Calculating TDEE once and for all! And using FitBit!

linka411

Hi Everyone,

24, 5'3'', 129, looking to build muscle and drop body fat from 37% down to 20. Ideally, I would also like to drop my weight down to 120, but given that I'll probably gain muscle wait I'm ok with being heavier at the end. Thanks to some some questions posted earlier and some looking around, I have just figured out what's going to be my exercise routine, I plan to exercise 3 times a week, doing HIIT, along with weight lifting at the gym according to the Stronglift 5x5 program. On saturday, I plan to go to fencing practice for 2 hours, so that's my cardio. If I can do on tuesdays when it's available and I have the time, I'll try to do that too.

My final issue now before going off on a trailblaze is figuring out how many calories I'm supposed to eat every day, and getting MFP and my Fitbit One to play nice. Here is my understanding so far of how to do it from the last few days of research and my confusion:

The best thing to do in order to lose weight in a healthy manner is to eat above my BMI and below my TDEE. Here is my question: what's the most accurate way of doing that? Every site I go to spits out different numbers. For example:

On this site: http://iifym.com/tdee-calculator/ I put in my numbers and set it to the Mifflin formula, stating that I am exercising 3 days a week. The results: 1305 BMR, 1795 TDEE. Ok, cool. I take about 10% from TDEE (as per this thread: http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/931670-bmr-and-tdee-explained-for-those-needing-a-guide) and get 1615 calories. That's how much I have to consume a day.

Now then, on that same site, there's also an option for calculating it if I know my body fat, which I do-it's the Katch option at the bottom. I put in 37% and I got the following: BMR: 1168, TDEE: 1606. Do the 10% cut, I get 1445.

From 1445 to 1615. Kind of a noticeable difference there, if you ask me .

I'm not sure whether to follow the thread I mentioned above: http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/931670-bmr-and-tdee-explained-for-those-needing-a-guide because the BMR it seems to calculate at my goal weight (120) appears to be about 1600, more than my BMR now. How does that work? Plus, in doing the calculation for TDEE, I get around 1700 calories (assuming light exercise and 10% cut). Now I'm even higher than the other two numbers! Whaaa?

In searching the forums more, I found this site: http://scoobysworkshop.com/calorie-calculator/. And it says my TDEE is around 1900!

What the heck is it?! :sad: I gots to know how much to eat!

Let's say that's figured out now. I also have a new Fitbit one and I want to use it alongside MFP. According to my research, what I should be doing is logging my calorie goal on MFP. That should be my TDEE sans the 10% I would cut for my weight loss goal. Ok. Cool. I also should not log walking/running time on MFP. The fitbit's gonna do that for me. I would, however, log other calorie burning time like weight lifting time (since apparently the fitbit's bad at that) and fencing(which I'm hoping the fitbit will calculate correctly). And I would do it in MFP, put in the time I worked out, punch in the calories there, and it'll override Fitbit. So far, so good.

Now then, just to get this straight, do I or do I not eat back calories from working out? Does my TDEE account for my workouts already, based on the exercises that I plan to do? If so, do I then just ignore the extra calories that MFP tells me to eat since I punched in exercise? If TDEE does not account for my workouts, how much of the calories do I eat back that MFP tells me to?

If TL;DR : What's the best way to calculate TDEE, and do I eat back workout calories once I know it?

Any help here would be appreciated, I know this is a lot of stuff but I've been trying to research and just want to get it right. Thank you in advance!

healthybodyhealthylife

Your TDEE accounts for your workouts so if you are using the FitBit, you don't eat back your exercise calories.

I have a FitBit.. I've had it for a couple months now and it calculates based on your BMR based on the Katch McArdell formula + steps. Its pretty much off for all other activities. There is an option to manually enter other activities onto FitBit but in all honesty its just a ball park estimate and you won't get an accurate TDEE number with the FitBit. It can't differentiate between physical inactivity and walking. Having said that, I still use it as a guide. I assume it to be underestimating by about 10% after manually entering my other exercises. Hope this has helped

nxd10

I use a fitbit as the OP does. It counts all my steps and feeds them into the MFP counter. I log additional activities on MFP. Fitbit reads it and drops out my steps during those time periods of other exercise (e.g., bicycling or weighlifting) and MFP subs in numbers more appropriate for those activities. For example, if I bike from 12-1 and log it on MFP, fitbit doesn't count steps from 12-1 and I do get calories added in for cycling.

