Nutritional Facts for Low Carb Dieters?

♥_Ellybean_♥

So I am setting my goals up for the new year, as I want to be ready to go.. I have PCOS which requires a Low Carb Diet to maintain my body and to help the symptoms of PCOS... So I am going off the calorie intake that MFP gave me for losing 2lbs per week

Calorie Intake 1463

My question is if I only want to eat 5% of carbs (73 carbs) ... how do I know what percentage of Fat, Protein and Fiber should come from my calories? Since I will not be eating carbs, my energy is going to be supplied from the fat that I take in...

Hopefully this makes sense and someone can help me out...


Here is my stats:

Calories Intake: 1463
Carb Intake: 73 (5%) - Really should be lower, but I am starting here

Fat Intake - ?
Protein Intake - ?
Fiber Intake - ?

♥_Ellybean_♥

I also just noticed that MFP shows 25% for 88carbs... I'm not sure how they get this figure, as I thought it was based off the number of calories you ate... I'm so confused.

TrainingWithTonya

Okay, first of all, as a nutritionist I don't recommend going that low in carbs. I too have had PCOS and do 70% carbs with no problems. In fact, when I eat right and exercise, the PCOS symptoms go away completely.

That being said, 5% of 1463 is 73 calories from carbs, not grams. Once you have taken the percentage of carbs or protein you want to eat, then you divide them by 4 to get the grams. For fat, you divide by 9. And if you really wanted to you could also figure alcohol by dividing by 7.

Now, as for what I would recommend, I'd suggest 45% carbohydrates, 30% protein, and 25% fat. This way you aren't risking other health issues by going to high in fat (heart problems) or protein (kidney issues if you are prone to them). Here are the figures for that breakdown so you can see the math.

1463 calories x 0.45 = 658.35 calories from carbs / 4 = 164.6 grams of carbs per day

1463 calories x 0.3 = 438.9 calories from protein / 4 = 109.7 grams of protein per day

1463 calories x 0.25 = 365.75 calories from fat / 9 = 40.6 grams of fat per day

cmriverside

cool ^^ what she said.

____________________________

♥_Ellybean_♥

Thanks for the input... my doctor told me I should not be eating them at all... he recommended started out by eating under 100g of carbs... so that is why I am trying to figure this out.


So I guess what I am asking, based off 100g of Carbs, how much Fat should I be taking in compared to protein and fiber? What is the percentage I sould be taking in based off a low carb diet like this?

Sigra

I'm not sure why your doctor told you that you shouldn't eat carbs, they are important. The only reason people go on low-carb diets is because carbs store a lot of water, and water = weight. However carbs ARE good for you, but with everything it's good in portions. If you decide to go on a low-carb diet it's possible you will gain a lot of the weight back when you decide to start eating carbs again.

Low Calorie meals are important because they are what your body runs off of. And if you don't have calories to burn, then your body has to start eating the fat. All in all, whatever works best for you is the direction you should go! But keep in mind carbs = store water! Water = important for your body!

TrainingWithTonya

Thanks for the input... my doctor told me I should not be eating them at all... he recommended started out by eating under 100g of carbs... so that is why I am trying to figure this out.


So I guess what I am asking, based off 100g of Carbs, how much Fat should I be taking in compared to protein and fiber? What is the percentage I sould be taking in based off a low carb diet like this?

First of all, doctors aren't nutritionists or dietitians. They are only required to take one, very minimal, nutrition class in school and have no clue about nutritional science at all. I don't perform surgery because I'm not trained in it, so they need to stay out of my realm of expertise too. Okay Rant Over. LOL

Second of all, the minimum requirement in grams of carbohydrate is 130 grams per day. This is to meet the basic needs of the brain and blood cell production for the average adult. Even diabetics are told not to go below 130 grams per day. If you want to start that low, we can work backwards with the numbers to get your percentages.

Starting with 130 grams, multiply by 4 to get calories from carbs, which is 520 calories from carbohydrates. Divide the 520 by the 1463 and you get 35.5% carbs. That is below the minimum recommendations from the Institute of Medicine, which gives a range of 45-65% carbohydrates, BTW, so if you feel sluggish, have memory issues, acetone breath, yellow sweat, etc. those are signs that you are going too low in carbs and too high in protein for your body.

Subtracting that 35.5% from a total of 100% gives you 64.5% left to play with. The IOM Recommendations for Protein are 10-35% and for fat are 15-30% (This is a new recommendation. Older publications may list 20-35% for fat.), so you can pick anything in those ranges. I recommend going lower in fat if possible, so I'd choose the highest amount of protein possible instead of fat. So, 35% protein would be 1463 x 0.35 = 512.05 calories from protein / 4 = 128 grams of protein.

Subtracting that 35% from the 64.5% after taking out carbs gives you 29.5% from fat. 1463 x 0.295 = 431.59 calories from fat / 9 = 48 grams of fat.

Fiber is a form of carbohydrate, so it isn't figured separately percentage wise. It is included in the % of carbs. The recommendation is 14 grams of fiber per 1000 calories consumed. So, 1463 / 1000 = 1.463 x 14 = 20 grams of fiber.

