BMR and Calorie Deficit - CONFUSED!

Hanna1983 · November 2008

Dear All,

A few days ago I posted a message about why I dont seem to lose weight even though I eat less calories. I was told that I probably eat too few calories and that my body therefore is in "starvation mode" and is hanging on to any bit of fat he can get. Therefore no weight loss occurs.

When I joined MFP I was told a recommended calorie intake of 1,200 calories/day to get a weightloss of 1lbs per week. I have stuck to the 1,200 calories, but have not lost any weight.

WHY NOT?!

The answer to that was that my body apparently needs a certain amount of calories to keep going called BMR. And if I eat less than my BMR, then my body is starving and hangs on to the fat. So I went off and calculated my BMR through online BMR calculators. I got 7 completely different results ranging from 1800 to 1290. :grumble:

Then I found this forumla wich seems to be commonly used:

Female: BMR = 655 + (9.6 x weight in kg) + (1.8 x height in cm) - (4.7 x age in yrs)

With the Harris Benedict Equation I then calculated my requirements including exercise.
As I only started doing a little exercise recently I used the first equation:
Sedentary Calorie Calculation = BMR x 1.2

The overall result is 1,872.6 cals per day.

So if I understand it right, this is the calorie intake I should eat if I want to KEEP my weight as it is.
Correct?

Obviously I want to LOSE weight and NOT keep my weight. So I looked up how much I have to recude my calorie intake to lose the weight I want to lose per week. The common suggestion I found on so many websites is that to lose 1 lbs per week, I have to eat 500 per day cals less. If I want to lose 2lbs per week I have to eat 1000 cals per day less.

For me that means:

1,372 cals per day = -1lbs / week
872 cals per day = -2 lbs / week

If I was to eat 1,372 cals per day however, according to what is said about your BMR, I will be below my BMR and therefore starving my body and therefore it will not let go of the excess fat.

If I eat 872 cals per day I am definitely starving it so I wont even go there. Also I will simply not be able to stick to so few cals and will probably binge at weekends. Which of course is no help.

Can someone please tell me what am I misunderstanding here?

I would really appreciate some help with this.:frown:

Thank you.

Hanna x

Hanna1983 · November 2008

Dear All,

A few days ago I posted a message about why I dont seem to lose weight even though I eat less calories. I was told that I probably eat too few calories and that my body therefore is in "starvation mode" and is hanging on to any bit of fat he can get. Therefore no weight loss occurs.

When I joined MFP I was told a recommended calorie intake of 1,200 calories/day to get a weightloss of 1lbs per week. I have stuck to the 1,200 calories, but have not lost any weight.

WHY NOT?!

The answer to that was that my body apparently needs a certain amount of calories to keep going called BMR. And if I eat less than my BMR, then my body is starving and hangs on to the fat. So I went off and calculated my BMR through online BMR calculators. I got 7 completely different results ranging from 1800 to 1290. :grumble:

Then I found this forumla wich seems to be commonly used:

Female: BMR = 655 + (9.6 x weight in kg) + (1.8 x height in cm) - (4.7 x age in yrs)

With the Harris Benedict Equation I then calculated my requirements including exercise.
As I only started doing a little exercise recently I used the first equation:
Sedentary Calorie Calculation = BMR x 1.2

The overall result is 1,872.6 cals per day.

So if I understand it right, this is the calorie intake I should eat if I want to KEEP my weight as it is.
Correct?

Obviously I want to LOSE weight and NOT keep my weight. So I looked up how much I have to recude my calorie intake to lose the weight I want to lose per week. The common suggestion I found on so many websites is that to lose 1 lbs per week, I have to eat 500 per day cals less. If I want to lose 2lbs per week I have to eat 1000 cals per day less.

For me that means:

1,372 cals per day = -1lbs / week
872 cals per day = -2 lbs / week

If I was to eat 1,372 cals per day however, according to what is said about your BMR, I will be below my BMR and therefore starving my body and therefore it will not let go of the excess fat.

If I eat 872 cals per day I am definitely starving it so I wont even go there. Also I will simply not be able to stick to so few cals and will probably binge at weekends. Which of course is no help.

Can someone please tell me what am I misunderstanding here?

I would really appreciate some help with this.:frown:

Thank you.

