HCG Diet
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Ok, I just wanted to chime in here. I don't want to offend anyone, but there were a few things said that kinda bothered me.
First, I've never heard of you fat cells storing vitamins along with the fat. I think that is a bit of misinfirmation being handed around. If anyone can find anything to substantiate this I'd be very interested.
Second, while the offer to produce peer reviewed studies supporting HGC's roll in the diet non have been. After looking for myself I found one that claimed a statistically significant difference in weight loss, body composition of weight loss, and fewer feelung of hunger when compaired to a placebo group. The base group was 600 or so people and they were split into 3 groups - 2 on different dosages of HGC and one on sugar pills. All groups followed the same diet. At the end of the 5 week study those on HGC lost a "statistically significant" .02 kilograms more than placebo, and a "statistically significant" .0005% more body fat. Personally I take from this study that "statistically significant" means "actually irrelevant." If anyone can offer a different study with better results, please do.
And lastly there may be no side effects from the HGC itself, but there are common and frequent side effects that are often severe, of a 500 calorie a day diet and lack of nutrition. Including hair loss, and organ failure, the later leading to death.
In severely obese people 500 calorie a day diets are sometimes prescribed because the risks of being so over weight out way the risks of the diet. These people are monitored closely and given vitamin, mineral, and proteib supplements to further decrease their risks. If you are not severely obese and under a doctors care, please consider a safer approach to your weight loss.
Statistically significant, by definition, means exactly that...it made a difference. Where did you get the study from? Where was it conducted? Was muscle mass loss determined as well? What were the results of that particular bit of information? This is the point that so many have a hard time comprehending: You are not reducing your body to 500 calories a day; the calories are being released into the blood stream through the metabolization of fat caused by the hormone. Thats why so many of these clinicals are nonsense, because while the results may of been comparable weight loss wise the amount of muscle atrophy in each study would have been significantly different.
The study can be found here: http://www.indexmedico.com/english/obesity/hcg.htm
The conclusion was:
"Discussion and conclusions
The hCG protocol for the treatment of obesity has been loved and hated for the last 40 years. In 1974, the FDA banned the use of hCG in the US based on a series of studies maintaining that weight loss was similar both in the Placebo and hCG-treated groups. Our study corroborates those previous findings."
They do go on to say that they have some curious results and further study needed to be done on a few issues. Bottom line is HCG beat the placebo group by such a small margin that it could be explained by someone sneezing before they got on the scale and losing an extra ounce of snot.
Oh and I was wrong about the size of the study group it was only 60 people, not 600, which makes the margin of error greater.0 -
Ok, I just wanted to chime in here. I don't want to offend anyone, but there were a few things said that kinda bothered me.
First, I've never heard of you fat cells storing vitamins along with the fat. I think that is a bit of misinfirmation being handed around. If anyone can find anything to substantiate this I'd be very interested.
Second, while the offer to produce peer reviewed studies supporting HGC's roll in the diet non have been. After looking for myself I found one that claimed a statistically significant difference in weight loss, body composition of weight loss, and fewer feelung of hunger when compaired to a placebo group. The base group was 600 or so people and they were split into 3 groups - 2 on different dosages of HGC and one on sugar pills. All groups followed the same diet. At the end of the 5 week study those on HGC lost a "statistically significant" .02 kilograms more than placebo, and a "statistically significant" .0005% more body fat. Personally I take from this study that "statistically significant" means "actually irrelevant." If anyone can offer a different study with better results, please do.
And lastly there may be no side effects from the HGC itself, but there are common and frequent side effects that are often severe, of a 500 calorie a day diet and lack of nutrition. Including hair loss, and organ failure, the later leading to death.
In severely obese people 500 calorie a day diets are sometimes prescribed because the risks of being so over weight out way the risks of the diet. These people are monitored closely and given vitamin, mineral, and proteib supplements to further decrease their risks. If you are not severely obese and under a doctors care, please consider a safer approach to your weight loss.