♥_Ellybean_♥

I'm not sure why your doctor told you that you shouldn't eat carbs, they are important. The only reason people go on low-carb diets is because carbs store a lot of water, and water = weight. However carbs ARE good for you, but with everything it's good in portions. If you decide to go on a low-carb diet it's possible you will gain a lot of the weight back when you decide to start eating carbs again.

Low Calorie meals are important because they are what your body runs off of. And if you don't have calories to burn, then your body has to start eating the fat. All in all, whatever works best for you is the direction you should go! But keep in mind carbs = store water! Water = important for your body!

Sigra I have PCOS and Insulin Resistance, which means my body has an imbalance and does not properly get rid of the sugar in my body... so I need to stay away from carbs as much as possible.

♥_Ellybean_♥

Thanks for the input... my doctor told me I should not be eating them at all... he recommended started out by eating under 100g of carbs... so that is why I am trying to figure this out.


So I guess what I am asking, based off 100g of Carbs, how much Fat should I be taking in compared to protein and fiber? What is the percentage I sould be taking in based off a low carb diet like this?

First of all, doctors aren't nutritionists or dietitians. They are only required to take one, very minimal, nutrition class in school and have no clue about nutritional science at all. I don't perform surgery because I'm not trained in it, so they need to stay out of my realm of expertise too. Okay Rant Over. LOL

Second of all, the minimum requirement in grams of carbohydrate is 130 grams per day. This is to meet the basic needs of the brain and blood cell production for the average adult. Even diabetics are told not to go below 130 grams per day. If you want to start that low, we can work backwards with the numbers to get your percentages.

Starting with 130 grams, multiply by 4 to get calories from carbs, which is 520 calories from carbohydrates. Divide the 520 by the 1463 and you get 35.5% carbs. That is below the minimum recommendations from the Institute of Medicine, which gives a range of 45-65% carbohydrates, BTW, so if you feel sluggish, have memory issues, acetone breath, yellow sweat, etc. those are signs that you are going too low in carbs and too high in protein for your body.

Subtracting that 35.5% from a total of 100% gives you 64.5% left to play with. The IOM Recommendations for Protein are 10-35% and for fat are 15-30% (This is a new recommendation. Older publications may list 20-35% for fat.), so you can pick anything in those ranges. I recommend going lower in fat if possible, so I'd choose the highest amount of protein possible instead of fat. So, 35% protein would be 1463 x 0.35 = 512.05 calories from protein / 4 = 128 grams of protein.

Subtracting that 35% from the 64.5% after taking out carbs gives you 29.5% from fat. 1463 x 0.295 = 431.59 calories from fat / 9 = 48 grams of fat.

Fiber is a form of carbohydrate, so it isn't figured separately percentage wise. It is included in the % of carbs. The recommendation is 14 grams of fiber per 1000 calories consumed. So, 1463 / 1000 = 1.463 x 14 = 20 grams of fiber.

Thank You... I will use these number and figure it from 100 grams of carbs. I have lost 30lbs from eating low carb, and I just never counted calories/fat etc. because I was just concentrating on carbs. Dr. Atkins actually reccommends as low as 20 carbs per day, and many of my fellow cysters have found a huge amount of weight loss on his eating lifestyle. (and kept it off)

With that said, I am aware if you eat a large amount of carbs after cutting them out you will gain. However as someone who has PCOS and INsulin Resistance, as well who has been trying to conceive for the last 3.5 years, I am at my witts end. Thus is why I asked my doctor what I should be doing.... he gave me two options 1) get lapband surgery 2) cut the carbs..I chose th later.

anovasjo

Low Carb diets:
http://www.quackwatch.com/06ResearchProjects/lcd.html

TrainingWithTonya

Thanks for the input... my doctor told me I should not be eating them at all... he recommended started out by eating under 100g of carbs... so that is why I am trying to figure this out.


So I guess what I am asking, based off 100g of Carbs, how much Fat should I be taking in compared to protein and fiber? What is the percentage I sould be taking in based off a low carb diet like this?

First of all, doctors aren't nutritionists or dietitians. They are only required to take one, very minimal, nutrition class in school and have no clue about nutritional science at all. I don't perform surgery because I'm not trained in it, so they need to stay out of my realm of expertise too. Okay Rant Over. LOL

Second of all, the minimum requirement in grams of carbohydrate is 130 grams per day. This is to meet the basic needs of the brain and blood cell production for the average adult. Even diabetics are told not to go below 130 grams per day. If you want to start that low, we can work backwards with the numbers to get your percentages.

Starting with 130 grams, multiply by 4 to get calories from carbs, which is 520 calories from carbohydrates. Divide the 520 by the 1463 and you get 35.5% carbs. That is below the minimum recommendations from the Institute of Medicine, which gives a range of 45-65% carbohydrates, BTW, so if you feel sluggish, have memory issues, acetone breath, yellow sweat, etc. those are signs that you are going too low in carbs and too high in protein for your body.

Subtracting that 35.5% from a total of 100% gives you 64.5% left to play with. The IOM Recommendations for Protein are 10-35% and for fat are 15-30% (This is a new recommendation. Older publications may list 20-35% for fat.), so you can pick anything in those ranges. I recommend going lower in fat if possible, so I'd choose the highest amount of protein possible instead of fat. So, 35% protein would be 1463 x 0.35 = 512.05 calories from protein / 4 = 128 grams of protein.