Yes, it is an estimate. But it seems to work fine for me. I eat those calories back. I lose the weight I'm supposed to.

Don't make it too complicated.

P.S. I also just told MFP how much I weighed, my age and sex and how much I wanted to lose and it calculated calories for me. If you have the fitbit, set yourself to sedentary and log other exercise. It's all automatic.

Francl27

Your numbers are weird.

I use scooby, but IMO it overestimates activity a bit... I walk or workout for 6/8 hours a week but I'm more between lightly active and moderately active. I used a fitbit to give me an idea of how much I burn during a day, but I didn't synch it to MFP... I just eat 20% less than the average it gives me.

editorgrrl

Here's a calorie adjustment explanation I posted in the "Fitbit Users" group: http://www.myfitnesspal.com/forums/show/1307-fitbit-users

When you set up your MFP account, you specified an activity level: http://www.myfitnesspal.com/account/change_goals_guided MFP used your answer, plus your age, sex & height, to estimate how many calories you burn every day (your TDEE). Then you set your weight-loss goal, and MFP subtracted the appropriate deficit to calculate your daily calorie goal.

Once you link an activity tracker to your MFP account (via the "Apps" tab at the top of every page), you start getting calorie adjustments. If your tracker says you burned more calories than MFP estimated, you get a positive adjustment (meaning more calories to eat). If you enable negative calorie adjustments and you burn less than the MFP estimate, you will lose calories. (But negative calorie adjustments will never drop your daily calories below 1,200.)

Log food & drink in MFP. No need to log step based activity. Log non-step based exercise (like swimming or spinning) either in Fitbit or in MFP--never both. If you choose to log in MFP, you'll be asked for start & end times. Then MFP will override your step data during that time.

It will take trial & error to find which settings work best for you.

linka411

Hi editor, I apologize but could you please specify where it is? The link you provide just takes me to the group and I don't see any pinned threads started by you.

editorgrrl

I must have posted the above explanation eleventy-seven times.

shutyourpieholeandsquat

bump for later

QuietBloom

In just to point out that you will not gain muscle while in a deficit. It is still important to exercise and eat plenty of protein so you retain the muscle you already have. Once you have lost the fat weight, then you can do a bulk (lift heavy weights while in a calorie surplus) if you so choose to.

linka411

Based on what has been said above, I should record non-walking exercises and eat back the calories from them. I think I have at least that clear. One thing that still confuses me a bit is the fitbit adjustment that appears here on MFP. For example, so far today I have only been sitting down and sleeping, and I've apparently burned 243 calories. MFP then says I have earned those calories for the adjustment, so I can eat that much more. Assuming I don't exercise today (so I have no exercise to log here), do I not eat the 243 calories, and just delete the adjustment from my diary?

And if I do plan to exercise (which I am), I would log the time/calories spent on MFP, which would override the calories from fitbit and then I eat the new difference all back.

Do I have it straight?

editorgrrl

Your adjustment is recalculated throughout the day. Mine got more accurate every day, as if the system was "learning" my routine.

Everybody's different, and it will take trial & error to find what works for you. Go to your Fitbit settings http://www.fitbit.com/user/profile/edit scroll down to "Preferences," and disable calorie estimation (or enable it if it's currently off). Give it a couple of days, then reevaluate.

WinoGelato

Try not to overthink it too much for the next few weeks. Pick one of the estimated TDEE's that you calculated on one of the sites, probably the one in the middle. Set that - 10% as your goal in MFP. Enable negative adjustments in MFP. Then, for the next couple of weeks, see how big of adjustments you get in MFP from your FitBit, and also track your daily calories burned in FitBit. That is probably a more accurate estimate of your TDEE than the online calculators will give you. Make adjustments after you get used to things, and the systems will also get better at estimating your daily activity and will adjust accordingly.

It took me about 2 months of playing with the numbers and activity settings in MFP and FitBit to get things figured out but you have to put a little faith in it.

Also, you do eat back the FitBit adjustments in MFP because if you have the two systems set up consistently to work together, then your goal in MFP is basically your daily activity (TDEE) minus whatever deficit you are setting (10% seems about right for what you are wanting). If you exercise or are just more active than that number, you will get a positive adjustment and you should eat those calories back. Right now my adjustment is usually about 200 more each day than my goals are set at. I eat those, often exceed those, and am still losing and am very close to my final goal.

