P.H.A.T and recovery

Escape_Artist

So I just moved on from SL to P.H.A.T after doing SL for almost a year. I never had any issue recovering from my lifts except the occasional DOMS which would go away quickly and not come back unless I took a week off.

I was expecting a bit of pain since I was moving to Isolation and my body isn't use to that at all. I have been in such pain non stop for the past 2 weeks it's crazy. I know I am not injured but I feel like I was bulldozed every morning when I wake up. My BF has to help me remove my clothes cause I can't lift my arms. (Not as funny and kinky as it sounds really...)

I have been foam rolling, taking Epsom salt baths and using tiger balm but it barely helps.
I was wondering if any of you guys had experience with this type of program and could tell me if this is normal at all.
I have read from the BB forums that people on PHAT felt sore all the time and I am starting to worry.

I started with around 1550 cals since I am cutting but upped them when I realized I was hungry as hell. I'm now around 1800 which is about 200 cals from my maintenance. I am still adjusting with the cals because I don't know yet what I need, it's a lot more intense than SL so I need to figure that part out still.

I am not taking supplements, I used to take BCAAs since I was working out fasted but i don't anymore.

Anyways, hoping some of you more experienced can give me advice on this.

For those not familiar with PHAT it looks like this (to not get into the details)

Day 1: Upper Body Power
Day 2: Lower Body Power
Day 3: Rest
Day 4: Back and Shoulders Hypertrophy
Day 5: Lower Body Hypertrophy
Day 6: Chest and Arms Hypertrophy
Day 7: Rest

I don't do any cardio and I don't do yoga anymore.

Thanks for the help

Escape_Artist

Bump!

pcastagner

Oh my. I ran into this when I did a similar split. Upper/lower, alternating heavy work with high volume work.

It's brutal, and in my case, led to systemic inflammation. The DOMS did not improve, even after 3 months.

My advice is to pick a goal and work on that. I went with strength.

jimmmer

I've not personally run PHAT, so takes this for what it's worth, but people I know who have done it all bombed out when they were cutting on it. These same people were previously doing ok when they were in a surplus...

Perhaps it's just too much on a cut (depending on age, genetics, etc) for some people?

MisterDerpington

I've mixed strength rep ranges with hypertrophy rep ranges without a problem. Though they were on the same day and done as a traditional body part split.

The program itself doesn't crazy. Maybe significantly lower the weights on hypertrophy days.

livingleanlivingclean

our training is based on phat ( I think), but we do 6 days out of 8...

for the first couple of weeks we (my husband and I) both felt wrecked. completely dead. I don't get doms, so I wasn't sore, just exhausted....it did get better though! we had enough after 14 weeks though, and did a deload for 2 weeks. we're now back on it and not feeling as bad as the first time round!

while we were doing it, we were increasing our macros gradually - how much would depend on weight and BF% changes taken weekly. our coach would let us know of increases. this time we're starting a mini-cut at the same time, although i'm still eating a minimum of about 2200 cals even on "low" days.

Escape_Artist

Oh my. I ran into this when I did a similar split. Upper/lower, alternating heavy work with high volume work.

It's brutal, and in my case, led to systemic inflammation. The DOMS did not improve, even after 3 months.

My advice is to pick a goal and work on that. I went with strength.

Ok so it's not just me!

Well still sh$t, I have to admit I absolutely love the program, the DOMS are terrible though! It's like they won't go away :grumble:

Think I should stick to it for another couple of weeks and see what it does? I was thinking it might be due to attempting to cut with this type of program so that's why I upped my cals this week but it didn't really change anything.

If I up my cals again I will be at maintenance. Mind you I am not even sure WHAT is maintenance anymore since this program is more intense it might be higher than when I was running SL :embarassed:

DavPul

Yeaaaaaah, you may want to ease into a transition like that. There's really no need to go from doing 3-ish exercises per day 3x per week to doing 8-ish exercises 4-5 days per week. Take that shish in steps.

Take a week off, pick an area to focus, then do 70% of the workout for that area and just part of the rest of the muscle groups. See how you do and keep adding gradually.

_SABOTEUR_

Yeaaaaaah, you may want to ease into a transition like that. There's really no need to go from doing 3-ish exercises per day 3x per week to doing 8-ish exercises 4-5 days per week. Take that shish in steps.

Take a week off, pick an area to focus, then do 70% of the workout for that area and just part of the rest of the muscle groups. See how you do and keep adding gradually.

I agree. When I started PHAT I did the big exercises and 2 of the accessories and added an accessory to each workout every week until I was up to full steam.

Escape_Artist

Thanks guys!!

I think I will keep it slow for the first couple of weeks and load progressively.

I'll keep my cals at around 1800, I guess 200ish short of maintenance is good besides I am in no hurry to cut, I like keeping my belly full :laugh:


:flowerforyou:

pcastagner

Oh my. I ran into this when I did a similar split. Upper/lower, alternating heavy work with high volume work.

