Who else is older and has BAD KNEES?

michedarnd

I am trying to get myself in shape, but I often run afoul of the fact that my knees leave a WHOLE LOT to be desired. What do other people do for high-efficiency workouts with bad knees? I use my elliptical, but I know that not changing your routine gets your body to be super-efficient with that one exercise. How do others do protracted cardio, interval training, etc., when their knees start to complain?

watermelonstarfish

swimming is good for bad knees.

suz155

Hi,

I can relate. Swimming and my stationary bike.

hardatwork45

The elliptical is fantastic, my knees have been bothering me for years but this machines makes me feel no pain whatsoever. I also heard swimming is good, don't know because I can't swim...LOL

Jenscan

Me. I have a bad left knee. My workouts are usually walking, with yoga and pilates also. I find that my alignment is much better since doing yoga, and that has helped with the knee. Losing weight obviously has helped with the pressure on my joint as well.

I'd strongly suggest to ensure your form is correct or you'll make matters worse, so get a physical trainer or at least an instructor or video that hammers on form until you know exactly what you're doing. And I'd be very careful with Jillian Michaels videos! She HATES knees, I swear.

Remember, you do not need to work out 60-90 days every single day to lose weight, it's about efficiency of the workout. It's not BAD to do protracted cardio, but it's not necessary at all.

Crystal_Pistol

Even if you do the same things, change the levels and intensities. I change the programs, workout with more or less resistance, and challenge myself with speed. In essence, do intervals on whatever machine you have so your body doesn't know what's coming. The issues is when you do the same workout over and over, not necessarily using the same machine.

Also, bike of course.

I haven't lost enough weight to run again yet and jogging is hard on my knees. I also developed some random knee pains. This is what is working for me.

HTH!

patriot201

I am only in my early-mid thirties, but I have bad knees. Mine have been surgically repaired several times and still give me issues. In addition, I have osetopenia (first stage of osteoporosis), which gives me additional problems.

I walk. A lot. I got fitted for correctly-fitting shoes and I walk. Ironically, the more I walk, the better my knees feel. I am strengthening my muscles, which helps support my weak joints.

Crystal_Pistol

And I'd be very careful with Jillian Michaels videos! She HATES knees, I swear.

She ABSOLUTELY hates knees.

zukekitty

I have only found the elliptical and stationary bike to work for me. I hate water so swimming is out. They should get at least a bit stronger as you work them though. Lunges and squats.....carefully. As soon as I feel any hint of pain I stop whatever I'm doing because it will only get worse. Lately my "good" knee has been complaining. My Dr. years ago said to avoid stairs. I moved into a two story house and they actually got stronger because of it.

catwrangler

And I'd be very careful with Jillian Michaels videos! She HATES knees, I swear.

She ABSOLUTELY hates knees.

oh no! I just bought her video today! :ohwell:

Yancando

I will soon be 48 and have bad knees. My favorite form of exercise is a water aerobics class. I am not a swimmer, but exercising in the water has worked for me!

Azdak

I am trying to get myself in shape, but I often run afoul of the fact that my knees leave a WHOLE LOT to be desired. What do other people do for high-efficiency workouts with bad knees? I use my elliptical, but I know that not changing your routine gets your body to be super-efficient with that one exercise. How do others do protracted cardio, interval training, etc., when their knees start to complain?

First of all the idea that "efficiency" will hurt your routine is mostly hooey. I don't know where the idea came from, but it's a misunderstanding of how the body works.

You can vary your training stimulus without changing machines. Cross training can be helpful for addressing muscle imbalances and decreasing the risk of overtraining, but it's not necessary for weight loss.

Mix up the duration and intensity of your workouts. Include longer endurance workouts, shorter continuous "higher tempo" workouts and various types of interval workouts.

I don't know the nature of your "bad knees" but often chronic joint problems develop because of muscle weakness, balance issues, or insufficiently rehabbed injuries.

llkilgore

I'm 58, and my knees complained bitterly until I stabilized them with strength training. The resistance machines at the gym have made a huge difference, enough that I was able to get through C25K without knee pain. Six months ago I bombed out of the 30 day shred because I couldn't handle the jumping jacks. This morning I ran more than 6 miles.

shoshi68

I have severe chondromalacia, which is basically pre-arthritis. I can do most things, but I wear a brace on my left knee, and will probably need another on my right eventually.

trelm249

I can relate to the bad knees. The weight only exacerbates knee problems. My cardio activities that work with my knees are:

walking - usually 3.5 to 4 mph on either the traedmill or the surrounding turf of the local soccer fields. No pavement for me, hurts to much the next day in the knees and hips.
recumbent stationary bike
swimming laps
tai-chi

Good luck.

nrvo

I'm not really "older", but my left knee is shot! Bumping for workout ideas!!!

michedarnd

Wow. Thanks, everybody! :-)

michedarnd

First of all the idea that "efficiency" will hurt your routine is mostly hooey. I don't know where the idea came from, but it's a misunderstanding of how the body works.

