Serious question for everyone

SHBoss1673

OK, if someone posts something on the boards (and remember, these are publicly accessible boards people, not private thoughts like a Facebook board), do you think it's ethically and morally ok to post a reply that questions their post, or even point out the error if you feel it's wrong? I'm not talking about someone asking a question, I'm pretty sure someone asking a question is looking for responses, but what about for someone who's just stating something that they feel is right or correct?

Is it our place to post something correcting them?

Lets assume that any response given is a well thought out reply and it's courteous and not disrespectful for the purposes of this discussion. I.E. the only perceived negative would be that the reply is basically pointing out an error in some way.

Also, if something is a fact that someone posts and it's incorrect, that's really not what I mean. I mean if someone asks what a gallon of water weighs and someone else posts the wrong weight, of course you would correct that. I'm talking more about things in regards to a diet plan or an exercise regimen (or what ever).

sillygoose1977

Of course. I think that posting something automatically gives anyone the right to state disagreement. It's what you risk by stating your opinions to mostly total strangers.

Healthyby30

I think it's ok to correct someone when you know/think it's wrong. I wouldn't want to read something and believe it to be true, apply it to myself or see others do it only to find out it's false!

eatingmysandshoe

I agree, as you said, it's a public forum. Plus, if you leave their incorrect post unchallenged, then others may believe it and base their actions on it in error.

laurenk182004

Of course it's ok I would want to corrected politely if I was dead wrong about something and was putting it out there for other people to see. I think if you know something is wrong you should correct it before other people take the wrong information and use it themselves.

SMarie10

I feel the whole point of a threaded discussion is to allow varied viewpoints - and to point out inaccuracies or outright errors. Some of the ideas / views are definitely opinion, not fact - so those you have to read and judge on your own beliefs. I've kind of figured out already who I trust and who's on the fringe. You have corrected me before, and I did not resent it at all - I kind of appreciated it...

SHBoss1673

ah ha! But that's what I mean, what if some people believe it to be true, but others don't and it wasn't a question asked, just a statement given.

like for instance, if someone were to say something like (and I'm going to be absolutely ridiculous here so I don't step on any toes)

"I use twinkies for half my calories because I have the room in my diet, and it's only about calories in vs calories out for me."

Now most of us are pretty sure that eating half your diet in twinkies is not a very good diet plan, but then again, the statement above wasn't telling anyone else what to eat, nor was it asking if this is ok. Is it really our place to say, "Um, eating half your diet in twinkies is not good."

this is an outrageous example to prove a point, many times the posts are much more subtle than this. But still they are in error. Is it right to point this out? I don't know, I go back and forth all the time about this in my head. I want to help, but they weren't asking for help, and is it really any of my business?

crystal_sapphire

i think so. Thereare tactful ways of doing it which sometimes I'll admit I'm not always showing.

scagneti

I think it's fine to say something, and to avoid stepping on toes, you could say IMO or something along those lines.

There is a danger to leaving something that you know to be blatantly incorrect "out there" without challenging it. And frankly, those are the people who are giving advice to new people (that you know to be wrong) and then start threads wondering why they plateau eating half their calories in Twinkies.

SHBoss1673

I think it's fine to say something, and to avoid stepping on toes, you could say IMO or something along those lines.

There is a danger to leaving something that you know to be blatantly incorrect "out there" without challenging it. And frankly, those are the people who are giving advice to new people (that you know to be wrong) and then start threads wondering why they plateau eating half their calories in Twinkies.

I agree with incorrect statements out there. But I pointed out above that I'm not talking about blatently incorrect statements. These are generally less obvious problems, or issues that are applicable to only a small amount of people (the poster and maybe a few others), things that others may not even recognize as a wrong statement at all.

lilmissy2

Now most of us are pretty sure that eating half your diet in twinkies is not a very good diet plan, but then again, the statement above wasn't telling anyone else what to eat, nor was it asking if this is ok. Is it really our place to say, "Um, eating half your diet in twinkies is not good."

I think, given that it is a public forum that we can assume that things people are saying could potentially be used by another user to make or justify their own decisions. Therefore I whole-heartedly support the right to object (respectfully) to something that somebody else has said, even if it doesn't specify the information as 'advice for others'.