Subtracting that 35% from the 64.5% after taking out carbs gives you 29.5% from fat. 1463 x 0.295 = 431.59 calories from fat / 9 = 48 grams of fat.

Fiber is a form of carbohydrate, so it isn't figured separately percentage wise. It is included in the % of carbs. The recommendation is 14 grams of fiber per 1000 calories consumed. So, 1463 / 1000 = 1.463 x 14 = 20 grams of fiber.

Thank You... I will use these number and figure it from 100 grams of carbs. I have lost 30lbs from eating low carb, and I just never counted calories/fat etc. because I was just concentrating on carbs. Dr. Atkins actually reccommends as low as 20 carbs per day, and many of my fellow cysters have found a huge amount of weight loss on his eating lifestyle. (and kept it off)

With that said, I am aware if you eat a large amount of carbs after cutting them out you will gain. However as someone who has PCOS and INsulin Resistance, as well who has been trying to conceive for the last 3.5 years, I am at my witts end. Thus is why I asked my doctor what I should be doing.... he gave me two options 1) get lapband surgery 2) cut the carbs..I chose th later.

With insulin resistance, you need to exercise, exercise, and then exercise some more!!! Exercise lowers blood glucose levels, so it will help burn calories plus help with your insulin resistance. Exercise isn't a cure, but it can be as helpful as medication.

SHBoss1673

Thank You... I will use these number and figure it from 100 grams of carbs. I have lost 30lbs from eating low carb, and I just never counted calories/fat etc. because I was just concentrating on carbs. Dr. Atkins actually reccommends as low as 20 carbs per day, and many of my fellow cysters have found a huge amount of weight loss on his eating lifestyle. (and kept it off)

With that said, I am aware if you eat a large amount of carbs after cutting them out you will gain. However as someone who has PCOS and INsulin Resistance, as well who has been trying to conceive for the last 3.5 years, I am at my witts end. Thus is why I asked my doctor what I should be doing.... he gave me two options 1) get lapband surgery 2) cut the carbs..I chose th later.

I'm actually shocked that he gave you those two options. It angers me. Unfortunately, this is more and more common these days. Many doctors don't even give the "eat a healthy balanced diet and exercise vigorously 4 to 6 times a week for at least 30 minutes" option any more. I mean, between choosing a surgery (and any surgery has inherent risk factors that can make it dangerous, especially to someone who has other complications such as obesity and PCOS), and a low carb program which is designed NOT as a way to lose weight, but as a lifestyle for those who choose to do so after copious research and eyes wide open about the inherent risks associated with it (did he mention to you that low carb is harder on both your liver and kidneys, and that hydration levels must be monitored very closely?).

Sorry, I just become supremely frustrated at these things.

TrainingWithTonya

Just some light reading on Dr. Atkins:

"On April 17, 2003, Dr. Atkins died. He was 72 years old. The media reported that he had suffered a fall and subsequent head injuries while walking to his office in New York City. Several months earlier, he had been hospitalized for a heart problem, which his public relations representatives asserted was not related in any way to artery blockage. But the question remains unanswered whether Atkins' heart problem was in fact a heart attack related to severe hardening of the arteries. Did Atkins fall cause the head injuries that killed him, or was the fall really caused by a massive stroke or other event? Did Atkins' injuries reveal that he never even sought to brace himself at all to break his fall?

On February 10, 2004, The Wall Street Journal published excerpts from the New York City Medical Examiner's report on Atkins' death. The report indicated that Atkins weighed 258 pounds at his death, making the diet-guru clinically obese, and that he had a history of heart disease, congestive heart failure, and hypertension. Was this caused by his diet? Did the Atkins' diet kill Atkins?

Atkins' widow, Veronica Atkins, told the Journal she was outraged that the report had been made public, but even she conceded in a statement issued the same day the story came out that her husband "did have some progression of his coronary artery disease in the last three years of his life, including some new blockage of a secondary artery."

At his death, the family apparently objected to and stopped any autopsy, so city medical examiners conducted only "an external exam" and a review of Atkins' hospital records, according to the Journal . But in these records there clearly is plenty of information about Atkins' heart disease and hypertension, information that the public never knew of until this week and much of which is still unknown.

In her statement, Veronica Atkins asserts that her husband's personal medical history "is private and of no concern or relevance to the media or general public." She also calls the individuals who made public her husband's records "unethical." But couldn't the same be said of the Atkins' empire? Given the widespread popularity of the Atkins diet, Americans have a right to know all the facts. The Atkins' books and food sales continue to rise, exceeding $100 million dollars last year, and are expected to be at least double that amount this year. Given the nationwide popularity of the Atkins diet, Americans have a right to know all the facts about Dr. Atkins and the Atkins diet. They are entitled to know if this diet harmed the arteries of its most ardent proponent who followed the diet long-term rather than just for a short 6 or 12 months like the people in the recent Atkins' diet studies. They are entitled to know because their own arteries are at stake. The whole debate, in short, is not just about diets. It's about the health and well-being of the nation."

