<sigh> bad metabolism?

hroush

Why are you focusing on your core? What burns fat is essentially your legs (quads and glutes) as they are the biggest muscles in your body. I would also hope that you are doing arm exercises.

I would guess as to your gaining weight, you told your body last year that there wasn't any food around and now this year you are saying that there is food around, but you have to work hard to get it. You've trained your body to conserve everything it can. It will take time for it to overcome the fear of starvation.

Ellebeegirl

Hroush,

I totally agree with your post. I'm certain that I am paying the price now, and I'm willing to do that. I really am. I just expected it to happen a little faster. I mean, I could lose 5 pounds a week for the first two weeks then I would start gaining on 500 calories a day. You can imagine what happens when I'm eating 1500 calories a day.

I guess I just need reassurance that this will eventually work.

oh, and I guess I need to say something different than "core" it is a large muscle workout to build the muscles that are large enough to burn calories. My trainers words were, "you're never going to build your biceps enough to require a lot of calories" So yes, it is a lot of squats, lunges, rows, curls, retractions, and planks.

krazygloo

If you're not into measuring your food, one step you can change without measuring is substitution. Switch out all your normal snack food for fruit or veggies, at least for a few weeks, look at your portions, make sure it's half veg, quarter carbs and quarter protein, and change any dressing to lemon and a little light olive oil. Once you get more comfortable with what you eat, then you can tackle the tougher bit of counting the calories. Good luck, and keep with it!

SHBoss1673

I've been told you can't create a calorie deficit with exercise alone.

Try tracking what your eating using this site and see what you intake is.

untrue, you sure can. Strictly speaking exercise is just an extension of your TDEE, and thus you are able to expand it at desire and/or need.

Tiggerrick

I did not weigh my food for 42 years, I started this year... a few weeks ago. I will not do it for the rest of my life, but I have learned a few things:
1. A serving of steak that I consider normal is actually 5 to 6 servings
2. I pour more coffee creamer than one or two servings.
3. Peanut butter and jelly tastes the same at 2 servings of each or 5 servings of each, but difference in calories taken in is huge.
4. A serving of chips is much smaller than I was eyeballing.
5. I am just as full with a serving of rice that is 150gm as I am with 200gm, but save the extra calories.

I don't like the idea of dieting, and I am not. My food intake is the same as it was before I started measuring, the only difference is that I am keeping better track of calories taken in. I am also getting better at eyeballing one or two servings of an item. You can't just 'eye ball' something if you have nothing to compare it to.

I am sure you are frustrated with no weight loss, but don't let that stop you. Even if you are not loosing weight, you are building muscle, and that will make a difference no matter what.

SHBoss1673

Hroush,

I totally agree with your post. I'm certain that I am paying the price now, and I'm willing to do that. I really am. I just expected it to happen a little faster. I mean, I could lose 5 pounds a week for the first two weeks then I would start gaining on 500 calories a day. You can imagine what happens when I'm eating 1500 calories a day.

I guess I just need reassurance that this will eventually work.

oh, and I guess I need to say something different than "core" it is a large muscle workout to build the muscles that are large enough to burn calories. My trainers words were, "you're never going to build your biceps enough to require a lot of calories" So yes, it is a lot of squats, lunges, rows, curls, retractions, and planks.

not sure what a retraction is, but you described both core (planks) and a lot of lower body work. Which is fine. But I disagree with Hroush on one point. Muscle size does not elicit more fat burn. You burn fat by creating a deficit.

now, labeam, you asked before if I thought that the extreme dieting could have been the cause for your lack of progress. My answer is Yes and no. It's hard to make that assessment without knowing a lot more about you, but the possibility does exist. Believe it or not, with that kind of long term issue, it's more about your micronutrients (vitamins and minerals) than your macronutrients. it's difficult to cause a healthy liver, kidneys and digestive system to be permanently damaged from low calories alone, but you can do all sorts of damage to the more fragile organs such as the gall bladder, bladder, duodenum, small intestines this way. What I would suggest is this:

And understand, this will take a good month to six weeks to do, so don't expect magic results right off the bat, and you may gain a couple of pounds at the start, that's ok, those will come off rather quickly once you get going.