SMarie10

If you are posting something on this public forum, it invites replies - whether asked for or not. You could always preface it by adding IMHO which you do often. I don't believe people should think your trying to be a know it all - and no matter what is said, people will believe what they want - ignoring science and studies and choosing to go with what they believe to be true.

I've actually learned much about nutrition - clean eating, HIIT, ect.. that I did not have a clue about before. I take the info from here, then go off and investigate it on my own through other reliable sources.

scagneti

I think it's fine to say something, and to avoid stepping on toes, you could say IMO or something along those lines.

There is a danger to leaving something that you know to be blatantly incorrect "out there" without challenging it. And frankly, those are the people who are giving advice to new people (that you know to be wrong) and then start threads wondering why they plateau eating half their calories in Twinkies.

I agree with incorrect statements out there. But I pointed out above that I'm not talking about blatently incorrect statements. These are generally less obvious problems, or issues that are applicable to only a small amount of people (the poster and maybe a few others), things that others may not even recognize as a wrong statement at all.

Well then you could acknowledge that while it might work for the poster (and possibly only short term), the majority of the population would find a different direction more beneficial.

I'd like to believe that since we're all adults and weight loss is far from an exact science (as in what will work for one person will unquestionably work for every single person), as long as it's stated respectfully, should be acceptable.

SHBoss1673

See lil, there's my dillema. I agree that the board is public, and in spirit we should all be allowed to respectfully object to a post or it's replies, but then again, is it respectful to call someone out in public for a plan that they are implementing for themself and not subjecting to others. Especially when they aren't asking whether that plan is correct or not? On some level it's going to be demoralizing to that person, if for no other reason than just basically saying "you're wrong" to them. Even if they ARE wrong.

Fit4Vet

Yeah, I think you should say something - maybe in a generalized way - but there are A LOT of hot topic items on the boards & some people just aren't going to listen to reasoning. You can talk until you are blue in the face & some people won't listen. :grumble:

lilRicki

As long as you can back up your disagreeing statement, and show them proof as to why you disagree, it might prevent drama. I know a lot of people are taking everything they read at face value, but sometimes that's the danger. If you can disprove what the post said with fun facts and the dangers of believing everything you read, than you're in the right. I don't agree with people being mean and just saying "no you're wrong, that's stupid" without giving me proof as to why I'm wrong, or what you based your opinion on (personal experience, etc).

SHBoss1673

I think it's fine to say something, and to avoid stepping on toes, you could say IMO or something along those lines.

There is a danger to leaving something that you know to be blatantly incorrect "out there" without challenging it. And frankly, those are the people who are giving advice to new people (that you know to be wrong) and then start threads wondering why they plateau eating half their calories in Twinkies.

I agree with incorrect statements out there. But I pointed out above that I'm not talking about blatently incorrect statements. These are generally less obvious problems, or issues that are applicable to only a small amount of people (the poster and maybe a few others), things that others may not even recognize as a wrong statement at all.

Well then you could acknowledge that while it might work for the poster (and possibly only short term), the majority of the population would find a different direction more beneficial.

I'd like to believe that since we're all adults and weight loss is far from an exact science (as in what will work for one person will unquestionably work for every single person), as long as it's stated respectfully, should be acceptable.

LOL, you haven't been on MFP long enough then

there are arguments and hurt feelings all the time on the boards.

SHBoss1673

If you are posting something on this public forum, it invites replies - whether asked for or not. You could always preface it by adding IMHO which you do often. I don't believe people should think your trying to be a know it all - and no matter what is said, people will believe what they want - ignoring science and studies and choosing to go with what they believe to be true.

I've actually learned much about nutrition - clean eating, HIIT, ect.. that I did not have a clue about before. I take the info from here, then go off and investigate it on my own through other reliable sources.

what if they weren't the original poster. Just responding to something someone said above? Then all they are doing is responding to someone else. And not really looking for people to critique them. I'm not asking if it's valid to post, just whether it's "right".

SHBoss1673

FYI, the reason why I ask this guys, is because this is usually how arguments on the boards start. With well meaning replies to statements made for no other reason than to help out an original poster. I'm not agreeing or disagreeing with either side of it. I've done both, so I just wanted it out there.

