Low Carbs......how low can you go?

aa0020

Hi there. I am thoroughly demoralised after being given medical advice to completely cut carbs FOREVER. This will apparently help with inflammation and pain from fibromyalgia and lipodoema as well as help me to lose the 70 pounds that have occured because I am too sore to move (and I eat too much!!!) The Dr's logic is that even a small taste triggers the biological process that I am supposed to be avoiding ....medical stuff. Didnt understand any of it. Something about glucose and insulin, etc. He was implying that a tiny amount is the same as a small amount and therefore no effort will really be good enough unless nothing is eaten that will trigger this insulin response. Can anyone explain this to me in the language reserved for small children? If a teaspoon of honey launches this negative insulin process, how long does it last? If the general feeling is that low carbs are ok, how many carbs per 100g aim I aiming for? If I limit this to a few times a day is my whole day shot or will the various organs responsible get to have some sort of a break? I am confused that Atkins says no pasta and then goes on to sell Atkins pasta at 14g per 100g I am confused about recipes. The Doc says sweetners fool the body into producing insulin but I cannot imagine living without something sweet, and then he scuppered fruit for me in his next breath. Of course all my favorite veggies are too starchy and I am required to concentrate on the ones I hate like Kale and brussell sprouts. I am supposed to see plain yoghurt as the answer to world tension, when I HATE plain yoghurt. Can anyone tell me where to start!! Thank you so much

StephGetsSexy

I am apart of an amazing group on Facebook:

https://www.facebook.com/groups/304246766284187/

I highly recommend joining and posting to our members! Everyone is SO nice and helpful and it has been life changing for me! I have lost 35 lbs in 2 month so far on low carb journey and I feel great

The group is closed so your facebook friends can't see what you post so you don't have to worry about privacy issues. Hope to see you there!

Ajewett214

I would suggest a couple of appointments with a very good nutritionist who can guide you through this process in a healthy way.

SideSteel

How many grams of carbs did your doctor recommend?

Vegetables are primarily carbohydrate and I doubt your doctor is suggesting that you entirely eliminate all carbs.

nikkimwarren

If you are part of facebook go search out Trim Healthy mama, there is a great group that walks you through eatin healthier and allowing you to still have treats every now and again and how to do it

abear007

Can anyone tell me where to start!! Thank you so much

I can tell you what I do. I've always hated veggies except for potatoes and peas. Lately I've been eating spinach, kale and all sorts of greens by mixing them all together with some frozen peas and carrots and topping them off with real butter. I often make a stir fry with them by mixing it all with ground beef or chicken. Very yummy.

FIT_Goat

How low can you go? In theory, you could go down to 0g of carbs per day. There's no such thing as an essential carb. If you're not eating any, your body has ways to get enough from other sources. In practice, getting down to 0g is not really necessary and makes for way too many food restrictions. Stuff like eggs, cheese, liver, and other foods that are good to eat all have trace amounts of carbs.

People also typically count net carbs. This means you can have lots of leafy green veggies. If something has 7g of carbs, but two grams of fiber, it's really only 2g of carbs that will reach your blood stream. So, you just count them as 2g of carbs.

Personally, I average under 10g a day. That's gross (not net). But, I will openly admit that I go to an extreme that most people have no need to reach. A more reasonable goal is 20-25g of net carbs a day. Ratio and timing doesn't matter. You can have 20g with dinner, or spread out through the day. The amount of carbs per 100g doesn't matter. It's just total grams / day that matters.

Atkins bars, pasta, and most frozen meals are garbage. They are full of a bunch of junk that you don't need to be eating. They should all come with a warning that Atkins himself did not approve of most diet foods and products and told people to just buy their own real foods. Many things sold today would be stuff that he probably wouldn't agree with. Sadly, with his death, the company became more profit driven than sanity driven. That said, a rare treat from the Atkins line of products is something you may wish to indulge in. Eating one or more products every day is a sure way to have problems.

