriously, don't get stressed out about it and even more seriously - you're really over thinking this.

The FitBit adjustment is increased accuracy - you might not like it but it's just a reflection of reality. If you're worried about over eating just don't eat them on the day and save up anything you earn on FitBit for drinks with freinds / a meal out / other treat etc... at the weekend .
Your daily totals don't really matter as long as you roughly hit your weekly calorie goal.

The effect of slightly inaccurate information on a tin of tomatoes is going to make virtually zero difference to anything.

Seriously though, I've been a weight loss coach for 3 years so I know what I'm talking about - STOP stressing, STOP over thinking. Pick something and stick to it.

p4ulmiller

I am wondering if I calculate my sedentary TDEE and take 20% from that, if I can just use my FitBit adjustment to determine how much I can eat from day to day, or if the math won't work out.

Exactly this. Simply set your MFP profile to sedentary, link up your fitbit, and will give you a running total of your daily calorie limit.

Don't over-complicate it. You've got it sussed.