Here is part of an article from a university that speaks specifically about fat soluable nutrients being stored in fat cells. This is not misinformation in the least.
http://www.chemistry.wustl.edu/~edudev/LabTutorials/Vitamins/vitamins.htmlNutrients Must Be Soluble
In order to use the nutrients that we take in when we eat, we must first break the food down into its nutritive components. These components are then either absorbed by the body, or they pass through the intestinal tract and are removed from the body in the feces. The nutrients that are absorbed pass through the lining of the intestinal tract into the blood. The blood carries these nutrients to the sites where they will be reassembled and used by the body. If the nutrients are not used immediately, they will either be stored for later use, or excreted in the urine. Each of these fates of the absorbed nutrients (immediate use, storage, or excretion via urine) requires that the nutrients be soluble. To be transported from the stomach to other parts of the body, the nutrients must either be soluble in water (the main component of blood plasma), or be solubilized by some other particles (e.g., proteins) that are carried in the blood. Nutrients that are stored in the body are typically stored in fat cells, so they must be soluble in fat. And of course, to be excreted via the urine, a nutrient must be water-soluble. Hence, understanding the solubility of nutrients in the different substances of the body is very important for understanding how they can be used or processed in the body.
Scientists have developed several ways to discuss the important concepts of solubility. For salts (ionic solids) that dissociate into ions in water, such as the compounds containing the dietary minerals, a solubility product (Ksp) is typically given. The solubility product is the equilibrium constant for the dissociation reaction of the compound into ions in aqueous solution. This quantity is useful, for instance, in determining which compound containing a given mineral is more soluble, and hence would be better absorbed as a dietary supplement (e.g., calcium carbonate vs. calcium sulfate). The solubility of organic molecules, such as the vitamins, is quantified using a different scale known as Hidebrand solubility parameters (which will not be discussed in this tutorial). Organic molecules may be soluble in water or in lipids, depending on the functional groups on the molecule. A vitamin's solubility in water or in lipids determines where it can be used, and whether it will be stored in fat cells or excreted from the body if it is not needed for immediate use.0 -
Just a reminder folks - please keep the discussion respectful at all times. If you disagree with someone, you must do so respectfully. As per our forum rules, personal attacks and insults will not be tolerated at any time, under any circumstance. Members who insult or attack other members can have their posting privileges suspended or can even be banned from the site. So please make sure to adhere to the forum rules at all times.0
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Just a reminder folks - please keep the discussion respectful at all times. If you disagree with someone, you must do so respectfully. As per our forum rules, personal attacks and insults will not be tolerated at any time, under any circumstance. Members who insult or attack other members can have their posting privileges suspended or can even be banned from the site. So please make sure to adhere to the forum rules at all times.
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That is so myopic of you!
I admit it, I don't know what myopic means.0 -
Just a reminder folks - please keep the discussion respectful at all times. If you disagree with someone, you must do so respectfully. As per our forum rules, personal attacks and insults will not be tolerated at any time, under any circumstance. Members who insult or attack other members can have their posting privileges suspended or can even be banned from the site. So please make sure to adhere to the forum rules at all times.
That is so myopic of you!
I admit it, I don't know what myopic means.
You just need to break it down. MYO is the Metropolitan Youth Orchestra and Pic means picture. So you are saying he is a picture of a youth orchestra from some metropolitan area.0 -
What is the cost comparison between the injections and the drops?0
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What is the cost comparison between the injections and the drops?
I went with the injections, that was the 80's and it was costly, My sister has recently lost weight on the diet and used the drops, only about $15 to $30 a bottle. They work just as well I think.0 -
Both widely vary,
If you are talking Homepathic Drops the price can range for anywhere between $20-$60 for a single cycle. I paid $130 for a high quality drop the first time around, enough for 90 days, and it worked well. The injections can be comparably priced if you know what to buy and how to buy them. I bought my last batch of HCG from a Canadian pharmacy, 5 vials of 5000IU HCG, which is enough for 3-4 rounds, for $80.00 plus shipping. You will still need your supplies...alcohol swabs, insulin needles...which are on amazon pretty cheaply, the mixing vials and the bacteriostatic water is a little more difficult to find. I had to buy it in a case. All in all when I finished buying all the supplies and HCG I spent $201 and that is enough for several rounds...so it can be done cheaply if you are comfortable with self administration, if not then go to a clinic under the supervision of a physician, but that will cost you much more as your insurance company wont cover it. However, if you are a male in your 30's and up there is a good chance you can get your Doctor to prescribe HCG for testosterone production, which your insurance would cover. You can also buy the injectable HCG and mix it for sublingual use (drops under the tongue) if you dont like needles.What is the cost comparison between the injections and the drops?0 -
I am doing the injections and I got my prescription from my doctor. She wrote prescription for the HCG, mixing kit and insulin needles. It cost me $124.56 for enough HCG for 2 rounds. She also wrote me 2 refills.