Good luck.

luckydays27

Hi Everyone,

24, 5'3'', 129, looking to build muscle and drop body fat from 37% down to 20. Ideally, I would also like to drop my weight down to 120, but given that I'll probably gain muscle wait I'm ok with being heavier at the end.

Are you sure you are 37% body fat? that seems high for your height and weight. I am not saying its not possible but you would have to be very flabby to have that high BF for your height and weight. Your BMI should be around 23% so I dont think you are at 37%

As for muscle gains, you wont gain muscle while eating at a deficit or very little if you do. You can strengthen what you have but you wont gain any.

You are at within the normal weight range for your height so whatever you do decide to do, you need to keep your deficit at a minimum (5%-10% or .5 lbs loss) a week. It will be hard to lose more than that (just not enough food in your body to fuel your life and workouts).

As for TDEE calculations: I use my Fitbit to determine my cals burned and I eat at a .5 lb deficit. (250 cal a day deficit). I trusted that system and found it worked for me.

You have to pick a system that you want and trust it for 4 weeks or so. Evaluate your success (or lack of) and readjust. This is the only way you will truly know what will work for you.

WBB55

You have to pick a system that you want and trust it for 4 weeks or so. Evaluate your success (or lack of) and readjust. This is the only way you will truly know what will work for you.

Requoting this for emphasis, but her entire post was spot on.

For my fitbit, I only alter the automatically generated calories if I ride bicycle or lift weights or swim. Other than that, it seems to do well. I don't have negative calories enabled, but MFP does give me more food allowance when I exercise above and beyond my normal walks.

linka411

Are you sure you are 37% body fat? that seems high for your height and weight. I am not saying its not possible but you would have to be very flabby to have that high BF for your height and weight. Your BMI should be around 23% so I dont think you are at 37%

As for muscle gains, you wont gain muscle while eating at a deficit or very little if you do. You can strengthen what you have but you wont gain any.

To answer your first question I went here: http://www.fat2fitradio.com/tools/mbf/. I think it's the military one. I just now realized upon reevaluation for the umpteenth time that I was measuring my waist wrong for this one. I was doing it at the navel, where i'm 33. However, it seems I'm supposed to do it at the small of my waist, which is 30. I fixed that, and put in my numbers again (63 height, 129 lbs, 30 waist, 39 hips). It put out 29%! It might actually be a skosh smaller than that since I'm doing this late in the day after I've eaten. I'll try again tomorrow in the am and see what happens. Thanks for pointing out something that seemed off!


I found this calculator today (appears to be originally made by the site) http://www.fat2fitradio.com/tools/bf/ and put in the measurements it asked for, again assuming I did them right: 6 wrist, 33 waist (it asks for at the navel), 39 hips, 11 forearm, it gave out 26%. Is this more accurate? I'm a little timid to ask since I'm asking so many questions now, but if that's more accurate, more power to me I guess! It'll make my life a little easier in the future! lol. Although, 3% isn't a huuge difference.

I've decided after some thought that I'm going to lose the 10 pounds first and then work to gain muscle and burn remaining body fat. So right now I'm just working on losing the 9/10 pounds. I'm actually really happy that you advised 0.5 lb/week, because I wasn't really sure whether I could get away with 1 or 0.5. 0.5 a week is just fine with me, so I'm just glad I know. Thank you!

Today I hit the gym and burned about 250 calories on the treadmill, and tracked it. Within these last few hours fitbit is telling me I also burned an extra 260 or something as well. I put that I was doing light exercise right now, so on top of everything I'll just work to make sure I don't go into the red today after eating my extra calories, since it seems that a 250 deficit is already calculated for me everyday from MFP. Aaaah this is starting to make sense now I think. I'm already pretty full so I don't think it'll happen but I'll try to get as close to 0 as possible XD.

I think this is starting to make sense now please let me know if I have anything inaccurate, and thank you all for your patience with me! I very much appreciate it!

luckydays27

To answer your first question I went here: http://www.fat2fitradio.com/tools/mbf/. I think it's the military one. I just now realized upon reevaluation for the umpteenth time that I was measuring my waist wrong for this one. I was doing it at the navel, where i'm 33. However, it seems I'm supposed to do it at the small of my waist, which is 30. I fixed that, and put in my numbers again (63 height, 129 lbs, 30 waist, 39 hips). It put out 29%! It might actually be a skosh smaller than that since I'm doing this late in the day after I've eaten. I'll try again tomorrow in the am and see what happens. Thanks for pointing out something that seemed off!