The full article can be seen here: http://www.pritikin.com/eperspective/specialissues/pritikinatkins/

Yes, you might lose "weight" on Atkins plan, but it's not the healthiest way to eat. With other health issues already showing themselves and the big link between insulin resistance, diabetes, and heart disease, I'd worry more about health then weight. Healthy eating will improve your hormone levels and help you improve your chances of conception too.

♥_Ellybean_♥

SHBoss & Training with Tony


I exercise 4-6 times week now... and see a trainer 3x's a week... My doctor actually recommeneded since I was TTC that I cut my sessions down to 30 minutes to prevent over stress on my body. I was doing about 60-90 minute sessions. Even though I was doing all this work, it was not paying off for me... I was working out like a mad man, counting calories, watching carbs and I was not losing... I lost 30lbs, of which 21 of that was in the first 6 weeks... since April I lost only 9lbs... that's working out 3xs a week with a trainer and 60-90 minute sessions on my own, in July I joined MFP and started watching my calories... and followed their recommendation of carbs and gained 9lbs!!!... then September I went back to low carb and lost that 9lbs... As I said it's not that the effort is not there... My husband is also doing this with me he has lost 110lbs .. and he does the same amount of exercise I do, and eats the same way as I do... So please don't think it's not the effort or the lack of exercise!

As for my doctor, the first doctor told me to lose weight, she said to go home and come back ina year... and when I asked her what she recommends she said that only thing for girls like me is "lapband sugery" and so I went home, lost 30lbs doing the above and went back in October... saw a different doctor in the same office and he also told me to lose 10% more (I already lost 10%) .. and when I asked him how, he told me one of two options "Surgery" or "Cutting out Carbs" ...

♥_Ellybean_♥

Training with Tony: That's great, I can find a bad article about anything and everything... I can also find an article which proves it can be done without risks of any of the things mentioned in that article and with the weigh staying off... What we read on the interenet is only a portion of the truth. Ofcourse they are going to attack DR. Atkins and try to say that his death was related to his diet or way of life... because many people disagreed with his way of thinking.. at the same time.. you can find that there are people that will agree with his way of thinking... it's just an aritcle..


I did not post to receive a lecture of weather or not to do a low carb diet, I am not cutting out carbs all together, or for that matter considering using Dr Atkins way of life. I have read Dr. Atkins book as well as "Idiots Guide to Low Glycemic Diets" and many books on Insulin Resistance, PCOS and PCOS & Infertility and know what will work for my body... I know how foods are processed into the body and what foods trigger hunger, as well as cravings and overeating. For me those foods are carbs, so to reduce my intake will be beneficial to ME.

I also feel very offended that you assume I do not exercise or am not getting enough exercise.... As I have posted before I exercise on a regular basis (as i enjoy it) and work out with a trainer 3xs a week. I enjoy doing this even though in the 8 months i've been with a trainer I've only lost 10lbs because I was following what THEY though was good for MY body. Let's face it, only MY body knows what is best for MY body.

So although I appreciate your effort to convince me that the way I am chosing to do this is not the "proper" way, I know that this is what works for me, my doctor agrees this is what works for me, and we are the ones putting the effort in to getting pregnant.

TrainingWithTonya

SHBoss & Training with Tony


I exercise 4-6 times week now... and see a trainer 3x's a week... My doctor actually recommeneded since I was TTC that I cut my sessions down to 30 minutes to prevent over stress on my body. I was doing about 60-90 minute sessions. Even though I was doing all this work, it was not paying off for me... I was working out like a mad man, counting calories, watching carbs and I was not losing... I lost 30lbs, of which 21 of that was in the first 6 weeks... since April I lost only 9lbs... that's working out 3xs a week with a trainer and 60-90 minute sessions on my own, in July I joined MFP and started watching my calories... and followed their recommendation of carbs and gained 9lbs!!!... then September I went back to low carb and lost that 9lbs... As I said it's not that the effort is not there... My husband is also doing this with me he has lost 110lbs .. and he does the same amount of exercise I do, and eats the same way as I do... So please don't think it's not the effort or the lack of exercise!

As for my doctor, the first doctor told me to lose weight, she said to go home and come back ina year... and when I asked her what she recommends she said that only thing for girls like me is "lapband sugery" and so I went home, lost 30lbs doing the above and went back in October... saw a different doctor in the same office and he also told me to lose 10% more (I already lost 10%) .. and when I asked him how, he told me one of two options "Surgery" or "Cutting out Carbs" ...

Sorry, I don't mean to sound like I don't think you are working at this. I'm sure you are. But not all trainers are created equal. Unless your trainer has taken additional courses to know how to work with special populations, they may not be giving you the right workouts for your needs. Metabolic disorders such as insulin resistance need special consideration when working out and planning meals that your trainer may not be capable of giving you. I've spent almost 15 years in the fitness industry with various certifications and continuing education classes and am still learning new things in my university program. If your trainer isn't continuing that education, he or she can't help you to get the right program for you. I would be glad to do an overhaul of your program to help you, but I can't look at your journals to be able to see how much you are eating, what you are eating, or how you are exercising. Even if I could see your journal, they aren't set up to show me the sequence of your exercise so that I can see if there are ways to tweak it to get more out of your exercise. If you want to, we can work through the private message system here and review a typical week for you, listing everything you do, what order you do it in, etc. and get your records from your trainer of your results from the standard exercise tests so I can design you a plan. While I do make a living doing this, I don't charge anyone on MFP for anything. I am here to help others and use this as my way of donating my time and giving back to the community at large. So, reviewing everything in detail won't cost you anything but time.

