Back Squat - Form Question

_lyndseybrooke_
_lyndseybrooke_ Posts: 2,561 Member
in Fitness and Exercise
This seems super simple, but I'm getting different answers from everyone.

Half of the people I talk to say you have to squat down to where your thighs are parallel to the floor.

Then there are those "*kitten* to grass" people that say it's not a squat unless you're deeper than parallel to the floor.

So, which is it? I'm now squatting 120 lbs and I record myself every so often to check out my form (I work out at home alone). I'm definitely getting parallel every time and I try to go as deep as I can, but I don't get a whole lot deeper than that. I can definitely go deep in a bodyweight or lightweight squat no problem, but with the heavier weights and no safety rails/power rack, I don't want to risk tipping back or having to bail out of the squat.

Thoughts?
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Replies

  • levitateme
    levitateme Posts: 999 Member
    I squat below parallel, not ATG but pretty low. I agree that if you can't squat below parallel, you may as well go home (or just use lighter weights til you can :smile: )

    How is your stance? I stand somewhat wide with my toes slightly turned out which puts me in a position to just sit down naturally and get very low.
  • JoRocka
    JoRocka Posts: 17,525 Member
    first things first

    low bar or high bar?
  • _lyndseybrooke_
    _lyndseybrooke_ Posts: 2,561 Member
    I squat below parallel, not ATG but pretty low. I agree that if you can't squat below parallel, you may as well go home (or just use lighter weights til you can :smile: )

    How is your stance? I stand somewhat wide with my toes slightly turned out which puts me in a position to just sit down naturally and get very low.

    I have a wide stance with toes slightly turned out as well.
    first things first

    low bar or high bar?

    High bar.
  • madhatter2013
    madhatter2013 Posts: 1,547 Member
    Bumping cause I want to know too!
  • neandermagnon
    neandermagnon Posts: 7,436 Member
    you should squat below parallel... it doesn't have to be literally *kitten* to grass though
  • robweaver77
    robweaver77 Posts: 14
    If you're doing lowbar squats, a bit below parallel (hip crease below the top of the knee) is best. Try to go too much lower and you'll unload the glutes/hamstrings and lose power. If you're doing highbar squats, going ATG is fine, since you are primarily working the quads. I am not as familiar with highbar squats, so someone else might know better than me about them. Personally, I do lowbar and front squats. Lowbar I go for just below parallel and front squats I go until my hamstrings hit my calves.
  • TKhamvongsa
    TKhamvongsa Posts: 287
    I do high bar - I squat below parallel - basically ATG because my legs are short and I like to feel the burn/muscles across my butt move before I move up and clench.
  • SezxyStef
    SezxyStef Posts: 15,267 Member
    I agree with neandermagnon...on my warm ups I get ATG...

    on my working weight almost ATG...but definately below parallel and I work out at home.

    If you have someone in your life that is handy have them build you a squat rack with rails..my husband son did for me...

    It's crude but it works and I now have that safety thing taken care of.

    Another suggestion would be to get a box for your squats at the height which is below parellel but not necessarily ATG...

    I did that on my first deload and it helped me a lot..however I wills say this...

    Parellel squats @ `180 aren't as hard as almost ATG squats @ 160....
  • _lyndseybrooke_
    _lyndseybrooke_ Posts: 2,561 Member
    Looks like I'll be fixing my squats tomorrow. Hopefully I don't have to deload. We'll see.
  • madhatter2013
    madhatter2013 Posts: 1,547 Member
    This has got to be the most useful thread I've seen all week. Thank you!
  • Meredith8684
    Meredith8684 Posts: 681 Member
    I love ATG squats, both back and front. They do a much better job at working my quads AND glutes. Plus, they're super impressive!
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  • TKhamvongsa
    TKhamvongsa Posts: 287
    Looks like I'll be fixing my squats tomorrow. Hopefully I don't have to deload. We'll see.

    As SezxyStef has suggested - get a box just below parallel and use that as guide - with this - I doubt you'd have to deload. This was the only way I taught myself how to get low.
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  • JoRocka
    JoRocka Posts: 17,525 Member
    I agree with neandermagnon...on my warm ups I get ATG...

    on my working weight almost ATG...but definately below parallel and I work out at home.

    Another suggestion would be to get a box for your squats at the height which is below parellel but not necessarily ATG...

