Are the poor fat?
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The person who posted that initially was trying to say "hey look we did it, you should be able to as well".. but she was lucky enough to be married *potentially 2 incomes* to a chef *who in theory knows more then the average person does about food prep and cooking* and they clearly had the items they needed to do the cooking and the time they needed to do it. Exhaustion and stress factors play a huge role in your ability to cook, learn to cook or carve out the time to learn recipes and cook them. It's not being lazy. It's reality.
Since I think this one was aimed at my post, I'm going to let you know that I agree with you. I KNOW that because of my husband's background that we had extra food knowledge that made it easier for us than for some, and I know that in the down economy he got laid off because people just don't go out to fancy restaurants when the economy was bad. That is why I worked 2 jobs and he stayed home with the kids and did the shopping and cooking.
However It still wasn't easy and by NO MEANS did I mean that because we did it that anyone could. Part of my point also - was that processed foods that are easy to make and fill your belly aren't always the best for you. We ate A LOT of pasta, because it was a good way to fill the boys' stomach. One of them could eat a whole box (1#) by himself. Now that he is done 'growing' and eats normally - that 1# box feeds all 5 of us. I also was able to learn to shop/cook from my mother. We always had what we needed, but I now know that mom was really good at making it stretch, with coupons, and the ability to cook. I know that there are people out there with lack of electricity, stove (and I sympathize - I had 2 months where I cooked on a hotplate and a toaster oven or microwave because our stove needed to be replaced and I didn't have the money)
You have to get creative was my point. You also have to get educated. Something that isn't always easy for the poor. I was on SNAP - I think in order to get it, you should have to take a class on shopping/cooking/sales/coupons - you could teach a lot in one day that would be good for anyone for a lifetime! I was fortunate.
Trust me - there were plenty of times that we also bought stuff that was considered junk food, just because it was easy, cheap and would go a long way. I bought crappy deli meat and chips to pack lunches. I am sure roasted chicken on whole wheat would have been much better for me that baloney or PBJ on cheap white bread every day with chips (cause a bag would last a week) - but it was cheap and it was lunch and I wasn't hungry.
However, eating like that, is why I am here now - I have a good 20-25 pounds maybe more still to lose on my short tiny frame (5'0" and small boned). A teenage boy eats like that - he burns it off - I eat like that and I pack on the pounds. It wasn't even the quantity of what I ate, it was the lack of nutritional value in what I was eating (high empty calories).
Like you said - when you are poor, you don't care what you eat, as long as you get to eat.0 -
and I don't know why that posted my entire response as another quote - only the first part was. So please bear with it!. Thanks0
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Are you kidding?? Comparing a sensible portion of food for your 5 year old daughter to that of my 14 year old son???
My son is a 6 foot 3, 175lbs broad shouldered, football playing, 5k running. weight lifting, camping, swimmer solid skinny teenager. He's a size 32x33 in pants. (Which is at the low end of the "ideal weight" doctors what to see a person of this height be at. ) How does that amount of food amount to too much?? I actually do not think he brings enough for his lunch. I did tell him he should have eaten something else besides a 3rd chicken leg, but boys are also lazy in that they don't want to take a minute to make something else when there is food already hot and prepped. And due to conflicting schedules I am not always there to provide an alternative. He's bigger than (taller and broader) a lot of adults I know. he went snow cave camping and when the recommended meal plans for that came out I swear it was near 4000 calories per day on them!
I fail to see how feeding my growing super active teenage boy enough food to fuel his body is bad parenting or ignorance? he ate all healthy food with a nice treat in there, because kids like treats. I really don't think you have any clue what you are talking about when it comes to feeding teenage boys.
When my son does eat eggs he eats 5 or 6 at a time scrambled with cheese and whatever else I make him put in it, with a side of meat and potatoes and yogurt.