I found this calculator today (appears to be originally made by the site) http://www.fat2fitradio.com/tools/bf/ and put in the measurements it asked for, again assuming I did them right: 6 wrist, 33 waist (it asks for at the navel), 39 hips, 11 forearm, it gave out 26%. Is this more accurate? I'm a little timid to ask since I'm asking so many questions now, but if that's more accurate, more power to me I guess! It'll make my life a little easier in the future! lol. Although, 3% isn't a huuge difference.

Thats closer to correct than 37%. The best BF measurement is the water dunk test. If you can find one that is reasonable and fits in your budget its worth a shot.

I think the calculators are great for a tool for tracking. Use the same method each time you do it with the same tightness or slack in the measuring tape and so long as the number is going down, the actual number is not important.

I've decided after some thought that I'm going to lose the 10 pounds first and then work to gain muscle and burn remaining body fat. So right now I'm just working on losing the 9/10 pounds. I'm actually really happy that you advised 0.5 lb/week, because I wasn't really sure whether I could get away with 1 or 0.5. 0.5 a week is just fine with me, so I'm just glad I know. Thank you!

Today I hit the gym and burned about 250 calories on the treadmill, and tracked it. Within these last few hours fitbit is telling me I also burned an extra 260 or something as well. I put that I was doing light exercise right now, so on top of everything I'll just work to make sure I don't go into the red today after eating my extra calories, since it seems that a 250 deficit is already calculated for me everyday from MFP. Aaaah this is starting to make sense now I think. I'm already pretty full so I don't think it'll happen but I'll try to get as close to 0 as possible XD.

I think this is starting to make sense now please let me know if I have anything inaccurate, and thank you all for your patience with me! I very much appreciate it!

Dont avoid the weights entirely. You can still hit them and make them heavy so you lose weight but dont lose more muscle mass. I do weights and just a little bit of cardio and am still losing weight. The muscles are are more defined because of the body fat reduction.

WinoGelato

Today I hit the gym and burned about 250 calories on the treadmill, and tracked it. Within these last few hours fitbit is telling me I also burned an extra 260 or something as well. I put that I was doing light exercise right now, so on top of everything I'll just work to make sure I don't go into the red today after eating my extra calories, since it seems that a 250 deficit is already calculated for me everyday from MFP. Aaaah this is starting to make sense now I think. I'm already pretty full so I don't think it'll happen but I'll try to get as close to 0 as possible XD.

When you say that you tracked it, and that you put in that you were doing light exercise now, I don't understand what you mean. FitBit should be tracking your exercise if it is something like running or walking on a treadmill. You don't need to put that into MFP. MFP will get a FitBit adjustment periodically throughout the day reflecting your calories burned. It may go up and down based on your level of activity. The only exercise I enter in MFP are things that FitBit isn't good at tracking. Stationary bike, weight training, etc. I still leave my FitBit on for that exercise, and it tracks some movement, but when I tell MFP what I was doing and when I started it, you can then see the two systems adjusting accordingly if you log into both and they synch up. For example, I did a circuit training video with some weights this morning and entered that in as 30 minutes. Right now I have those 230 calories on MFP and a negative adjustment from FitBit because it still thinks I will burn less than my TDEE plus 230 for the total day. But as the day goes on, and I have additional activity and calories burned, then the FitBit adjustment will probably move to positive, although probably not by much.

linka411

See, that's pretty much what I did. I went on the treadmill and put it into MFP, just so I could have recorded what I did. It did subtract from the Fitbit during the time I said I was working out, like you said it would. The mysterious thing is that a few hours later, after I came home and just hung out, the FitBit adjustment jumped to the 260 something calories I mentioned before. Thus, I apparently had to eat about 515 extra calories instead of the 250 from the actual exercise I did. I ran around trying to figure out what to eat so I could compensate, and while I wound up getting full below the goal, I was around 200 something calories left to eat.

I woke up today and the adjustment yesterday just magically went from the 200 it was to 13. So, I would up eating 18 calories more and 17 grams of fat more than I had to. Pretty embarrassing :embarassed:

I think I'm going to do what you suggest, and only log calories into MFP if it's something like weight training, which seems to be harder for it to track. I'll trust the fitbit when I'm on the treadmill or fencing. That should stop the strange blowing and shrinking.

