Low BMR?

lavaughan69

Hi, I've been on a 1200-1400 calorie diet for 17 months now and currently in maintenance mode essentially. Like you, I wanted to create a diet that I could live with and a lifestyle I could maintain in the long term,. I focused all my efforts towards counting and measuring and really sticking to the 1200 calories, but what I'd do was more of a 5/2 approach in the beginning to allow for the amount I liked to drink on weekends. So basically I'd pick two days a week where I would only have 600 cals so that I had an extra 1200 to play with. That buys a lot of drinks...and a few chicken wings;-)

As for exercise, I hate it, and I didn't want to start something that ultimately I knew I'd quit anyways. What I chose to do was walk on my lunch hours for a 1/2 hour three days a week. That's it. I've just recently started a walk/jog program three days a week to do a 5k with a friend, but I'm not really enjoying it, so once it's over I'm going back to my walking.

SueInAz

Are you weighing/measuring everything that you consume? I can probably bet that you are consuming more than you think.

Did you not read all of the OP's post? She's tracking accurately.

Yes I did read all of it. And I asked because people who log "accurately" don't really log as accurately as they think. And that can be an indication as to why they are not losing weight.

Obviously, you did not because she specifically asked for no posts asking if she was accurately tracking. Since she obviously knew those posts would be forthcoming when she posted one should respect that she knows what she's doing. Posting regardless is just you having difficulty keeping your opinion to yourself. It makes these forums an uglier place when one can't ask for, and receive, that type of respect.

silentKayak

Thanks, to all the helpful commenters here!

I am 44, 5'5", 240 lbs. Calculators say my BMR should be 2000-2100, but I can't see how that's right. If that were accurate I should have dropped a meaningful amount of weight after 4 weeks on 1450 cal/day. At 240 lbs, it is a mystery to me how I'm NOT losing weight on my current eating plan but ....

- I've never been able to lose weight on a diet except for strict ketogenic ones, which I can't sustain for more than a year at a time. I get bored with the food AND don't see results, and give up.
- For the last few years (since starting this full-time desk job) I've gained about 1 lb/month on what was previously my maintenance level of eating.
- I've "restricted" calories my whole life (I haven't had sugar soda in years, and have gradually cut out all kinds of empty calories), but continue to gain weight.
- My metabolism is clearly changing with age, as I'm eating far less than I ever did but gaining weight faster.
- I eat a variety of healthy foods, but portions are (clearly) larger than they need to be to maintain my weight.
- I hate exercise. I get that other people find it energizing; I find it exhausting. If I do a morning workout, it pretty well destroys my day at work. It makes me hungry, sleepy, and grouchy, not necessarily in that order.
- My family (husband, kids) eat what I eat (same meals, same portions), and they are all slim. They exercise more, but they also eat more snacks and desserts AND I weigh more than them.
- My mother struggled in exactly the same ways her whole life. I have her body shape/type.

These are clues that tell me that I simply have a low metabolism/low energy. You can't make a Jack Russell Terrier out of a Basset Hound

So in my opinion, I need to find the right number (is it 1400? 1200? 1000?) If I can stay below that number on average, my weight should start to shift. Once I know my budget, I should be able to find the right foods to fit it. IF I can find foods I can eat and not be hungry, I may have a solution.

That's the plan, anyway! Just looking for others in the same boat who've managed to take the weight off and keep it off.

As for "you're not measuring right" - again, I'll repeat. I am 240 lbs. Do we really think that if I track my steak salad as containing 4 oz instead of 3 oz of sirloin ... that THIS is the reason I haven't lost weight while cutting my intake in half last month? But also - I'm a data person, and I make my own food almost all of the time. The measurements are as correct as they can be. A 12 oz sirloin chopped into slices and divided equally onto 4 plates is ... 3 oz. I track every bite (though I missed a day when I was on a hiking trail out of cell phone reach).

Mr_Knight

...and anyone who KNOWS that their BMR is, say, 30% below the typical numbers reported here but has still lost weight and maintained the loss.

BMR variance follows a typical distribution. 96% of people will be within 15% of the expected BMR. To get to 30% variance, you're basically looking at 4-5 sigma, which is extremely rare (1 in 3.5 million).

Your challenge almost certainly lies elsewhere.

yarwell

my resting metabolic rate measured at 16% below predicted, but I was dieting at the time which tends to reduce RMR below prediction.

About 70% of people fall within 10% of the predicted BMR and 30% outside that band. A lot of the data used to derive the prediction was skinny people and not 240 lb ladies, so the accuracy is less good for heavy people.

Have you had thyroid and blood glucose levels checked out ?

Mr_Knight

I am 44, 5'5", 240 lbs. Calculators say my BMR should be 2000-2100, but I can't see how that's right.

And sure enough, there's your problem. At that level of body fat, you're looking at a BMR in the range of 1300-1400.

