So incredibly out of shape!

AproMunro

I will make this long story as short as I can. I went throung a period of severe depression and poverty and was very sedentary for about a 4 year period. I was already overweight when this all began but was fairly fit and strong.

Due to all the lifestyle factors during this time I gained about 90 pounds topping out at 316. My joints decided to quit on me. There was a six month or so period of time that I could not even stand or walk because of sprain like severe pain in both knees. There have been similar problems with my feet tendons and hips and some back pain as well.

I have since acheived status in Canada as a permanent resident (the process of obtaining this was part of my stress and depression) so I have been checked out. Had mri and xrays and 6 months of physio therapy. No one can tell me what has caused my debilitating joint pains but they have mostly ruled out arthritis and other obvious thing that it could have been. The best I get is speculations about muscle imbalances coupled with obesity.

So the point of all this info is that I am now trying to correct these things but WOW is it hard to get going from this state!

So starting about two years ago I became more finacially stable and could start eating better. Simply by dieting alone I have lost weight and am now about 280. I feel about fifty time better but still have occasional joint pains and random sprains or strain type injuries appear out of nowhere. I dont even have to be doing anything. I could just be laying in bed feeling great not moving, then a random ache will appear in mu knee or foot or whatever and then ill try to move it or get up and ouch! I am apparently injured again. Two weeks or so of rest and ice before I can try to start from scratch with my fitness again!

For the last two months I have been swimming, gently, really I am treading water. Just moving my limbs and stret ching them as much as I can gently so that they can re find correct range of motion. I feel a little improvement but I even injure myself doing this from time to time. My body is just so fragile! It is ridiculous!

I want more than anything to feel a nice healthy muscle burn from working out but currently I am so fragile that I cannot even move enough to acheive it, as my joints with ache or injure before I get there. I think that dieting alone had taken me as far as it can and now I really need to add exercise to keep losing weight. I have been steady in the low 280s for about 5 months.

The only thing that I can do when my joints Allow is marching in place slowley lifting knees high. I can get a muscle burn going but I can only manage 100 steps tops before they burn so much continuing is impossible. I dont come close to getting out of breath.

How oh how do I improve my fitness starting in such a pathetic state?

Has anyone ever been there and made it out of this deep hole? Or know of someone who has? Tips? Encouragement?

Btw I know the obvious answer is to ask my doc or physio therapist for advice but the problem with that is that my doc barely believes that I have any joint pains since all tests are normal, and my physio therapist, while he does recogise that something is going on, he is kind of clueless as to what to do about it. He just massages me and gives me exercises to do that are usually beyond my abilities. Him telling me to do what he wants me to do tells me that he sereiously doesnt get what is going on with me. I do what I can but it doesnt get me far and sometimes sets me back.

Sorry if there are a lot of typos I am typing on mu phone. Thanks

Slashnl

I really don't have any advice for you. I'm not sure how to tell you how to start, but I think you need to get in touch with another member of MFP, handfordrose. Gosh, I think that's her name. She has an amazing story of how she went from not being able to move, to losing a lot of weight. She recently had a post in the motivation/support tab that was amazing. Her success story is one of a kind!!

cantfail

Google DDP Yoga. It is virtually impact free, you can modify it based on your limitations and you can get a good workout.

AproMunro

I looked it up and watched a few videos and saw that guy who famously went from using canes to running. I remember him. His story is one of the things that kept me from suicide back when I was totally bed bond on account of my knees.

Still, that exercise is wat too advanced for me still. It is not easy enough on joints. I see a lot of bending forward. No go with my back. No way. All the knee bending and strange leg positions while bearing weight looks terrifying. Even if I did a very modified version of the positions I would definitely damage my knees and probably my feet. I could probably do most of the arm movements but I work my arms in the pool already.

Thanks anyway. Maybe someday I can work up to it.

rogerOb1

Exercise-wise swimming is probably still is your best bet. On this site, I hear leslie Sansone's programs mentioned alot - I think she can give a gentle introduction to cardio/walking (check her out on youtube). I would suggest pilates - but thats probably similar to the moves your physio has recommended.

While exercise helps, diet is still going to be the main way you are going to lose weight (as is the case for everybody). Maybe check out a TDEE calculator if you havent already done so.