♥_Ellybean_♥

Tony:

Thank you and I would not mind sharing and learning from you. I did take it as you thought I was not working on it or hard enough. :noway: .. I'v ebeen working on it like you can't believe. :huh:

I did take the last two week off to refocus, and re adjust my goals... so possibly this is a good time to learn from you and you can help me set up the right steps to take from here on out. I have not tracked my journal on MFP in awhile.. (before Christmas)..

My trainer did not keep records of my progress... which is why I switched gyms two weeks ago! ... I had nothing to show of what I worked on or how I could improve and this made me very upset... Also I went through 5 trainers at the gym because I was not happy with the results I was getting.

Here is what I can tell you about my program:

I eat about 1400 calories, 100-125 net carbs.. ( I did not worry about anything else)

I exercised Monday, Tuesday, Thursday running intervals - was up to running 1.5 minutes walking 2 minutes for 25 minutes, and then 30 minutes on the elliptical, crossramp or bike

Monday, Wednesday, Friday - I would work out with my training, dong a cardio.strength training routine (kind of like curves) - then 25 minutes on the treadmill doing about 2.5-3.0 walking

Saturday I would go in for 1 hour usually would do the elliptical or crossramp for that hour

Ruffly I would burn about 750 calories on a non-training day and around 1000 on a training day. I do wear a HRM to keep track of my calories burn.

Feel free to message me, and I do apologize about my tone in my last message. Thank You.

NoAdditives

Not to be rude, but if you are significantly overweight, you shouldn't be trying to get pregnant. There are serious risks to you and your baby, especially if you are already insulin resistant.

cmriverside

MsMonny

Hi

Hope you don't mind me replying as I may seem a bit out of my league.

I have just started reading a book called "Sweet Poison - why sugar makes us fat". Yes the title is a bit OTT! But, I regress, the start of the book and most of the way through it acually explains how our body works when we eat food. The glucose it makes from the food, the insulin also the diets from 100 years ago and why they thought they worked right through to the Atkins Diet and beyond. This is what I have learnt so far (actually last night!)....

Our bodies are equipt to deal with starvation or a lack of glucose and it will use our fat and muscles as energy by converting it into Ketones (an energy source). This is all very well for the odd time we are not able to find food for a little while BUT it is not a long term solution. People on low/no carb diets become ketonic and they eventually die from complications. As the ketones in the blood build up in time, the acidity of the blood increases significantly, since uric acid produciton is a by product of the process that produces ketones. This eventually leads to widespread tissue damage (especially eyesight and kidney damage).

I am not all the way through the book (chapter 5 from 14) but the chapters I have read are amazing and enlightening.

Get it and read it if you can. It will open your eyes and maybe make up your mind to which way you want to go with your diet. I know refined sugar is my poison - I am addicted to it. I am hoping that this book plus his "The Sweet Poison Quit Plan" will get me on track and totally get me off the poison.

In the last chapter I read last night it said "A raft of recent studies have clearly shown that high levels of fatty acids in the arteries block the action of Leptin* in much the same way that they inhibit insulin. Insulin Resistance means that your immediate appetite control is impaired and will eventually lead to type II diabetes. Leptin Resistance means that your body loses the ability to tell when it has had enough to eat ove the medium to long term."

* Leptin is produced by the fat cells to help tell us we are full. The release of insulin into the blood stream after we eat is swiftly eliminated by the various digestive processes, so the hormone Leptin performs a longer term appetite control.

The author is going to go into more depth on type II diabetes further in the book.

I hope this has helped just a little.

P.S. If any of this is incorrect, please let me know as I am only going by what I am reading and only like the truth, not some made up BS!!

cheers
Monika

SHBoss1673

SHBoss & Training with Tony


I exercise 4-6 times week now... and see a trainer 3x's a week... My doctor actually recommeneded since I was TTC that I cut my sessions down to 30 minutes to prevent over stress on my body. I was doing about 60-90 minute sessions. Even though I was doing all this work, it was not paying off for me... I was working out like a mad man, counting calories, watching carbs and I was not losing... I lost 30lbs, of which 21 of that was in the first 6 weeks... since April I lost only 9lbs... that's working out 3xs a week with a trainer and 60-90 minute sessions on my own, in July I joined MFP and started watching my calories... and followed their recommendation of carbs and gained 9lbs!!!... then September I went back to low carb and lost that 9lbs... As I said it's not that the effort is not there... My husband is also doing this with me he has lost 110lbs .. and he does the same amount of exercise I do, and eats the same way as I do... So please don't think it's not the effort or the lack of exercise!

