DONT EAT AFTER 8PM!

iAMaPhoenix

I eat before bed, in bed and sometimes get up to eat. Wifey appreciates that!!! Thread hijacked.

sarahsmart88

i'll have to read the study, but some arbitrary cutoff time where eating somehow becomes bad is ridiculous

I agree. From my own research, it seems that it depends on your body and your eating patterns. Naturally, you don't burn a ton of calories while you sleep, so theoretically if you eat before bed you don't have much time to burn it off. However, people have various bedtimes, so one straight cut off for EVERYONE is nonsense.

I think more important than the time you eat, is how much eat. It's also important to spread out your calories through the day-- you shouldn't just gorge yourself at night and only nibble on snacks in the morning/day time.

Also, many people don't have time to work out until night, and I think it is very important to have post-workout calories to refuel your body and recover your muscles. Sometimes you just have to listen to your own body and actually get to know what works for you and what doesn't.

alkion

correlation =/= causation

Bingo!! Very basic, but so often ignored...!!

I was thinking someone was going to say this right before i pushed "enter" on my otherr post. That saying I don't like at all. That's like saying "just because eating too much sodium has been linked to high blood pressure, doesn't mean salt is the cause." Okay that's absolutely true... but it's also true, "just because because eating salt has been linked to high blood pressure DOESNT MEAN it's not related too." That cause != correlation, is completely dismissed.

killerqueen17

I was thinking someone was going to say this right before i pushed "enter" on my otherr post. That saying I don't like at all. That's like saying "just because eating too much sodium has been linked to high blood pressure, doesn't mean salt is the cause." Okay that's absolutely true... but it's also true, "just because because eating salt has been linked to high blood pressure DOESNT MEAN it's not related too." That cause != correlation, is completely dismissed.

Well yeah, but basically the saying means that the correlation alone is not enough to determine a cause. A correlation indicates nothing more than a relationship. Whether one variable causes the other must then be determined by additional study.

LorinaLynn

When my husband was on 2nd shift, I never had dinner before 8pm. And I typically have huge dinners.

Acg67

correlation =/= causation

Bingo!! Very basic, but so often ignored...!!

I was thinking someone was going to say this right before i pushed "enter" on my otherr post. That saying I don't like at all. That's like saying "just because eating too much sodium has been linked to high blood pressure, doesn't mean salt is the cause." Okay that's absolutely true... but it's also true, "just because because eating salt has been linked to high blood pressure DOESNT MEAN it's not related too." That cause != correlation, is completely dismissed.

"Epidemiological studies can only go to prove that an agent could have caused, but not that it did cause, an effect in any particular case"

Stolarz-Sk­rzypek K Et Al. Fatal and nonfatal outcomes, incidence of hypertensi­on, and blood pressure changes in relation to urinary sodium excretion. JAMA. 2011 May 4;305(17):­1777-85.

"CONCLUSIO­NS:

In this population­-based cohort, systolic blood pressure, but not diastolic pressure, changes over time aligned with change in sodium excretion, but this associatio­n did not translate into a higher risk of hypertensi­on or CVD complicati­ons. Lower sodium excretion was associated with higher CVD mortality.­"”

Corpsebride08

My husband gets home from work @ 2:30 a.m. and that is when we eat supper- we are to bed around 6 a.m. There is no way we could put 8 p.m. as a cut off time as we live night shift hours. We walk before bed and exercise in the late afternoon/early evenings (him on his days off). Since joining MFP I have already lost 13lbs (2 weeks) and 37 total since March. My husband is losing too so the 8 p.m. thing isn't a factor for us.

FearAnLoathing

Am I going to turn into a gremlin?

No a zombie
I ate last night at 8:01 and look at me now:sad:

lucythinmint

I have had people tell me this a lot. I used to try and follow it but I always felt like I was starving later on since I stay up super late at night.

And on top of that I get up super early to go running and if I stop eating that early I do not feel like I have enough energy to get through my run. Now I eat whenever I feel hungry.
I have a light snack before bed usually around 12M and when I get up at 530am to go run I feel better and have more energy.

