Has anyone read "Skinny *****?"

wannaBme

Back a few posts you asked me why i thought cheese was addicting.

My first hint was trying to give it up myself and failing miserably. Then I asked several people if they had ever gone without cheese ... full fat or low fat ... have you ever quit cheese?

Grilled cheese, nacho cheese, feta cheese, cheesy macaroni, Big Mac with cheese, pasta & parmesan cheese, caesar salad with cheese, bagels and cream cheese, cottage cheese, cheddar cheese, ... Seriously, how many people have ever given all of those up ?

So i looked it up ... as you can ... search "cheese addiction" and you will find articles like this.

Why is cheese so addicting? Certainly not because of its aroma, which is perilously close to old socks. The first hint of a biochemical explanation came in 1981, when scientists at Wellcome Research Laboratories in Research Triangle Park, N.C., found a substance in dairy products that looked remarkably like morphine. After a complex series of tests, they determined that, surprisingly enough, it actually was morphine. By a fluke of nature, the enzymes that produce opiates are not confined to poppies -- they also hide inside cows' livers. So traces of morphine can pass into the animal's bloodstream and end up in milk and milk products. The amounts are far too small to explain cheese's appeal. But nonetheless, the discovery led scientists on their search for opiate compounds in dairy products.

And they found them. Opiates hide inside casein, the main dairy protein. As casein molecules are digested, they break apart to release tiny opiate molecules, called casomorphins. One of these compounds has about one-tenth the opiate strength of morphine. The especially addicting power of cheese may be due to the fact that the process of cheese-making removes water, lactose and whey proteins so that casein is concentrated. Scientists are now trying to tease out whether these opiate molecules work strictly within the digestive tract or whether they pass into the bloodstream and reach the brain directly.

This is wannaBme talking again ...
Interestingly enough, they even add "casein" to soy cheeses. So it is very important to read the labels on our foods.

Back to the B*tches that wrote the Skinny book. As I said in the very beginning, I didn't not appreciate their language, and I do believe that it is a big mark against them (for example there are people I would like to pass some of the animal industry info on to ... but I could never recommend the book because of the language) ... but SB writers use that "shock" factor to try and shake people up ... starting with the title ... begging them to think out side the industry, and get themselves informed about what they are put in their mouths.

In their promotion of Vegetarian and Veganism they were careful mention the down side of that journey (lack of B vitamins, especially B 12) and a few other points.

I would hardly call trying a vegetarian diet dangerous though, compared to a typical american diet that consists of low nutrient highly processed preserved meals.

songbyrdsweet

Actually, I don't eat cheese.

Okay, you found one article claiming that traces of opiates are found in milk, but they're so small that it can't explain why people like cheese...so at that point, the article nulls the hypothesis that cheese is actually addictive.

I have to be honest and say that conspiracy theorists rub me the wrong way. No one goes into actual cheese withdrawal. If you wanted to move in that direction, stop eating chocolate, spicy foods, and don't exercise. They're all 'addictive' because they increase a certain neurotransmitter that makes us feel good.

Hannah_Banana

Actually, I don't eat cheese.

Okay, you found one article claiming that traces of opiates are found in milk, but they're so small that it can't explain why people like cheese...so at that point, the article nulls the hypothesis that cheese is actually addictive.

I have to be honest and say that conspiracy theorists rub me the wrong way. No one goes into actual cheese withdrawal. If you wanted to move in that direction, stop eating chocolate, spicy foods, and don't exercise. They're all 'addictive' because they increase a certain neurotransmitter that makes us feel good.

Ditto :flowerforyou: At least about the conspiracy theory thing. I don't really get the neurotransmitter part

wannaBme

You asked me why I thought Cheese was addictive.
I just answered the question with my personal experience and an article.
You can be interested or null it as you did.

Granted you can find an article any where on the internet in favor or not, on any given subject. Which is one of THE most frustrating things for me and a lot of other people. There is so much conflicting information on diet and health and cancer prevention. Mind boggling !! if we let it be.

I've just taken my out stretched arm and swiped everything off the table. I'm start out fresh. Going with my gut feeling and ... how my gut feels. I'm starting my days with a fresh orange, then an apple or maybe a banana. Then fresh salads galore with vegies and nuts and seed and homemade dressing, then fresh BB muffins, crisp crackers, humus ... the options are endless ... and a smaller, healthy body is my reward.

keiko

I want to know if this Skinny stuff is true then why do I know overweight vegans/vegetarians?

Also I eat cheese if it's in something like lasagna or on pizza but I don't crave it or eat it just to eat it.

nightangelstars

Actually, I don't eat cheese.