If you're going to use a calculator, use one that accounts for your body composition.

rosebette

I might suggest a check up for any hormonal or other issues that are causing your inability to lose weight. At 240 lbs., eating at 1200 is way below what would maintain that weight. Also, since your mother is heavy, whether there is a genetic condition (Thyroid, PCOS or some other condition?).

I also wouldn't underestimate the capacity of a desk job and travel to contribute to weight gain. Some studies say "sitting is the new smoking." My husband is heavy, probably around 275 at 6 feet; he doesn't eat that much more than I do, but he didn't lose anything until he started moving every day. He put 18 lbs on in a month of travel and desk work at a site. Sitting constantly does some real damage to the metabolism.

itsbasschick

my bodyfat was just over 40% on may 1, which is 25% over the 30.5% body fat online calcs and some devices came up with for my weight and height. i did great at 1200 calories per day for a while, losing weight at a steady pace. as i added weight training to my daily regime, however, i started needing to eat more calories on intense workout days, however, so i suspect my body fat is down and therefore BMR is up.

arcsnack

You are great. I feel your pain and wish I had recommendations to share.

In terms of our circumstances, I feel like I'm your twin - thus I'm battling very similarly to the way you are. 1200 cal or less 40 carb or less. I've been strict for 7 weeks and haven't lost a pound yet. I feel the same way when people swear we aren't reporting accurately because it is impossible to be sub 1200 calories a day for 7 weeks and to not have lost a pound. I'm recording with the utmost honesty so the only thing I can determine is at 45 years old, the CICO thing just isn't working for me.

I could go on and on about the number of things I've tried...symptoms....doctors advice...all related to being a person like you with very low energy and what seems to be a very low metabolism naturally. I'll keep reading and trying hoping to find something that alters the playing field. I'm wishing you the best of luck with that as well.

Thanks for the post. It helps me to feel like I'm not alone when there are so many people out there that are posting success. Maybe it will be our turn soon!

silentKayak

Thanks. I had my thyroid checked several years ago and there was no evidence of a problem. I don't have symptoms of PCOS. In any event, none of that would matter. I'm not really looking for reasons I haven't yet lost weight, but for a long-term solution I can live with.

I feel confident that there is a number of calories below which I need to eat to lose weight, even if I can't (OK, won't) build weight-loss-focused exercise into my life. I just need to figure out the number. Once I have my budget, I'm pretty sure I can work within it. I mentioned I'm a data person

Mr Knight - you really can't know what % of people are 30% below the stated "average" BMR unless you know the standard deviation of the distribution. You're confusing the standard deviation (sigma) with the standard error of the sample mean (sigma / sqrt(n)). Just as an example: if the average house price in my area is $600,000, it's not a "1 in 3.5 million chance" that a particular house will be priced 30% below or above that. Sorry to be picky here, but bad statistics makes my head hurt

You also don't know my body composition. I have quite a bit of lean muscle in addition to the fat (I used to lift weights a LOT and I build muscle easily). But as I said, the calculators clearly aren't accurate. I clearly need to find somewhere in my area to have my RMR measured. But what I do know is that at the levels I'm eating, I get these annoying warnings from MFP to "eat more". Yeah, like that's ever worked for me.

silentKayak

Also - the reason I don't go to the doctor to get evaluated for thyroid, blood glucose, PCOS, Cushing's or any other underlying cause .... is that the response I get is ....

"You need to eat less and exercise more. You're taking too much in. If you were eating as little as you say, you wouldn't be so big, etc."

One of the many reasons I'd like to lose weight is so that medical professionals will take my health concerns seriously. When my mother complained of back pain, they told her to "eat less and exercise more". Unfortunately, that advice didn't help her with the actual cause of her back pain: metastatic breast cancer that went undiagnosed because they wouldn't look past her weight for disease.

doctorregenerated

What's your age? Are you in pre-menopause? Hormones have an effect on metabolism. Also, I find when I'm more active, the weight comes off easier/faster at the same net calories.
I am at 1200 and losing about a pound a week. 5 years ago when I was younger, and had better hormone balance, I lost 2-3 pounds a week at 1200.
I don't want to go lower because I won't be able to sustain that type of low calorie intake for very long. 1200 is a challenge.
I'm 38 now and having some unusual hormone flux under stress. (ovarian cysts and irregular menstrual cycles.)
Feel free to add me.

WalkingAlong

It really doesn't matter what your BMR is or really even how accurately you log, as long as you're fairly consistent in your mis-estimating. If you're logging 1400 and not losing, you need to eat less.

The issue comes from people thinking the starvation mode and undereating messages apply to all of us and to all our estimates. In either case you fall into, under-estimating or under-burning, you're not going to hurt anything at 1200.

shadow2soul

Also - the reason I don't go to the doctor to get evaluated for thyroid, blood glucose, PCOS, Cushing's or any other underlying cause .... is that the response I get is ....

"You need to eat less and exercise more. You're taking too much in. If you were eating as little as you say, you wouldn't be so big, etc."