I think it is just whatever works for the individual person. I have read a lot of studies that sound great but when I try them they don't work for me. Who knows?! :drinker:

alkion

I was thinking someone was going to say this right before i pushed "enter" on my otherr post. That saying I don't like at all. That's like saying "just because eating too much sodium has been linked to high blood pressure, doesn't mean salt is the cause." Okay that's absolutely true... but it's also true, "just because because eating salt has been linked to high blood pressure DOESNT MEAN it's not related too." That cause != correlation, is completely dismissed.

Well yeah, but basically the saying means that the correlation alone is not enough to determine a cause. A correlation indicates nothing more than a relationship. Whether one variable causes the other must then be determined by additional study.

I do understand what you're saying. I do agree with you. Everything is a relationship and anything can be said not to be the cause. I just finished my computer science major, and started my chemistry major this semester. We basically plot data, see results of things, and plot more data. Just what a scientist does. What i learned there are SOOOOOOOOOOOOO many errors in science it's crazy. For example, each person had to write data on the chaulk board. So we had like 30 samples. Then we heeded to make a trend line. Some people forgot to add "decimals" aka periods. Which completely threw the data off. My lab partner just sat back, and i'd record data, and i'd say "okay i measured this at .5 ml" he would just copy my answer. So we only have 1 sample out of test researches which would also lead to inaccurate results. Of course we're beginners in this field, but I can see how errors can be produced very easily.

alkion

People know to gain weight you need a caloric surplus. To lose weight you need a deficit. Lets say you burn 2000 calories a day. So if you eat 1500 calories a day you'd be in a caloric deficit. Doesn't matter if you eat 1500 calories in the morning, or evening, it's still 500 calorie deficit either way.

123456654321

Everyone knows that late night snacking and obesity are linked, but it has nothing to do with WHEN your eating. It has to do with the fact that typically people who eat at night eat MORE then people who don't. So basically, it all goes back to calories in vs calories out. If you stick to your calorie allowance, it doesn't matter when you eat. For a person who doesn't track calories...yes, eating at night may be a potential issue because generally people are less active,bored, alone, watching tv, reading, on the computer and it's easier to just mindlessly eat.

alkion

correlation =/= causation

Bingo!! Very basic, but so often ignored...!!

I was thinking someone was going to say this right before i pushed "enter" on my otherr post. That saying I don't like at all. That's like saying "just because eating too much sodium has been linked to high blood pressure, doesn't mean salt is the cause." Okay that's absolutely true... but it's also true, "just because because eating salt has been linked to high blood pressure DOESNT MEAN it's not related too." That cause != correlation, is completely dismissed.

"Epidemiological studies can only go to prove that an agent could have caused, but not that it did cause, an effect in any particular case"

Stolarz-Sk­rzypek K Et Al. Fatal and nonfatal outcomes, incidence of hypertensi­on, and blood pressure changes in relation to urinary sodium excretion. JAMA. 2011 May 4;305(17):­1777-85.

"CONCLUSIO­NS:

In this population­-based cohort, systolic blood pressure, but not diastolic pressure, changes over time aligned with change in sodium excretion, but this associatio­n did not translate into a higher risk of hypertensi­on or CVD complicati­ons. Lower sodium excretion was associated with higher CVD mortality.­"”

love your signature pic, it's funny. Here's the question though, how many "correlatoins" do you need for it to be determined as the cause? You know.

SiltyPigeon

Even if you totally STOPPED digesting your food at 8 PM (which is completely ridiculous, btw), a calorie is a calorie. It takes 3500 of them to gain a pound-- no matter what time you consume them. 200 calories after 8PM will effect your body the same as 200 calories before 8PM. Even if they sit in your stomach and don't get digested until morning... it's still the same calorie and you're not going to gain extra weight from it.

Acg67

love your signature pic, it's funny. Here's the question though, how many "correlatoins" do you need for it to be determined as the cause? You know.

you would need to design a controlled experiment controlling for all potential confounding factors to prove if something actually is the cause of something or not

maillemaker

Arg. This is a frustrating read.

