Does the source of sugars matter?

mapexdrummer69

I notice your only purpose around this forum is to argue with people and insult their "trainers", meanwhile your only area of expertise seems to be a couple of websites.

If my friend's advice wasn't sound he wouldn't be winning his age group in bodybuilding competitions. He lives by the advice he preaches and it shows (awards). But then again, real results don't hold up to "internet articles", do they?

I refuse to argue with a faceless internet expert. Feel free to insult anyone else that has an opposing view to yours, and we'll just all accept you as the forum know-it-all.

He and I are both on this forum to INFORM and not just to prove wrong. In MANY instances, information that is not true is given to people just starting their weight loss journey, and they believe they MUST follow rules such as the following.


1. Limited/restricted carbs
2. Avoid fruit
3. Don't eat late at night
4. Eat multiple/frequent meals to "boost" your metabolism




These are just some of the VERY FREQUENT postings I see, and all of them are irrelevant to weight loss and not needed.


A calorie IS a calorie.


Body WEIGHT is determined by energy balance, or calories in vs. out, body COMPOSITION is determined by MACROnutrient consumption. Carbs/fat/protein.

dls06

If your carbs are ok and you are not eating a lot of cake, cookies or high refined sugar snacks, don't worry about it.

sharidiane

This thread is EXACTLY why I want to stab out my own eyeballs when I try to get any more 'informed' about healthy food choices.

I eat pretty clean. The main source of my sugar overage is my organic cane juice filled yogurt. But I stay well within my calories. I eat a lot of fruit and I always go way over on my sugar.

And I have NO IDEA if that matters. Meh.

dleithaus

Sugar is sugar.
Glycemic index values shows the potential to raise blood sugar is important.
How your body processes that sugar is important as presented in the insulin index (or maybe better termed the "glycemic load").
These concepts are important to all parties, even outside those with abnormal insulin responses, because insulin response is also a regulator of how satiated you are after eating something. GL is an average response to normal portions (sometimes in isolation, sometimes with surrounding players. (Portion control is a key factor in GL testing)

Some quick examples. Carrots -- high GI due to sugar content, but lower GL due to the fact that carrots have a strong matrix and fiber load, slowing digestion and absorption of sugar. White Potatoes, high GI, high GL (note no significant sugar in white potato). Potatoes and similar things like RICE, have high GI and GL because, eaten alone, they are quickly digested and can spike insulin levels. Now, add a controlled amount of yogurt or sour cream to that same potato. The addition of a fat or protein can slow the digestion of the carb and slow insulin response. Surrounding matrix certainly play a role.

There are those that say these concepts are only relevant to those with abnormal responses. I say no. And indeed entire books have been written on why the concept of GL is particularly relevant to diet(er)s. It can be simplified to --if you eat a bunch of sugar or carbs that turn into sugar, quickly digested, insulin spikes then can decline just as fast, leaving you hungry again. The key point... HUNGRY.

Finding foods that satisfy you and sustain you, and keep you from being hungry is a natural consequence of keeping a food diary like myfitnesspal. Enjoy your fruits and carbs, counting every calorie! Moderation is and always has been the key to life time weight control.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glycemic_index
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glycemic_load
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Insulin_index

Dragonwolf

He and I are both on this forum to INFORM and not just to prove wrong. In MANY instances, information that is not true is given to people just starting their weight loss journey, and they believe they MUST follow rules such as the following.


1. Limited/restricted carbs
2. Avoid fruit
3. Don't eat late at night
4. Eat multiple/frequent meals to "boost" your metabolism.

Technically speaking, eating small, frequent meals does have merit, though not for the usually touted reasons (such as boosting metabolism). It keeps you from getting so hungry that you binge and overeat., and keeps your blood sugar stable (yes, even non-diabetics have dips and spikes in their blood sugar), which in turn keeps you from feeling overly hungry. It's more about control than how the body handles it, though, and therefore not required if you can control how much you eat no matter how hungry you feel.

A good example of the fact that meal frequency doesn't matter much is John Walker's "Hacker Diet" (http://www.fourmilab.ch/hackdiet/www/hackdiet.html). He himself eats something like one or two large meals a day and that's about it and successfully lost/maintains weight.

