+ 800 cals/day, almost no fat gain - CICO broken?

EvgeniZyntx

Looking at a recent study, from a review by Brad Schoenfeld - a study this year showed weight trained individuals that ate an excess of 800 cals per day in protein over 8 weeks gained little weight - and most of that gain was muscle.

His blog post and review of the article is here:

http://www.lookgreatnaked.com/blog/new-study-on-protein-overfeeding-a-critical-analysis/

The research looked at the difference one might expect from eating that much extra protein by trained individual and how the gain these high protein individuals was mostly concentrated in LBM gain. Lean gains, yo!

The article is here. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4022420/

So is Calories In / Calories out broken? How about "a calorie is just a calorie"?

The research authors note:

The results of the current investigation do not support the notion that consuming protein in excess of purported needs results in a gain in fat mass. Certainly, this dispels the notion that ‘a calorie is just a calorie.’ That is, protein calories in ‘excess’ of requirements are not metabolized by the body in a manner similar to carbohydrate.

And I'm sure this thread will focus on that - but consider the following:

Study was not a comparison of different calorie excesses. Nor was it a review of individuals in deficit. Nor were the result measurements significant from control. In fact, it's impossible to draw any conclusions with that in mind and one can only consider this as a directive study --- the authors recognize that further work needs to be carried out.

What I found interesting and the reason I'm posting this very inconclusive research is that:

a) it might suggest highly trained individuals might ramp up metabolism a little better than the usual TDEE equations suggest with excess available protein.

b) the high drop out rates, digestive issues and consumption of 4.4 g/kg/day or a mean of over 300g per day of protein suggest that those rates suck - and are likely not sustainable (never mind long term potential issues)

So a little bro science learning that I got from reading that: if you are going to over-consume - train hard and get your extra calories from protein. Oh, and to reach those levels of proteins, as the researchers note, it's almost impossible to do so without protein supplements. Guess who pays support for that research?

Galatea_Stone

How bad was his gas? Was it just bad or was it the cleaning lady quit because of the pine sol couldn't cover up the methane bad?

Mr_Knight

When I'm faced with puzzling evidence, I, too, assume it is caused by the laws of the universe no longer working

PS The study itself says the "high protein" crew gained nearly 4 pounds on average. In addition, as much as 4.5 pounds of fat mass was added.

WalkingAlong

Schoenfeld's conclusion seems reasonable, as far as CICO not being broken:

"...approximately 600 of the 800 extra calories consumed would have been expended via TEF and NEAT. So we’re left to account for about 200 extra calories a day. Well, it just so happens that the reported weight gain of just over 3 pounds explains this away very nicely."

DamePiglet

in because... well... just in.

kellyetaylorsmith

I laughed SO loud in response to this, because you KNOW that was some tear gas!

EvgeniZyntx

How bad was his gas? Was it just bad or was it the cleaning lady quit because of the pine sol couldn't cover up the methane bad?

The study notes:

Of the 10, three stated an inability to consume the protein needed for the study and one subject complained of gastrointestinal distress.

I think that means the cleaning lady died and the couldn't find her body in the fart cloud.

heybales

In to bump higher for viewers - and to see where it goes as far as ones that have reached those levels.

Scott_2025

I'm in as well