My insurance didn't cover it, so I paid for it out of pocket because for women it is used as a fertility treatment and my insurance did not cover fertility treatments at all.0 -
Thats not a bad price. Definately reasonable, maybe just a bit more expensive then ordering everything seperately on your own. You will always pay a price for conveinance and paying one sum for everything you need is definately better than paying three different places, even if I did get a pretty good deal. That is actually a bit cheaper I think than some of the better priced reputable online places.I am doing the injections and I got my prescription from my doctor. She wrote prescription for the HCG, mixing kit and insulin needles. It cost me $124.56 for enough HCG for 2 rounds. She also wrote me 2 refills.
My insurance didn't cover it, so I paid for it out of pocket because for women it is used as a fertility treatment and my insurance did not cover fertility treatments at all.0 -
I'm so glad to see so many people on here who are trying or have tried this, and have positive remarks. The negative criticism is going to happen regardless because people don't understand how it works (never bothered to read it). I have to admit that I gave a co-worker the same "that's not safe" speech when I first heard about it, but after she had me actually read it, and then I did A LOT of research myself, I was ready to try it too. Another co-worker and I are on this together now, and though it's not easy, we're both doing great. We are only day 10, and she has lost 9 lbs, I have lost 8 (well, probably 1.5 since I gained day 2 before started the VLCD - and my ticker is off because of my previous weight from before this diet). I did have a bit of a standstill, where I went from losing 1 1/2, then two days of 2 1/2, I had two days where I lost absolutely nothing. I assume I was retaining water, because I wasn't going to bathroom every hour like I had been from all the water.
But this morning, back to losing a pound. I'm very happy with this so far. Granted, I have a ways to go, but as long as I can see the results, I can still with the low calories. And for those that are concerned we're in starvation mode, I can tell you that now that some of the fat is melting off my arms, I can actually see the biceps that I had previously worked so hard on before. The fat is going away, and the muscle tone is starting to show through. YAY!!! Thank you to all who are here for support. To all who are not, well.... 0 -
GREAT!!! Im glad it is working for you, as it has for thousands of others. I wouldnt get too concerned when your weight loss flat lines, this often happens to me, regardless of the method I am using to lose weight, I may plateau for several days and then all of a sudden several pounds have dropped off the scale. I think the protocol has you check your weight every day to keep you motivated because more often than not you will see weight loss every single day, or at least maintain. I am less concerned with my weight loss/gain (more often loss) per day then I am my net results at the end of the week. If at the end of the week I have not lost between 5-7 pounds I know that I need to adjust something, be it diet (either adding or reducing calories or simply changing food types), exercise (may need to slightly increase exercise to give the metabolism a kick in the rear), water intake, or even SLEEP...yes recent research is speculating that insufficient sleep may be a large contributor to obesity and inability to lose weight. Interestingly enough, the percentage of increased obseity cases over the past 10 years almost perfectly correlates with those who have severe sleep apnea, actually not that big of a break through being that sleep apnea is often a symptom that results FROM obesity. Either way it is what you call a "self licking ice cream cone" one symptom feeds the cause and the cause feeds the sympton. As users, and dieters, we need to truly try to work on whole body improvement in order to maximize weight loss and the change of body structure. This means getting 8 hours of sleep, and at the very least 6 hours of sleep. Sleep has long been a scientific mystery, and even today science has not fully explained why we need to sleep or how our bodies would react to multiple days of total sleep deprivation (many live with insomnia, but even insomniacs dose off into a nappy daze at times)...in fact in an experiment conducted with lab rats who were kept from sleeping through the use of electrical stimulation died after 14 consecutive days without sleep. While I am getting off on a bit of a tangent here, I hope I have highlighted the importance of sleep and just how much it effects your total well being and your bodies ability to regulate multiple functions. Think of it this way....If you own a car and there is a flat tire, the car may go somewhere but it is going to result in some serious damage, if there is no gas it doesnt move, if it is too weighed down with cargo it will burn an extreme amount of gas, and also experience severe wear and tear on many of its mechanical systems, if the surface is rusty it will operate but eventually that rust will make its way into the under body and cause serious damage, if a car is run too long it will over heat and go into total failure: what I am getting at here is that all of our systems must be properly functioning to maximize the efficiency and effectiveness of any other system...follow me? WHOLE BODY HEALTHI'm so glad to see so many people on here who are trying or have tried this, and