Cheaters never win? What do you think?

SarabellPlus3

Well, of course cheaters sometimes win. It's like "crime doesn't pay," and Yogi Berra (I think?) responded that of course crime pays. Otherwise there wouldn't be crime. LOL Of course, it's a gamble.

Would I cheat in exercise? Sure. It depends what your goals are, I guess. I want to be hot, but I also want to have a healthy heart, and a strong body; those are the reasons I do this. If I had a pill that ensured I healthily had that, sure I'd take the pill! It's not really a MORALS question for me, in the least, littlest bit.

My morals are more focused on doing good, not hurting people, etc. How I excersize... Um, I guess it just has nothing to do with it. If I could press a button and teleport to Target this afternoon, that'd be cheating compared to having to get there the old fashioned way. But so what? It's not hurting anyone, it's not really a moral concern for me.

FauxNinja

Of course people would cheat. If every one were committed to getting in shape via exercise and healthy consumption, the diet supplement and exercise gimmicks industries wouldn't be a multi billion dollar industry.

People would much rather take a pill than get off their *ss and get to work.

ninerbuff

Honey, Carrot Top is all real...I used to go to the same gym as him before I moved to WI. He works HARD for his body!

As for me...I honestly don't think I would. Karma always seems to have her eye on me...I usually pay pretty hard for the mistakes and easy routes I take, so no.

Trust me, Carrot Top is enhanced. Yes you have to eat right a work out hard to attain it, but there's NO WAY he gained that much mass in so little time (with very little body fat) without anabolics. I've worked around enough pro and amateur bodybuilders to know the tell tale signs.

ninerbuff

I don't think I could do it. It wouldn't mean anything if it just happened.

You could sport a bikini and buy all the cute clothes you want at that point? Still no?

withchaco

If there were no negative consequences.....could you still call it cheating?

Lol, how many CEO's , and banks have gone on trial for the complete scam they ran on America so they could make money?

.....so your saying there isn't any negative consequences to actions like that? Even if they got away with it, how about those who were scammed? There are definitely always negative effects when someone cheats.

If eating nothing but cakes cakes and ice cream and doing nothing but playing video games all day had no negative effects on our health or the health of those around us....then they wouldn't be unhealthy anymore and doing it wouldn't be cheating. Just sayin.

**That said, if I could do whatever I wanted, whenever I wanted without any negative effects to myself or those around me.....yes, I'd do it. I wouldn't feel that was cheating though.

Fully agreed!

AlsDonkBoxSquat

So while training a client we were discussing football and some of the great players past and present. He also brought up that they as well as many Olympians use enhancement drugs (not just steroids, but drugs to enhance their performance) to beat the competition. I didn't disagree. But growing up I was, and I'm sure most were taught this way, that cheaters never win or prosper. Well the more I thought about it, I find the statement more as a "feel good" statement rather than a true one.
Fanny Mae, Freddy Mac, CEO's of hedge funds, politicians etc. have "cheated" to get money or ahead. Many an Olympian has been busted, but got their money before being caught. There are countless cheaters in the Capitalism market out there that cheat people every day and make millions. So to say that they don't prosper, I think isn't the right term.
Anyway after thinking about it, it made me come up with this question:

If you could "cheat" your way to having the body/physique in a week, would you cheat to do it? Or are your morals higher than that?
There's no right or wrong answer here, I'm just curious to see how many would honestly do it and see if cheating is a losing cause in this situation.

So would you or wouldn't you?

I enjoyed the road as much as I've enjoyed the results. Having that instant gratification removes the satisfaction of having put in the hard work to get here, the hours of trying to understand the balance of my body has taught me patience and lessons about myself that I wouldn't have learned otherwise. The gradual melting away of the jagged edges of my psyche while I melted away the pounds and the ever decreasing pant sizes to go along with both. No, I wouldn't give that up, I still relish my workouts. My exercise routine gives me something to look forward to at the end of the day that is purely about me instead of doing something in support of my household, which when you are an aerobics instructor can become a fine line, reminding myself that the dishes will still be there and can wait until I've sweated out the day. Nope, absolutely not.