Is it hard at first? Yes. I was the world's biggest bread eater. I would bake 4-6 loaves of homemade bread every week. I would eat fries, potatoes, or rice daily. If I ate breakfast at all, it was usually oatmeal. Changing to low-carb required me to completely rebuild my understanding of food. More than physically, this was a mentally tough task.

Finally, there are many groups on here that you should consider joining:
Low Carber Daily Forum... The Group
Keto
Low Carb/High Fat Lifestyle

These groups, and there are some others, are more supportive and understanding than the general forums. You'll get replies from people who are doing the same thing you're trying to do and who understand.

Ehecatl915

I have fibromyalgia and spinal stenosis. I eat low carb because I am carb sensitive and it does help with the fibro pain. I don't think your doctor meant to cut out all carbs, because some carbs are needed. I stay under 90 carbs a day, and I eat mostly veggies and fruits to make that carbs, once in awhile I will have a rice cake or gluten free english muffin. I cut out the rice pasta and potatoes. I also take a good multi vitamin and caprylic acid. A lot of people with fibromyalgia are loaded with candida and caprylic acid which comes from coconuts kills the yeast. I have felt a lot better since taking caprylic acid. I would also suggest you see a nutritionist, they know a lot more than a medical doctor about the right foods and natural remedies for good health.

Tom_on_keto

Cutting carbs and going LCHF was the best thing I've ever done in my life. Most days I'm under 10g of carbs a day. There are still a lot of awesome things you can make if you get a sweet tooth. I like to have 85% dark chocolate. It's 8g of carbs for a 25g bar. There are also a ton of sites with fantastic low carb recipes. My favorite site is Ibreatheimhungry.com. You think that cutting them is hard now, but once you actually start eating this way you won't even miss them.

http://www.ibreatheimhungry.com/recipe-index/low-carb-gluten-free-dessert-recipes

Mr_Knight

This doesn't sound like an even remotely feasible path for you. Might be worth considering a second opinion.

DamePiglet

This doesn't sound like an even remotely feasible path for you. Might be worth considering a second opinion.

Yup.

MagnumBurrito

How many grams of carbs did your doctor recommend?

Vegetables are primarily carbohydrate and I doubt your doctor is suggesting that you entirely eliminate all carbs.

+1

Don't cut out veggies and dark leafy greens. They contains tons of mitochondria which supports brain health.

nitrospop

I agree with the above posts. No need to go to extremes, but you can safely cut every single carb. As for myself, I try to stay at 30g net carbs/day. As stated before, difficult at first, then you begin to wonder why you didn't eat this way your whole life. I have enjoyed discovering new recipes to replace the foods I once ate. I have several low carb pizzas, waffles, pancakes, and a low carb ricotta cheese cake, just to name a few, that will cure any sweet craving!

GarbageCollector

What your Dr recommends is possibly keto. I eat this way myself and lost about 10 pounds the last two month. Also it's said to cure diabetes and other diseases. Just google "ketogenic diet" or something like this and read what you find. There is so much information, even with images or nice youtube-videos.

To start, I recommend this:
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1gZfJejOM8fJsX1iCilmnpp1qmT_KncJwWCR4-EsaEHc/edit?pli=1

And if you use reddit (or don't bother to start to), you should visit www.reddit.com/r/keto. They can totally help you!

Try keto. It's fun.
I can eat all the things I love (meat, veggies, cheese, nuts, ... ) and only miss sweets sometimes. But then there are possibilities (like diet choco dessert) and so on.
Also it doesn't mean that you should never eat one carb ever again. It's just that you cut out bread, noodles, fruits etc.

I go for about a maximum of 50g carbs a day. That's enough to stay in ketosis and stop high blood sugar.


Also, if this sounds too "hardcore" for you, try to whatch your glycemic index. That's the next best thing to do.
But really. Try keto. After a few days (maybe weeks) it's soo easy!

baconslave

I agree with the above posts. No need to go to extremes, but you can safely cut every single carb. As for myself, I try to stay at 30g net carbs/day. As stated before, difficult at first, then you begin to wonder why you didn't eat this way your whole life. I have enjoyed discovering new recipes to replace the foods I once ate. I have several low carb pizzas, waffles, pancakes, and a low carb ricotta cheese cake, just to name a few, that will cure any sweet craving!