SHBoss1673

As long as you can back up your disagreeing statement, and show them proof as to why you disagree, it might prevent drama. I know a lot of people are taking everything they read at face value, but sometimes that's the danger. If you can disprove what the post said with fun facts and the dangers of believing everything you read, than you're in the right. I don't agree with people being mean and just saying "no you're wrong, that's stupid" without giving me proof as to why I'm wrong, or what you based your opinion on (personal experience, etc).

ah, there's the rub though. What you may consider kind and thoughtful, someone else, for what ever reason may consider rude and inconsiderate (it's happened to me before). So what's the solution? Sometimes the true meaning doesn't come out until pages later when feelings are hurt and the damage is done. That's why I ask the question.

Oompa_Loompa

"I use twinkies for half my calories because I have the room in my diet, and it's only about calories in vs calories out for me."

Oompa_Loompa

Omg The twinkie diet is what i do! lol jk

SHBoss1673

Omg The twinkie diet is what i do! lol jk

instigator!

lilRicki

As long as you can back up your disagreeing statement, and show them proof as to why you disagree, it might prevent drama. I know a lot of people are taking everything they read at face value, but sometimes that's the danger. If you can disprove what the post said with fun facts and the dangers of believing everything you read, than you're in the right. I don't agree with people being mean and just saying "no you're wrong, that's stupid" without giving me proof as to why I'm wrong, or what you based your opinion on (personal experience, etc).

ah, there's the rub though. What you may consider kind and thoughtful, someone else, for what ever reason may consider rude and inconsiderate (it's happened to me before). So what's the solution? Sometimes the true meaning doesn't come out until pages later when feelings are hurt and the damage is done. That's why I ask the question.

Statements like "I really don't mean to be rude" or "this is what I just read" things like that to justify your disagreement will go a long way in settling the high strung. You could also use IMO, or "this is what my trainer said", or "if that doesn't work try this"...

SHBoss1673

Statements like "I really don't mean to be rude" or "this is what I just read" things like that to justify your disagreement will go a long way in settling the high strung. You could also use IMO, or "this is what my trainer said", or "if that doesn't work try this"...

that's fine, but qualifying the statement isn't really what my point is. I'm talking about pointing it out in the first place. I mean, what if that twinkie example was real. And the person REALLY believed it, but they aren't telling anyone else to do it. Should you say anything to them? I don't think I would. But the minute someone else expressed interest I might. Once the door is open with questions, then it's fair game IMHO, but if a statement isn't specifically wrong, and isn't meant as advice, then I'm not so sure.

lilmissy2

See lil, there's my dillema. I agree that the board is public, and in spirit we should all be allowed to respectfully object to a post or it's replies, but then again, is it respectful to call someone out in public for a plan that they are implementing for themself and not subjecting to others. Especially when they aren't asking whether that plan is correct or not? On some level it's going to be demoralizing to that person, if for no other reason than just basically saying "you're wrong" to them. Even if they ARE wrong.

Well, the way I see it - if there truly were something dangerous or even short of optimal about the approach I was taking, then I would like to know. I don't see it as demoralizing - there is not a single approach to diet and exercise that couldn't be questioned to an extent and that's exactly what these forums are for. Sure, I may not agree with what someone has said about what I am doing and that is fine but at least other people have different view points to consider. It also may not make me change that thing - the reality with lifestyle changes is that it's all about what you as an individual are willing to do, not what everybody else thinks is right.

Obviously, being a health professional I'm a bit biased because I'm fairly confident in my own knowledge and I imagine that it's certainly more difficult for someone else to sift through all of the information posted and decide what they believe is correct.

I should specify that I'm talking about when replying to a general post. For example, a question somebody else has asked or an article somebody has posted. I think it is absolutely disrespectful to go into a support group post for something you don't believe in and question it in that environment.

fitnesspirateninja

A respectful tone makes a huge difference in my opinion. Unfortunately, tone doesn't always come across in the way you intended when it comes to text. There's no inflection or body language, which I think expresses more then words ever could. If you can clearly make your argument in a concise, respectful manner, then I say go for it. There will always be people who get pissy when someone disagrees with them, but posting your opinion in a public forum invites people to challenge it.