SarabellPlus3

Actually, just to say, those examples are "cheating" because they hurt someone, are illegal, or are dishonestly breaking the rules of a game agreed to. That's wrong. It's not wrong BECAUSE it's a shortcut. Instead of taking the long route to work, I take a shortcut. it's not morally wrong, it's just a shorter path. If I was lying about it, or hurting someone through it, THAT would be wrong.

ninerbuff

If there are no negative consequences, it doesn't hurt anyone, then it doesn't seem like cheating. What is the cheating part? The other examples you are using - they hurt people. They ruined lives. Whether they get punished or not doesn't mean there are no implications for them. Guilt is a big thing. So, if I frauded people out of large amounts of money, I would feel guilt. In this hypothetical situation - where is the harm to others to cause the guilt? Does someone else get my excess weight? Is it illegal to use this method?

I used big business, but for example look at Sylvester Stallone. His "HRT" doesn't hurt anyone, yet he's been able to profit (by still doing action movies) from using them. Arnold was a steroid user. Mark McGwire and Sammy Sosa basically revived baseball because of their steroid use.
And trust me, the big business guys felt no guilt or they would have never concocted the scam in the first place. They knew the consequences but since it wouldn't affect them monetarily, they had no guilt in doing it.
The only real harm in the hypothetical is just your own ethics and how you may be perceived. Barry Bonds broke the homerun record, yet pure baseball fans won't acknowledge it because he "cheated".

vim_n_vigor

I don't think I could do it. It wouldn't mean anything if it just happened.

You could sport a bikini and buy all the cute clothes you want at that point? Still no?

I COULD sport a bikini now, others may not appreciate it yet (LOL). To be cheating, there has to be some sort of a negative somewhere. I think it would be a huge psychological issue to transform from 200+ pounds to 130 in a week. My brain would not be able to handle it and it would require a lot of therapy and adjustment. 20 pounds? Maybe. That doesn't change me into a completely different person.

ninerbuff

.....so your saying there isn't any negative consequences to actions like that? Even if they got away with it, how about those who were scammed? There are definitely always negative effects when someone cheats.

If eating nothing but cakes cakes and ice cream and doing nothing but playing video games all day had no negative effects on our health or the health of those around us....then they wouldn't be unhealthy anymore and doing it wouldn't be cheating. Just sayin.

**That said, if I could do whatever I wanted, whenever I wanted without any negative effects to myself or those around me.....yes, I'd do it. I wouldn't feel that was cheating though.

No I was saying the "cheaters" weren't affected. They made out good. And are still making out good.

ninerbuff

I enjoyed the road as much as I've enjoyed the results. Having that instant gratification removes the satisfaction of having put in the hard work to get here, the hours of trying to understand the balance of my body has taught me patience and lessons about myself that I wouldn't have learned otherwise. The gradual melting away of the jagged edges of my psyche while I melted away the pounds and the ever decreasing pant sizes to go along with both. No, I wouldn't give that up, I still relish my workouts. My exercise routine gives me something to look forward to at the end of the day that is purely about me instead of doing something in support of my household, which when you are an aerobics instructor can become a fine line, reminding myself that the dishes will still be there and can wait until I've sweated out the day. Nope, absolutely not.

I am also with you here. I busted my *kitten* to get to where I'm at now, and fully enjoyed doing it. For me it helped to shape me not only physically, but mentally as well. I've carried the same discipline to my work, my life and free time.

ninerbuff

I COULD sport a bikini now, others may not appreciate it yet (LOL). To be cheating, there has to be some sort of a negative somewhere. I think it would be a huge psychological issue to transform from 200+ pounds to 130 in a week. My brain would not be able to handle it and it would require a lot of therapy and adjustment. 20 pounds? Maybe. That doesn't change me into a completely different person.

Okay, so let's make that the NEGATIVE. You get the body you want now, BUT you have to eat the correct way to keep it or you gain all the weight back. Alright new hypothetical.

123456654321

.....so your saying there isn't any negative consequences to actions like that? Even if they got away with it, how about those who were scammed? There are definitely always negative effects when someone cheats.

If eating nothing but cakes cakes and ice cream and doing nothing but playing video games all day had no negative effects on our health or the health of those around us....then they wouldn't be unhealthy anymore and doing it wouldn't be cheating. Just sayin.

**That said, if I could do whatever I wanted, whenever I wanted without any negative effects to myself or those around me.....yes, I'd do it. I wouldn't feel that was cheating though.

No I was saying the "cheaters" weren't affected. They made out good. And are still making out good.

Maybe, maybe not. People do carry emotional burdens when they lie, cheat and they cause harm to others.

......that's besides the point though. You are totally confusing me now. Are you saying that our decision would or would not have any negative effects on our health and the health of those around us or not?