TheVirgoddess

I'd continue swimming and counting your calories. Diet is going to be key for you (over exercise), until you get to a weight where your joints are under a lot less stress (IMO).

I'm sorry for all your pain.

AproMunro

Oh how I miss Pilates! I used to bang out an hour of Pilates a few times a week back in my fit (yet overweight) days. Whne I first committed to fitness again a couple years ago I thought Pilates would be my best friend. Boy was I wrong! Things that I used to do while almost napping is now utterly impossible for me! It really tells me how far I have fallen from grace.

I do certain Pilates movements as I am able. Ill do some things in bed and some in the pool. Sometimes it goes ok. But sometimes I get an ouch. I am currently recovering from my latest back strain because I was doing some gentle leg kicks while laying on my side and my back said " nope"!

The worste thing about all this is that I am only 31! I cant imagine this body surviving even to 50. I need to fix this mess!

It really is true, the saying "Use it or lose it". I used to be able to be on my feet all day. Walk, run, stretch, whatever I wanted. Let this be motivation on days when you just dont feel like it. Enough days of no exercise will take away your ability to do it at all even when you really want to.

Slashnl

http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/1215838-can-i-really-be-that-close-to-my-goal-weight-and-more

Seriously, read hanfordrose's success story (I found it!). She did an amazing thing and I think her story can help you.

AproMunro

Thank you. I did look but could not find it.

That is definitely an uplifting story. I am not sure if she had all fragile joints like I seem to and honestly the knee replacement thing scares me. That is my biggest fear currently, since no one can seem to figure out why my knees are so wonky I am just waiting for the day that they tell me I need knee replacement surgery IN MY EARLY 30s!!! I truly hope it does not come to that.

Phaedra2014

Slow walking and swimming are the only two things I can come up with right now. I'm sorry you are in so much pain. I can see how you'd be so frustrated.

The good news is that you don't show any signs of degeneration as per your doctor's evaluations. It's very possible that the weight you are carrying around is doing all the damage. Being obese means you are probably in a constant state of inflammation and that would cause your joints to hurt they way they do.

See if you can get blood work done to check your inflammatory markers.

dfranch

It seems like you'd be better off losing weight first, and adding exercise as you begin to feel better/stronger. I lost 50lbs from diet alone before adding exercise back into my routine.

Tomboly1

Honestly while you may have some legitimate issues that are holding you back (it seems like pain is one of them) you have a lot of mental road blocks as well. Your outlook of "that's impossible" or "that's too advanced" and "I have a fragile body" is holding you back from actually achieving fitness. Nothing is impossible and your body can handle it. If you have been checked out medically (which you state that you have) you should listen to your physiotherapist and really do what he tells you to do. When you are that out of shape everything is going to burn or hurt the first few workouts. It happened for me to when I started this journey. But you have to keep doing it! It will eventually become easier.

The best advice for you is probably to talk to a counselor about your problems. You are mentally holding yourself back and at that rate you will never achieve your goals.

AproMunro

It seems like you'd be better off losing weight first, and adding exercise as you begin to feel better/stronger. I lost 50lbs from diet alone before adding exercise back into my routine.

Oh, yes this is my thinking as well! The thing is, I have lost around 35-ish pounds over the course of about a year strictly with diet, and for the last 5 months or so I have been steady at 280. I was hoping to get to 260 before really trying to exercise, but I am tired of waiting and to be honest it is painful to be inactive. My muscles scream for stimulation! The pool is helping, as I said. I still tweak this and that occasionally while swimming, but at least I am doing something! I am sleeping better now, with a little activity. My weight still isn't moving, but I am just hoping that it will soon.

I do eat very very healthy. Mostly veggies and meats with only real fats, no crappy oils, all homemade food (about 95% of the time anyway) and limited carbs, like a little sweet potato here, peas there, occasional fruit like cherries or berries, etc. No breads or anything super high GI. And I do not track my calories every day, but I did for a while and I always fell at around 1500 to 1800 calories a day. That is without even trying. That is just what is satisfying for me. People tell me I should eat more but then I feel bloated when I do. I do, however have a little something extra on days that I swim. A smoothie or an extra piece of fruit or something like that. The weight came off easily at first but just stopped. I just think I need more muscle tone to have more metabolism. I also became pregnant last year but then lost it after only a few weeks. The moment the pregnancy happened was when the weight loss stopped and it never picked up again after that even though i did not change anything. So maybe there is something hormonal going on. I don't know.

