Let's say your metabolism is ACTUALLY slow...

Maleficent0241

I have been honest about my intake, weighing everything I eat, etc., and barely shifting weight - basically I just stopped gaining when I should be losing. After visiting the doctor and a registered dietician about it, I ended up at the lab getting my RMR tested. Well, now I know why it isn't working! My RMR is quite a bit lower than expected based on formulas.

My question is now that I know how slow I'm running, how do I get my metabolism back to normal or at least semi-normal? If you want our theories as to why I got stuck this way, I can give more detail, but for now I will just say that up until a sudden change a few years ago I have not had this problem so I don't think it's a matter of genetics.

My current stats:
5'7", 30 yr old female. 175 pounds give or take a pound depending on the day.

Measured RMR: 1285, and I assume BMR would be a bit below that.

Sedentary job right now. The only exercise I really get is workouts, of which I am doing cardio 3x per week for 25 minutes, weights 3x per week (upper body and lower body alternating days), and walk at least a bit every day.

My average intake for the last several months is currently at 1403 calories per day. Silly me thought that I would at least lose something between food counting and exercise, and I haven't been. Since cutting my calories down another 500 is at best stupid and at the worst dangerous, how do I go about losing weight? If I keep at heavy lifting, will that eventually help? I'm so lost as to what to do, and so far I have not gotten much guidance from the physicians. Thanks in advance for any help!

WBB55

In theory, building new muscle fibers will increase your BMR. (Of course, building new cells of ANY kind will increase your BMR, to get scientific about it.)

ell_v131

If your RMR is 1285, you should be losing while eating 1400. I believe the TDEE for sedentary is RMR (or BMR) x1.2, so you should have a 100-150 calorie deficit per day, leading to a weight loss of a pound a month at least. Not great loss I know

The only way to really increase your RMR or BMR is to add muscle mass. For that you would have to make peace with gaining weight and begin a stregth training regime focused on gaining muscle along with eating above your maintenance. This is called a bulk and is usually set at about 500 cals over maintenance. You would gain about a pound a week, but a lot of it would be muscle. With new muscle, your RMR/BMR goes up, and then you can go into "cut" phase, when you take down calories from your new maintenance number.

I know putting on weight sounds counterproductive but it would be the only way to increase RMR. You can however increase your TDEE by adding more movement to your day. Get up every hour on the hour and walk around your office building. Take stairs instead of elevator. Park your car in the furthest stop. Stand up or pace while on the phone. Drink a lot of water and get up to go to the bathroom a lot (just kidding. but not really lol). All these things combined can add a good couple hundred calories to your daily burn, and will make it easier for you to lose and then maintain weight.

Maleficent0241

Thank you both. I probably have lost a pound last month, it's just hard to know for sure since a pound could be attributed to just about anything. I was weighing in between 177-179 and now I am fluctuating between 175 and 178, so it's possible. It was just becoming so damn frustrating when I should be losing 1.5 lbs per week by the math (I know loss isn't linear, but still) and it's MAYBE going down by .25, you know? Now that I know my true numbers, the crawl makes sense.

Is it possible to go through a bulk or similar phase AT maintenance instead of above? I have a GI disorder that makes it really hard for me to eat as it is (another frustration - who the hell gains weight while on TPN?!). I bought some protein powder so maybe that could help fill in some needed nutrients.

I did have a ridiculous amount of muscle wasting when I was at my sickest - I lost around 30 pounds over the course of a few months before I was diagnosed which put me at a BMI in the 16's. it sounds like the lack of muscle I am left with is probably the main reason for the crappy RMR... Am I understanding that correctly?

ell_v131

If you have lost a large amount of muscle, then yes, this would be a big blow to your BMR.

you can't bulk on maintenance. Think about it as building a house. Can't build it without bricks. If all your bricks are used to keep your body running(maintenance), none are left to build muscle.

Definitely protein shake is a great idea, but it will not give you "nutrients", just protein. But you will need the protein to build muscle. Unfortunately the only way to gain muscle is to put yourself above maintenace. However on the plus side, there are a lot of women who are heavier now then they were before, but are thinner, as a pound of muscle occupies less space than a pound of fat!

You however need to be ready to gain some fat along with the muscle, which will then need losing. You can minimize this by high protein intake, not having your bulk calories too big (with your RMR I would say 200-300 above) and taking up strength training focusing on volume with a trainer. You will need to mostly work with weights, as Cardio would not benefit your muscle growth. 3 times a week with full rest on rest days (that's when muscle growth happens).