ArroganceInStep

I already have, I know how to cut weight and I've done it before. I lost almost 70 pounds in three months on the 'eat almost exclusively yogurt and workout like crazy' diet. I looked good at the end of it too...when I came off the diet though I gained over 90 pounds in about 5 months. 20+ pounds and the wear and tear on my body was a pretty stiff price to pay.

All short cuts have consequences of some kind, if not to you than to others. If they didn't it wouldn't be a short cut, it would be the way. So if you're asking would I not diet if eating cake and playing video games all day was a safe and healthy way to lose weight, I'd say no, I would still diet--the cake n' video games diet!

If you're asking would I cut weight like I did in the past with the consequences, the answer is maybe. There are certain things for which I think the consequences are worthwhile. If I'm not able to meet my weight loss goals, and honestly probably even if I am, I most certainly will be cutting weight leading up to my wedding. I'll take the hit on my body to make sure I look as fit as I possibly can for my future wife on our wedding day. If I start competing in martial arts competitively again, probably. I'm extremely competitive, and I play to win. Beyond that? Would I do it just in general because it's...you know...a Wednesday? Probably not. It's not sustainable and it isn't worth it.

vim_n_vigor

I COULD sport a bikini now, others may not appreciate it yet (LOL). To be cheating, there has to be some sort of a negative somewhere. I think it would be a huge psychological issue to transform from 200+ pounds to 130 in a week. My brain would not be able to handle it and it would require a lot of therapy and adjustment. 20 pounds? Maybe. That doesn't change me into a completely different person.

Okay, so let's make that the NEGATIVE. You get the body you want now, BUT you have to eat the correct way to keep it or you gain all the weight back. Alright new hypothetical.

Nope, but you are a great salesman! I had a great body at one time. I used to run, lift weights, play basketball, you name it. I was super healthy and in great shape. I could wear whatever I wanted. I thought I was fat. My mind couldn't appreciate what I really had. I am working now to get the body I want. Each success gives me a sense of accomplishment. I have a pile of clothes already that I can no longer wear. I did it. The only way that I could see saying yes to this hypothetical is if there was an immediate health reason caused by my current weight that would make it so I could not take the time to work it off. Then I could. It would be life saving.

ArroganceInStep

And for the 'no negative effects to you but potential negative effects to others'...well how much do I like the guy?

ninerbuff

Maybe, maybe not. People do carry emotional burdens when they lie, cheat and they cause harm to others.

......that's besides the point though. You are totally confusing me now. Are you saying that our decision would or would not have any negative effects on our health and the health of those around us or not?

Well the new add on is that you have to conform to eating correctly to maintain the body or you gain all the weight back.

sharonsjones

Maybe, maybe not. People do carry emotional burdens when they lie, cheat and they cause harm to others.

......that's besides the point though. You are totally confusing me now. Are you saying that our decision would or would not have any negative effects on our health and the health of those around us or not?

Well the new add on is that you have to conform to eating correctly to maintain the body or you gain all the weight back.

Still wouldn't do it. I don't know many people that if all of a sudden they were exactly where they wanted to be, but had to eat healthy and exercise to maintain could do it. If they knew how to do it already wouldn't need to cheat then, they would already be there.

123456654321

Maybe, maybe not. People do carry emotional burdens when they lie, cheat and they cause harm to others.

......that's besides the point though. You are totally confusing me now. Are you saying that our decision would or would not have any negative effects on our health and the health of those around us or not?

Well the new add on is that you have to conform to eating correctly to maintain the body or you gain all the weight back.

ahhh I see I see. Yes, I'd still do it. I'd keep it up for sure though.

ILiftHeavyAcrylics

Depends-- if there were no consequences I'd totally do it. I'm not a goal oriented or competitive person. I hate to exercise. If I could just not do exercise that'd be awesome to me. I do enjoy the healthier eater so I would probably keep that.

But if it's like having a genie (you wish for a new car so your parents die and you inherit theirs) with some kind of unintended consequences or bad side then no.

ILiftHeavyAcrylics

I COULD sport a bikini now, others may not appreciate it yet (LOL). To be cheating, there has to be some sort of a negative somewhere. I think it would be a huge psychological issue to transform from 200+ pounds to 130 in a week. My brain would not be able to handle it and it would require a lot of therapy and adjustment. 20 pounds? Maybe. That doesn't change me into a completely different person.

Okay, so let's make that the NEGATIVE. You get the body you want now, BUT you have to eat the correct way to keep it or you gain all the weight back. Alright new hypothetical.

I would do that in a heartbeat. :P

foremant86

They may be rich but they're morally bankrupt and honestly i'd rather be poor than morally bankrupt.