Honestly, I don't think the person posting will change their mind if you disagree with them on the boards, but perhaps it will inform someone reading. If you really want to have a discussion with someone about their opinion then send them a personal message and have a private debate.

elainegsd

"I use twinkies for half my calories because I have the room in my diet, and it's only about calories in vs calories out for me."

I would absolutely feel OK correcting, since they are posting in a public forum. If it is stated like your example above, I would be less inclined to correct the statement above than if it was stated as:
"Using twinkies for half your calories is a healthy way to lose weight." or
"Try using twinkies for half your calories."

The difference to me is in the first case, it is stated as the one person's approach to eating. In the other two cases, it is stated in an authoritative manner, implying that the person knows what the heck he/she is talking about.

callipygianchronicle

It absolutely "ethically and morally ok to post a reply that questions their post, or even point out the error if you feel it's wrong.” The most tactful way to do this is to

A) state something positive—which isn’t always easy because sometimes the information may 100% wrong and not 50% wrong and there’s not a lot of positives to go on—but an example would be, “Yes, it is true that there was a highly publicized case of a man eating twinkies and losing weight last year…”

use the phrase, “My understanding is different” and then explain what you know. This is not the same as saying you are right (even when you know you are). You are tactfully showing how you gathered evidence, from which sources, and what conclusion you have come to.

If you jump straight into B, you’re in argument territory, because it can feel to the person reading it as though you have come to the forum only to make them look stupid. But if you always start with A—making sure you acknowledge something that is positive about their contribution to the discussion—you’re less likely to get derailed by someone feeling insulted.

But sometimes, we all lack tack, or the claims are just so dangerously off, that we just have to unload with facts we know to be true.

SHBoss1673

See lil, there's my dillema. I agree that the board is public, and in spirit we should all be allowed to respectfully object to a post or it's replies, but then again, is it respectful to call someone out in public for a plan that they are implementing for themself and not subjecting to others. Especially when they aren't asking whether that plan is correct or not? On some level it's going to be demoralizing to that person, if for no other reason than just basically saying "you're wrong" to them. Even if they ARE wrong.

Well, the way I see it - if there truly were something dangerous or even short of optimal about the approach I was taking, then I would like to know. I don't see it as demoralizing - there is not a single approach to diet and exercise that couldn't be questioned to an extent and that's exactly what these forums are for. Sure, I may not agree with what someone has said about what I am doing and that is fine but at least other people have different view points to consider. It also may not make me change that thing - the reality with lifestyle changes is that it's all about what you as an individual are willing to do, not what everybody else thinks is right.

Obviously, being a health professional I'm a bit biased because I'm fairly confident in my own knowledge and I imagine that it's certainly more difficult for someone else to sift through all of the information posted and decide what they believe is correct.

I should specify that I'm talking about when replying to a general post. For example, a question somebody else has asked or an article somebody has posted. I think it is absolutely disrespectful to go into a support group post for something you don't believe in and question it in that environment.

the hard part about this is, now you're talking about assumptions of other people's emotional state. While you may not see it as something bad, others may, and where do you draw the line? I mean think about it, in truth, they weren't asking if it's ok to do it, and weren't asking for help, and they don't seem to be having difficulty, so why comment at all? Again, this is pretty much me playing devil's advocate here.

lilmissy2

I'm talking about pointing it out in the first place. I mean, what if that twinkie example was real. And the person REALLY believed it, but they aren't telling anyone else to do it. Should you say anything to them? I don't think I would. But the minute someone else expressed interest I might. Once the door is open with questions, then it's fair game IMHO, but if a statement isn't specifically wrong, and isn't meant as advice, then I'm not so sure.

I think that as soon as it is posted in a public forum, it becomes fair game for comments. Why? Because I spend all day trying to talk people out of ridiculous things they have read on the internet! (Not that I'm saying the things you are talking about are necessarily ridiculous). Just because nobody on the board has asked a question about it or agreed they were going to try that does not mean nobody has thought about it. So I think it's exactly the same situation where someone else in the thread mentions it or not.