50+ miles a week running, no weight loss
Replies
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People, all of those numbers are just estimates and should only be used as guidelines. If you've been eating in a certain calorie range for a few weeks and haven't lost anything, than gradually reduce it by a couple hundred calories until you start losing.
You'll drive yourself crazy if you obsess on the numbers too much.0 -
When people are saying strength work, is that gym work or a class or something else?
Interested to hear what people do.
Strength is generally lower rep, higher weight type stuff.
Most people will be thinking about barbell work with compound lifts: Bench, Squat, Deadlift, OHP, Rows
But you can gain strength using any system that incorporates lower rep and progressive resistance. So for instance, heavy kettlebell work in the low rep ranges or even bodyweight progressions (if programmed correctly to keep the rep ranges low).
For someone running as much as you, you may want to look to something like a 2x week fullbody compound lifting schedule, which you could get done with minimal time commitment and still recover from.0 -
When I was depending upon the calorie burned from my Garmin I would deduct 100 calories an hour from it's estimate. This helped me get down to 155 prior to my "A" marathon last year.0
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Hi all,
I run 6 days a week, cover 50+ miles in that period and have been using Endomondo to log my runs with my Garmin GPS and heart rate monitor.
The issue is I eat all my calories, including my excercise calories and I'm not loosing weight, Ive also tried eating less food than what my daily allowance is and still nothing.
I'm 6"2, currently floating around 13.2 stone, from week to week I go from 13.3 to 13.0 but never get any lower than 13.
My aim was to get down to 12.6 as I find this is a good weight for me when racing.
Any help / suggestions would be great,
my guess is you are over trained and cortisol levels are high. That is a lot of training and this is a common symptom. I'd be curious to know what your training protocol is. I would recommend the following:
Reduce carbs to 100g per day and less than 30% of exercise calories.
Reduce training if possible until you reach your leanness goal.
Implement polarized training, 80% of the training is fully aerobic (easy pace), and 20% is HIIT (very hard pace). No junk LT miles.
Take your showers cold to reduce cortisol and burn extra calories.0 -
Cheers Jim, and for for the day off i.e. Friday rest day. Do I still stick to the TDEE calulation?
Looking at : http://iifym.com/tdee-calculator/
It gives me 2779 for 6 days a week activity, minus 250 = 2529 a day
A TDEE calculator will give you an average per day (training or otherwise) based on your activity level, so yes eat that everyday.
I would run with a good, solid 2539 daily for two weeks and then re-evaluate. Hopefully you'll have a fairly accurate estimation right off the bat and minimal adjustment will be necessary!
At the end of the day it's the easiest method for those of us on a regular training schedule or some sort. For more casual or sporadic peeps, then the MFP method is probably superior.
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Pretty easy on the weight piece, you are either consuming more calories than you think or burning less calories than estimated. Even at the "highly active" setting, net calorie goals are just estimates based upon averages. Adjust accordingly.
The real question is why are the estimates off. 50 miles per week is not nearly average, it is extreme. I run 30+ miles per week and find that my body is more efficient than devices estimate - meaning that "calories burned" seem to be always higher than reality when correlated over time against calories consumed and weight lost (I'm a geek, I did analyze the data over time).
Another reason is muscle mass. Running is great for cardiovascular fitness and weight loss, but does not build muscle mass. In fact, if your are losing weight at high levels of cardiovascular activity you are probably also losing muscle mass. Muscle burns more calories per unit measure than any other tissue, even at rest. So I'd be willing to bet if your activity was more balanced, and it you reduced your daily run time by, say 15 mins per day and augmented it with strength training you be more fit, less prone to injury, and would lose more weight. One challenge with weight training - it's very hard to estimate calories burned so I just use weight training as my daily error factor correction.0 -
I agree with a lot of the other posters here. You may have hit a platue and I agree with some others that it might be time to try something other than just running. Try only eating back half of your exercise calories, not all of them. Also look at what you are eating and the quality of it. Try to start making healthier choices even if the calories are the same. Our bodies get too used to what we are doing and we need to 'trick' it in a way.0
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my guess is you are over trained and cortisol levels are high. That is a lot of training and this is a common symptom. I'd be curious to know what your training protocol is. I would recommend the following:
Reduce carbs to 100g per day and less than 30% of exercise calories.
Reduce training if possible until you reach your leanness goal.
Implement polarized training, 80% of the training is fully aerobic (easy pace), and 20% is HIIT (very hard pace). No junk LT miles.
Take your showers cold to reduce cortisol and burn extra calories.
What?
Cortisol too high? Highly unlikely that's the case. 50 miles a week isn't THAT much volume.
Runner's need carbs for fuel.