If I'm having a regular day with no actual exercise (like today, which is my rest day), should I ignore the calories the adjustment says I'm burning and not eat them back?

linka411

Dont avoid the weights entirely. You can still hit them and make them heavy so you lose weight but dont lose more muscle mass. I do weights and just a little bit of cardio and am still losing weight. The muscles are are more defined because of the body fat reduction.

What kind of weight training to you suggest? Machines or lifting? I'm pretty new to this kind of exercise so I guess I don't know what would be appropriate. I was going to do lifting once I hit my weight goal, but if I can try it a little bit now I guess if it's worth a shot.

WBB55

What kind of weight training to you suggest?

Do you have the money for a personal trainer session? That's an effective way to go. The trainers at gyms give great advice. I prefer the pullys and freeweights. But that's just me.

WinoGelato

See, that's pretty much what I did. I went on the treadmill and put it into MFP, just so I could have recorded what I did. It did subtract from the Fitbit during the time I said I was working out, like you said it would. The mysterious thing is that a few hours later, after I came home and just hung out, the FitBit adjustment jumped to the 260 something calories I mentioned before. Thus, I apparently had to eat about 515 extra calories instead of the 250 from the actual exercise I did. I ran around trying to figure out what to eat so I could compensate, and while I wound up getting full below the goal, I was around 200 something calories left to eat.

I woke up today and the adjustment yesterday just magically went from the 200 it was to 13. So, I would up eating 18 calories more and 17 grams of fat more than I had to. Pretty embarrassing :embarassed:

I think I'm going to do what you suggest, and only log calories into MFP if it's something like weight training, which seems to be harder for it to track. I'll trust the fitbit when I'm on the treadmill or fencing. That should stop the strange blowing and shrinking.

If I'm having a regular day with no actual exercise (like today, which is my rest day), should I ignore the calories the adjustment says I'm burning and not eat them back?

Yes you would still eat the calorie adjustment even if you don't actually exercise if you do have the systems set up right. The adjustment is anything above and beyond what your goal is. Even if you are using TDEE-10%, if you have the two systems both set up that way, and you are on your feet and burn more calories than that level, then you would still get an adjustment and still eat those back.

Also, as someone advised me, if you are set to Sedentary in MFP because you think that's what you should do for your job, but you actually are moving a lot more and getting 8-10K steps/day, or more, then you probably want to change the setting from Sedentary to at least Lightly Active. That will help you not get such big adjustments that you feel like you need to eat back. Plus, the FitBit adjusts throughout the day and so if you last synch at 7:00 but then you are pretty sedentary for the rest of the evening, go to bed early, then yes, the number will drop down and you will see many less calories left when you check it again the next day. You do need to keep that in mind if you are hanging things up earlier in the evening, maybe don't eat back all the calories.

I still think you are overthinking this trying to get this just right right now. It will take a few weeks at least to figure out what you need to set up in both systems. I changed mine a number of times before getting it where I felt both of them were consistent and I was getting the best results.

BTW I am 5'2, original weight 150, current weight 127.
In MFP I am now set to Active after bumping it up from Sedentary to Lightly Active to now Active. I usually get about 12,000 steps/day and I do some light weights at least 3 or so days/week. I occaisionally do stationary bike but most of my activity is my general hectic schedule and maybe 30 minutes of walking/jogging on the treadmill a couple days/week. In FitBit I average 2100-2200 calories burned each day. MFP estimates my TDEE at maintenance to be 1950. With the basic exercise I do, I probably burn around 200 calories a day which is right about the same as what FitBit is saying my calories burned would be.

I have set up FitBit to lose 0.5lb/week and MFP to do the same. That gives me a daily goal of around 1700 in MFP because it deducts 250 cal/day from your TDEE at that weight loss.

Beyond that, I just trust the systems. I log exercise that isn't walking/jogging - I eat back the calories. Sometimes I go over, sometimes I am under, but on a weekly basis I am pretty close to that. I am losing about 0.5lb a week, just as I would like.

Don't think too much about it right now. Maybe adjust the activity level in MFP if you are seeing big adjustments, but beyond that, just go with something and re-evaluate in a few weeks.