If I was *still* poor. He'd not have had that much food available unfortunately. He's also not be this active or involved in as many activities as he is, so he wouldn't need as much. Because you know it all costs money. If he was 5, he would eat significantly less. When I was young and flat broke, I bought ramen because it was cheap and filling if I had a dollar and a stove. It definitely was not enjoyable nor did it taste good. Food bank are generally open 1 or 2 days a week, during working hours and where I used to live there weren't any close by and a lot of the foods they give you require cooking. (potatoes come to mind) If I could get to one, i'd have veggies for a day or two.. since I had no fridge they'd go bad pretty quick. And I could spend my dollar on what protein exactly??
So if you know that your son is overly active, much more so than the average teenager (dont tell me he is because 1 in 4 kids in the States are overweight), then why bring this to the discussion. It is an irrelevant comparison.
The point about my daughter still stands. Irrespective of her age, feed a fair size portion of sensible amounts and she can eat healthily relatively cheaply. I dont buy all these sob stories about people being so poor they have to feed themselves rubbish all the time. If for $5 dollars you can buy a pack of 10 burgers or a chicken salad (obviously this is not the cost of a salad. I am using this for illustration purposes), the lesson is still the same. Just because you buy 10 burgers it doesnt mean you need to eat them in large proportions.
Also, exercise can be free. If people are eating too many calories, then they can still exercise. Obviously this doesnt happen enough if they are overweight0 -
Being poor doesn't mean you definitely become fat, but it certainly helps you down that road. When I can get an entire box of swiss cake rolls for a buck versus one (maybe one depending on size and price) uncooked chicken breast.. And yea.. it is easier.. but it's also more calories and more filling and i can give half to my son.
Difference is, that for other people, irrespective of income, a chicken breast would be almost sufficient for a person of less gluttonous mentality, whereas for others, a box of swiss cake rolls would be starter...0 -
The "poor" get food supplement (Food stamps, wic etc.) It is the lower middle class that cut out more expensive foods. Avocado are near $1.00 each. Those are luxury items for most lower middle class... A bag of mandarin oranges are $5.00, and so they are bought in limited quantities. Healthy eating is not as cheap, as ramen noodle, but then again neither is a trip to the Dr. for the lack of nutrition. I think convenience is more of an issue. If it's cheap and easy we will fore go healthy choices for convenience.
$1 for an avocado means I'm actually going to buy one. That's dirt cheap. Mandarin oranges? Well, they are 80 cents for a can. Those are strange examples. To me, eating healthy means having adequate protein and fats and limiting total calories. The protein is the only hard part. Fruits and veggies from cans or frozen are very cheap.
After being on MFP for a year and a half, I no longer associate healthy eating with specific food choices. Healthy eating is about meeting nutritional requirements. Period.0 -
Being poor doesn't mean you definitely become fat, but it certainly helps you down that road. When I can get an entire box of swiss cake rolls for a buck versus one (maybe one depending on size and price) uncooked chicken breast.. And yea.. it is easier.. but it's also more calories and more filling and i can give half to my son.
Difference is, that for other people, irrespective of income, a chicken breast would be almost sufficient for a person of less gluttonous mentality, whereas for others, a box of swiss cake rolls would be starter...
Swiss cake rolls have little to no protein. They are primarily carbs and fat. And, if you are having chicken breast then there's probably room in the day's macro requirements for one two-pack of them. They are roughly 300 calories if you buy them in the $2 box.
But there I go again, talking about nutrients instead of vague subjective terms like "healthy." :smokin:0 -
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$1 for an avocado means I'm actually going to buy one. That's dirt cheap. Mandarin oranges? Well, they are 80 cents for a can. Those are strange examples. To me, eating healthy means having adequate protein and fats and limiting total calories. The protein is the only hard part. Fruits and veggies from cans or frozen are very cheap.
After being on MFP for a year and a half, I no longer associate healthy eating with specific food choices. Healthy eating is about meeting nutritional requirements. Period.