Hanna x

PussyKat · November 2008

Wish I could help, this whole area confuses me too...I have tried to calculate my BMR on many different sites and got very wide-ranging results. I've also heard that you should eat your BMR calories each day, but I don't see how this would produce weight-loss, especially as most results I've found give my BMR as considerably more than what MFP says I should eat every day.

Hanna1983 · November 2008

Hi *****Kat

glad to see I am not the only one that does not understand it.
Let's hope someone can explain. :ohwell:

H

shorerider · November 2008

Ok, look--MFP does all this for you. I don't know why people continue to get so confused about all this but the beauty of this site is that it takes into account your BMR, adds to that your activity level (that you select and input) and then tells you what you would need to maintain your weight at your activity level and then gives you a calorie to shoot for to lose weight. All that is visible on your goals page.

Part of your problem seems to be that you are trying to lose 2 pounds a week when you really don't have all that much to lose. AND, 1200 calories a day is an extreme figure that should only be used by those who have a LOT to lose. Most people should be shooting for 1 pound a week loss--NO MORE.

If you noticed, when you selected your weight loss per week goal, MFP states next to the 1 pound selection RECOMMENDED.

there is no need--again NO NEED--to try to figure all this out on your own. That is why I love this site. I plug in my figures, it does the math for me. It works; I know. I have lost 72 pounds since April.

If you read the posts pinned in the "General Diet and Weight Loss" forum area, you will see all this discussed and explained and PLENTY of other links to help you understand.

http://www.myfitnesspal.com/forums/show/9-general-diet-and-weight-loss-help

Hanna1983 · November 2008

Shorerider,

I was told 1200 calories for a weightloss of 1.5lbs per week. I dont think that is too much. However, I now changed it to be 1lb per week and it gives me 1,340.

What I got confused with is that this figure still is below my BMR.

Fine, if MFP include the BMR and do it all for me, then why am I being told that if I go below my BMR (which I am if I do the 1340 as recommended by MFP) I starve my body and it wont let go of the fat? That is my problem.

The links you refer to in the posts are the ones that I looked at (as mentioned in my original post at the top) and they obviously seem to be contradicting.

All I am looking for is for someone to explain to me which is correct.

What happens if I go below my BMR?
- do i starve my body and get the opposite result of what I want
or
- do I lose weight healthily if I do so?

I am glad to hear that it worked for you. And I wish I could say the same, but I cant and I am starting to get really frustrated because no matter what I do, it all seems to NOT WORK!

hgam1 · November 2008

"Part of your problem seems to be that you are trying to lose 2 pounds a week when you really don't have all that much to lose. AND, 1200 calories a day is an extreme figure that should only be used by those who have a LOT to lose"

I am sure, we'd prevously skimmed through this slightly before,

but my arguement still remains that, IF the above quote is right, why is it suggested to people like us that have less to lose. Like most people you entered your details and MFP calculates it right....why suggest 1200 cal if you don't need to go that low at all?

shorerider · November 2008

I'm not sure where all this about the BMR is coming from or how it all got brought up, but here's how I look at it.

One--your BMR is what it takes to MAINTAIN your current weight

Two--I'm assuming you want to lose weight

Three--if you want to lose weight, you have to go below what it takes to maintain your current weight, so your body will draw upon the fat reserves it has stored up for energy. That is what happens to the fat you lose. The body burns it up for energy INSTEAD of using all the extra food you're no longer eating.

Again, MFP does all this--and it adds back in the exercise calories to ensure that you're not depriving your body drastically. It is one of the few sites that recommends that, and that is why I love MFP. Because it encourages a healthy way to lose weight.

shorerider · November 2008

"Part of your problem seems to be that you are trying to lose 2 pounds a week when you really don't have all that much to lose. AND, 1200 calories a day is an extreme figure that should only be used by those who have a LOT to lose"

I am sure, we'd prevously skimmed through this slightly before, but my arguement still remains that, IF the above quote is right, why is it suggested to people like us that have less to lose. Like most people you entered your details and MFP calculates it right....why suggest 1200 cal if you don't need to go that low at all?

Because some people can do a 1200 calorie a day diet, and I'm assuming Mike realizes that. I did 1100 a day when I started BUT I WAS UNDER DOCTOR'S CARE. And, I only did it for about 3 weeks until I simply couldn't anymore because I was so hungry. I bumped up to 1200. Now, I'm at 1300-1400 and some days 1500 or more when I was cycling heavily (before it got cold).