As for my doctor, the first doctor told me to lose weight, she said to go home and come back ina year... and when I asked her what she recommends she said that only thing for girls like me is "lapband sugery" and so I went home, lost 30lbs doing the above and went back in October... saw a different doctor in the same office and he also told me to lose 10% more (I already lost 10%) .. and when I asked him how, he told me one of two options "Surgery" or "Cutting out Carbs" ...

I hope you didn't get that I thought you weren't working at it. I wasn't trying to imply that at all. I'm just bothered by the state of our doctors these days. Everything seems to be a pill or surgery with them these days. To honest all I'd say is that IMHO Tonya know's her stuff, so when it comes to her offering up anything for you, it's probably good advice. Other than that, I'll stay out of the way as I do NOT have experience helping women with PCOS and wouldn't presume to offer any PCOS tailored advice to you. I will wish you the best of luck though, I can tell this has been really rough on you, and hope it finally clicks for you soon.
Keep at it lady, you'll get there.

TrainingWithTonya

Tony:

Thank you and I would not mind sharing and learning from you. I did take it as you thought I was not working on it or hard enough. :noway: .. I'v ebeen working on it like you can't believe. :huh:

I did take the last two week off to refocus, and re adjust my goals... so possibly this is a good time to learn from you and you can help me set up the right steps to take from here on out. I have not tracked my journal on MFP in awhile.. (before Christmas)..

My trainer did not keep records of my progress... which is why I switched gyms two weeks ago! ... I had nothing to show of what I worked on or how I could improve and this made me very upset... Also I went through 5 trainers at the gym because I was not happy with the results I was getting.

Here is what I can tell you about my program:

I eat about 1400 calories, 100-125 net carbs.. ( I did not worry about anything else)

I exercised Monday, Tuesday, Thursday running intervals - was up to running 1.5 minutes walking 2 minutes for 25 minutes, and then 30 minutes on the elliptical, crossramp or bike

Monday, Wednesday, Friday - I would work out with my training, dong a cardio.strength training routine (kind of like curves) - then 25 minutes on the treadmill doing about 2.5-3.0 walking

Saturday I would go in for 1 hour usually would do the elliptical or crossramp for that hour

Ruffly I would burn about 750 calories on a non-training day and around 1000 on a training day. I do wear a HRM to keep track of my calories burn.

Feel free to message me, and I do apologize about my tone in my last message. Thank You.

First of all, no problem on tone. I don't take anything personally on the boards. If I did, I'd be mad at everyone for calling me Tony because my screen name is cut off on the side of the message boards. LOL Besides, I know that we can't get our emotions to come across in print. I know a lot of people take me as a B**** on boards because I don't know how to give virtual hugs when needed. Oh, lets be honest, I speak my mind way too often and some people take me as a B**** in person too. LOL

As for the article I posted, I chose it because it specifically referred to the medical examiners report on Dr. Atkins death and questioned if his diet had anything to do with his health issues and also mentioned that he is the only person of record that had been on the diet long term, whereas the studies often quoted are usually only people who are on the plan 6-12 months. As much as I would love to have research on people who have been on the Atkins plan since he first came up with it in the 70's it just doesn't exist. So, my professors in teaching nutrition point us to articles like that one because it shows the only documented case of someone who could stick with the plan long term. Short term studies are great, and have shown promising results. But it's those long term effects that worry me and apparently the entire kinesiology and nutrition departments at Valdosta State University because they are the ones giving me this information. LOL I wasn't trying to say don't do low carb, but just trying to point out that there are risks involved with it that a lot of people don't know about.

If you remember, I was the one who said to start with the lowest end of the recommended carb range and even gave you numbers for the lowest recommended intake of carbs per day of 130 grams. I know that there are some people who respond better to a lower carb plan. That recommendation is total carbs, BTW, not net. When they figure net carbs, they subtract fiber because it is virtually indigestible so you aren't really getting any calories from it. At the level you are taking in now, you are probably at that recommendation already once you add the fiber back in.

How is your fat intake? I know you've not been tracking the past couple of weeks, but before that what % of fat were you getting? How much of it was saturated? Having the high end of the range of fat isn't necessarily bad as long as it is mostly poly and mono unsaturated fats instead of saturated fats. The unsaturated, specifically the Omegas, are actually heart healthy and help prevent some of the risks of having a higher fat diet.

As for your workouts, the one thing I'm seeing that is a big red flag for me is the lack of weight training. Circuit training is good, but heavy weight training is much better for improving insulin resistance and other hormonal issues. Yes, I said Heavy Weight Training. As heavy as you can go and only get like 6-8 reps before you feel like you are maxed out. This promotes muscle growth, which promotes more glucose uptake into the muscles, which helps prevent too high of blood glucose from insulin resistance. When you do heavy weight training, you may not see the scale weight change much at first because you will be storing more glycogen and water in the muscles and increasing muscle mass while you are losing fat, but the big change will come as the muscle burns more calories at rest and your shape changes.

Did the new trainer/gym do any kind of assessments? Like Body Fat %? Cardiovascular tests? Muscular strength or endurance tests? If so, that is what your program should be based on for setting your weights and training zones for your heart rate. If not, they are just giving you a basic routine that isn't personalized at all, so I'd quit wasting the money on a trainer. You've been doing these workouts for a while now, so you know how to do the exercises on your own.