80% aerobic I can get behind, but calling LT miles junk? Hardly. LT training is the cornerstone of any respectable distance training program and is far from being junk. Additionally, 20% at very high intensity is a recipe for injury.0 -
You could be in a classic plateau - your body has become such an efficient machine that it has learned to cling to extra weight while you run.
It might be time to add in some cycling, swimming, or better yet - some weight training to tone up the muscles so that they burn fat more readily.
If it clings to extra weight, what is it burning when exercising though?
To the OP, it sounds as though you are eating at maintenance, hence why there is no deficit and no deficit, means no weight loss.0 -
my guess is you are over trained and cortisol levels are high. That is a lot of training and this is a common symptom. I'd be curious to know what your training protocol is. I would recommend the following:
Reduce carbs to 100g per day and less than 30% of exercise calories.
Reduce training if possible until you reach your leanness goal.
Implement polarized training, 80% of the training is fully aerobic (easy pace), and 20% is HIIT (very hard pace). No junk LT miles.
Take your showers cold to reduce cortisol and burn extra calories.
What?
Cortisol too high? Highly unlikely that's the case. 50 miles a week isn't THAT much volume.
Runner's need carbs for fuel.
80% aerobic I can get behind, but calling LT miles junk? Hardly. LT training is the cornerstone of any respectable distance training program and is far from being junk. Additionally, 20% at very high intensity is a recipe for injury.
If you are running alot of LT miles then yes, its very common to have high cortisol and low testosterone which contribute to fat retention and hunger. The carb recipe is plenty as your primary is fat for aerobic respiration and the excess carbs contribute to the potential hormonal imbalance as well. I'll PM you references if you would like or just keep doing what your doing.0 -
Hi everyone,
Thanks again for all your comments. I'm not going to change too many things all at the same time. Im going to go with the TDEE daily calories for 2 weeks and see how I get on with that.
My training has been setup from years of running marathons, I know what works for me and 50 mi a week is actually a bit lower than I have done in the past. I had been running 70 a week but found I was just getting tired and not putting in quality sessions.
I'm pretty lucky that I haven't had any major injuries in the 8 years that I've been running and so I am reluctant to change anything to drastically. Especially this close to Edinburgh marathon.
I'll keep you all updated on how the TDEE goes, I really want to get below the 13 stone mark. The photo was taken a year or two ago when I was running my best and that was about 12.6 so that is my aim.
I'm going to look at BodyPump classes for strength work, I'm not a fan of the gym.
Look forward to reading more of your replies.0 -
Running that far each week is a big commitment time wise. When I record my HRM calories from running, I always subtract out my BMR from the amount as the HRM includes those calories. For shorter runs, it's not many, but, if you're running many hours per week, it would add up. Just a thought! Other than that, likely undercounting your food. The HRM is fairly accurate for running so there shouldn't be more than 20% difference there (and probably less than that).
As far as TDEE goes, that may work better for you if you are overcounting exercise calories. For me, TDEE ends up almost exactly the same as MFP + exercise calories and I needed the extra incentive of not earning my extra calories until after my workout. Sounds like that's not an issue for you given your running history so TDEE might be easier/better for you.0 -
my guess is you are over trained and cortisol levels are high. That is a lot of training and this is a common symptom. I'd be curious to know what your training protocol is. I would recommend the following:
Reduce carbs to 100g per day and less than 30% of exercise calories.
Reduce training if possible until you reach your leanness goal.
Implement polarized training, 80% of the training is fully aerobic (easy pace), and 20% is HIIT (very hard pace). No junk LT miles.
Take your showers cold to reduce cortisol and burn extra calories.
What?
Cortisol too high? Highly unlikely that's the case. 50 miles a week isn't THAT much volume.
Runner's need carbs for fuel.
80% aerobic I can get behind, but calling LT miles junk? Hardly. LT training is the cornerstone of any respectable distance training program and is far from being junk. Additionally, 20% at very high intensity is a recipe for injury.
If you are running alot of LT miles then yes, its very common to have high cortisol and low testosterone which contribute to fat retention and hunger. The carb recipe is plenty as your primary is fat for aerobic respiration and the excess carbs contribute to the potential hormonal imbalance as well. I'll PM you references if you would like or just keep doing what your doing.
The OP is training for a marathon, they would be a fool not to train appropriately for it, this includes so many miles per week running, I can never make out why some people (usually those that do no running nor have ever done any running) think that a person will be able to go out and run a marathon on just 20 miles per week or less, this is what comes across in some of the postings in this thread.
However, 50 miles per week, would be highly unlikely to cause high cortisol levels and added to that, OP are you running those 50 miles per week at tempo pace? If not, I would not worry about any cortisol levels being at danger level.