Mike, and I'm assuming here, probably has no way to stop people from selecting 1200 who don't need to be at 1200.

shorerider · November 2008

Shorerider,

I was told 1200 calories for a weightloss of 1.5lbs per week. I dont think that is too much. However, I now changed it to be 1lb per week and it gives me 1,340.

What I got confused with is that this figure still is below my BMR.

Fine, if MFP include the BMR and do it all for me, then why am I being told that if I go below my BMR (which I am if I do the 1340 as recommended by MFP) I starve my body and it wont let go of the fat? That is my problem.

The links you refer to in the posts are the ones that I looked at (as mentioned in my original post at the top) and they obviously seem to be contradicting.

All I am looking for is for someone to explain to me which is correct.

What happens if I go below my BMR?
- do i starve my body and get the opposite result of what I want
or
- do I lose weight healthily if I do so?

I am glad to hear that it worked for you. And I wish I could say the same, but I cant and I am starting to get really frustrated because no matter what I do, it all seems to NOT WORK!

Oh, and you just joined this month? Yet, you're frustrated already? You have to give it time. I'm not trying to be a smartie here but it takes time. The less you have to lose--the longer it takes. This is not a sprint but a lifetime journey to health. It is not a "diet" but a change to lifetime of good health.

Hanna1983 · November 2008

Shoreider: "One--your BMR is what it takes to MAINTAIN your current weight
Two--I'm assuming you want to lose weight
Three--if you want to lose weight, you have to go below what it takes to maintain your current weight, so your body will draw upon the fat reserves it has stored up for energy. That is what happens to the fat you lose. The body burns it up for energy INSTEAD of using all the extra food you're no longer eating. "
(end of quote)

Just thought I would throw this in from the post-its for newbies and important links in MFP as I ahve bene advised to read those:

"Just want to clear up something with BMR.
BMR is the absolute minimum number of calories the human body needs to function normally if you didn't use any muscles at all all day.

So

- Subracting calories from your normal Maintain calories is good for loosing weight.

- Subtracting calories from BMR causes malnutrition and is dangerous (this is what causes you to be sluggish, have headaches,...etc) Even approaching BMR calories while keeping up a normal, active schedule is dangerous, please stay above this level"

My BMR is 1472 cals per day, yet MFP calculated me to eat no more than 1340.

is it clear now WHY I AM CONFUSED!

Hanna1983 · November 2008

yes I joined this month and i would expect to see at least 2lb off which I havent.

arewethereyet · November 2008

Hi Hanna. I can only provide what has worked for me. I am in a very technical job, looking at numbers and medical files all day long....I must look at the simple picture just to remain sane!!

I was 168 when I started. I am 5'2" tall and at the time sedentary. I wanted to lose 1 pound a week.
MFP gave me 1200 cals, because that is the lowest anyone should ever go. FORGET all the other stuff...and get to basics.

IF you eat less cals than your body expends, you will lose weight. Period.

An easy equation a doctor once gave me was 15 cals per pound to maintain. 170 x 15 = 2550 just to maintain your current weight. So if you reduce by 1000 calories, you will lose 1 pound a week.

I like MFP because it doesnt assume I am going to do the required work outs. It gives me 1200 and then says....well sweety if you work out, you get to eat more!! So I make sure to do 30 minutes of moderate exercise each day to get my extra 200-300 calories.

Other websites will give you 1500 and say you must exercise 30 everday. What if you dont??? Then you dont lose.

What worked for me...with my age and size....was 1300-1400 cals a day (of clean food) + exercise calories.

I would implore you to exercise each day. Once you begin you wont want to stop. Dont look at all the posts with 6x week at 3 hours a day...that is right for them. Start with 30 minutes-walk, bike, skate, DVD,TV guru....something to get your metabolism moveing.

I truly hope this helped in some way. I tried in the beginning to over analyse and it drove me crazy. Ironically enough it was Shorerider who gave me the best info!!

Hanna1983 · November 2008

Hi arewethereyet (also Shorerider)

Thank you for all the info. Actually the last post seems the most helpful.

I just want to understand what will work. I think maybe I read up too much information and that is what confused me. I never meant it to sound like I dont believe what shorerider said.

I just dont understand how it all works and I dont like what I dont understand.