Also, I'm wondering about your calorie goal. Don't get me wrong, MFP is great for the masses at figuring calorie needs. But it's not perfect, especially when figuring the deficit strictly on 500 calories per pound you want to lose a week. Too much of a deficit can be just as bad as too little of a deficit for some people. With my nutrition certification and again with my nutrition classes at university, I've been taught a more specific formula to determine calorie needs. I'd like to put your information through it and see just how close MFP has you. You may want to change you calorie intake too depending on what we find.

I'm going to go over to your profile and send you a friend request and then send you a PM with a bunch of questions. Sorry if I duplicate them here.

cRiSCeL021

I love this post!

TrainingWithTonya

Hi

Hope you don't mind me replying as I may seem a bit out of my league.

I have just started reading a book called "Sweet Poison - why sugar makes us fat". Yes the title is a bit OTT! But, I regress, the start of the book and most of the way through it acually explains how our body works when we eat food. The glucose it makes from the food, the insulin also the diets from 100 years ago and why they thought they worked right through to the Atkins Diet and beyond. This is what I have learnt so far (actually last night!)....

Our bodies are equipt to deal with starvation or a lack of glucose and it will use our fat and muscles as energy by converting it into Ketones (an energy source). This is all very well for the odd time we are not able to find food for a little while BUT it is not a long term solution. People on low/no carb diets become ketonic and they eventually die from complications. As the ketones in the blood build up in time, the acidity of the blood increases significantly, since uric acid produciton is a by product of the process that produces ketones. This eventually leads to widespread tissue damage (especially eyesight and kidney damage).

I am not all the way through the book (chapter 5 from 14) but the chapters I have read are amazing and enlightening.

Get it and read it if you can. It will open your eyes and maybe make up your mind to which way you want to go with your diet. I know refined sugar is my poison - I am addicted to it. I am hoping that this book plus his "The Sweet Poison Quit Plan" will get me on track and totally get me off the poison.

In the last chapter I read last night it said "A raft of recent studies have clearly shown that high levels of fatty acids in the arteries block the action of Leptin* in much the same way that they inhibit insulin. Insulin Resistance means that your immediate appetite control is impaired and will eventually lead to type II diabetes. Leptin Resistance means that your body loses the ability to tell when it has had enough to eat ove the medium to long term."

* Leptin is produced by the fat cells to help tell us we are full. The release of insulin into the blood stream after we eat is swiftly eliminated by the various digestive processes, so the hormone Leptin performs a longer term appetite control.

The author is going to go into more depth on type II diabetes further in the book.

I hope this has helped just a little.

P.S. If any of this is incorrect, please let me know as I am only going by what I am reading and only like the truth, not some made up BS!!

cheers
Monika

Yep, seems pretty accurate to me from what I've been taught. I have one nutrition professor who will especially like knowing that the leptin information is finally being let out. There have actually been studies on rats about how leptin levels effect weight gain and loss. So far they haven't come up with anything we can specifically do to use leptin to help us yet, but it is pretty interesting stuff, at least for nerds like me.

spritie

As for the article I posted, I chose it because it specifically referred to the medical examiners report on Dr. Atkins death and questioned if his diet had anything to do with his health issues and also mentioned that he is the only person of record that had been on the diet long term, whereas the studies often quoted are usually only people who are on the plan 6-12 months. As much as I would love to have research on people who have been on the Atkins plan since he first came up with it in the 70's it just doesn't exist. So, my professors in teaching nutrition point us to articles like that one because it shows the only documented case of someone who could stick with the plan long term. Short term studies are great, and have shown promising results. But it's those long term effects that worry me and apparently the entire kinesiology and nutrition departments at Valdosta State University because they are the ones giving me this information. LOL I wasn't trying to say don't do low carb, but just trying to point out that there are risks involved with it that a lot of people don't know about.

I have to say its been great seeing so many knowledgable people sharing there knowledge here sounds like Tonya really knows her stuff. I just wanted to add in that the whole lack of chronic Atkins study is a worldwide issue in nutritional departments and the same information has been given to us in Australia regarding this diet and the research avaliable.

also the leptin thing in a non acaedemic book is good to know.

♥_Ellybean_♥

Not to be rude, but if you are significantly overweight, you shouldn't be trying to get pregnant. There are serious risks to you and your baby, especially if you are already insulin resistant.

In the risk of not sounding rude, if you smoke the risks are up, if you have even as much as 20lbs extra (which from your ticvker you do) your at risk, if you smile wrong, if you don't eat well enough, if you look the wrong way YOUR AT RISK! ....

I may be overweight but I do not have Diabetes, Blood Pressure Issue, or any other issue which effect the risk of my child. PCOS is not something that I have control over or ever have had control over, it is not an illeness in which I could of prevented either!

There are MANY women who are WELL over my weight out there that have children, have had them, and their children Are just fine. So before you go telling someone they should NOT have children because of their weight, you should get your fact straight.