There is not enough information in the article to make any comments.

If this was a scientific study, you can be pretty sure that the scientists understand that causation does not equal correlation. These people are quite well versed in biostatistics, and they understand how to control for variable and how to detect which variable are statistically significant and which are not. There are software packages that make it pretty easy to do this.

It should be pretty obvious to a scientist that if a fat person consumes more calories than a thin person it probably doesn't matter what time of day they eat those calories. So if you are eating more icecream after 8pm in addition to all the crap you eat all day long, it doesn't take a scientist to know that obviously you will be gaining weight.

It seems its hip to be anti-science these days, but scientists really do understand about things like correlation, causation, and statistical relevance.

Spitfirex007

Just so you don't eat right before crawling into bed, I don't think it matters. Even then a small snack shouldn't be a problem imo

channa007

Yeah I don't agree with it. I think it matters what you're eating and how much sleep you're getting to digest it. Also, I think it has to do with metabolism of the individual as well as the fitness they're getting.

HMonsterX

Acg, did you take that graph from one of my earlier posts, or are you a fellow Pastafarian?!

Huskeryogi

Arg. This is a frustrating read.

There is not enough information in the article to make any comments.

If this was a scientific study, you can be pretty sure that the scientists understand that causation does not equal correlation. These people are quite well versed in biostatistics, and they understand how to control for variable and how to detect which variable are statistically significant and which are not. There are software packages that make it pretty easy to do this.

It should be pretty obvious to a scientist that if a fat person consumes more calories than a thin person it probably doesn't matter what time of day they eat those calories. So if you are eating more icecream after 8pm in addition to all the crap you eat all day long, it doesn't take a scientist to know that obviously you will be gaining weight.

It seems its hip to be anti-science these days, but scientists really do understand about things like correlation, causation, and statistical relevance.

I'm not anti science - I'm anti journalist attempting to anaylze scientific research - they kinda suck at it. The link provided in this article didn't link to the study - it linked to ANOTHER article. At least the second article acknowleged the short comings of the study.

And I just found the actual study
RESEARCH METHODS AND PROCEDURES: Sixteen female rhesus monkeys (Macaca mulatta) were ovariectomized and placed on a high-fat diet to promote weight gain, and we examined whether monkeys that ate a high percentage of calories at night were more likely to gain weight than monkeys that ate the majority of calories during the day.

Then in the RESULTS section it says

However, the percentage of calorie intake occurring at night was not correlated with body weight (r = 0.04; p = 0.87) or weight gain (r = 0.07; p = 0.79) over the course of the study. Additionally, monkeys that showed the greatest nighttime calorie intake did not gain more weight (p = 0.94) than monkeys that showed the least nighttime calorie intake.

The study says the opposite of what the article says.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16421340

*edit - sorry that was the first study referenced (controlled)

Here's the study they are referencing

Abstract
Sleep duration has been linked to obesity and there is also an emerging literature in animals demonstrating a relationship between the timing of feeding and weight regulation. However, there is a paucity of research evaluating timing of sleep and feeding on weight regulation in humans. The goal of this study was to evaluate the role of sleep timing in dietary patterns and BMI. Participants included 52 (25 females) volunteers who completed 7 days of wrist actigraphy and food logs. Fifty-six percent were "normal sleepers" (midpoint of <5:30 AM) and 44% were "late sleepers" (midpoint of sleep ≥5:30 AM). Late sleepers had shorter sleep duration, later sleep onset and sleep offset and meal times. Late sleepers consumed more calories at dinner and after 8:00 PM, had higher fast food, full-calorie soda and lower fruit and vegetable consumption. Higher BMI was associated with shorter sleep duration, later sleep timing, caloric consumption after 8:00 PM, and fast food meals. In multivariate models, sleep timing was independently associated with calories consumed after 8:00 PM and fruit and vegetable consumption but did not predict BMI after controlling for sleep duration. Calories consumed after 8:00 PM predicted BMI after controlling for sleep timing and duration. These findings indicate that caloric intake after 8:00 PM may increase the risk of obesity, independent of sleep timing and duration. Future studies should investigate the biological and social mechanisms linking timing of sleep and feeding in order to develop novel time-based interventions for weight management.

