Aching muscles so do I rest?

Debx12345

I did a new workout yesterday and my arms and legs ache a tiny bit, I normally do a work out today but not sure if I should, or want sort to do. Any advice ?

myukniewicz

oh! i have the same exact question my legs are achy from a new exercise i did yesterday as well, and i am suppose to use to work out again today. please help us ha ha

hckygrl

my suggestion is to do a light workout...such as if you normally run on the treadmill, walk today. The soreness you are feeling is lactic acid which has built up in our muscles. If you rest today the soreness could become more intense tomorrow. Doing a light workout will help work some of the lactic acid out of your muscles without building more up. Also, try mixing some glutamine powder in your after workout drink.....it helps disperse lactic acid.

Ciao!

TrainingWithTonya

You should rest that muscle group, but workout another. Anytime you do resistance training, you cause microscopic tears in the muscle that cause the pain you feel a day or two later. You have to let those muscles heal before you work them again. If you don't, then you just put tear upon tear and don't actually build up the muscle. Muscle builds during rest. Even if you are going for "tone" you are building muscle, just a different type of muscle fiber that doesn't hypertrophy as easily.

So, if you did upper body yesterday, do lower body today. If you find you are getting exceptionally sore, you can break down your workouts even more, like back and biceps for day one, legs for day two, chest and triceps for day 3, shoulders and abs for day 4, take a rest day and then repeat the 4 previous days. Thats just an example. There are an unlimited number of ways you can break down the muscle groups so you don't work the same muscles two days in a row.

myukniewicz

awesome thank you!!!!

elmct57

stretch afterwards--cooldown, take ibuprofen, push fluids and an easy walk. don't NOT do anything or it will get worse. next time after your stretch out and are done try consuming some protein after your workout. helps repair those microscopic tears, etc. You can also soak in (as warm as you can stand it) the tub with epsom salts. Hang in there!

TrainingWithTonya

Oh, and FYI, lactic acid buildup is actually what causes the soreness while you are lifting, not the delayed onset muscle soreness felt a day or two later. Lactic acid only builds up if you are burning primarily muscle glycogen (carbs) and not going into the Krebs Cycle to burn body fat. At the end of anaerobic glycolysis (where you break down a molecule of glycogen to produce fuel) you have a byproduct called pyruvate. IF you have enough oxygen available (meaning you are at a low enough intensity to allow the body time to get the oxygen you are breathing to the muscles for usage in the process), then you can go into aerobic metabolism (Kreb's Cycle and Electron Transport Chain) where you can produce a lot more fuel by taking that pyruvate and using it to convert fat to fuel. If you are going too intense, then the body can't go into aerobic metabolism with all of the by products of anaerobic metabolism so the pyruvate produced from those cycles becomes lactic acid. Lactic acid build up makes the area more acidic which makes the area sore right then. Because the body can't survive in an acidic state, it works pretty fast after exercise to clear the lactic acid from the muscles. A day or two later, when most people feel sore from exercise, the lactic acid has already been removed. It's actual cellular damage that causes that pain. You have to then let the muscles repair on a cellular level to see progress in your muscular development.

BoresEasily

Another very informative post Tonya. Thank you yet again.

This is a little off-topic but I wonder if anyone could help me out here. I learned today that I'm not consuming enough calories per day just to maintain and if I want to build muscle, lean or otherwise I need to eat a surplus of calories. Does anyone have an idea on some clean foods that will boost my caloric intake?

Debx12345

Wow thanks for that. Was very er ........ Technical. But I got the gist. Thanks, unfortunately most of my muscles ache, not in bad way, just can feel I have used them, so might go on exercise bike later or cross trainer. I never do major weight work, but should I have protein shakes after a muscle workout anyway ?

TrainingWithTonya

Sorry, I get excited in the forums because I'm talking fitness (Some people get excited about talking about football or music. For me, it's exercise and how the body works.) and I get too technical sometimes.

As for the other questions:

BoresEasily: Additional protein is best for adding muscle. But you can only build so much muscle at a time and any extra calories you consume that aren't used for that muscle build will be stored as fat. A pound of muscle equals 600 calories, which is a lot less then the 3500 calories of a pound of fat, so to add a pound of muscle a week, you only need like 85 extra calories from protein a day. Thats only about 21 grams of protein added a day. An extra chicken tenderloin (grilled and not breaded) will give you that. Or one scoop of protein powder.