First step is to reset your body's RMR (Resting Metabolic Rate), you do this by eating what you should be eating, I.E. by eating your maintenance. Do this for a month or so, get your body used to eating this many calories, make the calories SUPER clean (this part sucks), take some time, a few hours at least, and sit down and plan out a perfectly healthy diet. I.E. exactly right on macronutrients (carbs, fat, protein) and make sure the carbs and fats and proteins are all healthy versions. Then do the same with micronutrients, taking care to add at least 6 veggie servings a day, 2 green leafy, 2 yellow or red, and 2 dark or hard green. Don't forget your healthy fats (omega 3 and omega 6 rich foods).

Doing this is NOT easy, it gets boring so make sure you design 3 to 4 different meals for each meal of the day, and also remember to add snacks.

Things to avoid like the plague,
restaurant foods (in general, I know this is impossible sometimes, but do the best you can)
fast foods, never ever, sorry, it's a no no during this period.
candy
pastries (yep that includes everything, donuts, cake, pies, muffins...etc.)
White flour foods
white sugar (limited fruit sugar is fine, but stay away from juice)
lots of saturated fats (lean red meats like filet minion are ok on rare occasion but not things like prime rib)
...etc. you get the picture.

keep in mind this is only for a month, four weeks. That's all.

Is this tough? Yep, but it's doable. I did it. My wife did it, I know tons of people that hold to this every day of their lives.

NOW,
once that's done you can be slightly more lenient on stuff, but here's the thing, now you can start your deficit, but don't make it huge, make it just large enough to do what you need to do. This is a long term thing, you don't get fast results this way, but you get permanent results this way.
I'm proof. 4 years later, same weight I was when I stopped losing (actually I'm 10 lbs heavier, but that's by design, I've actually lost 4% body fat since then and gained 12 lbs of lean tissue).
And trust me, I don't eat super super clean, I have the occasional brownie or ice cream here and there. But you know what, I can because the rest of my life is healthy eating.

As to whoever it was who said you can't measure for the rest of your life, I disagree, I do, every day I weigh or measure food. there are days when I can't, but in general, I do, I don't see why that's so difficult to do.

ksv123

Tiggerrick -

Excellent point on being able to estimate servings. She must know what a serving actually looks like first. I understand why she wouldn't want to constantly weigh each meal yet feel it is necessary to do so initially in order to get a good feel for what one serving should look like.

Ellebeegirl

SHBoss, Thank you so much for taking the time to write that all out for me. If there is one thing I can do, it is follow a strict plan for a limited amount of time! ; )

I will have to put some time into research, I have never once worried about vitamins and minerals. Carbs, protein, fat...all of that I have counted-controlled-limited-eliminated, but never have I worried about vitamins and minerals. I don't even know how much I need. (Omega 3 and 6 is the only supplement I take) A lot of your "don't" I already "don't" so really I think your plan is pretty doable.

I have a problem with the possibility of gaining but since that is happening anyway, what do I have to lose? teehee

Thanks to everyone for their support. I'll stick around and let you all know how it works out for me. I just know I can beat this, I know I can!

Glucocorticoid

I mostly agree with SHBoss's suggestion. I will add that during this maintenance period, it is still important to be eating adequate protein (1g/lb is a good rule of thumb), and also be sure to get plenty of carbs (this will help upregulate some of the hormones that have been depleted due to prolonged dieting). Get plenty of high fiber veggies and water as well. Obviously it should go without saying that you should be eating at your maintenance caloric level (hopefully you know what that is).

SHBoss1673

I mostly agree with SHBoss's suggestion. I will add that during this maintenance period, it is still important to be eating adequate protein (1g/lb is a good rule of thumb), and also be sure to get plenty of carbs (this will help upregulate some of the hormones that have been depleted due to prolonged dieting). Get plenty of high fiber veggies and water as well. Obviously it should go without saying that you should be eating at your maintenance caloric level (hopefully you know what that is).

Yes, except, 1 gram of protein per pound is excessive, 1.2 gram per kilogram is about the average that both the American Dietetic Association and the ACSM recommend, as well as the US Olympic Weight Lifting association, maybe slightly more for someone actively trying to build muscle mass, but slightly means maybe 1.5 or 1.6 grams per kilo.

SHBoss1673

SHBoss, Thank you so much for taking the time to write that all out for me. If there is one thing I can do, it is follow a strict plan for a limited amount of time! ; )

I will have to put some time into research, I have never once worried about vitamins and minerals. Carbs, protein, fat...all of that I have counted-controlled-limited-eliminated, but never have I worried about vitamins and minerals. I don't even know how much I need. (Omega 3 and 6 is the only supplement I take) A lot of your "don't" I already "don't" so really I think your plan is pretty doable.