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If you are on a restrictive budget you don't spend $1 on an avocado - I only buy them on sale at Aldi for .29 - now that is cheap (and if you have one near you I highly recommend it because it is cheap and most if not all produce is grown in USA) If I want veggies for a dollar, I'll buy a bag of frozen or $.99 worth of broccoli or 2 $.50 cans of green beans - not one avocado - that is the point. Unless you have really been on a restrictive budget and have more than ONE person to feed - by myself I might make one avocado be my whole lunch -but that isn't going to feed a family of 4 or 5 - but a can of beans will - or a crown of broccoli.
I used to have to feed a family of 5 on about $300 a month - you have to be filling and nutritious at that point - the two words are NOT equal - and sometimes as a parent you have to make a choice. I may have to make do with something that you don't consider nutritionally feesible (say cheap white pasta) and combine it as best I can with something that is. (take 1 chicken breast and one crown of broccoli and stir it all together with Italian dressing or with cheese or something. Most people would feed that one chicken breast to ONE person - I would have to stretch it to feed 5.
That's the point - sometimes when you are poor - you have to fill in with non-nutritional items just to get by. It doesn't mean you can't combine it - but if you don't have the education and cooking know-how - it can be very difficult.0 -
I still keep Ramen in my cupboard, but I never eat it. My kids eat it occasionally, but it's there in case we run out of food right before payday.
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I have some too but I just checked, 470 calories, 20g of fat PLUS 10g of saturated fat, 1870 mg of sodium, 63g of carbs in every package.
Don't think I'll be eating another one, guess I'll donate it to the Food Bank.0 -
I still keep Ramen in my cupboard, but I never eat it. My kids eat it occasionally, but it's there in case we run out of food right before payday.
I have some too but I just checked, 470 calories, 20g of fat PLUS 10g of saturated fat, 1870 mg of sodium, 63g of carbs in every package.
Don't think I'll be eating another one, guess I'll donate it to the Food Bank.
What are your macros?0 -
$1 for an avocado means I'm actually going to buy one. That's dirt cheap. Mandarin oranges? Well, they are 80 cents for a can. Those are strange examples. To me, eating healthy means having adequate protein and fats and limiting total calories. The protein is the only hard part. Fruits and veggies from cans or frozen are very cheap.
After being on MFP for a year and a half, I no longer associate healthy eating with specific food choices. Healthy eating is about meeting nutritional requirements. Period.
If you are on a restrictive budget you don't spend $1 on an avocado - I only buy them on sale at Aldi for .29 - now that is cheap (and if you have one near you I highly recommend it because it is cheap and most if not all produce is grown in USA) If I want veggies for a dollar, I'll buy a bag of frozen or $.99 worth of broccoli or 2 $.50 cans of green beans - not one avocado - that is the point. Unless you have really been on a restrictive budget and have more than ONE person to feed - by myself I might make one avocado be my whole lunch -but that isn't going to feed a family of 4 or 5 - but a can of beans will - or a crown of broccoli.
I used to have to feed a family of 5 on about $300 a month - you have to be filling and nutritious at that point - the two words are NOT equal - and sometimes as a parent you have to make a choice. I may have to make do with something that you don't consider nutritionally feesible (say cheap white pasta) and combine it as best I can with something that is. (take 1 chicken breast and one crown of broccoli and stir it all together with Italian dressing or with cheese or something. Most people would feed that one chicken breast to ONE person - I would have to stretch it to feed 5.
That's the point - sometimes when you are poor - you have to fill in with non-nutritional items just to get by. It doesn't mean you can't combine it - but if you don't have the education and cooking know-how - it can be very difficult.
