How 'Clean Eating' leads to 'Binge Eating'.

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  • Grokette
    Grokette Posts: 3,330 Member
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    Modification does not = change.

    my definition of change as it relates to a healthy lifestyle is different than yours.

    To each his own...............
  • kelsully
    kelsully Posts: 1,008 Member
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    I said in my first response that each needs to find what works for them. My newer lifestyle isn't a drastic change from my older lifestyle but it is still healthier. My issues were my portions more so than my food choices so for me moderation is healthy and good and appropriate. My mom needs to abstain like an alcoholic or she loses it. One french fry and all attempts to a healthier lifestyle are out the window. Me, I can have 5 french fries, enjoy the saltiness of them and move back to my dinner with satisfaction. People are far too complex to have a one way fits all approach to life. Everyone needs to find a way that they can live with that leads them to health.
  • lotusfromthemud
    lotusfromthemud Posts: 5,335 Member
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    People are far too complex to have a one way fits all approach to life. Everyone needs to find a way that they can live with that leads them to health.

    Exactly.
  • ChubbieTubbie
    ChubbieTubbie Posts: 481 Member
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    I think that eating in moderation IS a lifestyle change. If I used to eat until I was so full that I was nauseous and now I eat a quarter of that, I have made a change. I moved from binge eating to eating healthy amounts, and it's a big accomplishment. It may not be 100% healthy if I'm eating junk, but it most definitely is a change for the better!
    I am very pro-eating-in-moderation. It's the advice my endocrinologist gave me and it's the advice I stick by. I have lost weight this way in the past and I continue to do so now at a healthy pace. You don't have to totally give up what you enjoy to be fit and thin, but you do have to make changes. Just because it isn't the change you would make doesn't mean it's not a cause for celebration once a bad habit is broken.
    Just my two cents.
  • iamstaceywood
    iamstaceywood Posts: 383 Member
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    http://www.happiness-project.com/happiness_project/2009/01/quiz-are-you-a-moderator-or-an-abstainer.html

    This is an interesting, and connected blog post about "moderators" vs. "abstainers".

    For me, I cannot moderate. Having cake/cookies/pie refined sugar in general in "moderation" simply doesn't work. I get triggered, I want more sugar (and more and more and more) and then, well, I'm screwed. It is much easier for me to have none than have some.

    For me, and I think I'm hearing Grokette say this at the core of her argument...no junk is easier than some junk.

    If you read the article, notice the part where it says that people are extraordinarily judgemental/harsh towards people who the other approach is working for. I think we're just so hardwired to have one or the other be the correct approach for us that it's hard not to demand that it's the correct approach for everybody.

    {tiptoes backwards out of the the room}

    :flowerforyou:

    So, never before have i read a post from someone else and felt so "get out of my head!" as I do with this one. I started to diet in March of this year. I had made a serious change in my eating habbits by April. No processed, low fat, strict calorie counting, for months I ate 1600 calories daily (within 100) practically exactly. I lost 50 lbs. I got so much more in shape. Killed myself at the gym at least four days a week. Then I had a cheat day, I ate a pot roast melt at work. Then some fries. Then a funny bone. Then some ice cream. Its been a solid month of half healthy, half crap eating. I got back on the wagon yesterday. So long as I didn't budge even a little I was fine, now, i can't figure out how to get it back. I think im doing better now. We will see tho.
    I will add that I also felt like everyone who made different choices was an idiot and low carb dieters were so dumb. Who cares what everyone else does? Do you. Forget everyone else.
    I spose I had nothing to add, just had to say that your post spoke to me.
  • Mindful_Trent
    Mindful_Trent Posts: 3,954 Member
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    People are far too complex to have a one way fits all approach to life. Everyone needs to find a way that they can live with that leads them to health.

    Exactly.