have positive remarks. The negative criticism is going to happen regardless because people don't understand how it works (never bothered to read it). I have to admit that I gave a co-worker the same "that's not safe" speech when I first heard about it, but after she had me actually read it, and then I did A LOT of research myself, I was ready to try it too. Another co-worker and I are on this together now, and though it's not easy, we're both doing great. We are only day 10, and she has lost 9 lbs, I have lost 8 (well, probably 1.5 since I gained day 2 before started the VLCD - and my ticker is off because of my previous weight from before this diet). I did have a bit of a standstill, where I went from losing 1 1/2, then two days of 2 1/2, I had two days where I lost absolutely nothing. I assume I was retaining water, because I wasn't going to bathroom every hour like I had been from all the water. But this morning, back to losing a pound. I'm very happy with this so far. Granted, I have a ways to go, but as long as I can see the results, I can still with the low calories. And for those that are concerned we're in starvation mode, I can tell you that now that some of the fat is melting off my arms, I can actually see the biceps that I had previously worked so hard on before. The fat is going away, and the muscle tone is starting to show through. YAY!!! Thank you to all who are here for support. To all who are not, well....0
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People seem to have done alot of research on this topic, and many seem to have come away with the belief that hcg causes your body to release stored fat to be used for energy. Perhaps I'm just horrible at searhing the internet, but I can't find any study or report or opinion offered by some one not trying to sell me hcg that says that hcg has been scientifically proven to do anything in regards to weight loss. I've asked for links and links and other information have been promised, but so far no one has been able to say go here and read this study to see proof of hcg at work. If anyone can, please help me to understand where this information is comming from.0
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Ok what I have provided below are multiple links, which includes two double blind studies, very well done, by medical doctors in support of HCG for weightloss, I included one double blind study that doesnt believe it had any effect and I included this so people can see the difference in the thorughness of the reports. I also included multiple links to what should be unbiased articles and review, even some medical journal reviews. In these reviews you will see that doctors do not see eye to eye on HCG, and where one doctor disagrees with its use for weight loss, another one would prescribe it off use for HCG. Also, regardless of all the provided information below, I dont think you can dismiss the 10s of thousands of individuals who have documented their success through the use of HCG. There are simple 1000 positive experiences to every 1 bad experience, of which I have yet to find....so here ya go ....enjoy.
http://www.ajcn.org/content/26/2/211.full.pdf
THIS IS THE DOUBLE BLIND STUDY BY TWO MEDICAL DOCTORS
http://hcgobesity.org/research/Double_Blind_Study_hCG.pdf
DOUBLE BLIND STUDY WITH PHOTO DOCUMENTATION
http://guidetoplasticsurgery.com/what-is-the-controversy-surrounding-hcg/
http://www.stltoday.com/lifestyles/health-med-fit/fitness/article_1afd3eb8-1a85-508f-8634-eb96435599db.html
http://www.yumasun.com/articles/diet-67829-hcg-barnett.html
http://www.nevadaappeal.com/article/20100306/NEWS/100309682
http://www.lvrj.com/health/safe-effective-weight-loss-116643674.html
http://www.aestheticmedicinenews.com/follow-jeffs-hcg-weight-loss.htm
http://www.wpbf.com/health/25149581/detail.html
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1237915/pdf/westjmed00268-0035.pdf ---Double blind study that says HCG is not effective...notice that the study does not take the actual protocol into as nearly as much consideration as the studies above. Additionally, notice that the study is published on a .gov website, as I have stated before the FDA would not support HCG for weightloss because the big drug companies dont want it to be approved, there is no money to be made on a hormone.People seem to have done alot of research on this topic, and many seem to have come away with the belief that hcg causes your body to release stored fat to be used for energy. Perhaps I'm just horrible at searhing the internet, but I can't find any study or report or opinion offered by some one not trying to sell me hcg that says that hcg has been scientifically proven to do anything in regards to weight loss. I've asked for links and links and other information have been promised, but so far no one has been able to say go here and read this study to see proof of hcg at work. If anyone can, please help me to understand where this information is comming from.0 -
http://www.ajcn.org/content/26/2/211.full.pdf
THIS IS THE DOUBLE BLIND STUDY BY TWO MEDICAL DOCTORS
OK a double blind study but it's kinda hard for me to accept. One of the people conducting the study owns operates an HCG clinic. And they had a tiny base group of 40 with nearly half the placebo patients not completing the study, and 1/3 of the total participants dropping out by the end .http://hcgobesity.org/research/Double_Blind_Study_hCG.pdf
DOUBLE BLIND STUDY WITH PHOTO DOCUMENTATION
The one study that sems to be legit, and have some positive results about Hcg.