How do they determine that it was the eating after 8 PM that caused the weight gain and not just that those people were more likely to eat high calorie meals?

Personal experience - I eat 75% of my calories after 6PM and 25% after 8PM and I've lost 23lbs.

stephreed11

"This probably applies to people who have a problem with night-time snacking. Not necessarily people that eat after 8 and it's part of their regular daily intake. I'm willing to guess that the people that are heavier that do eat after 8pm are eating that meal/snack after they've already had dinner and are already over in their daily allotment of calories.
I think as long as we are at a deficit, we'll be alright. It leaves your body less time to use it before you are sedentary and you'll probably be holding in your stomach when you weigh the next morning but I'm guessing that overall, it would not make a difference as long as the food isn't "extra"."

^ Agreed!

adross3

love psychology today. I eat 200 cals less than I am going to burn overnight. I know that I am going to burn 1000 cals. my BF% is dropping. Go figure. Know your cal burn cycles and eat to fuel them, but not to store fat during that time.

R4z0r4Mm0

This is just as funny as the myth that breakfast is the most important meal of the day.

kaorihana13

It's definitely true that snacking after 8pm will kill your sleep cycle, your body needs to relax for sleeping and eating will gve more energy and that is why some people have trouble sleeping at night. Think about it, we eat during the day to stay energized why do we need to eat before bed when we're just going to sleep?

tigersword

Ok, "studies" are sometimes fun. Sometimes their conclusions attempt to draw causality out of what may correlation. As the two concepts aren't the same, they probably shouldn't be treated the same.

Not having read the study, though, I'm a little suspicious. If they can't point to an observable, bioochemical mechanism, they're really just grasping at straws. It's all well and good to notice patterns, but a single pattern does not a rule make.

The study was actually about sleep timing and weight gain, not meal timing and weight gain. Definitely a correlation, and not a causality.

cupotee

without reading the article, for me, this is true. for one week over the summer i slept over a friends' house, and her family ate dinner very early (6pm). We hung out all night and didn't eat. At the end of the week, I realized I'd eaten about 400 calories less every day without effort. i think it all has to do with habits. people who eat at night tend to be heavier because at night, they are watching tv/surfing the internet and eating mindlessly, leading for more opportunities to overeat, leading to being overweight. I doubt the correlation has a lot to do with metabolic rate after a certain set hour.

With that said, i find that having lunch for breakfast, dinner for lunch, and breakfast for dinner works extremely well at controlling my calories.

HMonsterX

It's definitely true that snacking after 8pm will kill your sleep cycle, your body needs to relax for sleeping and eating will gve more energy and that is why some people have trouble sleeping at night. Think about it, we eat during the day to stay energized why do we need to eat before bed when we're just going to sleep?

Im the opposite, I can't sleep if I'm hungry.

So while it may be true for you, you can't say its a true fact as everyone is different.

skinnyinnotime

I think it's a load of rubbish (trash) makes no difference at all when you eat, why would you body know what time it was anyway and even if it did why would calorie burning suddenly decrease? Makes no sense at all.

I've never had weight issues other than after pregnancies, (shedding the baby weight) and have eaten whenever I wanted, regardless of the clock.

skinnyinnotime

It's definitely true that snacking after 8pm will kill your sleep cycle, your body needs to relax for sleeping and eating will gve more energy and that is why some people have trouble sleeping at night. Think about it, we eat during the day to stay energized why do we need to eat before bed when we're just going to sleep?

What a load of tosh, I often feel sleepy after eating and could easily take a nap as it makes me feel cosy and content.

It might apply to you, but certainly not to everyone!

Lift_hard_eat_big

It's definitely true that snacking after 8pm will kill your sleep cycle, your body needs to relax for sleeping and eating will gve more energy and that is why some people have trouble sleeping at night. Think about it, we eat during the day to stay energized why do we need to eat before bed when we're just going to sleep?

You're wrong, I get the "Itis" after I eat ribs and can fall asleep in a few minutes.