It's brutal, and in my case, led to systemic inflammation. The DOMS did not improve, even after 3 months.

My advice is to pick a goal and work on that. I went with strength.

Ok so it's not just me!

Well still sh$t, I have to admit I absolutely love the program, the DOMS are terrible though! It's like they won't go away :grumble:

Think I should stick to it for another couple of weeks and see what it does? I was thinking it might be due to attempting to cut with this type of program so that's why I upped my cals this week but it didn't really change anything.

If I up my cals again I will be at maintenance. Mind you I am not even sure WHAT is maintenance anymore since this program is more intense it might be higher than when I was running SL :embarassed:

Lol, yeah, and I had some weird exchanges trying to talk about it with others. I got all kinds of newbie tips for DOMS and advice to take supplements.

It was just getting ridiculous though, and the final straw was when it started to affect my voice. I was such a ball of inflammation that any tiny technical error would result in swelling that ruined my sound.


So I decided to focus on strength, but some other possible solutions I pondered involved changing the hypertrophy-strength cycle from alternating to periodic.

jimmmer

Thanks guys!!

I think I will keep it slow for the first couple of weeks and load progressively.

I'll keep my cals at around 1800, I guess 200ish short of maintenance is good besides I am in no hurry to cut, I like keeping my belly full :laugh:


:flowerforyou:

You could always run it at (your educated guess for) maintenance for a four week block until you get used to the volume? Worry about cutting when you've got a handle on the routine?

pcastagner

Tababarnac une québécoise!

Ajoute-moi, christ

Escape_Artist

Tababarnac une québécoise!

Ajoute-moi, christ

:smooched:


@jimmmer, That's exactly what I will do!

Thanks all!

DavPul

You're welcome. If the area you choose to focus on is in the same general vicinity as your current profile pic, but sure to post updated pics. For the purpose of scientifically measuring progress, of course.

I'm all about the science

Escape_Artist

You're welcome. If the area you choose to focus on is in the same general vicinity as your current profile pic, but sure to post updated pics. For the purpose of scientifically measuring process, of course.

I'm all about the science

Of course lol

ElliottTN

I'm currently running the p.h.a.t. system right now and I love it. I had to tweak it just a bit because I'm also marathon training so I don't have a leg hypertrophy day (runs take care of that plus more)

I will say it did take me a full three weeks of running the system for my body to really catch up with what I was putting it through and I am naturally a pretty quick recovery type.

Give it some time for your body to adjust. This by far was the longest adjustment my body has ever taken to pick up a routine which isn't nec. a bad thing. Also, don't skip out on the speed work. You will want to but just don't, it helps tremendously.

If you do fall off the system then maybe try a split routine and come back to it. I can see where it may be a bit of a bigger adjustment to someone who is used to doing a strong lifts program because this one has a good deal of auxiliary and assistance work you are probably not used to in a routine.

Good luck and feel free to connect if you need any help with the program. I'm loving it so far.

pcastagner

I'm currently running the p.h.a.t. system right now and I love it. I had to tweak it just a bit because I'm also marathon training so I don't have a leg hypertrophy day (runs take care of that plus more)

I will say it did take me a full three weeks of running the system for my body to really catch up with what I was putting it through and I am naturally a pretty quick recovery type.

Give it some time for your body to adjust. This by far was the longest adjustment my body has ever taken to pick up a routine which isn't nec. a bad thing. Also, don't skip out on the speed work. You will want to but just don't, it helps tremendously.

If you do fall off the system then maybe try a split routine and come back to it. I can see where it may be a bit of a bigger adjustment to someone who is used to doing a strong lifts program because this one has a good deal of auxiliary and assistance work you are probably not used to in a routine.

Good luck and feel free to connect if you need any help with the program. I'm loving it so far.

In my case, I was already doing all the same moves as before, so I don't think auxiliary vs not was what did it. I am quite convinced that some of us are more susceptible to inflammation.

What's crazy is that if I do only high volume work, or only strength work, no problems. It's the alternating every workout that seems to do it,

ElliottTN

In my case, I was already doing all the same moves as before, so I don't think auxiliary vs not was what did it. I am quite convinced that some of us are more susceptible to inflammation.

What's crazy is that if I do only high volume work, or only strength work, no problems. It's the alternating every workout that seems to do it,

That is most likely very true. I won't lie, there were days where I drowned myself in advil and started sleeping more than 9 hours a night when I was adjusting to it.

The higher rep range days really took its toll on me initially as I had not done hypertrophy work in a very long time. I have really increased my cal intake for it even though I'm not on a bulk and I believed that helped. I'm not a big pusher of supplements because I think its an individuals choice but at any given time I'm on a bit of my own mixture which I believe it helps. Who knows if it is really working or just a placebo effect but I *believe* they have helped quite a bit with this amount of workload.