AproMunro

@Tomboly1

I hear what you are saying and understand why you said it. But the fact is, if I stand up right now, and try to bend over forward, even a little bit, I WILL pull something in my back. If I try to squat, even with perfect form and only a little bit, I WILL sprain my knee again, for the 20th time. One of the things my physio tried to get me to do was just that. Squats. He said I should be able to do modified squats (because he doesn't get it totally, like my doctor doesn't. They do not know what is wrong with me.) I tried. With him there coaching me. My form was perfect. One squat, and my knee cracked a little, but no pain. "Okay, he said. That is normal. Do another." I was nervous but happy to oblige. So I did a second one, and This time no sound, but a sudden searing pain next to my knee cap and I fell, luckily into the bed. It took a few week for this injury to heal.

As you said, "Your body can handle it." The thing is, no, it can't. This is the point of this post. My mind is all about doing it. I want to do it all! but PHYSICALLY I cannot. This is not a normal, experience that most people have when they are started to exercise again. This is an extreme problem. I wanted to hear if anyone else has experienced this kind of thing, and learn how they overcame it. One cannot just ignore the pain of an injury and keep working out hoping that it will go away. It will only get worse. I learned this the hard way. When my knees first gave out on my, I had tried to start walking more, and climbing stairs. My knees started aching, so I backed off a bit but kept doing stuff. Over the course of a few weeks they got worse and worse and then one day BAM. It is hard to explane but they felt BIG on the inside. There was some kind of swelling going on, but they looked normal fro mthe outside. I could not, however, bend my knees. Neither of them for about THREE MONTHS!!! I was bed bound. Had I a wheelchair I would have used it, but I did not so I was totally helpless.

After about three to four months I could tolerate a few seconds at a time of weight and VEEEEEERY slowly over the course of about a year, got to a point where I could walk again, but with a cane, and very slowly, with a lot of pain most of the time. Since then (about three years on) I have improved. The weight loss has also helped tremendously over the last year or so, and I usually no longer need a cane!!! So improvements are happening, but I still have many many issues making the improvements painful slow!

I know, mostly, my limits. If I cannot do something it isn't because I don't want to. It is because, through years of dealing with these crappy joints, I know when something isn't doable, and when I try to push myself, I almost always suffer an injury. These are different from regular aches and pains too. I welcome sore muscles. I want them. I crave them. My pain is from faulty joints. Ones with no diagnosis. It just makes it so much more frustrating. Sometimes I wish I just had arthritis so that there was a name to my condition and a treatment.

Tomboly1

Obviously I don't know you so I can't know the full extent of your problems. But from what you have said about yourself I can deduce that your mental outlook is a big issue that is holding you back. Maybe you are that one in a million person that can't tolerate exercise because you were born with bad joints. But more than likely your joints ache and injure easily because of your weight.

Dfranch made an excellent point that maybe the best route for you is to work on weight loss through diet first, get to a weight where your body is more comfortable moving, and then tackle fitness. Apro I wish you luck on your journey. I know you said you have suffered from depression as well, which I have suffered from pretty much all my life. For me, that in itself can hold you back. With the addition of physical issues your having I can imagine it feels impossible to move forward. My only point that I wanted to make is that you should consider your mental well being as well as your physical. That is a big component of overall health as well!

AproMunro

I understand where you are coming from. You didn't offend me and I am not being defensive at all here I am only clarifying. First of all, even with all my issues, I currently am extremely happy and totally not depressed anymore. My depression was a result of factors which are no longer a problem. Loooooooooong stories, no point in getting into all that! I don't think I was born with bad joints. I used to be able to do everything! Also I am positive that my weight has a whole damn lot to do with my problems, that, and the years I spent almost totally sedentary, which caused enormous muscular imbalances and weakness.

