Muscle weighs more then fat?

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  • diannethegeek
    diannethegeek Posts: 14,776 Member
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    I'm stealing this analogy from a very smart friend on here.

    If someone said to you "Gold costs more than tinfoil" would you correct them because $1 = $1 and start an argument about it, or would you just agree because you know that they're talking about cost per unit weight?

    I don't feel that analogy works here...gold cost vs tinfoil cost?

    When someone says the word weighs more it means weight...not volume...
    If someone says takes up less space that means volume....not weight...

    devil is in the details..you will have to excuse my OCT

    So what does the word "cost" mean?
  • MoreBean13
    MoreBean13 Posts: 8,701 Member
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    I'm stealing this analogy from a very smart friend on here.

    If someone said to you "Gold costs more than tinfoil" would you correct them because $1 = $1 and start an argument about it, or would you just agree because you know that they're talking about cost per unit weight?

    I don't feel that analogy works here...gold cost vs tinfoil cost?

    When someone says the word weighs more it means weight...not volume...
    If someone says takes up less space that means volume....not weight...

    devil is in the details..you will have to excuse my OCT

    Not to knock your feelings on it, but the analogy is perfect.

    Cost is the required payment for something. In the sense that it's used, the fact that you're talking about equivalent amounts of the item is implied. It's exactly the same as comparing the muscle and fat weight, an equivalent volume is implied.
  • SezxyStef
    SezxyStef Posts: 15,268 Member
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    I'm stealing this analogy from a very smart friend on here.

    If someone said to you "Gold costs more than tinfoil" would you correct them because $1 = $1 and start an argument about it, or would you just agree because you know that they're talking about cost per unit weight?

    I don't feel that analogy works here...gold cost vs tinfoil cost?

    When someone says the word weighs more it means weight...not volume...
    If someone says takes up less space that means volume....not weight...

    devil is in the details..you will have to excuse my OCT

    So what does the word "cost" mean?

    seriously?

    If you guys want to continue on down this path go ahead...as I said I am not going to argue the point any further as it is just getting obtuse and doltish. Along with derailing this thread with an off topic conversation.

    All I have to say is I take words at face value and don't "assume" someone means something other than what was said or typed....
  • jofjltncb6
    jofjltncb6 Posts: 34,415 Member
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    This drives me crazy. Everyone knows what everyone else is saying here. Everyone is correct. "Per unit volume" is implied when people say muscle weighs more than fat and the unit of volume everyone is talking about is the human body.

    I feel like people just argue about this to pontificate.

    You couldn't be more wrong
    False, she is spot on. Most people understand the concept but some people are just anal about the wording of the phrase.

    Please tell me you heard a "whooshing" noise overhead when you clicked the "post reply" button.
    Sarcasm is tough to spot on the internets sometimes. Plus, I'm slow.

    Yup. And at least you got there eventually. :drinker:
  • SezxyStef
    SezxyStef Posts: 15,268 Member
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    I'm stealing this analogy from a very smart friend on here.

    If someone said to you "Gold costs more than tinfoil" would you correct them because $1 = $1 and start an argument about it, or would you just agree because you know that they're talking about cost per unit weight?

    I don't feel that analogy works here...gold cost vs tinfoil cost?

    When someone says the word weighs more it means weight...not volume...
    If someone says takes up less space that means volume....not weight...

    devil is in the details..you will have to excuse my OCT

    Not to knock your feelings on it, but the analogy is perfect.

    Cost is the required payment for something. In the sense that it's used, the fact that you're talking about equivalent amounts of the item is implied. It's exactly the same as comparing the muscle and fat weight, an equivalent volume is implied.

    :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: sure if you say so...see above post.
  • WalkingAlong
    WalkingAlong Posts: 4,926 Member
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    I'm stealing this analogy from a very smart friend on here.

    If someone said to you "Gold costs more than tinfoil" would you correct them because $1 = $1 and start an argument about it, or would you just agree because you know that they're talking about cost per unit weight?

    I don't feel that analogy works here...gold cost vs tinfoil cost?

    When someone says the word weighs more it means weight...not volume...
    If someone says takes up less space that means volume....not weight...

    devil is in the details..you will have to excuse my OCT

    So what does the word "cost" mean?

    seriously?

    If you guys want to continue on down this path go ahead...as I said I am not going to argue the point any further as it is just getting obtuse and doltish. Along with derailing this thread with an off topic conversation.

    All I have to say is I take words at face value and don't "assume" someone means something other than what was said or typed....
    But you didn't take the words at face value. You assumed the OP meant something (stupid) that she didn't say, which is the opposite.

    It's not important, this one instance. But maybe people will stop posting that knee-jerk response if enough people point out how illogical and presumptuous it is.
  • MoreBean13
    MoreBean13 Posts: 8,701 Member
    Options

    I'm stealing this analogy from a very smart friend on here.