    I did that on my first deload and it helped me a lot..however I wills say this...

    Parellel squats @ `180 aren't as hard as almost ATG squats @ 160....

    I would agree with almost all of this except box squats.
    Under 80% of my 1 rmp is ATG.
    80% to 100% winds up being breaking parallel.

    Moving on
    I'm a big fan of pause squats rather than box squats- mostly because releasing significant weight solely on your spine (so working weights) with the sitting can be extremely hard on your body. using unweighted box squats- or just the bar and a box at the right height is a good idea, or better yet

    Get under the bar- have your friend eye ball and tell you when you hit depth.- and how much further are you going- so you need to know where you are hitting- having someone there is helpful for this.

    I definitely warm up and go all the way top to bottom as long as I can.

    I went and saw someone because I felt like I had significant issues with my squats. He recommend a belt- not because my form was bad- but because I wasn't properly bracing my abs. And it was causing an elevator up *kitten*- then chest- then *kitten*.
    So make sure THAT isn't' happening as well.

    One of my reason was- just chest up enough (which I was aware of ) but secondly was poor bracing/valsavla technique... I currently only use my belt when I'm at 80% or higher and I have trouble bracing- but using the belt has helped me get a better feel of what needs bracing- even with internal breath- so that might be an option..


    ATG for low bar is out.

    But High bar- you at LEAST want to break hip crease to knee.

    Check Kelly starlett as well for mobility work if you're finding ankle hip tightness limiting you.

    I found bringing my feet in just a hair gave me more drive- but it took some time to adjust to that. Felt awkward as hell the first couple of sets but it gets better!!!
  • SezxyStef
    SezxyStef Posts: 15,267 Member
    Looks like I'll be fixing my squats tomorrow. Hopefully I don't have to deload. We'll see.

    As SezxyStef has suggested - get a box just below parallel and use that as guide - with this - I doubt you'd have to deload. This was the only way I taught myself how to get low.

    Don't use a box. That is horrible for your spine. You have all this weight on your shoulders being supported, and you sit on something. That has a multiplying impact straight down your spine. When I see people do that, I cringe.

    I never ever sat on it tho...ever (well once when I had an epic fail)

    for me it was just a "guide" to know I was low enough

    ETA: it was suggested on the "so you think you can squat" series on youtube which I did find quite useful.
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  • JoRocka
    JoRocka Posts: 17,525 Member
    You can also use a small rubber ball or something that just gives you a queue. Me, personally, I'd just not do it at all.

    teh stability balls are okay for this- you can use them set inside a stepper riser (the black square things) so they don't roll away.

    Personally I find doing reduced weight pause squats with someone there- or you actually watching yourself *which is easier to do with lighter weight is extremely effective for getting a good feel for the depth you need to hit.
  • ValGogo
    ValGogo Posts: 2,168 Member
    first things first

    low bar or high bar?

    Since you're my go-to gal, explain low bar and high bar please. Thank you.
  • SezxyStef
    SezxyStef Posts: 15,267 Member
    You can also use a small rubber ball or something that just gives you a queue. Me, personally, I'd just not do it at all.

    teh stability balls are okay for this- you can use them set inside a stepper riser (the black square things) so they don't roll away.

    Personally I find doing reduced weight pause squats with someone there- or you actually watching yourself *which is easier to do with lighter weight is extremely effective for getting a good feel for the depth you need to hit.

    this is what I do now...I deloaded again and am currently working up again getting below parallel on the low bar back squats.
  • robweaver77
    robweaver77 Posts: 14
    You could also invest in some olympic weight lifting shoes, which have a 1/2"-3/4" hard heel that gives you better leverages and lets you hit depth easier. They are useful for front and highbar squats. You can also mess around with foot placement. I squat pretty wide for lowbar, but when I do front squats, I have my feet just a little bit beyond shoulder width. Check out youtube videos of Olympic lifters. This video is aptly named: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VcEsmhVag1c
  • JoRocka
    JoRocka Posts: 17,525 Member
    first things first

    low bar or high bar?

    Since you're my go-to gal, explain low bar and high bar please. Thank you.