    I definitely agree with this - although I choose to eat mostly clean, the concept of 'moderation' works better for some. My process was a gradual (but pretty dramatic) change over the course of a year and I'm at a place now where I feel fulfuilled without having to keep eating most of the treats I used to eat in moderation. The process is different for everyone, and I think as long as your choices are leading to a healthier you, that's what really matters.
  • Ms_Natalie
    Ms_Natalie Posts: 1,030 Member
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    I think everything I wanted to say has been said! Control is an amazing thing and a dangerous thing! You need to find the best balance, and I'm sure even the most elite athletes have moments of "whooops, shouldn't have eaten that"....but I believe this restriction needs to be broken at times to ensure that it doesn't do significant damage to your eating habits :flowerforyou:

    Thanks for sharing!.
  • LittleSpy
    LittleSpy Posts: 6,754 Member
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    I had to be an abstainer before I could be a moderator. :smile: But I've proven to myself that abstinence (and thinking of foods as forbidden, if you will) does NOT work for me long term (lost 40 pounds 6 years ago, gained 60 back). When I started MFP, I was majorly *addicted* to sugar. I abstained from candy of any kind because I could not be satisfied by moderation and at that point it was easier to avoid it completely than tempt myself with the idea of "moderation." I got past it and broke my addiction. Now I can have half of a candy bar or a square of chocolate and be completely fine.

    So, I'm a humongous fan of moderation these days. I eat generally healthy -- definitely healthier than ever before in my life and by far healthier than most people (everyone) I know. Yep, my diet consists of a slice of pizza here and a candy bar there. That's fine with me, and I've learned how to do it while continuing to lose weight (80 pounds in the last year). I strongly believe the majority of people who are healthy in general and are at healthy weights do not eat "cleanly" 100% of the time.

    The bottom line is you have to figure out what works and is sustainable for YOU in order to be healthier. That's going to vary widely from person to person, so debating which is the best way to go about it is pretty pointless. :flowerforyou: It's okay to stumble while searching for what works best for you. And you know what? What works for you now may not be what works best for you in the future. I know I'm constantly changing. And that's that.
  • SJSchwartz
    SJSchwartz Posts: 131
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    If "everything in moderation" isn't a lifestyle change, then why have I lost weight? If there were no change, then I would still be the same weight I was a month ago. Of course it's a lifestyle change! Compare it to "I'll eat this because it's so good, and I'll eat it until my stomach hurts because I just never know when I'm going to eat something this good again!". Now that I have the new "moderation" mentality, I'm learning how to feel full, as opposed to stuffed. This is working for me!

    Eating this way doesn't trigger any "sugar cravings" or leave me more hungry by eating "dirty" foods. But I suppose if I did have those cravings all the time and didn't have any self-control, then eating the "clean" way would probably have to be the way I would have to go to keep me from having ANY "dirty" food.
  • horizonflight
    horizonflight Posts: 75
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    This is a great post and probably perfectly describes many people who have the desire to lose weight. This is an eye-opener since I kind of had the same point of view on how to eat calories and what kind to eat. Although I must say that eating healthy food makes me feel a heck of a lot better than just eating fast food. But cheating every once in a while or controlling your intake is something I agree with and should really think about doing as well...
  • Grokette
    Grokette Posts: 3,330 Member
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    If "everything in moderation" isn't a lifestyle change, then why have I lost weight? If there were no change, then I would still be the same weight I was a month ago. Of course it's a lifestyle change! Compare it to "I'll eat this because it's so good, and I'll eat it until my stomach hurts because I just never know when I'm going to eat something this good again!". Now that I have the new "moderation" mentality, I'm learning how to feel full, as opposed to stuffed. This is working for me!

    Eating this way doesn't trigger any "sugar cravings" or leave me more hungry by eating "dirty" foods. But I suppose if I did have those cravings all the time and didn't have any self-control, then eating the "clean" way would probably have to be the way I would have to go to keep me from having ANY "dirty" food.

    You are losing weight because you are eating less calories, obviously..............

    However, if you are still consuming sugary, starchy, flour filled stuff you haven't cut your risk of developing heart disease, stroke, diabetes, etc...........

    Losing weight doesn't make you healthier. Eating less of the junk doesn't make one healthier either.