Although tht risk of a miscarriage is higher in someone who is overweight (even as little as 20-30lbs) .... there is managed care (which I am under) that can help reduce the risk of miscarriage... and with proper diet (which if you read you would see I was following and exercise) would also REDUCE this risk.

kk1987

Hi Elly,

I just wanted to offer some encouragement to you. I am actually shocked that your doctor recommended a low carb diet for PCOS. That is, in a GOOD way! Carbs have been shown to have inflammatory effects in many people, and oftentimes the the cysts reduce or disappear once this way of eating is introduced for a period of time due to the reduction of inflammation. Please consider a few of the following links for your journey towards fertility.

http://www.marksdailyapple.com/primal-nutrition-and-fertility/

Also, I am just curious towards the nutritionist. The OP said that she has insulin resistance. Therefore, her body overproduces insulin and the result is storing too much glucose that has been floating around in the bloodstream. If she should exercise to get rid of the excess, wouldn't it make sense to not add any if there is already excess?

Elly, good luck on your journey towards pregnancy and a healthy lifestyle. Find what works for you, keep doing your research, and look at everything with a critical eye. You might just be shocked what you find.

TrainingWithTonya

Also, I am just curious towards the nutritionist. The OP said that she has insulin resistance. Therefore, her body overproduces insulin and the result is storing too much glucose that has been floating around in the bloodstream. If she should exercise to get rid of the excess, wouldn't it make sense to not add any if there is already excess?

Good question. Insulin resistance means that the receptor sites for insulin that allow glucose to move from the blood into the muscles to be stored as glycogen or utilized as fuel to produce ATP aren't working properly to get the glucose out of the blood. So, the excess glucose is floating around in the blood stream, which is dangerous and over time will build up to be classified as diabetes. Exercise can act kind of like insulin in that it causes the glucose in the blood to be moved into the muscles via a different channel, going around those insulin receptors that aren't working properly. So, exercise will lower blood sugar and provide the glucose/glycogen to the muscles. When this happens, there have been issues with rebound hypoglycemia, where the blood sugar drops too much from the sudden ability to transport glucose out of the blood. So, you want to make sure you have some carbs in the diet to prevent the rebound hypoglycemia. The key is to make sure you are consuming low glycemic carbs so that they don't spike blood sugar and elevate insulin levels too because that isn't beneficial. High glycemic simple sugars should be avoided in insulin resistance, but low glycemic complex carbs provide the necessary glucose/glycogen without the same issues.

kk1987

I have heard of glycogen replenishment because of the depletion after a hard workout, but I generally thought recovery meals were for very difficult, high intensity work outs. However, it makes sense now so that the OP would not need a bolus of sugar to stabilize. However, by lowering sugar and carb intake, she could technically get to a point where it has stabilized and her receptors are again functioning properly, right? I just don't see shooting up with insulin as the answer, because it seems to fuel the fire.

wtbyerdocmd

SHBoss & Training with Tony


I exercise 4-6 times week now... and see a trainer 3x's a week... My doctor actually recommeneded since I was TTC that I cut my sessions down to 30 minutes to prevent over stress on my body. I was doing about 60-90 minute sessions. Even though I was doing all this work, it was not paying off for me... I was working out like a mad man, counting calories, watching carbs and I was not losing... I lost 30lbs, of which 21 of that was in the first 6 weeks... since April I lost only 9lbs... that's working out 3xs a week with a trainer and 60-90 minute sessions on my own, in July I joined MFP and started watching my calories... and followed their recommendation of carbs and gained 9lbs!!!... then September I went back to low carb and lost that 9lbs... As I said it's not that the effort is not there... My husband is also doing this with me he has lost 110lbs .. and he does the same amount of exercise I do, and eats the same way as I do... So please don't think it's not the effort or the lack of exercise!

As for my doctor, the first doctor told me to lose weight, she said to go home and come back ina year... and when I asked her what she recommends she said that only thing for girls like me is "lapband sugery" and so I went home, lost 30lbs doing the above and went back in October... saw a different doctor in the same office and he also told me to lose 10% more (I already lost 10%) .. and when I asked him how, he told me one of two options "Surgery" or "Cutting out Carbs" ...

wtbyerdocmd

SHBoss & Training with Tony


I exercise 4-6 times week now... and see a trainer 3x's a week... My doctor actually recommeneded since I was TTC that I cut my sessions down to 30 minutes to prevent over stress on my body. I was doing about 60-90 minute sessions. Even though I was doing all this work, it was not paying off for me... I was working out like a mad man, counting calories, watching carbs and I was not losing... I lost 30lbs, of which 21 of that was in the first 6 weeks... since April I lost only 9lbs... that's working out 3xs a week with a trainer and 60-90 minute sessions on my own, in July I joined MFP and started watching my calories... and followed their recommendation of carbs and gained 9lbs!!!... then September I went back to low carb and lost that 9lbs... As I said it's not that the effort is not there... My husband is also doing this with me he has lost 110lbs .. and he does the same amount of exercise I do, and eats the same way as I do... So please don't think it's not the effort or the lack of exercise!

As for my doctor, the first doctor told me to lose weight, she said to go home and come back ina year... and when I asked her what she recommends she said that only thing for girls like me is "lapband sugery" and so I went home, lost 30lbs doing the above and went back in October... saw a different doctor in the same office and he also told me to lose 10% more (I already lost 10%) .. and when I asked him how, he told me one of two options "Surgery" or "Cutting out Carbs" ...