Precisely. I do under 30g/daily (that's gross, not net) but intend to bump it up once I reach maintenance. The guy I quoted has it right.

Atkins has levels; you start low and then slowly you add other things. Read the book. Don't just look it up on the internet or read an article. Try to get a lot of fat and protein, less carbs. My target percentage is 5% carbs, 30% protein, and 70% fat.

If you don't think you can do it. Do this instead. Try for 50g net. Cut pasta, rice, refined breads, potatoes, corn, and other starches. Pick things off the low end of the Glycemic Index. Green leafies, veggies, fruits. This will improve your blood sugar and calorie intake nicely. That will drastically improve your health.
(My mother is a diabetic, and I have had gestational diabetes, so I'm well informed on restricted carb diets.)

baconslave

What your Dr recommends is possibly keto. I eat this way myself and lost about 10 pounds the last two month. Also it's said to cure diabetes and other diseases. Just google "ketogenic diet" or something like this and read what you find. There is so much information, even with images or nice youtube-videos.

To start, I recommend this:
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1gZfJejOM8fJsX1iCilmnpp1qmT_KncJwWCR4-EsaEHc/edit?pli=1

And if you use reddit (or don't bother to start to), you should visit www.reddit.com/r/keto. They can totally help you!

Try keto. It's fun.
I can eat all the things I love (meat, veggies, cheese, nuts, ... ) and only miss sweets sometimes. But then there are possibilities (like diet choco dessert) and so on.
Also it doesn't mean that you should never eat one carb ever again. It's just that you cut out bread, noodles, fruits etc.

I go for about a maximum of 50g carbs a day. That's enough to stay in ketosis and stop high blood sugar.


Also, if this sounds too "hardcore" for you, try to whatch your glycemic index. That's the next best thing to do.
But really. Try keto. After a few days (maybe weeks) it's soo easy!

Jinx. Sorry, I was pecking mine out while your were apparently. I lurk at r/keto, too.

I hang around here as well. [url] http://forum.lowcarber.org/index.php?[/url] Great support group.

Mr_Knight

I did VLC for about a year, and it was a truly miserable experience. I'm not saying that to try and scare you, just pointing out the obvious - the human body is designed to eat carbs, and going into strong deprivation will work for some people but will be an unsustainable horror show for most people.

Good luck!

alliemay1024

I would suggest a couple of appointments with a very good nutritionist who can guide you through this process in a healthy way.

Agreed!

activeinmysixties

It is an interesting concept that for some may be controversial I listen to a podcast this morning (ask ask prof noakes) professor Timothy Noakes who is an authority on low carb high fat diet. He recommends between 50-150 grams/day. Yes, you can go down to -zero- but that is not for everyone.

Another resource is the book 'the art and science of low carbohydrate living' by Jeff Volek and Stephen Phinney. Great read.

Another podcast you may want to listen to - and don't be intimidated by the fact that the hosts are marathoners and ironman triathletes - it is the concept. The pod cast is "fit fat fast".

Personally I would go low carb, but not necessary to the point of becoming ketotic. If you do for medical reasons, I would hope your physician have you on some kind of supervision and check numbers regularly.

One caveat is - in the beginning people can be very tired and irritable.

activeinmysixties

"I would suggest a couple of appointments with a very good nutritionist who can guide you through this process in a healthy way."

The problem with nutritionist is - they often think conventional wisdom, and that is not what a low carb diet is all about. I would be very selective.

Something to think about is using aerobic cardio (Maffetone method - http://philmaffetone.com/180-formula) for your cardio training - it will make you much more metabolic efficient.

If you look at my profile I do plenty of endurance runs - after I lowered t my carbs I feel so much better during the run - no blood sugar spikes from gels - when I did my last half marathon this was my fuel. A smoothie with spinach, avocado, berries, chia seeds, one scoop of Ucan, and almond milk. Felt perfect, ran for fun - not for time and did a 2:20 half.