The problem I am having now is that it seems near impossible to dig myself out of this hole. This is not a statement of defeat. I am not giving up! No way! NEVER! But I am legitimately dealing with huge obstacles to even get a footing into fitness. As I have stated in recent posts, I am far far better off now than during the worst of my physical disabilities, but I am still so so far from even starting to get fit, and the progress is so painfully slow I am wondering if I will ever get there.

Telling me that it is my outlook that is in my way, is just like telling someone with a broken leg that the only reason they cannot run is because they do not believe in themselves. They will say, "No I cannot do it. My leg is broken." The correct response to that is not, "None of that negative thinking! Have a better outlook!"

I have actually felt pretty good today. I do have occasional days, maybe one ever few weeks at this point, on average where I feel almost normal, mostly. These days are getting more and more frequent over the years too which is encouraging. However, just a few minutes ago I was simply walking through the hallway, doing nothing special, just normal walking, and BOOM a deep ache appears under my kneecap. GRRRRR! Now I cannot put weight on that leg. This happens regularly. It is not a real injury that will likely keep me down for days or weeks, but this is an example of the things I am dealing with far too often. It may take 5 minutes, or it may take a day or so to be able to put weight on this damn leg again. ARGBLARG!!!!!!!!!

Peace and love.

zdain

Can you get a second doctor or physical therapist's opinion? I lived with chronic pain for a long time in my early 30s because it didn't show up on any tests. When I got to the point where even opiates weren't working for me any more, my mom dragged me to a series of doctors until finally the Mayo Clinic suggested Amitriptyline, a depression drug which somehow messes up pain signals in some people. I finally ended up on Nortriptyline hydrochloride; I take 2 generic pills twice a day and I live an almost pain-free life.

I am not trying to diagnose your medical condition; the point I am trying to make is that just because one doctor and physical therapist are out of ideas does not mean that there isn't anything left to try. I also agree that it is much, much easier to exercise if you are not in chronic pain. It might be worth directing your energy to solving the pain problems before you attempt to form an exercise routine.

SkimFlatWhite68

I'd continue swimming and counting your calories. Diet is going to be key for you (over exercise), until you get to a weight where your joints are under a lot less stress (IMO).

I'm sorry for all your pain.

You can't out-train a bad diet. If I were you I would focus 100% on getting my diet under control, I would cut out ALL added sugar and processed foods and eat fresh vegetables and fruit, lean proteins, nuts and seeds. Concentrate on this and do a little bit of exercise when you feel up to it, but really, your diet is going to be THE most important thing at the moment.

Read "Grain Brain" - Dr David Perlmutter.

When you have dropped some more weight, you can then look at getting into weight training and getting your muscles to love you again. You don't have to run or do crossfit (unless you want to) be be fit, just walking and lifting some weights will get you into quite nice shape.

Focus on WHY you want this and do NOT lose sight of your focus - already sounds like you have a very good reason - not to live in pain.

AproMunro

Can you get a second doctor or physical therapist's opinion? I lived with chronic pain for a long time in my early 30s because it didn't show up on any tests. When I got to the point where even opiates weren't working for me any more, my mom dragged me to a series of doctors until finally the Mayo Clinic suggested Amitriptyline, a depression drug which somehow messes up pain signals in some people. I finally ended up on Nortriptyline hydrochloride; I take 2 generic pills twice a day and I live an almost pain-free life.

I am not trying to diagnose your medical condition; the point I am trying to make is that just because one doctor and physical therapist are out of ideas does not mean that there isn't anything left to try. I also agree that it is much, much easier to exercise if you are not in chronic pain. It might be worth directing your energy to solving the pain problems before you attempt to form an exercise routine.

I live in Canada.

Until two years ago I did not qualify nor could I afford medical care at all, so throughout most of the events I have described I was not being treated.

