Clean Eating?

Pangui

So, as an engineer and skeptic who likes to do your research, are you really suggesting that because some researchers are older and have a PhD that they are to be believed more? Isn't science about evaluating the data and the arguments?

But, you are right in that age and experience do certainly have a say in our paradigms and, to paraphrase Max Plank, "Science progresses one funeral at a time."

No. I am suggesting that credentials matter. Age can bring wisdom, but not necessarily.

Pangui

Indeed. This is what many ancestral researchers do, although, from what I understand, they tend to focus on non-agricultural groups of people, who appear to have very few incidences of the diseases of modern agricultural societies (not just Americans). Take, for example, the Kitvans: http://wholehealthsource.blogspot.com/2008/08/kitavans-wisdom-from-pacific-islands.html or the Inuit: http://wholehealthsource.blogspot.com/2008/07/inuit-lessons-from-arctic.html

I looked at your links. Thank you for sharing. I find it timely as I am currently reading about how the peoples of Papua New Guinea evolved and developed differing diets, based largely upon the altitudes on the islands and their relative isolation. They are one of the few peoples alive today that often survive on a hunter-gatherer diet. The KitAvans to whom you reference are one of these such peoples. However, the bulk of their diet (according to the link you provided) is "primarily composed of tubers (yam, sweet potato, taro and cassava), fruit, vegetables, coconut and fish, in order of calories". This is exactly in line with the findings of Dr. Campbell's research of healthy diets.

As for the very unique case of the Inuits, one must certainly consider not only the relatively small size of their society, but also the extreme environmental conditions in which they live. Their diet may be perfect for their living situation, but it certainly doesn't translate well to a middle class American office worker.

I don't think we are that much in disagreement. I think we are just placing different values upon the timeline of evolution of the human diet. Neither one of us is suggesting people continue eating the Standard American Diet.

questionablemethods

No. I am suggesting that credentials matter.

The closer I get to defending my own PhD thesis (a couple months from now), the less I believe this. I certainly hope no one believes me on the basis of my credentials without having solid data and a sound analysis.

questionablemethods

Indeed. This is what many ancestral researchers do, although, from what I understand, they tend to focus on non-agricultural groups of people, who appear to have very few incidences of the diseases of modern agricultural societies (not just Americans). Take, for example, the Kitvans: http://wholehealthsource.blogspot.com/2008/08/kitavans-wisdom-from-pacific-islands.html or the Inuit: http://wholehealthsource.blogspot.com/2008/07/inuit-lessons-from-arctic.html

I looked at your links. Thank you for sharing. I find it timely as I am currently reading about how the peoples of Papua New Guinea evolved and developed differing diets, based largely upon the altitudes on the islands and their relative isolation. They are one of the few peoples alive today that often survive on a hunter-gatherer diet. The KitAvans to whom you reference are one of these such peoples. However, the bulk of their diet (according to the link you provided) is "primarily composed of tubers (yam, sweet potato, taro and cassava), fruit, vegetables, coconut and fish, in order of calories". This is exactly in line with the findings of Dr. Campbell's research of healthy diets.

I think that Dr. Campbell's overarching thesis is quite a bit stronger than this, though, and that is what I question.

As for the very unique case of the Inuits, one must certainly consider not only the relatively small size of their society, but also the extreme environmental conditions in which they live. Their diet may be perfect for their living situation, but it certainly doesn't translate well to a middle class American office worker.

I don't think we are that much in disagreement. I think we are just placing different values upon the timeline of evolution of the human diet. Neither one of us is suggesting people continue eating the Standard American Diet.

I don't think we're necessarily disagreeing either, but I wonder why you favor beginning forming research questions and hypotheses at the dawn of agriculture when that comprises such a very tiny fraction of our history as a species.

Edited to add another interesting group covered discussed on the Whole Health Source blog: http://wholehealthsource.blogspot.com/2008/06/masai-and-atherosclerosis.html

And my apologies to the original poster since this thread has gone quite far afield of the original question.

cloneme_losehalf

Wow, do I live in a box!!! Here I thought clean eating was the dietary laws found in the Old Testament of the Bible. I need to get out of my box more often and socialize with the rest of the world.

Topsking2010

Bump