I have a problem with the possibility of gaining but since that is happening anyway, what do I have to lose? teehee

Thanks to everyone for their support. I'll stick around and let you all know how it works out for me. I just know I can beat this, I know I can!

It's my pleasure to help my dear. if you need any specific help, or just want to talk more about it, feel free to personal message me. My wife is constantly amazed that I put the amount of research effort as I do into this, in her words "I'd glaze over after five minutes of the research studies you read every day for hours." Which is funny cuz to me, this stuff is WAY more exciting than what I do for a full time job (trust me, if you think nutritional research is boring, never EVER look into becoming a database administrator, it's far more boring, this is like watching the Kentucky derby by comparison!)
So while I don't have a degree in nutrition or dietetics, I've probably studied as much as most people with a degree, I've read two separate books that are graduate level text books on advanced nutrition and human anatomy, and I've probably read over 1000 studies on various metabolic subjects, so I'm not just guessing (plus I have my ACE personal training certification, my Twist-Sport Conditioning Agility, Quickness, and Reactivity certification, and I'm going for my US Olympic Association Weight lifting level 1 certification in July).

robertf57

your blood numbers tell me that you probably have some deficiencies in your diet, I realize you have thyroid issues to deal with, but the synthroid should correct that. It would be helpful to know your other thyroid numbers though (T3 T4 numbers, TSH isn't all that accurate usually, it's a precursor number, not an actual sign of an under-active thyroid).

It would also help to be able to see your food diary. Right now that's private, tough to see whether you're eating correctly without that. As I'm sure you've been told by your trainer, it's not as much about the exercise as it is about the diet. We lose weight by eating the right amount and right kind of food. Exercise is what we do to become healthy and support our metabolism, but you eat right (by right I mean the right amount of nutrients and the right kinds of nutrients) to drop fat.

Actually TSH is a much more sensitive indication of hypothyroid hypothyroidism than T4 or T3. It reflects the pituitary gland's response to being hypothyroid. You can have a "normal" T4 value and an elevated TSH might be the only indication that you actually have deficient thyroid activity.


If your current plan isn't working, I would try something different. Drop those carbs and increase your protein. Choose one of the myriad lower carbohydrate approaches (Even the much maligned Atkins for a short period of time) and see if it works for you. I would also echo previous comments that you should MEASURE EVERYTHING! No estimates! no guesses! and if you don't have a good heart rate monitor to estimate calories burn, be very conservative in eating those back. (like no more than 1/2 the estimates from here)

Good luck. Remember that the operational definition of insanity is doing the same thing and expecting different results. ;-)

MartiJJohnston

Lori,
I share your reluctance to "diet" - just thinking about it sets my teeth on edge and makes me think of all the times I've not lost weight. Also it makes me hungry. LOL! I also agree with the thyroid testing - TSH is, as has been mentioned, terribly inaccurate, and I've found very few endocrinologists who will work with you to truly assess your metabolism with a full panel. And most general practitioners don't know how to INTERPRET a full panel if they order it! Its also hard to find a doctor that will take time to listen to your "diet history" - this is a really important part of your medical history, but it often is not even addressed! I'll tell you a secret - I'm a family medicine physician, and MOST residencies in this country give -NO- official training in nutrition and exericise science. Example? ME! I'm overweight and have been for years, and I have very little idea of how to change that besides "decrease calories in, increase calories out". ASK your doctor what training they have had in nutrition, you will be suprised!

I just watched the documentary "Food Matters" and was SHOCKED that our Doctors do not get the proper training on nutrition!! I am in the process of completely transforming my eating habits, not just for weight loss, but to HEAL by toxic body!!

If you haven't seen this documentary yet... I highly recommend it!!

SHBoss1673

Actually TSH is a much more sensitive indication of hypothyroid hypothyroidism than T4 or T3. It reflects the pituitary gland's response to being hypothyroid. You can have a "normal" T4 value and an elevated TSH might be the only indication that you actually have deficient thyroid activity.

TSH is a different mechanism for testing for thyroid issues, but it's not necessarily better.