I stumbled on an interesting article regarding diet and starvation mode, by the way:
http://caloriecount.about.com/truth-starvation-mode-ft28742

amfaery

I would not cut out your daily peice of friut maybe some other form of sugar. everyone is so angry here....everybody's body is different and body builders do need to eat way different than the average person...I personally can't do low carb I tried with my trainer who is a pwer lifted adn was just gaining (not in a good way)my body likes a healthy balance...everyone needs to find there balance....abd also your brain and muscles do need carbs to function properly so they are not the devil

just think about your quesions apple vs snickers bar....candy taste better but the apple is better good luck and deep breath boys

mapexdrummer69

Technically speaking, eating small, frequent meals does have merit, though not for the usually touted reasons (such as boosting metabolism). It keeps you from getting so hungry that you binge and overeat., and keeps your blood sugar stable (yes, even non-diabetics have dips and spikes in their blood sugar), which in turn keeps you from feeling overly hungry. It's more about control than how the body handles it, though, and therefore not required if you can control how much you eat no matter how hungry you feel.

A good example of the fact that meal frequency doesn't matter much is John Walker's "Hacker Diet" (http://www.fourmilab.ch/hackdiet/www/hackdiet.html). He himself eats something like one or two large meals a day and that's about it and successfully lost/maintains weight.

I stumbled on an interesting article regarding diet and starvation mode, by the way:
http://caloriecount.about.com/truth-starvation-mode-ft28742

With all do respect, recent studies have actually showed the exact opposite to the above points.


According to legions of diet and health "experts," eating small meals every so often will help you avoid hunger pangs, provide you with stable energy throughout the day and keep you mentally sharp. Contrary to what many people seem to believe, blood sugar is extremely well-regulated and maintained within a tight range in healthy people. It does not swing wildly up and down like a chimpanzee on meth and it doesn't plummet from going a few hours without food. Or even a full day without food. Or a week without food for that matter.

People seem to believe they will suffer severe hunger and mental impairment from not eating every so often. Consider for a second the evolutionary consequences for survival if this was true. Given that regular periods of fasting, even famine, was a natural part of our past, do you think we'd be here today if we were unable to function when obtaining food was most critical?

Maintaining blood sugar is of very high priority and we have developed efficient pathways that will make it happen even under extreme conditions. If you were to fast for 23 hrs and then go for a 90 min run at 70-75% VO2max, your blood sugar after the run would be identical to the same run performed in the fed state. It would take no less than three days or 84 hours of fasting to reach blood sugar levels low enough to affect your mental state; and this is temporary, as your brain adapts to the use of ketones. During 48 hours of fasting, or severe calorie deprivation, blood sugar is maintained within a normal range no measure of cognitive performance is negatively affected.

What about blood sugar and hunger? Blood sugar is one of many short-term feedback mechanisms used to regulate hunger and the notion which exists to say that low blood sugar may cause hunger is correct. Low just means lower range. This is subject to numerous confounders, such as your habitual diet, energy intake and genetics. Most importantly perhaps, it's subject to entrained meal patterns, regulated by ghrelin and other metabolic hormones. In essence, this means that blood sugar follows the meal pattern you are used to. This is relevant for those who fear blood sugar issues and hunger from regular periods of fasting, as it serves to explain why people can easily adapt to regular periods of fasting without negative effects.



*above taken from an article my Martin Berkhan.

mapexdrummer69

Again, it all comes down to personal preference.

tsherb

Sugar is sugar: the youtube video you reference is a great video. He tackles this topic around an hour and 13 minutes into the video. Basically says fruit is okay because it is being eaten in conjunction with fiber. If you have the time watch the video or at least this portion...it is really good. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dBnniua6-oM

Chuckw40

I would not cut out your daily peice of friut maybe some other form of sugar. everyone is so angry here....everybody's body is different and body builders do need to eat way different than the average person...I personally can't do low carb I tried with my trainer who is a pwer lifted adn was just gaining (not in a good way)my body likes a healthy balance...everyone needs to find there balance....abd also your brain and muscles do need carbs to function properly so they are not the devil

just think about your quesions apple vs snickers bar....candy taste better but the apple is better good luck and deep breath boys

Though you can get all the carbs you will ever need from vegetables it appears from my research that our brains can work just fine without carbs at all. Our bodies can produce everything we need from fat and protein.

Edit: In reference to energy that is, of course we still need vitamins and minerals to be healthy but my point was that we don't need the carbs from sugar.

mapexdrummer69

^ The above poster is correct in regards to the body not NEEDING carbohydrates.

amfaery

vegtables are carbs so regardless you are eating them