This is an interview with a doctor that runs an HCG clinic. Really? He's gonna say I sell sugar water for a small fortune?
And even he says - The only question left is how exactly the HCG injections work. Dr. Moulavi admits that there is a chance that HCG patients lose more weight simply because their commitment level is higher than dieters who have not invested in the plan.
An anecdotal story in the St Louis Today that in no way can attribute their weight loss to the HCG as opposed to the VLCD. This article is more about the couple than the diet.
And the only real reference to any type of study in this article -
"Recently, the FDA said that while the hCG chemical isn't harmful, the sale of it amounts to economic fraud.
And in 2009, a federal judge ordered Trudeau, author of the book that jump-started the recent trend, to pay a fine of more than $37 million to the Federal Trade Commission for violating a 2004 order, because he had misrepresented the content of his Weight Loss Cure book.
Dr. George Griffing, an endocrinologist and professor of internal medicine at St. Louis University Medical School, points to a 1995 meta analysis that looked at 24 studies on the efficacy of hCG as a diet drug. Several of them compared hCG to placebos, and just one of the 24 showed any benefit of hCG."
An article from the Yuma Sun in Yuma Arizona. Again anecdotal story, no evidence. And from the article, this is written on every vial of HCG
“HCG has not been demonstrated to be effective adjunctive therapy in the treatment of obesity. There is no substantial evidence that it increases weight loss beyond that resulting from caloric restriction, that it causes a more attractive or ‘normal' distribution of fat, or that it decreases the hunger and discomfort associated with calorie-restricted diets.”
So some legislators decided to allow it to be sold in Nevada, provided it gets final approval from another board. Again not evidence that HGC does anything.
From the article -
"According to the Mayo Clinic, studies have found HCG is no more effective in reducing weight than placebos. What loses weight is exercise and eating healthier foods, the clinic says."
Again, all 3 no evidence and just anecdotes. One from the Las Vegas Review Journal, one a blog from a doctor who's trying the diet, and one from a T.V. station ABC 25 in West Palm Beach.http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1237915/pdf/westjmed00268-0035.pdf ---Double blind study that says HCG is not effective...notice that the study does not take the actual protocol into as nearly as much consideration as the studies above. Additionally, notice that the study is published on a .gov website, as I have stated before the FDA would not support HCG for weightloss because the big drug companies dont want it to be approved, there is no money to be made on a hormone.
You linked a summary of the study, not the actual study itself. Of course they don't go into massive detail about what the patients were allowed to eat. It's 3 pages long and the diet portion of the other one was a full page by itself. It does say however that -
"Instructions regarding diet, cosmetics and handling of patients
at return visits were identical to those described
in the study reported previously by Asher and
Harper."
Which is the first study you posted. So in summary the patients were on the same diet, weighed and measured the same on return visits, told about cosmetics, and everything just like your study, but with different results.There are simple 1000 positive experiences to every 1 bad experience
This is simply not true. The problem is that every one who stops the diet because they can't seem to focus their mind, gets headaches, or is ravenously hungry all the time, is labeled a failure, and you ignore their bad experience.regardless of all the provided information below, I dont think you can dismiss the 10s of thousands of individuals who have documented their success through the use of HCG
Look, all I'm saying is everything claimed to be done by the HCG is also done by a VLCD. When you don't eat enough your body has to mobilize your fat stores to make up the difference. It has to. There is no magic. If it doesn't you die. And I know you say that the percentage of loss is more from fat when on the protocol, but the evidence just isn't there to make that claim.