I suggest you post a question about this in the fitness section or if there is a section here on gaining weight. How to best go about increasing your muscle mass while minimizing fat increase, how long to do the bulk for etc. I'm far from expert on it. Personally I would do 4-8 weeks bulk followed by similar period cut (so under the maintenance). You will need to recalculate your maintenance weekly based on your actual results (so number of calories eaten that week + any number you lost, i.e. 1lb is 3500cals, so add it to the weekly cals, divide total by 7. That's your maintenance. If you gained weight, substract the gained weightxcalories from the weekly total for your maintenance)

I don't have your kinda medical issues but understand it can be challenging to eat up. focus on calorie dense foods like cheese, avocado, nuts, peanut butter, this will help. Quesadillas with guacamole and sour cream are a really good food for bulking lol

BeachGingerOnTheRocks

How long have you been at this? Did the nutritionist/registered dietician or your doctor give you any ideas on how to overcome metabolic damage?

I'm not a medical professional and don't even pretend, but maybe you could try eating at only a slight deficit rather than trying to lose too fast (.5 to 1 pound a week max). Maybe switch to HIIT and add in strength training. Try it for a few months and then re-evaluate.

BeachGingerOnTheRocks

If you have lost a large amount of muscle, then yes, this would be a big blow to your BMR.

you can't bulk on maintenance. Think about it as building a house. Can't build it without bricks. If all your bricks are used to keep your body running(maintenance), none are left to build muscle.

Definitely protein shake is a great idea, but it will not give you "nutrients", just protein. But you will need the protein to build muscle. Unfortunately the only way to gain muscle is to put yourself above maintenace. However on the plus side, there are a lot of women who are heavier now then they were before, but are thinner, as a pound of muscle occupies less space than a pound of fat!

You however need to be ready to gain some fat along with the muscle, which will then need losing. You can minimize this by high protein intake, not having your bulk calories too big (with your RMR I would say 200-300 above) and taking up strength training focusing on volume with a trainer. You will need to mostly work with weights, as Cardio would not benefit your muscle growth. 3 times a week with full rest on rest days (that's when muscle growth happens).

I suggest you post a question about this in the fitness section or if there is a section here on gaining weight. How to best go about increasing your muscle mass while minimizing fat increase, how long to do the bulk for etc. I'm far from expert on it. Personally I would do 4-8 weeks bulk followed by similar period cut (so under the maintenance). You will need to recalculate your maintenance weekly based on your actual results (so number of calories eaten that week + any number you lost, i.e. 1lb is 3500cals, so add it to the weekly cals, divide total by 7. That's your maintenance. If you gained weight, substract the gained weightxcalories from the weekly total for your maintenance)

I don't have your kinda medical issues but understand it can be challenging to eat up. focus on calorie dense foods like cheese, avocado, nuts, peanut butter, this will help. Quesadillas with guacamole and sour cream are a really good food for bulking lol

Actually, some powders are fortified with a good punch of micronutrients. Muscle Milk, for example, gives 35%-50% of the primary micronutrients in 2 scoops/70 grams. It really all depends on brands.

parkscs

I would probably look to reduce your caloric deficit slightly - say from 1400 to 1200 - and see how that goes for a bit. Definitely make sure you're hitting your macro and preferably take up weight lifting, as you don't want to lose any more lean body mass than you already have. But I'm not sure it makes sense to start a pure bulk right now. You could also look into a recomp-type program where you look to maintain approximately your current weight while adding muscle.

ell_v131

If you have lost a large amount of muscle, then yes, this would be a big blow to your BMR.

you can't bulk on maintenance. Think about it as building a house. Can't build it without bricks. If all your bricks are used to keep your body running(maintenance), none are left to build muscle.

Definitely protein shake is a great idea, but it will not give you "nutrients", just protein. But you will need the protein to build muscle. Unfortunately the only way to gain muscle is to put yourself above maintenace. However on the plus side, there are a lot of women who are heavier now then they were before, but are thinner, as a pound of muscle occupies less space than a pound of fat!

You however need to be ready to gain some fat along with the muscle, which will then need losing. You can minimize this by high protein intake, not having your bulk calories too big (with your RMR I would say 200-300 above) and taking up strength training focusing on volume with a trainer. You will need to mostly work with weights, as Cardio would not benefit your muscle growth. 3 times a week with full rest on rest days (that's when muscle growth happens).