I still stand by what I said in an earlier posting that you are more than likely eating at maintenance levels, hence no reduction in bodyweight.
On another point, why the obsession with wanting to lose those last few pounds, are you finding the "excess" pounds you are carrying (I don't mean that as insulting, I just was unable to find the correct word lol) impede your running? If not and your training is going great, you are not getting injured during your running and you feel good when training, why try changing anything?
I am a firm believer in "if it's not broken, don't fix it" - in your case, you are not broken, don't try to change anything.
Rooting for you in your marathon, go get 'em, you will do grand - and keep up your training, it will reward you accordingly xxx0 -
Well, it's only been a couple of days (well, since Thursday) that I have changed my calories to the TDEE and guess what, Ive been sub 13 stone for the past 2 days - I'm over the moon! If it continues to come of nice and slowly then I'm a happy chap.
The reason I wanted to get back in to the 12's is because I feel my performances are slower with the extra bulk. I can also see the 'bulk' under my club vest
Not great in team photos. Vain I know!
50 miles a week are at a mixture of paces, some tempo, some slow, some at eye balls out!
I had a race yesterday and training is all going in the correct direction and 50 miles a week isn't that difficult for me, it's all about getting the balance and also an understanding, running wife.
I see 50 miles as a 'normal' mileage for training for a marathon, I have friends who on a weekly basis top 70 miles a week so in the present company, I'm doing lower mileage than the norm.
Will see how the following weeks go with my weight loss and also with my race times, got a half marathon this weekend and going to shoot for another PB. Finger crossed.0 -
I just read through this...sounds like you're on the right track.
One thing I was going to mention...you said "runners need carbs for fuel." And that makes me think...How much fuel do you take in for your runs?
A lot of times we don't even realize how much that adds up. And if we keep fueling, then our body gets used to burning the fuel that's in our stomach and nothing else.
Also, in your normal everyday diet, what percentage is carbs/proteins/fats?0 -
I just read through this...sounds like you're on the right track.
One thing I was going to mention...you said "runners need carbs for fuel." And that makes me think...How much fuel do you take in for your runs?
A lot of times we don't even realize how much that adds up. And if we keep fueling, then our body gets used to burning the fuel that's in our stomach and nothing else.
Also, in your normal everyday diet, what percentage is carbs/proteins/fats?
I said that, but I wasn't referring the taking in carbs during workouts, but rather getting the appropriate amount of carbs in our daily diet. I don't advocate using any additional fueling during workouts, only during races.0 -
Well, I've experienced similar things as you. Lots of mileage - running and biking - and good variation of intensity. But not losing weight.
So I've been researching things and analyzing my everyday diet and realizing I've been consuming way too much carbohydrate. Have just started to modify my diet so I can't give you results yet, but I'm adding in healthy fats and reducing my empty carbs...stuff like bagels. One thing I can see is if I eat lots of carbs, I'm usually a few pounds heavier the next day, so it kinda makes sense. .
Another thing to consider is sodium. I didn't realize how much sodium I was taking in until I analyzed my meals. And sodium does bond with water, so more sodium equals more water-weight.
Still experimenting though, so I'll be following along with this thread to see what works for you. good luck.0 -
Well, I've experienced similar things as you. Lots of mileage - running and biking - and good variation of intensity. But not losing weight.
So I've been researching things and analyzing my everyday diet and realizing I've been consuming way too much carbohydrate. Have just started to modify my diet so I can't give you results yet, but I'm adding in healthy fats and reducing my empty carbs...stuff like bagels. One thing I can see is if I eat lots of carbs, I'm usually a few pounds heavier the next day, so it kinda makes sense. .
Another thing to consider is sodium. I didn't realize how much sodium I was taking in until I analyzed my meals. And sodium does bond with water, so more sodium equals more water-weight.
Still experimenting though, so I'll be following along with this thread to see what works for you. good luck.
This could also be because of the increase in glycogen stores which can't exist alone. I want to say that every glycogen molecule is attached to two H2O molecules, or something like that.0 -
Well, I've experienced similar things as you. Lots of mileage - running and biking - and good variation of intensity. But not losing weight.
So I've been researching things and analyzing my everyday diet and realizing I've been consuming way too much carbohydrate. Have just started to modify my diet so I can't give you results yet, but I'm adding in healthy fats and reducing my empty carbs...stuff like bagels. One thing I can see is if I eat lots of carbs, I'm usually a few pounds heavier the next day, so it kinda makes sense. .
Another thing to consider is sodium. I didn't realize how much sodium I was taking in until I analyzed my meals. And sodium does bond with water, so more sodium equals more water-weight.