Debx12345: The extra protein needed for muscle growth and repair can be achieved through actual food if you are eating within an hour of your workout. If your schedule doesn't allow a meal of a portion of protein and a portion of carbs (to replace the glycogen burned), then a protein shake may be best just to make sure you are getting the building blocks when they will be used the most. If you can eat within an hour of exercise though, you can get the same benefit without the shake by eating real food.

Azdak

Oh, and FYI, lactic acid buildup is actually what causes the soreness while you are lifting, not the delayed onset muscle soreness felt a day or two later. Lactic acid only builds up if you are burning primarily muscle glycogen (carbs) and not going into the Krebs Cycle to burn body fat. At the end of anaerobic glycolysis (where you break down a molecule of glycogen to produce fuel) you have a byproduct called pyruvate. IF you have enough oxygen available (meaning you are at a low enough intensity to allow the body time to get the oxygen you are breathing to the muscles for usage in the process), then you can go into aerobic metabolism (Kreb's Cycle and Electron Transport Chain) where you can produce a lot more fuel by taking that pyruvate and using it to convert fat to fuel. If you are going too intense, then the body can't go into aerobic metabolism with all of the by products of anaerobic metabolism so the pyruvate produced from those cycles becomes lactic acid. Lactic acid build up makes the area more acidic which makes the area sore right then. Because the body can't survive in an acidic state, it works pretty fast after exercise to clear the lactic acid from the muscles. A day or two later, when most people feel sore from exercise, the lactic acid has already been removed. It's actual cellular damage that causes that pain. You have to then let the muscles repair on a cellular level to see progress in your muscular development.

There has been some research lately that is challenging the idea that lactate has anything to do with fatigue at all--even transient fatigue during an intense workout. I haven't digested it all yet, but here is one article that describes some of the recent findings--you might find it interesting:

http://running.competitor.com/2010/10/sports-science-update/sports-science-update-how-lactic-acid-prevents-fatigue_15666

TrainingWithTonya

Oh, and FYI, lactic acid buildup is actually what causes the soreness while you are lifting, not the delayed onset muscle soreness felt a day or two later. Lactic acid only builds up if you are burning primarily muscle glycogen (carbs) and not going into the Krebs Cycle to burn body fat. At the end of anaerobic glycolysis (where you break down a molecule of glycogen to produce fuel) you have a byproduct called pyruvate. IF you have enough oxygen available (meaning you are at a low enough intensity to allow the body time to get the oxygen you are breathing to the muscles for usage in the process), then you can go into aerobic metabolism (Kreb's Cycle and Electron Transport Chain) where you can produce a lot more fuel by taking that pyruvate and using it to convert fat to fuel. If you are going too intense, then the body can't go into aerobic metabolism with all of the by products of anaerobic metabolism so the pyruvate produced from those cycles becomes lactic acid. Lactic acid build up makes the area more acidic which makes the area sore right then. Because the body can't survive in an acidic state, it works pretty fast after exercise to clear the lactic acid from the muscles. A day or two later, when most people feel sore from exercise, the lactic acid has already been removed. It's actual cellular damage that causes that pain. You have to then let the muscles repair on a cellular level to see progress in your muscular development.

There has been some research lately that is challenging the idea that lactate has anything to do with fatigue at all--even transient fatigue during an intense workout. I haven't digested it all yet, but here is one article that describes some of the recent findings--you might find it interesting:

http://running.competitor.com/2010/10/sports-science-update/sports-science-update-how-lactic-acid-prevents-fatigue_15666

Thanks! I love reading new research. I use to think I wanted to get my doctorate in physical therapy after completing my bachelors, but lately I'm seriously considering a masters in nutrition and a doctorate in exercise physiology because it is all so much more technical and interesting then what I had seen as a trainer. I would love to be able to actually do some of these research studies in the future.