    I thought I had a photobucket picture of this to just post up- but I can't search my phone quickly with such low reception
    if you google low bar vs high bar squats- click images- there is a fantastic siloutte drawing that shows a guy with the bar in 3 placements- doing a squat- front- high and low (in that order left to right)

    this might bring it up for you.
    https://www.google.com/url?sa=i&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=images&cd=&cad=rja&uact=8&docid=0cKWw_kxa57UrM&tbnid=LW_o05nj7dawiM:&ved=0CAMQjhw&url=http://70sbig.com/blog/2012/01/low-bar-vs-high-bar-squatting/&ei=8MiQU92NJcKSqgbqr4G4Bw&bvm=bv.68445247,d.cWc&psig=AFQjCNEHZmeaE4RTbrQ03-sfEU_8cQGOnA&ust=1402083941833640

    ultimately low bar sits on yoru rear delts- very low... high bar sits on your traps - but not on your spine and it greatly impacts the way you actually squat.
  • SezxyStef
    SezxyStef Posts: 15,267 Member
    first things first

    low bar or high bar?

    Since you're my go-to gal, explain low bar and high bar please. Thank you.

    I thought I had a photobucket picture of this to just post up- but I can't search my phone quickly with such low reception
    if you google low bar vs high bar squats- click images- there is a fantastic siloutte drawing that shows a guy with the bar in 3 placements- doing a squat- front- high and low (in that order left to right)

    this might bring it up for you.
    https://www.google.com/url?sa=i&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=images&cd=&cad=rja&uact=8&docid=0cKWw_kxa57UrM&tbnid=LW_o05nj7dawiM:&ved=0CAMQjhw&url=http://70sbig.com/blog/2012/01/low-bar-vs-high-bar-squatting/&ei=8MiQU92NJcKSqgbqr4G4Bw&bvm=bv.68445247,d.cWc&psig=AFQjCNEHZmeaE4RTbrQ03-sfEU_8cQGOnA&ust=1402083941833640

    ultimately low bar sits on yoru rear delts- very low... high bar sits on your traps - but not on your spine and it greatly impacts the way you actually squat.

    this one?
    c4ab0829-8513-4dd1-a1f0-93c6258e68e9_zpsf6a3ec61.jpg

    edit for size
  • JoRocka
    JoRocka Posts: 17,525 Member
    grumble.. hold on-
    have to text this thread to my phone- can't see the picture- I'm assuming it is.

    YES.

    that one.
  • _lyndseybrooke_
    _lyndseybrooke_ Posts: 2,561 Member
    Okay guys. I'm just not sure I can get much lower than parallel regardless of the weight on my back. I tried different stances, deloaded, and I'm still getting what looks like parallel or maybe just below.

    I was squatting 120, so I deloaded to 115 to see if I could get deeper. This was the result (yes, I lift barefoot in my underwear):

    qy7bsp.jpg

    I decided to deload a bunch, just to see. This is me squatting with only 80 lbs, which felt like nothing on my shoulders:

    5v4qcm.jpg

    Is it just me, or do those look pretty much the same?

    So, what's the issue? Feel free to critique my form, stance, etc. I want to improve, so I'm not going to get defensive. If all of that looks good, could it be weak hip flexors? Or something else I can work on?
  • neandermagnon
    neandermagnon Posts: 7,436 Member
    hard to tell with the camera angle, but that looks below parallel to me, i.e. your knees are higher than your hips. You don't look that different from the diagram of the low bar back squats on the previous page either.
  • mryak750
    mryak750 Posts: 198 Member
    your form is fine...keep squatting...where did you get your squat rack from?? What brand is it??
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  • robweaver77
    robweaver77 Posts: 14
    You are definitely below parallel. Your body lean is more forward, which is more like lowbar squat. The body lean forward would make it more difficult to get much deeper. The bar placement looks like it is midway between highbar and lowbar. Is that a pad around the bar? That might be messing things up slightly.
  • _lyndseybrooke_
    _lyndseybrooke_ Posts: 2,561 Member
    You are definitely below parallel. Your body lean is more forward, which is more like lowbar squat. The body lean forward would make it more difficult to get much deeper. The bar placement looks like it is midway between highbar and lowbar. Is that a pad around the bar? That might be messing things up slightly.

    So I should stop leaning forward so far?

    Yes, that's a pad. The bar kills me without it. No matter how much I tighten up those muscles, it's still against my vertebrae.

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