TSH levels are a more sensitive indication of PITUITARY gland issues, but not more sensitive for thyroid issues. considering that the whole purpose of TSH is to trigger the production and release of T3 and T4 in the thyroid, I'm pretty sure it's not a more SENSITIVE indication of hypothyroidism. All the research I've done, and the two endo's that I talked to about it, both said that the T3 and T4 tests are more accurate indications of the thyroid having an issue. When I asked about TSH, they said (I'm paraphrasing, it's been over a year and I don't remember exact words) "Well yeah, TSH USUALLY gives a pretty good indication, and it's a lot cheaper to test than all 3, so that's usually what we test first, but testing for TSH just means that the right amount of TSH is being sent to the thyroid, not that the thyroid is producing or releasing the right amount of T3 or T4." My colleague has hashimoto's thyroiditis, and his TSH levels are high normal, yet his thyroid is toast and his free T4 levels are off the chart low.

robertf57

Actually TSH is a much more sensitive indication of hypothyroid hypothyroidism than T4 or T3. It reflects the pituitary gland's response to being hypothyroid. You can have a "normal" T4 value and an elevated TSH might be the only indication that you actually have deficient thyroid activity.

TSH is a different mechanism for testing for thyroid issues, but it's not necessarily better.

TSH levels are a more sensitive indication of PITUITARY gland issues, but not more sensitive for thyroid issues. considering that the whole purpose of TSH is to trigger the production and release of T3 and T4 in the thyroid, I'm pretty sure it's not a more SENSITIVE indication of hypothyroidism. All the research I've done, and the two endo's that I talked to about it, both said that the T3 and T4 tests are more accurate indications of the thyroid having an issue. When I asked about TSH, they said (I'm paraphrasing, it's been over a year and I don't remember exact words) "Well yeah, TSH USUALLY gives a pretty good indication, and it's a lot cheaper to test than all 3, so that's usually what we test first, but testing for TSH just means that the right amount of TSH is being sent to the thyroid, not that the thyroid is producing or releasing the right amount of T3 or T4." My colleague has hashimoto's thyroiditis, and his TSH levels are high normal, yet his thyroid is toast and his free T4 levels are off the chart low.

Well, I am not interested in a debate; but ,TSH measurements are THE most sensitive indication of hypothyroid hypothyroidism. Pituitary hypothyroidism leads to low TSH levels. Hashimoto's Thyroiditis is a mixed chronic inflammatory thyroid condition that can have periods of hyperthyroidism but usually leads to hypothyroidism. As such , it will have low T4 and high TSH if the patient is hypothyroid. In dosing thyroid replacement , it is not uncommon to solely measure TSH levels, because of the greater sensitivity in hypothyroid hypothyroidism.

SHBoss1673

Well, I am not interested in a debate; but ,TSH measurements are THE most sensitive indication of hypothyroid hypothyroidism. Pituitary hypothyroidism leads to low TSH levels. Hashimoto's Thyroiditis is a mixed chronic inflammatory thyroid condition that can have periods of hyperthyroidism but usually leads to hypothyroidism. As such , it will have low T4 and high TSH if the patient is hypothyroid. In dosing thyroid replacement , it is not uncommon to solely measure TSH levels, because of the greater sensitivity in hypothyroid hypothyroidism.

Dude, if you're not interested in debate, then why further the debate? Come on now.

So what your saying is that for a very specific condition (one that I wasn't even talking about), it's more sensitive. OK, I'll buy that, but why is this more important than other possible reasons? If there's some specific condition that she's showing symptoms of, then ok, but I didn't see that in her first email describing her conditions. I'll admit straight up, I'm no thyroid expert, I've read up on it, and talked to experts about it, but that's as far as my knowledge goes, so I could very well be missing something obvious, but if I am, just point it out. And please note, what I originally said was that TSH isn't all that accurate for THYROID problems, NOT hypothyroidism.

I mean, it just feels like you were looking for a reason to undercut what I was saying.

LuckyLeprechaun

it is getting ready to turn around for you, Lori. This is how it worked for me....I also yo-yo dieted. I did every unhealthy thing you can imagine (and maybe some you can't) to try to lose the weight. I was sure I had ruined my metabolism forever. But here I am, SO close to my goal...

You can do this! Your metabolism can and WILL recover! Stick to it and make a bunch of friends on MFP to help pull you through the tougher times. Yes YOU CAN!