I will ask the same of you: What are your macros?0 -
Totals 1,615 122 85 60 2,348 58
Your Daily Goal 2,122 266 71 107 2,300 79
Remaining 507 144 -14 47 -48 21
Calories Carbs Fat Protein Sodium Sugar
*You've earned 892 extra calories from exercise today
There is yesterday - We went rollerskating - that was the exercise -
I'll be happy to open my diary for you. I try hard to adjust my meals - yesterday the we had burgers for dinner - I didn't have a bun - the rest of the family did.0 -
Totals 1,615 122 85 60 2,348 58
Your Daily Goal 2,122 266 71 107 2,300 79
Remaining 507 144 -14 47 -48 21
Calories Carbs Fat Protein Sodium Sugar
*You've earned 892 extra calories from exercise today
There is yesterday - We went rollerskating - that was the exercise -
I'll be happy to open my diary for you. I try hard to adjust my meals - yesterday the we had burgers for dinner - I didn't have a bun - the rest of the family did.
I meant the ratio. The point is, it isn't about specific food choices, but about nutrients. Yes, you may choose two cans of green beans over an avocado for financial reasons, but depending on your macro needs, you can eat nutritious food on a tight budget.
My food budget is almost the same as yours. We have a family of four and spend about $80 per week. (Also, I tend to buy canned green beans when they are 4/$1 on sale, so I rarely have to pay full price.) I am big on shopping the loss leaders and buying on sale.0 -
If you're on a budget, chicken breasts aren't a great example.
Instead, I'd use cheaper cuts of meat, accept a bit of fat as part of macros and save a fair bit.0 -
If you're on a budget, chicken breasts aren't a great example.
Instead, I'd use cheaper cuts of meat, accept a bit of fat as part of macros and save a fair bit.
^^ Yep.
That's part of what I was getting at. Chicken and broccoli are always both thrown out as examples of so-called "healthy" food, but you don't ever have to eat either one to have a healthy diet.0 -
Costed less than what?My point in posting that was that I could have spend 5 or 6 dollars at mcdonalds and gotten him fed, which would have costed less. (double cheeseburgers off the dollar menue etc).
In the UK potatoes can be got from around 50p/kg, rice (dry) 40p/kg. Neither need a lot of effort to cook - a couple of minutes at the start and a minute when the timer goes. Or an 800g loaf of cheap bread 45p.
400g of cheap ham £1.65.
Some bits of salad £1, say.
Make 10 sandwiches at once and you're probably not taking any longer than it does to go in to McDonalds and order, pay, then wait for you food and so on.
45p?? What's that 70 cents US?? I can't get bread for anywhere near that here. Try 2 dollars for cheap unhealthy white bread. You can't get other foods you mentioned for those prices here either. Not where I live..and I price compare 5 different stores (Albertsons, king soopers, Safeway, Sams and wal-mart) Occasionally in the bakery markdown section you will find a loaf of bread for around 1.50, but don't bet on it. ham?? Cheap cheap cheap domestic ham, pre packaged in a solution of yuk is $3.99 minimum. bits of salad? I cant' even go there as that is too broad. Now to feed my son, with ham sandwiches, that have lettuce (maybe a dollar a pound) on it and no condiment.. i'd have to feed him 5 or 6 sandwiches easily.
Rice and potatoes, which are cheaper then a lot of other Foods, as well as pasta. (provided you get white of course) But you're really getting a small box if you get it for a dollar.
We could argue prices forever. they vary throughout the nation and world.What are your macros?
The very poor are not concerned with macros. They are concerned with eating.. period. That is who we are talking about right? Of course those on here, who have learned something about nutrition might be trying to eat healthier. But if it's between eat and not eating, they are going to eat regardless of macros or healthiness of food. they are going to go with what is cheap and what is big enough to feed everyone they need to feed. Perhaps for me a dollar menu somewhere is cheaper to feed my son off of but it wouldn't be if I had 4 children to feed. (or maybe it would, idk.. do I have 4 teenage boys? 4 girls who don't really eat? 4 toddlers?) I might do better doing something else. When I didn't have a way to cook or store food, I would have made a different choice then I would today since I have both of those items.0 -
I buy sales and markdowns as well - always watch for loss leaders, use coupons etc. I have never said that you can't eat healthy on a budget - just that it is harder and you need to work at it. I wish I understood macros more - I honestly don't my ratios, so I can't tell you the ratios. (Also note the cost of the cans of beans vs. an avocado was an example - I rarely pay 50 cents for beans as well)
Like I said - I am fortunate that I have a husband who is a trained chef (even though that isn't what he does now) we combine what we can with what is on sale. We were able to eat fresh out of garden (my mom's neighbor always has a huge one and sends stuff home with me, and I always grow stuff when I can - depends on living situation at the time - apartment rental didn't work so well) Also now that the teenage boy isn't in the house (he moved back in with his mom) -we can eat a little differently. It's a lot easier to feed a 8 year old and an 11 year old (combined they don't eat what he did) and my 18 year old daughter doesn't eat anywhere what he did either.