MrGonzo05

I am supposed to see plain yoghurt as the answer to world tension, when I HATE plain yoghurt. Can anyone tell me where to start!! Thank you so much

You can dump a bunch of artificial sweetener in it, and a few blueberries. It's decent.

Peloton73

It's a lot to take in when receiving news like this for the first time. A common reaction is to push back with "I can't live without x, y, and z" but you can. Give it a try and see how it works for you. I know it may seem unfathomable to enjoy foods without sugar in it but it is very possible. If you told me a year ago I would love steel cut oats, plain, with only blueberries added to it, I would've thought you were crazy. I wish you the best and hope you find success.

yarwell

the human body is designed to eat carbs

and yet you can live without them. Interesting.

SanteMulberry

I don't do very low carb (although I used to sometimes) because I have negative health effects from it (muscle problems, low mineral levels, etc.). I have found a LOWER carb plan to be more effective for me. I just keep my carb intake to 100-150 grams (with the higher level on exercise days, and the lower level on rest days). It usually averages 115-125 grams of carb per day. BUT, and here are some important parameters I think. I restrict grain pretty much--just often a bit of oatmeal to get me started in the a.m. I eat no wheat at all and no sugary foods (no cupcakes for me--ever). I didn't set out to eliminate these foods as much as I set out to maximize nutrition. Starch and sugar don't do anything except provide calories---which is fine if you are expending a lot of calories, but you really just cannot afford them if you are sedentary--which I was at the beginning of my health quest (arthritis). After I lost about 40 pounds and could face myself in a bathing suit, I started doing water exercise in a class designed for people with musculo-skeletal problems. That did a LOT to help with the aches and pains. Contrary to popular belief, exercise makes aches and pains better (but it is advisable to do low impact exercise--swimming is fantastic).

After a while, you don't even crave desserts and such anymore. Contrary to what you might be told here, I'm quite okay without these "foods" for the rest of my life. It has been four years since I had a piece of cake or pie or wheat bread. They don't even tempt me anymore because my health has improved so much without them, that I would never willingly go back to eating them. I eat vegetables and have learned to love them--it helps if you cut out the wheat and sugar. That was somewhat of a transformation for me to realize one day that I actually liked vegetables now whereas before, I barely tolerated them. And fruit is a pleasure for me now whereas before, it had to be absolutely perfect for me to give it a try at all--and even then, I ate it because it was "good for me" not because I really liked it. Breaking the starch and sugar addiction, is difficult for the first few months but then it becomes easy and a whole new world of tastes opens up in the vegetables and fruits you consume as a result of eliminating starch and sugar. It really is a matter of what you want more--the temporary satisfaction of starch and sugar--or the much more permanent and, to my mind, better health that follows eliminating them.

Tom_on_keto

the human body is designed to eat carbs

There is no such thing as an essential carbohydrate. Your body can produce all of the glucose it requires without eating any carbs. Just because the body burns them first doesn't make them the preferred fuel source. It is not very efficient for the main source of energy to be fast burning.

mike_ny

I try to stay under 100 grams a day. That allows enough for veggies and a small serving of bread or pasta at one meal If I hadn't already used it of sweet potatoes or something else.

canary_girl

I eat low carb. No bread, sugar, rice, pasta, etc. I do eat a lot of veggies, even those that are higher carb (carrots, beets) but stay away from starches. I limit fruit to higher fiber choices, so berries, apples, pears.

Changing the way I eat was the single BEST thing I ever did. I don't crave sweet things or carb-y things. I used to LOVE sushi. Now I can't stomach one piece, too much rice. Cutting sugar was hard, for like three days. The first day was easy, anyone can go a day without sweet things. Day two was HARD, I had to keep myself occupied to try to keep my mind off all the sweet things in the house. Day three was tough, too, but easier. After that I was fine. I'll have something sweet every once in a while, but mostly it just tastes sickly sweet and I can barely eat a bite or two.

I lost 50 lbs eating this way, no vigorous exercise besides a mile walk around my neighborhood pushing a stroller, in 6 months!