VLCDs can be effective for severely obese people because the risks of the diet, out weigh the risks of being severely over weight. But they should only be done under a doctors care.
What upsets me is that while you claim the FDA is in the pocket of the big drug companies you're more than willing to listen to the snake oil salesman who tells you the government doesn't want you to know about this but 1 tbls of this a day cures bad breath, toe jam, and cancer, provided you follow the protocol of hourly teeth brushing, twice daily toe cleaning, and no screenings for life.
I think I've had my say here so I'll leave you to it. I may be wrong but I seriously doubt that you or anyone already convinced of the power will be persuaded by anything I have to say.
Thank you for the links, and the mostly civil discourse.
*edited to fix all those dang quotes0 -
Actually Im not more willing to listen to the "snake and oil salesmen" Im more willing to listen to the thousands of people who have had success with this....including myself. It really wouldnt matter what evidence I provided, you would find fault with it, additionally just because the doctor the medical doctor, owns a clinic, that does not automatically dismiss the study. Thats like saying an oncologist cant conduct a study on cancer medication because he is an oncologist. The articles were merely to show that Doctors disagree, not to provide any type of "proof" thats what the studies were for. Nobody is going to invest money to research the claims, because there is not a significant amount of money to be made by the big research firms. And is there really any question that the FDA is not in the pocket of the drug companies? Really? Thats like saying that democrats arent in the pockets of Union bosses, and Republicans arent in the pockets of big business.http://www.ajcn.org/content/26/2/211.full.pdf
THIS IS THE DOUBLE BLIND STUDY BY TWO MEDICAL DOCTORS
OK a double blind study but it's kinda hard for me to accept. One of the people conducting the study owns operates an HCG clinic. And they had a tiny base group of 40 with nearly half the placebo patients not completing the study, and 1/3 of the total participants dropping out by the end .http://hcgobesity.org/research/Double_Blind_Study_hCG.pdf
DOUBLE BLIND STUDY WITH PHOTO DOCUMENTATION
The one study that sems to be legit, and have some positive results about Hcg.
This is an interview with a doctor that runs an HCG clinic. Really? He's gonna say I sell sugar water for a small fortune?
And even he says - The only question left is how exactly the HCG injections work. Dr. Moulavi admits that there is a chance that HCG patients lose more weight simply because their commitment level is higher than dieters who have not invested in the plan.
An anecdotal story in the St Louis Today that in no way can attribute their weight loss to the HCG as opposed to the VLCD. This article is more about the couple than the diet.
And the only real reference to any type of study in this article -
"Recently, the FDA said that while the hCG chemical isn't harmful, the sale of it amounts to economic fraud.
And in 2009, a federal judge ordered Trudeau, author of the book that jump-started the recent trend, to pay a fine of more than $37 million to the Federal Trade Commission for violating a 2004 order, because he had misrepresented the content of his Weight Loss Cure book.
Dr. George Griffing, an endocrinologist and professor of internal medicine at St. Louis University Medical School, points to a 1995 meta analysis that looked at 24 studies on the efficacy of hCG as a diet drug. Several of them compared hCG to placebos, and just one of the 24 showed any benefit of hCG."
An article from the Yuma Sun in Yuma Arizona. Again anecdotal story, no evidence. And from the article, this is written on every vial of HCG
“HCG has not been demonstrated to be effective adjunctive therapy in the treatment of obesity. There is no substantial evidence that it increases weight loss beyond that resulting from caloric restriction, that it causes a more attractive or ‘normal' distribution of fat, or that it decreases the hunger and discomfort associated with calorie-restricted diets.”
So some legislators decided to allow it to be sold in Nevada, provided it gets final approval from another board. Again not evidence that HGC does anything.
From the article -
"According to the Mayo Clinic, studies have found HCG is no more effective in reducing weight than placebos. What loses weight is exercise and eating healthier foods, the clinic says."
Again, all 3 no evidence and just anecdotes. One from the Las Vegas Review Journal, one a blog from a doctor who's trying the diet, and one from a T.V. station ABC 25 in West Palm Beach.http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1237915/pdf/westjmed00268-0035.pdf ---Double blind study that says HCG is not effective...notice that the study does not take the actual protocol into as nearly as much consideration as the studies above. Additionally, notice that the study is published on a .gov website, as I have stated before the FDA would not support HCG for weightloss because the big drug companies dont want it to be approved, there is no money to be made on a hormone.