Is it hooey, or is it over-generalized? If I start a new exercise and do it for 20 minutes, and my heart rate is at 170 for most of the workout, aren't I burning more calories than I am when, 2 months later, I can maintain the same rate/intensity for the same period of time with my heart rate at 152?

I certainly raise the resistance (and go backwards) and speed. My goal is generally to maintain aconsistent level of effort (preferably as measured by a heart rate monitor), or to vary it (as measured by the same), but after a while, it certainly seems like the results change (decrease).

odusgolp

And I'd be very careful with Jillian Michaels videos! She HATES knees, I swear.

She ABSOLUTELY hates knees.

I am SO glad I read this... I was about to order one of her dvds. I have bum knees - one worse than the other (shattered my kneecap and tore tendons). Are there videos you would recommend?

Azdak

First of all the idea that "efficiency" will hurt your routine is mostly hooey. I don't know where the idea came from, but it's a misunderstanding of how the body works.

Is it hooey, or is it over-generalized? If I start a new exercise and do it for 20 minutes, and my heart rate is at 170 for most of the workout, aren't I burning more calories than I am when, 2 months later, I can maintain the same rate/intensity for the same period of time with my heart rate at 152?

I certainly raise the resistance (and go backwards) and speed. My goal is generally to maintain aconsistent level of effort (preferably as measured by a heart rate monitor), or to vary it (as measured by the same), but after a while, it certainly seems like the results change (decrease).

The problem is that, using an HRM as the standard, you are mistaking RELATIVE intensity for ABSOLUTE intensity. And you are assuming that HRMs measure calories when in fact they only measure heart rate--the calorie numbers they show are indirectly derived from algorithms based on the HR measurement.

At any given intensity, an aerobic activity has a relatively fixed energy cost. That energy cost does not change when your fitness level improves. What happens is that, because of exercise training, your MAXIMUM fitness level increases. Therefore, the fixed energy cost is now a LOWER percentage of your maximum. Because it is a lower percentage of your maximum, it feels easier.

And since max HR doesn't change, and since the workload now represents a lower percentage of maximum, the heart rate will be lower.

People assume that because heart rate is lower, calorie burn is lower. In fact, the error comes from the fact that the HRM does not recognize that your fitness level has improved and so it is working off of an outdated scale, so to speak.

The other confounding factor is that, as people improve their fitness level, they often lose weight. Now in that case, yes you will burn fewer calories--but not because of "efficiency" . It's because you weigh less.

So in answer to your original question, if weight has not changed, then YES you are burning roughly the same calories at a heart rate of 152 as you did at 170 weeks earlier, assuming that the workload is exactly the same. In some of the older Polar models (F6, F11) you could manually update your VO2max and "recalibrate" the scale. The newer models use different algorithms, so I don't know how they account for increases in fitness anymore.

Mechanical efficiency can be a factor long-term, but it probably only would account for a 3%-5% decrease and it would take a lot longer than a couple of months to see that change.

Keep in mind this has nothing to do with varying your training intensity--i.e. including easy, medium and hard workouts in your routine. Varying your intensity and duration are bedrock principles of fitness training. But they are necessary to improve fitness and endurance, not to "confuse" the body into burning more calories.

jjs22

I trashed my knees in high school (running, not enough stretching, erratic schedule). Now I'm 48 and just beginning to diet and get in shape.

Personally, I'd rather jab a rusty spike in my eye than do aerobic exercise on a machine indoors.

If I tried running at my current weight, I'd constantly worry about knee pain.

For now, my cardio is walking. At first, I would just walk at a leisurely pace. But over time, I've upped my pace quite a bit. Lately I've been doing walks at 5-6 MPH, which is kind of at the extreme of how fast I can get my legs to move in a walking motion. (I'm not quite eccentric/confident enough to try speed-walking in public !)

Anyway, I've definitely seen marked improvement in my heart rate, sweating, etc. while doing the same walk at the same pace. I'm very glad to learn that I am still burning the same calories !

The other exercise I *like* to do is swimming. Many people don't swim because, although they might know how to reach the other end of the pool, they don't know how to swim WELL. It's definitely worth learning ! Many, many years ago, I would take a break in my day and try swimming laps in a pool on campus. In the adjacent pool, there was a swimming class going on. I just kind of eavesdropped and picked up a few tips on form and technique, and guess what ? It makes a huge difference ! I went from resting at each end of the pool to doing continuous laps with flip turns after just a few sessions. And concentrating on form gives you something to think about.

My only beef with swimming is the restricted pool hours and having to share a lane with others. Maybe when I become rich !

michedarnd

I REALLY appreciate that thorough explanation, Azdak!