I suggest you post a question about this in the fitness section or if there is a section here on gaining weight. How to best go about increasing your muscle mass while minimizing fat increase, how long to do the bulk for etc. I'm far from expert on it. Personally I would do 4-8 weeks bulk followed by similar period cut (so under the maintenance). You will need to recalculate your maintenance weekly based on your actual results (so number of calories eaten that week + any number you lost, i.e. 1lb is 3500cals, so add it to the weekly cals, divide total by 7. That's your maintenance. If you gained weight, substract the gained weightxcalories from the weekly total for your maintenance)

I don't have your kinda medical issues but understand it can be challenging to eat up. focus on calorie dense foods like cheese, avocado, nuts, peanut butter, this will help. Quesadillas with guacamole and sour cream are a really good food for bulking lol

Actually, some powders are fortified with a good punch of micronutrients. Muscle Milk, for example, gives 35%-50% of the primary micronutrients in 2 scoops/70 grams. It really all depends on brands.

You're right. When I say protein I usually mean Isolate, which where I come from are usually not enriched, but I guess that is just my undersanding and there are products to be found that have both.

sijomial

Thank you both. I probably have lost a pound last month, it's just hard to know for sure since a pound could be attributed to just about anything. I was weighing in between 177-179 and now I am fluctuating between 175 and 178, so it's possible. It was just becoming so damn frustrating when I should be losing 1.5 lbs per week by the math (I know loss isn't linear, but still) and it's MAYBE going down by .25, you know? Now that I know my true numbers, the crawl makes sense.

Is it possible to go through a bulk or similar phase AT maintenance instead of above? I have a GI disorder that makes it really hard for me to eat as it is (another frustration - who the hell gains weight while on TPN?!). I bought some protein powder so maybe that could help fill in some needed nutrients.

I did have a ridiculous amount of muscle wasting when I was at my sickest - I lost around 30 pounds over the course of a few months before I was diagnosed which put me at a BMI in the 16's. it sounds like the lack of muscle I am left with is probably the main reason for the crappy RMR... Am I understanding that correctly?

Regarding the bolded part - there's a bit of either misunderstanding or hyperbole going on.
A pound of fat uses about 2 cals a day to maintain itself.
A pound of muscle uses about 6 cals a day to maintain itself.
So losing (or gaining) a few pounds of muscle doesn't actually make a vast difference to your RMR. Some of course, just not a great deal.

As for gaining some muscle at maintenance (recomp)... You might be able to recover some lost muscle at maintenance as "returning after a layoff" puts you in the same sort of category as a newbie to lifting. Just don't expect it to be quick!

I really think that you need to decide your priority, weight loss or muscle regain. Whatever you do a good protein intake and a progressive lifting routine is only going to help.

Maleficent0241

Thanks again everyone...

I have worked out with a trainer a few times already, been lifting on my own steadily for a month (on and off before that, due to illness), so I realize I am very very new to it. Part of my problem is I can't decide my priority, I suppose. I really thought I could lose fat and slowly regain some muscle at the same time, but it sounds like it can't really work that way - my body fat percentage is at a very dangerous level, so for health reasons that is probably my priority - can I lose body fat while MAINTAINING (or at least greatly reducing) muscle mass?

BeachGingerOn - sadly not, just stay with low GI carbohydrates to improve blood sugar. Beyond that, it was just a lot of "well, keep doing what you're doing." Okay, well, what I am doing is NOT working, so...
parkscs - the ~1400 number is gross calories, not net. Should I go down to 1200 gross?

As an aside, the protein powder does have added nutrients, but my main reason for getting it is because I am having trouble hitting my protein requirements most days.

ell_v131

well at maintenance with the right diet you can lose some fat and gain some muscle, known as body recomposition. it does take a loooong time though so even after a year you may not see very clear results, some people do, some dont. Yes to protein powder.

With the nmber of calories, just figure out what your maintenance is and cut a bit from that if you wanna lose, go over if you want to bulk, stay on id you want to maintain. If you have been tracking accurately, it should not be hard to figure out your maintenance using my earlier explanation.

losing 30 pounds of muscle does make a difference. Like the previous poster mentioned, by losing 30lbs of muscle (if it in fact was all muscle), your RMR would go down by 180. That's a nice sized chicken steak. Also when we lose weight or feel weak, we don't move so much naturally, so our NEAT (non-exercise activity thermogenesis) is lower, impacting our TDEE. Think of it as your body trying to expand less energy on non-necessary movements. Fidgeting, pacing in place etc.Trying to move more consciousl wil increase your TDEE and give you higher numbers to work with.

Maleficent0241

Thanks again for all of your help. After a night's worth of thinking over everything and looking at my numbers, I think right now losing fat while trying to minimize muscle loss is going to be my priority right now. Once I am down to a not so dangerous level of fat, I will really work on building muscle back up. Does that sound feasible?