Scientifically Are the Last 10 lbs REALLY the Hardest?

ErinMcMom

I've been thinking...
So many people talk about how the last few pounds (10 or so) are the most difficult to lose, how they are very stubborn and slow to go, and it doesn't make sense to me at all.

Scientifically/mathematically speaking, since weight loss is calories in<calories out= weight loss, If you are eating at a calorie deficit it shouldn't matter whether the 10 pounds take you to your goal or whether they are somewhere in the middle of your journey, 3500 calories is still a pound. Right?

What am I missing here? Is the thought that "the last 10 pounds are the hardest to lose" just an old wives tale? Maybe it just feels like they are the hardest because you're so close to goal and just want to get there? If it's true, how is that explained? What's the deal?

Anybody here a dietician/nutritionist that knows?

dmenchac

Because for your last 10 lbs you will be eating at a much smaller deficit than your first 10 lbs.


Common sense really.

To clarify. If you have 75 lbs to lose you can eat at a 1000 cal def per day relatively easy and lose 2lbs per week. When you get closer to your goal weight, eating at that same 1000 cal deficit will be extremely difficult as your BMR has significantly decreased

ErinMcMom

Because for your last 10 lbs you will be eating at a much smaller deficit than your first 10 lbs.


Common sense really.

What if you maintained the same deficit all the way through the finish line, would they be slower then? No, right?

dmenchac

Because for your last 10 lbs you will be eating at a much smaller deficit than your first 10 lbs.


Common sense really.

What if you maintained the same deficit all the way through the finish line, would they be slower then? No, right?

Read my edit.

It isn't good to maintain the same deficit. What if a person has a TDEE of 1400. That would mean they would have to eat 400 calories a day to lose at the same rate they were heavier (TDEE of 2200)

GreatDepression

I've been thinking...
So many people talk about how the last few pounds (10 or so) are the most difficult to lose, how they are very stubborn and slow to go, and it doesn't make sense to me at all.

Scientifically/mathematically speaking, since weight loss is calories in<calories out= weight loss, If you are eating at a calorie deficit it shouldn't matter whether the 10 pounds take you to your goal or whether they are somewhere in the middle of your journey, 3500 calories is still a pound. Right?

What am I missing here? Is the thought that "the last 10 pounds are the hardest to lose" just an old wives tale? Maybe it just feels like they are the hardest because you're so close to goal and just want to get there? If it's true, how is that explained? What's the deal?

Anybody here a dietician/nutritionist that knows?

because your metabolic rate decreases as you carry less mass which means your daily maintenance is getting lower and lower as you get close to goal. duh

dmenchac

Made up numbers just to use for example:

Somone has 75 lbs to lose and they start with a 1000 cal def per day. Their daily expenditure is 2400 calories per day which mean they have to net 1400 calories to lose 2 lbs a week.

That person then lost 65 lbs and now has 10 to go. However since she lost a ton of weight, her daily expenditure is now only 1500 calories. Now she has to net 500 calories just to lose the same weight.

Its not good.

deksgrl

It is SLOWER, not necessarily harder. You cannot maintain the same level of weight loss as when you had more to lose. If you take too steep a deficit, then you will likely gain it right back when you start eating at what should be your normal maintenance calories.

Aaron_K123

I actually assume that this is a bit of a perception bias, that the last 10 pounds seem more difficult because they are the last 10. I'm sure I will be told otherwise though. I tend to agree with you OP that scientifically speaking if it is just calories in calories out then there should be little to no difference.

Now people may point out that as your weight drops your BMR drops and therefore your calorie deficit decreases. This is true but you can of course adjust for that by working out more to increase your TDEE and maintain your deficit at the same level while eating the same amount of food or you could drop your food intake.

Perhaps the fact that you have to ramp it up a bit (either eat even less or exercise more) is all people mean when they say that last 10 pounds is harder but honestly that increase in difficulty should be linear...in otherwords the last 10 pounds might be more difficult than dropping from 20 pounds to 10 pounds overweight but no more so than dropping from 20 to 10 pounds is harder than dropping from 50 to 40 was.

cmoncmonshake

It's slower, because you are burning less calories than you would normally (because your body mass is lower). I'm sure someone can explain it better than I can. Basically, the amount someone is burning each day when they are 250 pounds is significantly more than for the same person doing the same activity at 150 pounds, etc etc.

So yes, it takes longer, even if you have the exact same calorie intake, to lose the weight, even when you're doing the same exact thing as you were beforehand.

Sabine_Stroehm

It's a much smaller window. Smaller margin of error.

Aaron_K123

I've been thinking...
So many people talk about how the last few pounds (10 or so) are the most difficult to lose, how they are very stubborn and slow to go, and it doesn't make sense to me at all.

Scientifically/mathematically speaking, since weight loss is calories in<calories out= weight loss, If you are eating at a calorie deficit it shouldn't matter whether the 10 pounds take you to your goal or whether they are somewhere in the middle of your journey, 3500 calories is still a pound. Right?

What am I missing here? Is the thought that "the last 10 pounds are the hardest to lose" just an old wives tale? Maybe it just feels like they are the hardest because you're so close to goal and just want to get there? If it's true, how is that explained? What's the deal?

Anybody here a dietician/nutritionist that knows?

because your metabolic rate decreases as you carry less mass which means your daily maintenance is getting lower and lower as you get close to goal. duh

Says the person who a thread ago was declaring that if Americans truly ate 300 calories more per day than we used to we would all be one thousand pounds by now.

http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/1287703-burning-and-eating-calories-back-what-s-the-point?page=2

I think what you say here is true, but perhaps the "duh" was a bit unnecessary given what you apparently believed just yesterday.