No i wouldn't cheat. Cheating always has bad side effects, no matter what it is you're cheating at.

ArroganceInStep

Slight hijack of the thread because I think it's related and am honestly curious (and also because I'm far too lazy to create my own post)

A person once asked me this and it REALLY stuck with me. Thinking about it is one of the primary reasons I chose to change my lifestyle habits from my more extreme tendencies to one that is more balanced and sustainable.

Would you rather weigh 150 pounds but look like you weigh 300 or weigh 300 pounds but look like you weight 150.

To be specific, the numbers aren't important, but would you want to have a healthy, functioning body and enjoy all of the long term life benefits tied with that but at the same time look morbidly obese. Or would you rather look fit and slender but actually be unhealthy and have to deal with the health consequences. And this is not like on the brink of death or anything. I'm nearly 300 pounds myself. According to the doctor, all things considered, I'm pretty healthy. I do have lower back pain though, I have to worry about things like diabetes and such as well. Those kinds of health consequences, where the answer isn't quite as obvious or is a long way away..

When I answered honestly, it was the latter, because I did care what people thought of me. Was an eye-opener for me at least.

So would you rather cheat and be unhealthy, or do it right and not look like you've gotten anywhere?

ninerbuff

Slight hijack of the thread because I think it's related and am honestly curious (and also because I'm far too lazy to create my own post)

A person once asked me this and it REALLY stuck with me. Thinking about it is one of the primary reasons I chose to change my lifestyle habits from my more extreme tendencies to one that is more balanced and sustainable.

Would you rather weigh 150 pounds but look like you weigh 300 or weigh 300 pounds but look like you weight 150.

To be specific, the numbers aren't important, but would you want to have a healthy, functioning body and enjoy all of the long term life benefits tied with that but at the same time look morbidly obese. Or would you rather look fit and slender but actually be unhealthy and have to deal with the health consequences. And this is not like on the brink of death or anything. I'm nearly 300 pounds myself. According to the doctor, all things considered, I'm pretty healthy. I do have lower back pain though, I have to worry about things like diabetes and such as well. Those kinds of health consequences, where the answer isn't quite as obvious or is a long way away..

When I answered honestly, it was the latter, because I did care what people thought of me. Was an eye-opener for me at least.

So would you rather cheat and be unhealthy, or do it right and not look like you've gotten anywhere?

There are lots of people that I know who are of normal weight yet suffer from some malady. One has fibro and another diabetes.
I'd always choose health over looks.

vim_n_vigor

Slight hijack of the thread because I think it's related and am honestly curious (and also because I'm far too lazy to create my own post)

A person once asked me this and it REALLY stuck with me. Thinking about it is one of the primary reasons I chose to change my lifestyle habits from my more extreme tendencies to one that is more balanced and sustainable.

Would you rather weigh 150 pounds but look like you weigh 300 or weigh 300 pounds but look like you weight 150.

To be specific, the numbers aren't important, but would you want to have a healthy, functioning body and enjoy all of the long term life benefits tied with that but at the same time look morbidly obese. Or would you rather look fit and slender but actually be unhealthy and have to deal with the health consequences. And this is not like on the brink of death or anything. I'm nearly 300 pounds myself. According to the doctor, all things considered, I'm pretty healthy. I do have lower back pain though, I have to worry about things like diabetes and such as well. Those kinds of health consequences, where the answer isn't quite as obvious or is a long way away..

When I answered honestly, it was the latter, because I did care what people thought of me. Was an eye-opener for me at least.

So would you rather cheat and be unhealthy, or do it right and not look like you've gotten anywhere?

I would rather be healthy.

MisterDubs303

No surgery or physical complications. You just get to have the body you want. So would you cheat?

That's the only kind of cheating I can think of. There are pros and cons to all other methods, but nothing is cheating, short of surgery (I'm not referring to bariatric surgery, but liposuction). If I could take a pill and maintain attain health and a healthy weight, I would. I would almost consider it irresponsible not to, at least until I was down to a maintenance weight.

Not to be a stick in the mud, but I have a hard time comparing this to the sports examples. Those cheaters are not winners, they are merely trophy stands.

SarabellPlus3

Well, how about this... If someone walked up to me now, and gave me a million dollars, would I take it? Is it immoral to take it, knowing that I could decline, work my butt off, and possibly eventually earn some money? I don't know why it would be. Unless it was stolen or hurt someone in some way, it would nit be immoral to take the money (or, as it were) the hot, healthy body.