    Change is just that change.................moderation is still doing the same thing, just less of it.
  • PJilly
    PJilly Posts: 21,742 Member
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    I think every angle has probably already been covered, but I'll chime in with my 2 cents anyway. I completely abstain from some things I used to eat, and I consume others in moderation. It's easier for me to eat no chips, cookies, fast food, pizza, etc., than it is to eat a little. On the other hand, I have a bit of dark chocolate every day and a glass of wine with dinner every night. Those are things I choose not to give up entirely, and I'd rather have a little than none at all. I reached my weight-loss goal in March, and I've maintained since then. Besides that, I feel better than I have ever felt, so at least for now, I think I've found the magic balance that works for me.
  • skinnytayy
    skinnytayy Posts: 459
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    I haven't read all the replies, but I have to respectfully disagree with the original post. I've radically changed my diet over the last year - while I'm not completely "clean" (some people are VERY extreme), I'm pretty close - I eat very few processed foods, I don't add salt, I don't add sugar, etc. Now, when I eat something that is loaded with grease/sugar/salt/any of the above, it makes me feel like crap - it does not make me want to binge. Sure, I will occasionally have something that's definitely not "clean" but I don't have trouble controlling myself and I see myself sticking to this new diet ("diet" meaning simply the foods that I chose to eat) for the rest of my life. Clean eating may drive some people to binge or to become obsessed in an unhealthy way, but that is not a fault of clean eating, it is a problem with that individual. Plenty of people succesfully choose to eliminate most processed foods from their life and do so in a healthy way.

    Same here ... Since I've changed my eating habits, I've yet to eat any junk food or fast food other than homemade pizza that had a TON of sodium and made it feel deathly sick but If I decide one day that i want a milkshake or a little debbie then so be it. As long as you don't go overboard then there isn't a problem. One dessert occasionally is NOT going to make a difference. You won't gain 10lbs, your waistline is not going to pop your zipper, you won't develop diabetes or anything else over one "dirty" food. The human body needs food to use as fuel but if there is something that brings you 5 minutes of pleasure, then I don't see a problem as long as everyday your food isn't loaded with sugar, bad carbs, fat, etc.
  • nopeekiepeekie
    nopeekiepeekie Posts: 338 Member
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    I think we're just so hardwired to have one or the other be the correct approach for us that it's hard not to demand that it's the correct approach for everybody.

    I completely agree with this statement. It is so true.
  • nopeekiepeekie
    nopeekiepeekie Posts: 338 Member
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    you haven't cut your risk of developing heart disease, stroke, diabetes, etc...........
    Unfortunately, as long as you breathe there is always a risk of these no matter how clean or unclean you eat, especially if you have family that have had these diseases.
  • Grokette
    Grokette Posts: 3,330 Member
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    you haven't cut your risk of developing heart disease, stroke, diabetes, etc...........
    Unfortunately, as long as you breathe there is always a risk of these no matter how clean or unclean you eat, especially if you have family that have had these diseases.

    Actually you can re-program your genes and cells to be able to avoid those ailments.

    I have reversed the Type 2 Diabetes curse that plagued both sides of my family. However, my sister and I eat VERY, vERY differently than the rest of my family..................

    Clean eating makes a major difference in your hair, skin, nails and all around body function......................
  • StatutoryGrape
    StatutoryGrape Posts: 365
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    you haven't cut your risk of developing heart disease, stroke, diabetes, etc...........
    Unfortunately, as long as you breathe there is always a risk of these no matter how clean or unclean you eat, especially if you have family that have had these diseases.

    Actually you can re-program your genes and cells to be able to avoid those ailments.

    I have reversed the Type 2 Diabetes curse that plagued both sides of my family. However, my sister and I eat VERY, vERY differently than the rest of my family..................

    Clean eating makes a major difference in your hair, skin, nails and all around body function......................
    What works for you is not perfect for everyone. All bodies are different. You can control genetics to an extent, but you cannot reprogram your genes. I don't know where you're getting that idea.

    So, kudos for taking control of your health, but please stop being so dismissive of other approaches. They do work for other people. And at the very least, they're a starting point. I don't know why you feel the need to bash other people's methods. We're supposed to be supportive of one another here, no matter how much someone else's methods differ from our own. :)
  • Grokette
    Grokette Posts: 3,330 Member
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    What works for you is not perfect for everyone. All bodies are different. You can control genetics to an extent, but you cannot reprogram your genes. I don't know where you're getting that idea.