Strokingdiction

Because for your last 10 lbs you will be eating at a much smaller deficit than your first 10 lbs.


Common sense really.

What if you maintained the same deficit all the way through the finish line, would they be slower then? No, right?

The closer you get to goal, the less body fat you have to lose. People recommend slower when closer because they're encouraging people to maintain muscle mass. If you lose fast at the end, you're going to lose a disproportionate amount of lean tissue.

You get a lot of threads by people who say they've hit their goal and are surprised by how flabby they appear. A lot of them lost fast without thought to maintaining the muscle they already had. They then have to start the long process of body recomp which they wouldn't have had to do nearly as much if they'd chosen a smaller deficit toward the end.

Also, lifting heavy and eating enough protein can help retain as much muscle as possible as well.

Edit to add: I answered a question that wasn't really asked. Need to wait till my brain catches up sometimes.

ErinMcMom

So really, they are not more difficult or more stubborn to get rid of, the only difference is that your deficit has been dialed down to match your newer TDEE so it takes a longer period of time to reach the 3500 calorie deficit. Did I get it right?

By the way, "Duh" isn't really a kind response when someone is asking an honest question.

Additionally, since MFP doesn't tell users to decrease their calorie deficit as they get closer to goal, there are potentially many people that would continue rocking their initial deficit setting all the way to their goal weight and they'd never know that it should have been changed. So I'm not sure it's "common sense".

dmenchac

So really, they are not more difficult or more stubborn to get rid of, the only difference is that your deficit has been dialed down to match your newer TDEE so it takes a longer period of time to reach the 3500 calorie deficit. Did I get it right?

By the way, "Duh" isn't really a kind response when someone is asking an honest question.

Additionally, since MFP doesn't tell users to decrease their calorie deficit as they get closer to goal, there are potentially many people that would continue rocking their initial deficit setting all the way to their goal weight and they'd never know that it should have been changed. So I'm not sure it's common sense.

Yupp.

If those same people read the guides on this site, they would know

amperry328

because your metabolic rate decreases as you carry less mass which means your daily maintenance is getting lower and lower as you get close to goal. duh

Duh? Really??! Is it really necessary for people to be be so damn rude on here all of the time?

Sabine_Stroehm

because your metabolic rate decreases as you carry less mass which means your daily maintenance is getting lower and lower as you get close to goal. duh

rude much?

bcattoes

It's pretty difficult to scentifically measure "difficult" because "difficult" is usually little other than opinion.

Aaron_K123

It's pretty difficult to scentifically measure "difficult" because "difficult" is usually little other than opinion.

Yeah, this.

Hard to objectify subjective opinion.

jason_adams

There is, I believe, also the "hill factor".
If you watch runners or cyclists (non-professional) go up a hill, they'll do various forms of attack and persist until they get ALMOST to the top. Then they stop trying so hard because... they're almost there. They've put in so much effort so far, surely they can just rest a little bit before the top... etc. Think about a common phrase we use to help people through things: "Keep going, you're almost there!".

Continuing to pursue your goal with the same vigor when you are near the end as when you did at the beginning is tough. For some close is enough to stop the effort required (even if they don't change their goal). This is where a lot of dissonance sets in and things get "uncomfortable". You think of all the effort you've put in and you "deserve" to be at the end already..... but there's still more work ahead.... is that last bit really worth it?

Plan on having it feel hard. Really hard. Plan on needing every ounce of self discipline to make it through to your actual goal. Be ready for that challenge. It will come.

jeffpettis

I've been thinking...
So many people talk about how the last few pounds (10 or so) are the most difficult to lose, how they are very stubborn and slow to go, and it doesn't make sense to me at all.

Scientifically/mathematically speaking, since weight loss is calories in<calories out= weight loss, If you are eating at a calorie deficit it shouldn't matter whether the 10 pounds take you to your goal or whether they are somewhere in the middle of your journey, 3500 calories is still a pound. Right?

What am I missing here? Is the thought that "the last 10 pounds are the hardest to lose" just an old wives tale? Maybe it just feels like they are the hardest because you're so close to goal and just want to get there? If it's true, how is that explained? What's the deal?

Anybody here a dietician/nutritionist that knows?

because your metabolic rate decreases as you carry less mass which means your daily maintenance is getting lower and lower as you get close to goal. duh

Says the person who a thread ago was declaring that if Americans truly ate 300 calories more per day than we used to we would all be one thousand pounds by now.

http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/1287703-burning-and-eating-calories-back-what-s-the-point?page=2

I think what you say here is true, but perhaps the "duh" was a bit unnecessary given what you apparently believed just yesterday.

^^^ I noticed that as well in the other thread yesterday... ^^^

Anyways... To answer the OP's question, scientifically, all that is required for fat loss is a calorie deficit no matter if you have 100 or 10 pounds to lose. Period. It can seem to be harder when you get closer to your goal because of all the reasons already explained but it is still a matter of a deficit to continue losing fat.

Aaron_K123

OP I think I would boil this down to this:

I agree with you that scientifically/mathematically speaking the "difficulty" of the last 10 pounds is illusory however given the vast vast amount of people who subjectively experience that last 10 pounds to be the most difficult I think we can all brace for having that subjective experience ourselves.