I will go with both your suggestions and eat the cals that MFP gives me. Maybe I am too impatient.

I just want it to finally work that's all. I will give it a go and let you know as soon as there are results.

Thank you both x

allaboutme · November 2008

Your BMR is what your body requires if you were to lay in bed all day long, what it requires to function properly, without expending any energy to walk, take a shower etc. This is what you need to live. You guys I think are getting this number confused with maintence calories which is what you require when you add in everyday living activites. That is the number you would need to eat if you wanted to maintain where you are now.

BMR is the least amount of calories you should ever be consuming. 1200 is the minimum that any person age height weight, should never go below. A healthy person at their perfect weight has a BMR of about 1200 calories. Unfortunately, this is a standard number that is put into the program automatically (the program isn't perfect, it is free remembe) To calculate the amount you should be eating you need to calculate your bmr and plug that number manually in where your 1200 calories previously was. Otherwise, your body is not getting enough food to function, and the metabolism slows, because it needs to conserve energy for the important bodily functions, so say good bye to losing any or having any energy. You can lose weight this way without doubt, logic says if you don't eat calories you will lose, , but when your body starts getting the right amount of food it needs again, because you now want to maintain and start trying to eat normal again, it will store, because you haven't trained your metabolism that it will always have enough food. Your metabolism is basic and can't understand that you are dieting, to it, if you don't give it enough food to do its basic functioning, ie BMR Calories, it thinks it is starving.

Try reading all the posts for newbies, it migh help you understand it a bit more.

Hanna, 1,800 seems high for a BMR if you only have 40 lbs to lose

Is that what the BMR calculator told you in the tools here? It seems more like maintenance calories to me.

shorerider · November 2008

Hi arewethereyet (also Shorerider)

Thank you for all the info. Actually the last post seems the most helpful.

I just want to understand what will work. I think maybe I read up too much information and that is what confused me. I never meant it to sound like I dont believe what shorerider said.

I just dont understand how it all works and I dont like what I dont understand.

I will go with both your suggestions and eat the cals that MFP gives me. Maybe I am too impatient.

I just want it to finally work that's all. I will give it a go and let you know as soon as there are results.

Thank you both x

I think the biggest problem is the use of the term BMR--which is used to mean a wide variety of things depending on who is using it. Which is why I said I love MFP--it does it for me. In truth, you really don't need to even look at your BMR but your other figure which is on the goals page, which might be what you're using to figure to when saying BMR--I'm not sure. But that's not your BMR. The figure on the right of the page on your goal page is how much you burn each day breathing, walking, working, etc. based upon the activity level you set. MRP takes what it keeps to keep you alive, adds to it based upon your activity level, and goes from there.

Trying to overthink will drive you absolutely nuts. Trust MFP--give it time. If after several weeks, you're not seeing a result, then try tweaking it. But you've got to give it time. Patience. I have none but I've learned to not go completely bonkers anymore at least when I don't see results immediately. Took me 6 weeks to break a plateau.

Poison5119 · November 2008

SuzieQT · November 2008

So here's a definition of BMR.

Basal metabolic rate (BMR) is the amount of energy expended while at rest in a neutrally temperate environment, in the post-absorptive state (meaning that the digestive system is inactive, which requires about twelve hours of fasting in humans). The release of energy in this state is sufficient only for the functioning of the vital organs, such as the heart, lungs, brain and the rest of the nervous system, liver, kidneys, sex organs, muscles and skin. BMR decreases with age and with the loss of lean body mass. Increased muscle mass can increase BMR. Aerobic fitness level, a product of cardiovascular exercise, while previously thought to have effect on basal or resting metabolic rate (RMR), has been shown in the 1990s not to correlate with BMR, when fat-free body mass was adjusted for (see following section "Aerobic vs. anaerobic exercise" for references). Illness, previously consumed food and beverages, environmental temperature, and stress levels can affect one's overall energy expenditure as well as one's BMR.