    If someone said to you "Gold costs more than tinfoil" would you correct them because $1 = $1 and start an argument about it, or would you just agree because you know that they're talking about cost per unit weight?

    I don't feel that analogy works here...gold cost vs tinfoil cost?

    When someone says the word weighs more it means weight...not volume...
    If someone says takes up less space that means volume....not weight...

    devil is in the details..you will have to excuse my OCT

    Not to knock your feelings on it, but the analogy is perfect.

    Cost is the required payment for something. In the sense that it's used, the fact that you're talking about equivalent amounts of the item is implied. It's exactly the same as comparing the muscle and fat weight, an equivalent volume is implied.

    :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: sure if you say so...see above post.

    I saw it. You got trapped in a corner and then used the words "obtuse and doltish."

    Impressive.
  • diannethegeek
    diannethegeek Posts: 14,776 Member
    Options

    I'm stealing this analogy from a very smart friend on here.

    If someone said to you "Gold costs more than tinfoil" would you correct them because $1 = $1 and start an argument about it, or would you just agree because you know that they're talking about cost per unit weight?

    I don't feel that analogy works here...gold cost vs tinfoil cost?

    When someone says the word weighs more it means weight...not volume...
    If someone says takes up less space that means volume....not weight...

    devil is in the details..you will have to excuse my OCT

    Not to knock your feelings on it, but the analogy is perfect.

    Cost is the required payment for something. In the sense that it's used, the fact that you're talking about equivalent amounts of the item is implied. It's exactly the same as comparing the muscle and fat weight, an equivalent volume is implied.

    :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: sure if you say so...see above post.

    I saw it. You got trapped in a corner and then used the words "obtuse and doltish."

    Impressive.

    I was really laid low with doltish, let me tell ya. And the scare quotes around "logic" upthread. Is it time for .gifs or do we just quietly abandon this one? I never know the protocol for these things...
  • delicious_cocktail
    delicious_cocktail Posts: 5,797 Member
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    I can't join this argument because I just know my obsessive compulsive tisorder will act up and things will get ugly.
  • WendyTerry420
    WendyTerry420 Posts: 13,274 Member
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    I'm stealing this analogy from a very smart friend on here.

    If someone said to you "Gold costs more than tinfoil" would you correct them because $1 = $1 and start an argument about it, or would you just agree because you know that they're talking about cost per unit weight?

    I don't feel that analogy works here...gold cost vs tinfoil cost?

    When someone says the word weighs more it means weight...not volume...
    If someone says takes up less space that means volume....not weight...

    devil is in the details..you will have to excuse my OCT

    Not to knock your feelings on it, but the analogy is perfect.

    Cost is the required payment for something. In the sense that it's used, the fact that you're talking about equivalent amounts of the item is implied. It's exactly the same as comparing the muscle and fat weight, an equivalent volume is implied.

    Maybe it's just the accountant in me, but doesn't it always mean price per unit? When does cost mean something else?

    COGS is always per unit.
    MSRP is always per unit.


    *shrugs*
    *back to apathy*
  • MyaAlisha6
    MyaAlisha6 Posts: 19 Member
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    I don't think anyone was intentionally trying to give false/wrong answers. Some of us just need to be educated and maybe have been given false facts in the past. I am new at fitness, fitness terms, nutrition, pretty much this lifestyle I know nothing about. So thank you to everyone who gave me nice helpful answers. Why does everything have to turn into negativity. Rant over sorry. Thanks everyone
  • MyaAlisha6
    MyaAlisha6 Posts: 19 Member
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    Totally makes sense!!! If you don't mind if I ask...where did you get your scale? I was wondering how people find out there body fat percentage .
  • albayin
    albayin Posts: 2,524 Member
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    Most people who think they have a lot of muscle, don't. Until you get to a lowish BF% it is actually pretty hard to tell unless you have been lean before and know how much you carry.

    Even if you did, that has nothing to do with not being able to lose weight now.

    You may well be retaining water if you started exercising which is masking 'real' weight loss. Either that or you are not at a deficit.

    I like this post...

    Also, the more I read, the more I become to believe that there's a myth around muscle performance and metabolism...Really, a person who has a slightly lower body fat percentage can burn much more than the one with slightly higher one? say 5lb difference?
  • Morgaath
    Morgaath Posts: 679 Member
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    Totally makes sense!!! If you don't mind if I ask...where did you get your scale? I was wondering how people find out there body fat percentage .


    Accu-Measure Body Fat Caliper off amazon for ~$6.
    Throw in a Myo tape measure for ~$6 so you can easily track that as well.