One of the many reasons I'd like to lose weight is so that medical professionals will take my health concerns seriously. When my mother complained of back pain, they told her to "eat less and exercise more". Unfortunately, that advice didn't help her with the actual cause of her back pain: metastatic breast cancer that went undiagnosed because they wouldn't look past her weight for disease.

Not all doctors are like that though. My mom (who is obese) and my aunt (who is also obese) were both diagnosed with hypothyroidism and lupus. If a doctor isn't listening to your concerns/can't see past your weight, than you should try and find one that will. My mom was actually told that taking meds for her thyroid would help her lose weight.

Mr_Knight

Mr Knight - you really can't know what % of people are 30% below the stated "average" BMR unless you know the standard deviation of the distribution.

Good. Because I *do* know the standard deviation. It's well known, you can look it up in the literature, and that's what I based the numbers on.

Sorry to be picky here, but bad statistics makes my head hurt

You're not being picky, you're being wrong. :happy: It's ok, I can handle it.

You also don't know my body composition.

Yes, I do. You have very high body fat percentage at that weight/height. No two ways about it. At that high level, being within 10 percentage points doesn't matter much.

There's no reason to be confused - the number you need is 1300-1400. This is also consistent with your claimed food intake, whcih is great, because we don't have to assume any violation of the laws of physics. That's always a plus.

Now go forth and be successful - good luck!

rosebette

One thing you might look into is Calorie Restriction with Optimal Nutrition (CRON). It is a longevity diet based on taking in between 10% to 30% fewer calories than your BMR, but you have to really track all your nutrients because if you are at or below 1200, as you know, it's tough to get in all the micronutrients you need. There's an online tool, the cronometer (www.cronometer.com) that calculates this for you. I have been doing it to a modest extent and found it very helpful to ensure that all the calories I was getting were quality calories. Since you are already tracking using MFP, it is another way of tracking. Unlike some posters on MFP, I don't think you'll become malnourished on 1200 or even 1100 a day. Some people for whatever reason (age, size, metabolism) simply cannot lose on 1400-1500 a day. I personally had trouble staying at 1100 because I work out, but if you're inactive, this might be sustainable for you as long as you're watching your micronutrients.

toronto88

If you can buy a few weights/resistance bands and do even 20 minutes a day of strength training at home you can probably gain a couple pounds of lean muscle. You'll look leaner and you can fairly easily raise your BMR by a couple hundred calories to give yourself more wiggle room for food. Or you could do some bodyweight exercises from a workout video like Jillian michaels body shred (i think the video is available on youtube).

ninerbuff

People who lose weight with just diet alone have a tendency to stall a lot. As weight goes down, so does BMR but by how much differs from person to person.

So if weight isn't moving on a non exercise program, the usual reasons are:

Inaccuracy of calorie count of intake for lowering weight
Lack of sleep/rest
Hormonal issues start

A.C.E. Certified Group Fitness and Personal Trainer
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Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition

Cher1e1n2

I read thru all these posts and as most chronic dieters already know, everyone is a little different. No one plan will work for every person. No two plans are alike...and more importantly no two resources seem to say the same things.. a few examples would be the calories and protein in a 4 ounce serving of chicken breast skinned and raw. look it up...the calorie variances are there. Also the calories in cooking oils... some resources say this isn't significantly absorbed, some say lower temp oils absorb more and some say it varies by type. Also body calculators.. My best friend in HS and I are the same height and age. At 160 I have noticeably chiseled arms and legs, she looks watery at that weight..

Also subtracting for exercise is a slippery slope.. it should be more starting at a set # of cal and watching your measurements... lots of measurements... bicep, forearm, thigh, calf, waist at smallest and at navel, and hips...neck.. all of them and monitoring how the exercise you do increases the amount of chg you SEE.. muscles learn to compensate.. and exercise counters don't know how your body metabolizes.. or what it's metabolizes. Proteins and fats have to be converted for energy so the yield is less for the ATP in the cells themselves.

I think this thread offered great questions and for some of the questions the answers have to be questions like how are you calculating your data? what factors do you control? what kind of calories are you consuming? what resources do you use?

I have a caveman metabolism, but I found a diet that works for me when I follow it.. The first step has already been taken for all of us, we are here!

silentKayak

Good. Because I *do* know the standard deviation. It's well known, you can look it up in the literature, and that's what I based the numbers on.

Great. If you have a source, please cite it instead of keeping it secret. Then I can evaluate your source against the others I've seen (all of which disagree with yours, but either could be inaccurate because, you know, internet). That way I can also run the statistics or interpret them myself.

For example, this calculator gives me a BMR of 1802: http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/bmr_calculator.htm
This one, 1755: http://www.myfitnesspal.com/tools/bmr-calculator

Both of these are reputable sites, so honestly I'd take those numbers over the ones given to me by some guy from the internet from a secret source.

Neither has a way of adjusting for "body composition" (you claim to know mine based on my weight alone, which doesn't make any sense), but I'd be interested in seeing a calculator or formula that does.

"I'm right, you're wrong" really doesn't add anything to this (or any other) conversation.