Two years ago I finally qualified for healthcare. While searching for a GP (which can take YEARS here. No joke) I could only see clinic doctors. I saw several. The first one sent me for an xray. The second one told me that the xray showed nothing wrong and therefor whatever pain I had would likely jsut be permanent and there was nothing to be done. WTF???? Seriously, no joke. That was it. All I could get out of him. Hey, at least I didn't have to pay for that BS. Another one just tried to shove prescription pain killers down my throat. I wanted no drugs, unless the doc thought they would help it HEAL, not just take away pain. He just wanted to give me BS pain drugs. I begged him for physiotherapy, and finally got a prescription for it. This physio told me everything started with my feet. Told me I needed no physiotherapy, but only shoe inserts for arch support. Before I went through with it I miraculously found a GP. She ordered an MRI. It showed nothing. She said my knees are perfect. I asked her why,then do they not track smoothly and crack and hurt. She told me that it tracks perfectly... WHAAAAAT? Again, I begged for physio. This one told me all the problems start in my back and disagreed heartily at the feet theory. He also says that there is a minor posterior meniscus tear in my left leg that an MRI would not see, and also suspects that I have a bulging disk, but can not confirm without another MRI, (Which I COULD ask for, probably will. My annual physical is actually on Monday.) He has been treating me for 6 months with massage and exercises. I have seen improvement, but I still do not think he knows what is really going on. He does tell me that he expects me to make a full recovery eventually.

Pretty exhausted after all that. I can go to another clinic, but honestly, if you were me with all those experiences, would you want to? They all come from totally different directions with this. Who do I trust? As far as GPs go. Around here, when you get one, you cling on tight and hope they are worth their salt. If I am to go looking for another doctor, I first have to basically divorce this one officially, because other GPs will not consider you if you are registered with one already, and I will be out in the sea without a GP for who knows how long? It took my husband, who has cerebral palsy, 4 years! to finally find a GP. Even the government doctor searching service failed him all that time, even with his condition.

AproMunro

I'd continue swimming and counting your calories. Diet is going to be key for you (over exercise), until you get to a weight where your joints are under a lot less stress (IMO).

I'm sorry for all your pain.

If I were you I would focus 100% on getting my diet under control.

My diet has been near perfect for two years. I eat around 15 to 1800 calories a day on average, and treat myself occasionally to chocolatey yum yums. No deprivation. No binging. No emotional eating.

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I would cut out ALL added sugar and processed foods and eat fresh vegetables and fruit, lean proteins, nuts and seeds.

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I eat sugary foods a couple times a month. I feel this is okay. very few processed foods for this chick. I love to cook and do so from scratch. I even have a cooking blog where I teach how to create food as from scratch as possible. All flavour bases, like stocks, everything. Fresh and real food. Lots and lots of veggies, check. Low GI, mostly, fruits, check. Plenty of proteins, but I do eat lean ad well as fatty proteins. I am way within caloric limits even so. I don't eat a whole lot (now. Don't get me started on how i was eating when I gained my weight. Can you say "mountain of carbs?" That will give you an idea. Remember, this was years ago, not now.) Cannot and will not eat nuts and seeds. Disgusting. No likey.

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Read "Grain Brain" - Dr David Perlmutter.

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Did. Agree with some of it, but not all. Nontheless I limit grains and especially wheat. Oh, yeah, next week I will have some Bday cake with my husband, but won't have wheat again in any foreseeable time. I think this is a sane way to live life.

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When you have dropped some more weight, you can then look at getting into weight training and getting your muscles to love you again. You don't have to run or do crossfit (unless you want to) be be fit, just walking and lifting some weights will get you into quite nice shape.

[/quote]

You are right. I need to lose more weight before I can hope to really work on my fitness, though I see no reason to discontinue pool exercises. My 5 month plateau has been very frustrating though. When will I start losing weight again I wonder? I am hoping the little bit of exercise I can do will start helping me along soon. I will say this much, I usually feel damn great after a swim. I have swum every day save for the odd day off over the last two months. No weight loss but good overall feeling. That is a kind of progress, right?

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Focus on WHY you want this and do NOT lose sight of your focus - already sounds like you have a very good reason - not to live in pain.
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Damn right I have focus! The pain is a huge factor. I want to live life to the fullest and enjoy a long healthy life. I want to have kids and the clock is ticking! I want to be able to do every day tasks without becoming exhausted and of course to,hopefully, have the stamina to raise children.

kendall916

I would suggest doing a yoga program at your local gym. I had really bad lower back problems for sitting wrong in college. When I attended a summer yoga class I could feel the muscles gently stretch and I was able to build my balance again.