You linked a summary of the study, not the actual study itself. Of course they don't go into massive detail about what the patients were allowed to eat. It's 3 pages long and the diet portion of the other one was a full page by itself. It does say however that -
"Instructions regarding diet, cosmetics and handling of patients
at return visits were identical to those described
in the study reported previously by Asher and
Harper."
Which is the first study you posted. So in summary the patients were on the same diet, weighed and measured the same on return visits, told about cosmetics, and everything just like your study, but with different results.There are simple 1000 positive experiences to every 1 bad experience
This is simply not true. The problem is that every one who stops the diet because they can't seem to focus their mind, gets headaches, or is ravenously hungry all the time, is labeled a failure, and you ignore their bad experience.regardless of all the provided information below, I dont think you can dismiss the 10s of thousands of individuals who have documented their success through the use of HCG
Look, all I'm saying is everything claimed to be done by the HCG is also done by a VLCD. When you don't eat enough your body has to mobilize your fat stores to make up the difference. It has to. There is no magic. If it doesn't you die. And I know you say that the percentage of loss is more from fat when on the protocol, but the evidence just isn't there to make that claim.
VLCDs can be effective for severely obese people because the risks of the diet, out weigh the risks of being severely over weight. But they should only be done under a doctors care.
What upsets me is that while you claim the FDA is in the pocket of the big drug companies you're more than willing to listen to the snake oil salesman who tells you the government doesn't want you to know about this but 1 tbls of this a day cures bad breath, toe jam, and cancer, provided you follow the protocol of hourly teeth brushing, twice daily toe cleaning, and no screenings for life.
I think I've had my say here so I'll leave you to it. I may be wrong but I seriously doubt that you or anyone already convinced of the power will be persuaded by anything I have to say.
Thank you for the links, and the mostly civil discourse.
*edited to fix all those dang quotes0 -
Interesting reading from both points of view. Thank you.
I have just started this diet and reading all the information on the web is confusing me.
Can/should you take a multivitamin? Potassium, magnesium, biotin, B12?
Some sites say supplement, others say take nothing.
Some say exercise, others say you don't have too.
Some say certain shakes are OK, and "miracle noodles" ??
I want this to work but the food/ supplement advice is so varied.........help, anyone???0 -
Its varied because so many people have had success doing so many different things. I would read "Pounds & Inches" just google it, and then try and stick to the diet prescribed based on the book, at least for the first cycle. The book even talks about vitamin supplementation, and if I recall correctly it says it is unnecessary. So try the protocol to a T, if thats not working for you then you can adjust from there...things like miracle noodles are just foods to curb a carb craving...which personally I have never experienced after the first couple of days of HCG. B12 is the solution most drops are diluted in when taken orally.Interesting reading from both points of view. Thank you.
I have just started this diet and reading all the information on the web is confusing me.
Can/should you take a multivitamin? Potassium, magnesium, biotin, B12?
Some sites say supplement, others say take nothing.
Some say exercise, others say you don't have too.
Some say certain shakes are OK, and "miracle noodles" ??
I want this to work but the food/ supplement advice is so varied.........help, anyone???0 -
yes I agree with you bakinggranny. I went on Nutra System several years back & I was losing really fast but I started losing my hair by the handfuls too , just as fast. These quick fix , very low calorie diets just are not the healthy choices a person should be taking. You are playing with your health for sure!!0
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Interesting reading from both points of view. Thank you.
I have just started this diet and reading all the information on the web is confusing me.
Can/should you take a multivitamin? Potassium, magnesium, biotin, B12?
Some sites say supplement, others say take nothing.
Some say exercise, others say you don't have too.
Some say certain shakes are OK, and "miracle noodles" ??
I want this to work but the food/ supplement advice is so varied.........help, anyone???
I take B12 supplement even when I am not doing the protocol. I am lacking the enzyme that pulls the Vitamin B12 out of my protein sources during the digestive process so I was taking B12 shots once a week at my doctors office, but since I have started taking it sublingually.
B12 either has to be done in shot form or sublingually (under the tongue) - it is not absorbed by swallowing it.0
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