Debx12345

Trainingwithtony: I'm at that last 10lbs stage, and think my body wants to stay at 130lbs (no matter what I do!). So ive decided to tone, my legs and arms aren't too bad, it's the middle bits. What would you suggest I do ? I have DVDs turbo jam, 10 min solutions etc, I have a cross trainer, exercise bike, vibroplate, gym which uses hydraulic machines rather than those where you add weights and a treadmill. lol sounds a lot, but I can do about 30-40 mins a day on a work out, any tiles on which to use more of and do I alternate strength with cardio ? Any suggestions how to tone better ? Thanks

HealthyChanges2010

Oh, and FYI, lactic acid buildup is actually what causes the soreness while you are lifting, not the delayed onset muscle soreness felt a day or two later. Lactic acid only builds up if you are burning primarily muscle glycogen (carbs) and not going into the Krebs Cycle to burn body fat. At the end of anaerobic glycolysis (where you break down a molecule of glycogen to produce fuel) you have a byproduct called pyruvate. IF you have enough oxygen available (meaning you are at a low enough intensity to allow the body time to get the oxygen you are breathing to the muscles for usage in the process), then you can go into aerobic metabolism (Kreb's Cycle and Electron Transport Chain) where you can produce a lot more fuel by taking that pyruvate and using it to convert fat to fuel. If you are going too intense, then the body can't go into aerobic metabolism with all of the by products of anaerobic metabolism so the pyruvate produced from those cycles becomes lactic acid. Lactic acid build up makes the area more acidic which makes the area sore right then. Because the body can't survive in an acidic state, it works pretty fast after exercise to clear the lactic acid from the muscles. A day or two later, when most people feel sore from exercise, the lactic acid has already been removed. It's actual cellular damage that causes that pain. You have to then let the muscles repair on a cellular level to see progress in your muscular development.

Okkkk....Thanks Tonya... a bit to take in here, again I appreciate your input as well So when you say 'let the muscles rest on a celular level'....... this means after a break of strength training and if I'm sore is it then OK to do a cardio workout the next day or not?

Hm, I think I'm confused now. I should have skimmed this whole thread first...sorry gang.:blushing: I don't feel sore during but later in the day or sometimes right after and the next day typically unless I'm in a really good routine and then the soreness the day after decreases greatly if any. I then do a cardio day and then the next day another Strength training one. That's OK to do even with some soreness? Or not?

Sorry my head is a little cloudy so hope I made sense....:flowerforyou:
Thank you!

HealthyChanges2010

Oh, and FYI, lactic acid buildup is actually what causes the soreness while you are lifting, not the delayed onset muscle soreness felt a day or two later. Lactic acid only builds up if you are burning primarily muscle glycogen (carbs) and not going into the Krebs Cycle to burn body fat. At the end of anaerobic glycolysis (where you break down a molecule of glycogen to produce fuel) you have a byproduct called pyruvate. IF you have enough oxygen available (meaning you are at a low enough intensity to allow the body time to get the oxygen you are breathing to the muscles for usage in the process), then you can go into aerobic metabolism (Kreb's Cycle and Electron Transport Chain) where you can produce a lot more fuel by taking that pyruvate and using it to convert fat to fuel. If you are going too intense, then the body can't go into aerobic metabolism with all of the by products of anaerobic metabolism so the pyruvate produced from those cycles becomes lactic acid. Lactic acid build up makes the area more acidic which makes the area sore right then. Because the body can't survive in an acidic state, it works pretty fast after exercise to clear the lactic acid from the muscles. A day or two later, when most people feel sore from exercise, the lactic acid has already been removed. It's actual cellular damage that causes that pain. You have to then let the muscles repair on a cellular level to see progress in your muscular development.

There has been some research lately that is challenging the idea that lactate has anything to do with fatigue at all--even transient fatigue during an intense workout. I haven't digested it all yet, but here is one article that describes some of the recent findings--you might find it interesting:

http://running.competitor.com/2010/10/sports-science-update/sports-science-update-how-lactic-acid-prevents-fatigue_15666

Thanks! I love reading new research. I use to think I wanted to get my doctorate in physical therapy after completing my bachelors, but lately I'm seriously considering a masters in nutrition and a doctorate in exercise physiology because it is all so much more technical and interesting then what I had seen as a trainer. I would love to be able to actually do some of these research studies in the future.

I think you'd be very good at that Tonya!