Okay, you found one article claiming that traces of opiates are found in milk, but they're so small that it can't explain why people like cheese...so at that point, the article nulls the hypothesis that cheese is actually addictive.

I have to be honest and say that conspiracy theorists rub me the wrong way. No one goes into actual cheese withdrawal. If you wanted to move in that direction, stop eating chocolate, spicy foods, and don't exercise. They're all 'addictive' because they increase a certain neurotransmitter that makes us feel good.

Also a point to make here, as the psychologist in the 'room', is that anything can be 'addictive'. It's not all about chemicals and neurotransmitters all the time, although that certainly plays a big part in the vast majority of cases! One can become addicted to alcohol, cigarettes, marijuana; but one can also become addicted to gambling, sex, and even exercise - yes there are actually people in the world addicted to exercising.

So to say something is 'addictive' is rather a subjective term - I think books are addictive, but most people wouldn't agree with me. It all boils down to the individuality point that everyone was making before - some people become addicted to certain things and activities while others quit cold-turkey things that are supposed to be horrendously addictive. It's all about you and knowing yourself. I have no intention of giving up my cheese, at any rate!

wannaBme

I want to know if this Skinny stuff is true then why do I know overweight vegans/vegetarians?

My guess is .. that they are eating more processed foods than fresh ones. Additives and other processing toxins can wreck havic on the body's systems. Never mind the high fat, high simple carb content of a lot of processed foods, fast foods, and snack foods. You'll have to ask them for the exact answer though.

brazilsgirl

wannaBme,

I happened to skim through your original question, and went to Borders tonight with my husband. I saw the book so I was curious to see what they said about meat. Funny thing is that I took my newborn to the pediatrician this week and long story short, she does not recommend any milk once the child stops breastfeeding. She said that there are plenty of studies that prove that animal protein does leach calcium from bones, thus inducing osteoporosis, and it also worsens chronic diseases. And what's worse, for kids it can cause early chronic diabetis etc. I'm a carnivore myself as so is everyone in my family, but I'm always eager to learn more and if that's truly the case I'll definitely curb our animal protein eating habits.

She gave me a few referrals for reading so I'll pass it along to you and anyone else who may be interested. The main authors are Dean Ornish MD, and Mark Hyman MD. Dr Hyman has a website called www.ultrawellness.com that I haven't quite investigated, but it looks really good. Dr. Ornish was a physicial advisor to Pres. Clinton during his administration, so I would say they are pretty proficient in the subject.

Hannah_Banana

wannaBme,

I happened to skim through your original question, and went to Borders tonight with my husband. I saw the book so I was curious to see what they said about meat. Funny thing is that I took my newborn to the pediatrician this week and long story short, she does not recommend any milk once the child stops breastfeeding. She said that there are plenty of studies that prove that animal protein does leach calcium from bones, thus inducing osteoporosis, and it also worsens chronic diseases. And what's worse, for kids it can cause early chronic diabetis etc. I'm a carnivore myself as so is everyone in my family, but I'm always eager to learn more and if that's truly the case I'll definitely curb our animal protein eating habits.

She gave me a few referrals for reading so I'll pass it along to you and anyone else who may be interested. The main authors are Dean Ornish MD, and Mark Hyman MD. Dr Hyman has a website called www.ultrawellness.com that I haven't quite investigated, but it looks really good. Dr. Ornish was a physicial advisor to Pres. Clinton during his administration, so I would say they are pretty proficient in the subject.

Again, I think it comes down to personal choice right now. There are studies both ways. I know that my sons pediatrician would laugh at that. Doctors are people too. Since we don't know the 'truth' yet, everyone creates their own. :flowerforyou:

Fitness_Chick

Education is key. Read lots, learn lots and then make your own choices and decision. javascript:add_smiley('laugh','post_body')

To the nay sayers about the book ...

Why are we the only nation in the world that drinks milk AND we have the highest osteoperosis rate?
Would you suck on your mothers boob at 30 years old? or more appropriately a cows teat ?
Nature made cows milk to turn an 80 pound calf into a 2000 pound animal. Is that what the population resembles? big fat cows?

How about people who figure out that they are lactose intolerant. Actually, almost every human older than 4 is lactose intolerant, as they no longer NEED milk to survive. So the industry, not wanting to lose consumers, makes an altered product that has the lactose removed so now it is "disgestible" for those lactose intolerant. Give your head a shake !

And cheese ... don't get me started on cheese. Cheese is so addicting, and the industry damn well knows it. So it's everywhere to keep us coming back for more.