Still experimenting though, so I'll be following along with this thread to see what works for you. good luck.
This could also be because of the increase in glycogen stores which can't exist alone. I want to say that every glycogen molecule is attached to two H2O molecules, or something like that.
I'm not much help in this thread, but I think I can add in here. 1 gram of glycogen goes with 4 grams of water I believe....so yes lots of scale weight attached to how much glycogen a person is currently carrying.0 -
Well that's a week done on the TDEE and here is what my running diary looks like and also my weight....
I changed MFP to TDEE on Thurday last week and my weight was 185lbs
Thursday: 10 reps on a hill, 1:20min a rep with jog recovery back down + warmup / cool down. (6.9mi)
Friday: Rest
Saturday: parkrun + warmup/cooldown (4.7 mi)
Sunday: Trail race (9.8mi)
Monday: 7.3mi recovery run
Tuesday: Speed work (9.5mi)
Wednesday: 7.3mi temp marathon pace tempo run
Thursday: 7.2mi easy run
Friday: 7.3mi easy run in to the office to allow for 48 hours recovery before 1/2 marathon race on Sunday.
This morning's weight - 181lbs, the biggest loss was actually last Friday where I dropped from 185 to 181lb over night, I've now levelled out at about 181, will see what next week brings but so far, I'm very happy to be back in to the 12 stone mark...just!0 -
Correct me if I'm wrong but you do not eat exercise calorie intake if you want to lose weight.
Correcting you.
The way MFP is designed, you are supposed to eat back the exercise calories.
Well if you know what you are doing then how come your not loosing?0 -
Correct me if I'm wrong but you do not eat exercise calorie intake if you want to lose weight.
Correcting you.
The way MFP is designed, you are supposed to eat back the exercise calories.
Well if you know what you are doing then how come your not loosing?
Where has CarsonRuns said he's not losing weight? Are you perhaps confused in thinking this post belongs to another user?0 -
Well that's a week done on the TDEE and here is what my running diary looks like and also my weight....
I changed MFP to TDEE on Thurday last week and my weight was 185lbs
Thursday: 10 reps on a hill, 1:20min a rep with jog recovery back down + warmup / cool down. (6.9mi)
Friday: Rest
Saturday: parkrun + warmup/cooldown (4.7 mi)
Sunday: Trail race (9.8mi)
Monday: 7.3mi recovery run
Tuesday: Speed work (9.5mi)
Wednesday: 7.3mi temp marathon pace tempo run
Thursday: 7.2mi easy run
Friday: 7.3mi easy run in to the office to allow for 48 hours recovery before 1/2 marathon race on Sunday.
This morning's weight - 181lbs, the biggest loss was actually last Friday where I dropped from 185 to 181lb over night, I've now levelled out at about 181, will see what next week brings but so far, I'm very happy to be back in to the 12 stone mark...just!
I didn't see this thread originally, but well done OP on your progress, i'm glad it's working for you. 0 -
Well that's a week done on the TDEE and here is what my running diary looks like and also my weight....
[...]
This morning's weight - 181lbs, the biggest loss was actually last Friday where I dropped from 185 to 181lb over night, I've now levelled out at about 181, will see what next week brings but so far, I'm very happy to be back in to the 12 stone mark...just!
Great that it's got you (as in the scale) moving again! Now you're in a sustained calorie deficit, has it affected your performance, at all?
That first 4lb woosh was probably water. That's why a 2 week av is best, because that water will vary through your training week, but the overall trend should be downwards now (but not too steeply one hopes!)0 -
Not sure what Edmondo is telling you for cals burnt but typically, there's a formula that is commonly used which is:
(weight in lbs) x 0.63 x miles ran
So for your weight of 181 it would be 181 x 0.63 = 114 net calories per mile. Net cals doesn't include your BMR which MFP is already taking into account.0 -
Performance for my runs has been pretty good, I feel fuelled for all my runs and rather than trying to eat calories at the end of the day, I can spread them out over the full day. Works much better for me.
I've stopped using endomondo for my calories, just doing the TDEE and all looks good. Will see what next week brings Finger crossed.
Thanks everyone for your advice, hopefully this is the move in weight I needed to get me to my target in time for Edinburgh marathon.
Will post again next week and see how things are going.0 -
Sounds like you got it now! Good luck in your race!0
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Have you changed your training regime? Do you incorporate fartlek, hill training or interval training. Changing your routine can make a difference.0
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I do a mix of training every week.
Still sitting around the 180lbs mark, might need to adjust the TDEE a bit to see more results. Always going up or down a couple of pounds over a week.
May drop off 250 calories next week and see what happens.0
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