    So, kudos for taking control of your health, but please stop being so dismissive of other approaches. They do work for other people. And at the very least, they're a starting point. I don't know why you feel the need to bash other people's methods. We're supposed to be supportive of one another here, no matter how much someone else's methods differ from our own. :)

    Here is the information on re-programming your genes........................

    http://www.marksdailyapple.com/epigenetics/

    From time to time I’ll get a comment from a skeptical reader that says something like, “I don’t think it’s possible to reprogram your genes through diet/lifestyle. Of course our genes are set at birth and our DNA, or program, is copied into every cell of our bodies. You cannot modify or reprogram your genetic code.” I’d like to address this misunderstanding.

    One of the best ways to illustrate what I mean by “reprogram your genes” is to use the analogy that Duke University’s Randy Jirtle, Ph.D., uses in the following videos. Think of your genome as being like computer hardware. If you were to program your computer you wouldn’t be changing the hardware, rather, you would be changing the software that tells the computer what to do. So just as we talk about reprogramming or programming a computer and don’t suggest that the hardware itself has changed we likewise can talk about reprogramming our genes without suggesting that the genes have changed. In the case of genes what we are really changing is the epigenome. To quote Dr. Jirtle, “the epigenome would be like the software that tells the computer when to work, how to work and how much.”

    Luckily for us our genes are not our destiny. We have immense control through lifestyle behaviors to turn some genes on and other genes off for desired physical results. Watch these videos for it to all come together if it hasn’t already.

    There are multiple future possible versions of you. It’s up to you to decide which version you will become. It’s up to you to make lifestyle choices that direct genes toward fat burning, muscle building, longevity and wellness, and away from fat storing, muscle wasting, disease and illness.

    This is what The Primal Blueprint is all about. It’s why the sub-title of my book is “Reprogram Your Genes for Effortless Weight Loss, Vibrant Health and Boundless Energy”. And it’s what we talk about (either directly or indirectly) day-in and day-out here at Mark’s Daily Apple. We tend to focus on the practical, but epigenetics is at the heart of why we do what we do. Living like Grok just happens to be the best starting point for directing gene expression.
  • carl1738
    carl1738 Posts: 444 Member
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    I can easily see where clean eating could lead to binge eating. To completely deny yourself something that you crave can simply increase the craving to the point that when you do give in, you eat way more than you would have if you had simply allowed yourself a moderate portion at the time. I try to eat healthy most of the time, but I don't deny myself a treat now and then. I don't feel guilty about having an occasional ice cream cone or enjoying a fast food burger while out with my family. I grew up with a bulimic parent and have seen firsthand how denying yourself food that you enjoy can lead to the inevitable binges. One bowl of ice cream once in a while is not going to cause you to gain weight. It's better to treat yourself once or twice a week than to let your craving build up to the point that you eat the whole tub of ice cream in one sitting and feel guilty about it afterwards. I would rather exercise for a little bit longer than starve myself just so I could stay within my calorie range.
  • conidala
    conidala Posts: 2
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    My husbands Father had type 2 diabetes, all his Mothers brothers died from heart attack. At 40 he developed type 2 and at 53 he had a heart attack. I believe we could have kept him from developing diabetes so early and probably prevented his heart attack if we would have eaten right.
    I don’t buy anything without reading every ingredient on the label. At first glance if the label has a list a mile long I just put it back down. I avoid saturated and trans fats and you cant just go by the amount it tells you it has, read and see if theres anything ‘hydrogenated’. I have found some things say no trans fat, but has partially hydrogenated ingredients in it. Learning what the good and bad oils are is essential. (my hubby loves chicken wings,….yuck!…lol)
    I’m 51 years old and I have probably been on every known diet in my lifetime. I love to eat out and I wish there were places to eat that had fresh, healthy food. Most foods are processed, frozen and have no nutritional value and are filled with saturated fats and chemicals.
    I have Tosco Renos eat clean diet book , it has a lot of good info in it and I have used that to help make good choices. I followed her principles and lost 10 lbs the first month, and I wasn’t hungry or deprived. I can tell you that I was a little grouchy for a while, but that’s supposed to be normal because you are detoxing all those chemicals that are stored because your body doesn’t know what to do with them. The south beach heart program is a good book too, but I cried when I read it. It tells you what your future is if you don’t eat healthy, too late for my boo, but I’m feeding him good now.
    I guess everybody has to find the way that works best for them, I am learning every day and taking one step at a time. Wish you all the best of luck at finding you healthy lifestyle. I appreciate the good info and motivation I get here. Blessings!

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