A good resource for me was "The F Factor". It's a book that supports a high fiber/high protein diet. It changed my life. Right now I aim for at least 40 grams of fiber every day.

deansdad101

the human body is designed to eat carbs

There is no such thing as an essential carbohydrate. Your body can produce all of the glucose it requires without eating any carbs. Just because the body burns them first doesn't make them the preferred fuel source. It is not very efficient for the main source of energy to be fast burning.

Not to mention the fact that Mr_Knight's misstatement makes no sense from a logical point of view (but hey, since when are "logic" and "science" any part of most MFP "experts" dogma?).

It is true that our species "adapts" over time (a very looong time) to many conditions, including diet.

It's also true that if he's using "designed" to imply genetic adaptation to carb ingestion he's simply out to (a high carb) lunch.

For most of the first 99.5% of our existence (up to and including the early 20th century), carbs were a VERY minor percentage (if at all) of the diet for the vast majority of humanity.

Indeed up until the mid 1900's, carb restriction was the "generally accepted wisdom" of not only our Grandmothers but the medical community as well for weight reduction and diabetes prevention and control.

50 years, does not a genetic "adaptation", make.

Science actually DOES matter.

fastfoodietofitcutie

The point of this post and every other post on this website is that you need to try it out and see what works for you. Personally, I don't want to live without carbs but I only lose weight when I reduce them so I shoot for around 150g a day. My recommendation is to track your carb intake and keep reducing it until you find a point where you are feeling better but not restricting yourself to the point it's driving you crazy. After all, this is supposed to be a lifestyle change so taking drastic measures (unless your life depends on it) will just make you give up sooner.

eric_sg61

the human body is designed to eat carbs

There is no such thing as an essential carbohydrate. Your body can produce all of the glucose it requires without eating any carbs. Just because the body burns them first doesn't make them the preferred fuel source. It is not very efficient for the main source of energy to be fast burning.

Not to mention the fact that Mr_Knight's misstatement makes no sense from a logical point of view (but hey, since when are "logic" and "science" any part of most MFP "experts" dogma?).

It is true that our species "adapts" over time (a very looong time) to many conditions, including diet.

It's also true that if he's using "designed" to imply genetic adaptation to carb ingestion he's simply out to (a high carb) lunch.

For most of the first 99.5% of our existence (up to and including the early 20th century), carbs were a VERY minor percentage (if at all) of the diet for the vast majority of humanity.

Indeed up until the mid 1900's, carb restriction was the "generally accepted wisdom" of not only our Grandmothers but the medical community as well for weight reduction and diabetes prevention and control.

50 years, does not a genetic "adaptation", make.

Science actually DOES matter.

Nope
Paleo man ate fruit, honey, vegetables, grains and tubers they also got about 35% of their energy intake from carbs.
http://www.gregdavis.ca/share/paleo-articles/academic/The Ancestral Human Diet by S. Boyd Eaton.pdf

http://www.precisionnutrition.com/paleo-diet
FTA:
"Proponents of the Paleo diet argue that our ancestors’ diets could not have included a lot of grains, legumes, or dairy foods. And they contend that the past 10,000 years of agriculture isn’t enough time to adapt to these “new” foods.

This argument is compelling but doesn’t stand up to scrutiny.

To begin with, recent studies in the Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences, using more advanced analytical methods, have discovered that ancient humans may have begun eating grasses and cereals before the Paleolithic era even began — up to three or even four million years ago!

Further research has revealed granules of grains and cereal grasses on stone stools starting at least 105,000 years ago.

Meanwhile, grain granules on grinding tools from all over the world suggest that Paleolithic humans made a widespread practice of turning grains into flour as long as 30,000 years ago.

In other words, the idea that Paleolithic humans never ate grains and cereals appears to be a bit of an exaggeration."

Carnivor0us

I agree that paleolithic man likely ate seeds and grains. Evolutionarily speaking, even 100k years doesn't seem to be enough time to physiologically adapt to it but whatever. I'm not a paleo person.