HealthyChanges2010

Oh, and FYI, lactic acid buildup is actually what causes the soreness while you are lifting, not the delayed onset muscle soreness felt a day or two later. Lactic acid only builds up if you are burning primarily muscle glycogen (carbs) and not going into the Krebs Cycle to burn body fat. At the end of anaerobic glycolysis (where you break down a molecule of glycogen to produce fuel) you have a byproduct called pyruvate. IF you have enough oxygen available (meaning you are at a low enough intensity to allow the body time to get the oxygen you are breathing to the muscles for usage in the process), then you can go into aerobic metabolism (Kreb's Cycle and Electron Transport Chain) where you can produce a lot more fuel by taking that pyruvate and using it to convert fat to fuel. If you are going too intense, then the body can't go into aerobic metabolism with all of the by products of anaerobic metabolism so the pyruvate produced from those cycles becomes lactic acid. Lactic acid build up makes the area more acidic which makes the area sore right then. Because the body can't survive in an acidic state, it works pretty fast after exercise to clear the lactic acid from the muscles. A day or two later, when most people feel sore from exercise, the lactic acid has already been removed. It's actual cellular damage that causes that pain. You have to then let the muscles repair on a cellular level to see progress in your muscular development.

There has been some research lately that is challenging the idea that lactate has anything to do with fatigue at all--even transient fatigue during an intense workout. I haven't digested it all yet, but here is one article that describes some of the recent findings--you might find it interesting:

http://running.competitor.com/2010/10/sports-science-update/sports-science-update-how-lactic-acid-prevents-fatigue_15666

OH! This thread is a wealth of info I'm interested in... thank you so much for sharing the link Azdak.

TrainingWithTonya

Oh, and FYI, lactic acid buildup is actually what causes the soreness while you are lifting, not the delayed onset muscle soreness felt a day or two later. Lactic acid only builds up if you are burning primarily muscle glycogen (carbs) and not going into the Krebs Cycle to burn body fat. At the end of anaerobic glycolysis (where you break down a molecule of glycogen to produce fuel) you have a byproduct called pyruvate. IF you have enough oxygen available (meaning you are at a low enough intensity to allow the body time to get the oxygen you are breathing to the muscles for usage in the process), then you can go into aerobic metabolism (Kreb's Cycle and Electron Transport Chain) where you can produce a lot more fuel by taking that pyruvate and using it to convert fat to fuel. If you are going too intense, then the body can't go into aerobic metabolism with all of the by products of anaerobic metabolism so the pyruvate produced from those cycles becomes lactic acid. Lactic acid build up makes the area more acidic which makes the area sore right then. Because the body can't survive in an acidic state, it works pretty fast after exercise to clear the lactic acid from the muscles. A day or two later, when most people feel sore from exercise, the lactic acid has already been removed. It's actual cellular damage that causes that pain. You have to then let the muscles repair on a cellular level to see progress in your muscular development.

Okkkk....Thanks Tonya... a bit to take in here, again I appreciate your input as well So when you say 'let the muscles rest on a celular level'....... this means after a break of strength training and if I'm sore is it then OK to do a cardio workout the next day or not?

Hm, I think I'm confused now. I should have skimmed this whole thread first...sorry gang.:blushing: I don't feel sore during but later in the day or sometimes right after and the next day typically unless I'm in a really good routine and then the soreness the day after decreases greatly if any. I then do a cardio day and then the next day another Strength training one. That's OK to do even with some soreness? Or not?

Sorry my head is a little cloudy so hope I made sense....:flowerforyou:
Thank you!

Okay, let me see if I can explain this without being too technical. There are multiple types of muscle fibers in each muscle and the different types work better with different types of activity. Some of them are better for cardio and are used more for those activities and others are better for resistance activities and are used more for those activities. The "resistance" fibers are the ones that are growing and need the day of rest in between. The "cardio" fibers are less likely to bulk up so they need less time to repair and rebuild. (For those who are more technical, yes, I know they aren't really called "resistance" or "cardio" fibers. They are fast twitch or slow twitch, or Type I, Type IIa, Type IIb, Type IIc(x), etc. but I'm trying not to be technical and confuse people, so I'm just using "resistance" and "cardio".) When we talk about microscopic muscle tears being the cause of 2nd day soreness, we're actually talking about cellular damage to the individual muscle fibers. That is what you have to allow to heal so the muscle can repair and grow. Because the "cardio" fibers don't need the same amount of repair and build time, they can be worked daily. So, if you do weights and cardio one day, you can do just cardio the next or you can do a different muscle group with weights and the same or similar cardio. If you are sore a couple days later from cardio, you may be recruiting some of those "resistance" fibers for that cardio. This would be the case with an elliptical with resistance (IE: you went up to a higher level) so you might want to work them with less resistance or on a different cardio machine the next day or two. I don't recommend using the same muscle group with resistance until the soreness goes away, just in case the soreness isn't your standard muscle soreness but a pulled or torn muscle, ligament, or tendon. But say you are sore from the elliptical from using a higher setting then usual. Try the exercise bike with no resistance (Manual level 1) for a few days so that you get cardio without using resistance on that muscle group. If you are still sore from it, see a doctor. Sometimes that movement without resistance will help work some of the soreness out from DOMS. And always, always, always stretch after every workout.