My conclusion is that your BMR is the number of calories you need to maintain your body as is if only your main organs are functioning. I am by no means an expert or anything so this is just my two cents worth. I eat less than my BMR and I'm not in starvation mode or else I wouldn't be losing. One pound loss is most likely where you need to be at. I started out the same was as you with a 1.5 pound loss and wasn't losing any because I was in starvation mode at 1200 calories a day. It depends on your body and how much you need to lose as to where your body's starvation mode point is. My suggestion would be to let MFP calculate for you a 1 pound per week loss. If you think its too low or after a week or two you're seeing absolutely no results (don't forget to do measurements too!) then try lowering it to 0.5 pound loss per week. Also you need to eat your exercise calories as everyone else has mentioned. That will allow you to eat more because you're burning more. The most important part about beginning this journey is learning your body. If you're eating too little your body will let you know (headaches, tiredness, etc) and if you're eating too much you're body will let you know that as well (no weight loss, weight gain, etc). All of the suggestions are not perfect for everyone so just tweak some and you'll find your weight loss caloric intake area. Hope this helps! Good luck! :flowerforyou:

Hanna1983 · November 2008

Hanna, 1,800 seems high for a BMR if you only have 40 lbs to lose Is that what the BMR calculator told you in the tools here? It seems more like maintenance calories to me.

Hi allaboutme.

No the BMR of 1800 is one of the numbers that came up when I calculated my BMR through different websites. It also came up when I used the apparently commonly used formula. :ohwell:

The BMR i got from MFP was 1400 something.

H

allaboutme · November 2008

Hanna, 1,800 seems high for a BMR if you only have 40 lbs to lose Is that what the BMR calculator told you in the tools here? It seems more like maintenance calories to me.

Hi allaboutme.

No the BMR of 1800 is one of the numbers that came up when I calculated my BMR through different websites. It also came up when I used the apparently commonly used formula. :ohwell:

The BMR i got from MFP was 1400 something.

H

I am no expert either but that one sounds just about right. My BRM is 1254 and I only have a few pounds to lose, my maintenance (according to this sight) is about 1550 or 1600. I have followed the BMR since about two weeks after I started, and have seen consistent results, now sometimes I even go over, (not 1000 calories or anything) and I don't gain. It is slow, because I can only lose about 1/2 pound a week without going into starvation mode, but it has happened.

I exercise so I can eat more and I look toned, not to lose. .

Hanna1983 · November 2008

So here's a definition of BMR.

Basal metabolic rate (BMR) is the amount of energy expended while at rest in a neutrally temperate environment, in the post-absorptive state (meaning that the digestive system is inactive, which requires about twelve hours of fasting in humans). The release of energy in this state is sufficient only for the functioning of the vital organs, such as the heart, lungs, brain and the rest of the nervous system, liver, kidneys, sex organs, muscles and skin. BMR decreases with age and with the loss of lean body mass. Increased muscle mass can increase BMR. Aerobic fitness level, a product of cardiovascular exercise, while previously thought to have effect on basal or resting metabolic rate (RMR), has been shown in the 1990s not to correlate with BMR, when fat-free body mass was adjusted for (see following section "Aerobic vs. anaerobic exercise" for references). Illness, previously consumed food and beverages, environmental temperature, and stress levels can affect one's overall energy expenditure as well as one's BMR.

My conclusion is that your BMR is the number of calories you need to maintain your body as is if only your main organs are functioning. I am by no means an expert or anything so this is just my two cents worth. I eat less than my BMR and I'm not in starvation mode or else I wouldn't be losing. One pound loss is most likely where you need to be at. I started out the same was as you with a 1.5 pound loss and wasn't losing any because I was in starvation mode at 1200 calories a day. It depends on your body and how much you need to lose as to where your body's starvation mode point is. My suggestion would be to let MFP calculate for you a 1 pound per week loss. If you think its too low or after a week or two you're seeing absolutely no results (don't forget to do measurements too!) then try lowering it to 0.5 pound loss per week. Also you need to eat your exercise calories as everyone else has mentioned. That will allow you to eat more because you're burning more. The most important part about beginning this journey is learning your body. If you're eating too little your body will let you know (headaches, tiredness, etc) and if you're eating too much you're body will let you know that as well (no weight loss, weight gain, etc). All of the suggestions are not perfect for everyone so just tweak some and you'll find your weight loss caloric intake area. Hope this helps! Good luck! :flowerforyou:

Thank you Suzie. Yes maybe you are right and I made the mistake by only eating 1200 cals a day. I changed my goal to losing only 1 lb per week and will make sure I eat my exercise calories.
Hopefully that will work.

BMR and Calorie Deficit - CONFUSED!

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