    The electric ones are easy to have misread you, as in a 10% fluctuation between when I woke up and 2 hrs later. And if you are retaining water they are even more likely to get things off, as water conducts electricity better.
  • MoreBean13
    MoreBean13 Posts: 8,701 Member
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    Most people who think they have a lot of muscle, don't. Until you get to a lowish BF% it is actually pretty hard to tell unless you have been lean before and know how much you carry.

    Even if you did, that has nothing to do with not being able to lose weight now.

    You may well be retaining water if you started exercising which is masking 'real' weight loss. Either that or you are not at a deficit.

    I like this post...

    Also, the more I read, the more I become to believe that there's a myth around muscle performance and metabolism...Really, a person who has a slightly lower body fat percentage can burn much more than the one with slightly higher one? say 5lb difference?

    Yeah the numbers get greatly exaggerated- muscle burns something like 6cal/day/lb and fat is 2cal/day/lb at rest. So all other things equal your person with 5lbs of muscle will burn like 20 extra calories a day.

    But, on the other hand, if you're lifting weights, the muscle tissue gets torn up and additional calories are used over a couple day period to repair the tears- so that accounts for some additional calories not tied specifically to movement. There's also lifestyle trends that would suggest that the more muscular person is generally less sedentary so they burn more NEAT calories and that the more muscular person's CNS system is trained to fire more tissue through the day. But, those are just trends and there's obviously exceptions to the rule. Like, an ultramarathoner with lower muscle mass (because extra muscle is a hindrance in their sport) probably isn't a sedentary individual so they would defy those trends.
  • albayin
    albayin Posts: 2,524 Member
    Options
    Most people who think they have a lot of muscle, don't. Until you get to a lowish BF% it is actually pretty hard to tell unless you have been lean before and know how much you carry.

    Even if you did, that has nothing to do with not being able to lose weight now.

    You may well be retaining water if you started exercising which is masking 'real' weight loss. Either that or you are not at a deficit.

    I like this post...

    Also, the more I read, the more I become to believe that there's a myth around muscle performance and metabolism...Really, a person who has a slightly lower body fat percentage can burn much more than the one with slightly higher one? say 5lb difference?

    Yeah the numbers get greatly exaggerated- muscle burns something like 6cal/day/lb and fat is 2cal/day/lb at rest. So all other things equal your person with 5lbs of muscle will burn like 20 extra calories a day.

    But, on the other hand, if you're lifting weights, the muscle tissue gets torn up and additional calories are used over a couple day period to repair the tears- so that accounts for some additional calories not tied specifically to movement. There's also lifestyle trends that would suggest that the more muscular person is generally less sedentary so they burn more NEAT calories and that the more muscular person's CNS system is trained to fire more tissue through the day. But, those are just trends and there's obviously exceptions to the rule. Like, an ultramarathoner with lower muscle mass (because extra muscle is a hindrance in their sport) probably isn't a sedentary individual so they would defy those trends.

    Agreed. But I have also seen more like "she has all that muscle and she eats all day"...This is misleading, really...This actually made some of my friends who are newbie to fitness to believe that the only purpose of building muscle is to eat more...way more...
  • SezxyStef
    SezxyStef Posts: 15,268 Member
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    But you didn't take the words at face value. You assumed the OP meant something (stupid) that she didn't say, which is the opposite.

    It's not important, this one instance. But maybe people will stop posting that knee-jerk response if enough people point out how illogical and presumptuous it is.

    no I took them at face value.
    Muscle weights more than fat is not code for I am stupid it is a statement that is made when people are not really thinking about what they are saying...and a big pet peeve of mine...I took the words for their actual meaning and didn't imply anything. Now if the poster said the muscle I have takes up less space then my fat so I look smaller than I really am...I wouldn't have said anything except the advice I gave.
    I saw it. You got trapped in a corner and then used the words "obtuse and doltish."

    Impressive.

    not backed into a corner at all jsut refuse to carry on this fruitless conversation with strangers who are so sure they are right about what the OP was "implying' with a statement...cause this could go on and on and on...and then we have hijacked a thread and I don't want to do that. I don't have a desire to prove I am right about what words mean...:wink: and that is not me being a *kitten* honest..

    I was really laid low with doltish, let me tell ya. And the scare quotes around "logic" upthread. Is it time for .gifs or do we just quietly abandon this one? I never know the protocol for these things...

    And this was the logic I was laughing at...I have no idea where the poster came up with that...makes no sense. MIght just be my blond hair or the fact I need a coffee but this quote still makes me laugh..
    Detail oriented? Do you weigh more than other people you know? By your logic, no, because a pound of you weighs the same as a pound of anyone else.
    :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: because in all honest a lb of me does weigh the same as a lb of someone else I jsut have more lbs or less in some cases...:drinker:


    .

    I suspect there are 3 ex debate team members here...

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