HealthyChanges2010

Oh, and FYI, lactic acid buildup is actually what causes the soreness while you are lifting, not the delayed onset muscle soreness felt a day or two later. Lactic acid only builds up if you are burning primarily muscle glycogen (carbs) and not going into the Krebs Cycle to burn body fat. At the end of anaerobic glycolysis (where you break down a molecule of glycogen to produce fuel) you have a byproduct called pyruvate. IF you have enough oxygen available (meaning you are at a low enough intensity to allow the body time to get the oxygen you are breathing to the muscles for usage in the process), then you can go into aerobic metabolism (Kreb's Cycle and Electron Transport Chain) where you can produce a lot more fuel by taking that pyruvate and using it to convert fat to fuel. If you are going too intense, then the body can't go into aerobic metabolism with all of the by products of anaerobic metabolism so the pyruvate produced from those cycles becomes lactic acid. Lactic acid build up makes the area more acidic which makes the area sore right then. Because the body can't survive in an acidic state, it works pretty fast after exercise to clear the lactic acid from the muscles. A day or two later, when most people feel sore from exercise, the lactic acid has already been removed. It's actual cellular damage that causes that pain. You have to then let the muscles repair on a cellular level to see progress in your muscular development.

Okkkk....Thanks Tonya... a bit to take in here, again I appreciate your input as well So when you say 'let the muscles rest on a celular level'....... this means after a break of strength training and if I'm sore is it then OK to do a cardio workout the next day or not?

Hm, I think I'm confused now. I should have skimmed this whole thread first...sorry gang.:blushing: I don't feel sore during but later in the day or sometimes right after and the next day typically unless I'm in a really good routine and then the soreness the day after decreases greatly if any. I then do a cardio day and then the next day another Strength training one. That's OK to do even with some soreness? Or not?

Sorry my head is a little cloudy so hope I made sense....:flowerforyou:
Thank you!

Okay, let me see if I can explain this without being too technical. There are multiple types of muscle fibers in each muscle and the different types work better with different types of activity. Some of them are better for cardio and are used more for those activities and others are better for resistance activities and are used more for those activities. The "resistance" fibers are the ones that are growing and need the day of rest in between. The "cardio" fibers are less likely to bulk up so they need less time to repair and rebuild. (For those who are more technical, yes, I know they aren't really called "resistance" or "cardio" fibers. They are fast twitch or slow twitch, or Type I, Type IIa, Type IIb, Type IIc(x), etc. but I'm trying not to be technical and confuse people, so I'm just using "resistance" and "cardio".) When we talk about microscopic muscle tears being the cause of 2nd day soreness, we're actually talking about cellular damage to the individual muscle fibers. That is what you have to allow to heal so the muscle can repair and grow. Because the "cardio" fibers don't need the same amount of repair and build time, they can be worked daily. So, if you do weights and cardio one day, you can do just cardio the next or you can do a different muscle group with weights and the same or similar cardio. If you are sore a couple days later from cardio, you may be recruiting some of those "resistance" fibers for that cardio. This would be the case with an elliptical with resistance (IE: you went up to a higher level) so you might want to work them with less resistance or on a different cardio machine the next day or two. I don't recommend using the same muscle group with resistance until the soreness goes away, just in case the soreness isn't your standard muscle soreness but a pulled or torn muscle, ligament, or tendon. But say you are sore from the elliptical from using a higher setting then usual. Try the exercise bike with no resistance (Manual level 1) for a few days so that you get cardio without using resistance on that muscle group. If you are still sore from it, see a doctor. Sometimes that movement without resistance will help work some of the soreness out from DOMS. And always, always, always stretch after every workout.

I got it now! Thanks so much for breaking it down Tonya:flowerforyou:

HealthyChanges2010

bump

shoegirl2

On the aching muscles, basics are most helpful: stretch, light to moderate walking, drink plenty of water, and make sure you've had enough calories that day. Bananas help, too. I would be cautious taking ibuprofen or any anti-inflammatory unless it's truly necessary. Sometimes we can overdo it, and end up with intolerance (hives are a common indicator).

neonpink

Bump