going back to my original post - A 17 year old boy at 6'4" is going to eat drastically more than a 5 year old girl - to compare the two in ANY LIGHT as far as what it costs or a quantity to feed them is wrong. You can't - it's apples to oranges.
and
Poor people eat more processed food - that is fact - especially a lot of carbs - whether you take that into pasta/bread/etc.
They use it as a filler when they need to. They also usually eat fatter cuts of meat - because it's cheaper.
My family now can get by on salads and small amounts of protein and be full - not when I had a 17 year old soccer player - we needed those fillers to make the meal stretch far enough. He was active enough to burn it off. We just combined it with healthier choices (pasta with fresh veggies) - not all families have the education to do that.
I've never said that everyone could do what I did, nor did I ever say I ate horribly (except for my packed lunches for a while). I said education was key and that isn't always available to a poorer family. (We ended up poor due to economy swing - not generational) That makes a HUGE difference. We had the ability to do things differently because we knew better - not everyone does.0 -
Yea, about 75c for 45p. I'm surprised it's more expensive over there - these prices are for 'Asda' which is owned by Walmart and is the cheapest of the main stream supermarkets - there are other cheaper shops, but they don't offer the range the big ones do. I always presumed the US was cheaper for food through cheaper fuel, lower population density, higher population and just that you generally pay less for stuff
As an idea, for £1 I could get an iceberg lettuce and 4 tomatoes (the iceberg lettuce is currently half price to be fair, so it's the price of a cheaper lettuce, but I prefer the iceberg.)
Even with higher prices, I still find it hard to believe that buying McDonalds comes out cheaper on a basic calories thing.
Oh and what makes the white bread 'unhealthy'? (The brown bread is 2p more here, by the way.)0 -
The sale price for tomatoes is 99 cents per lb. They don't sell them per each usually. I don't buy iceberg lettuce so I don't know the cost of it, but when romaine is in season you can find it for a dollar or dollar twenty five a lbs if you shop around. Asparagus is on sale this week for a $1.99 lbs. Occasionally it drops to $1.49, but that's usually when the crops are very very thin and "wimpy". they don't taste as good. But I get them anyway.
Prices vary greatly here. I don't pay the same as my brother who lives on the other side of the country. Some better and some worse.
I did pretty good yesterday
3lb bag tangelos, (3.99)
2 containers fresh broccoli.carrot mix (1.49 each)
1 container fresh broccoli slaw (1.49)
2 containers fresh green beans (1.49 each)
1 loaf rye bread (1.49)
1/2lb salami (like 5 dollars)
6 donuts and 4 turnover pastries (3.00)
= $22.18
Not enough for a week or anything, but we were out of oranges for my son's lunch.
Everything but the oranges and lunch meat was a markdown so about half price, i am forgetting something.
This will all be gone by the weekend.0 -
While I have travelled across the US it was when I was 8 and we didn't pay much attention to prices of grocieries.
When I checked on google I was surprised to see prices varied across the country - in a UK supermarket it is the same for the same product in that chain anywhere (but they are careful to only have the more expensive lines in smaller ones generally) - however as we're smaller than some of your states, logistical issues are a little different!0
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