North America has the highest obesity rate. Why? because we are rich and can afford good food?
... or because the food industry has made cheap crap to fill us up so they can make money?
Just take a look people! Crap food everywhere, filled with stuff you can't even pronounce. The diet industry is making billions by filling us up with more fake synthetic cancer causing promises.

this whole farce infuriates me because I have been lead down the garden path for years. I've tired reading this ... and that ... tried new diet trends ... only to be bigger than I was when I started to "get healthy". I am pissed off at the constant brain washing and food advertising and the lies, ALL for the sake of the oh mighty dollar.

I don't need to be certified in anything to finally figure this out, and neither do the girls who researched many hours for their book.

Well, we'll have to agree to disagree. I don't know of anything in cheese that has addictive properties. We are fat because we overeat because it takes time and effort to count calories and exercise.
We aren't all lactose intolerant. Some of us continue to express the lac operon, some of us don't. It's no different from us having different hair colors. Also, the lactose isn't removed, they just add the lactase enzyme to it. For those of us who don't express the lac operon, the lactase helps us break down the lactose. The smaller sugars are still used just like they would be if we'd produced the lactase ourselves.

You don't have to research anything to have an opinion. But it's better to research so you don't come off as offensive or can't support your claims.

YOU ROCK CHICK, you simply ROCK!! So much wisdom in so few of years!! Can't even begin to imagine where you'll be after finishing school...you have such a bright future and the world is open to all things for a woman such as yourself SongBSweet:flowerforyou: :flowerforyou: \

FC

Awwwe, thank you my dear!! I'm glad all my time studying at home like a hermit can help others out LOL! :laugh: Hopefully I won't be living in a box from all the debt after I'm done with my PhD! :bigsmile:

well you can paint it and it'll purty it right up! Remember refrigerator boxes when we were little, they were fun then!! lol I know you are near 5 foot so.........well, just sayin is all!!

FC:laugh:

LOL I could probably stand up in a fridge box haha!

:bigsmile: :laugh:

Fitness_Chick

cheese, I can take it or leave it....not that important in my life... never heard of being addicted to cheese...never heard of cheese eaters anonymous..BUT lots of things I'm quite sure I haven't heard of.... no cheese for you, cheese for you, to each his own. Guess I'm not addicted to cheeese I do like cheese sometimes though.....

well I"ve heard some don't eat anything with a face

SoupNazi

After reading all of this, I must say......SBS is someone who ,after almost a year ,I have religiously believed in and read every bit of knowledge she posts. She knows her stuff and would buy her book ANYDAY over whoever wrote that book.

She truly is educated and I revel in the knowledge of everything she shares with us.

That being said......you go SBS! never would I read a book called "Skinny *****" I would, however, read SBS"s book called "Strong *****".:drinker:

Hannah_Banana

After reading all of this, I must say......SBS is someone who ,after almost a year ,I have religiously believed in and read every bit of knowledge she posts. She knows her stuff and would buy her book ANYDAY over whoever wrote that book.

She truly is educated and I revel in the knowledge of everything she shares with us.

That being said......you go SBS! never would I read a book called "Skinny *****" I would, however, read SBS"s book called "Strong *****".:drinker:

Ditto! :drinker:

Fitness_Chick

She gave me a few referrals for reading so I'll pass it along to you and anyone else who may be interested. The main authors are Dean Ornish MD, and Mark Hyman MD. Dr Hyman has a website called www.ultrawellness.com that I haven't quite investigated, but it looks really good. Dr. Ornish was a physicial advisor to Pres. Clinton during his administration, so I would say they are pretty proficient in the subject.

I recall reading a number of books years ago by Dean Ornish, very good books, sound advice, I don't recall him saying anything against milk back then but his books have changed with the times. Do you have a particular website your doc gave you for him? I can sure google but wondered if something in particular was given to you regarding him?

Thanks!:bigsmile:

nguill6

I read parts of it because my roomie was going to try it. Basically they suggest you eat vegan. While I don't eat meat, I will NEVER give up eggs, milk or honey! Also, green tea and half a grape fruit is not a sustainable breakfast; I don't care what anyone says. This is probably the reason they are *****es as well as skinny- who wouldn't be irritable on a diet like that!

stef_e_b

I bought it and went on their "diet" for a month and I just felt awful, weak and tired all the time. I didn't even have the benefit of losing weight. I think it was a waste of time.

nightangelstars

I read parts of it because my roomie was going to try it. Basically they suggest you eat vegan. While I don't eat meat, I will NEVER give up eggs, milk or honey! Also, green tea and half a grape fruit is not a sustainable breakfast; I don't care what anyone says. This is probably the reason they are *****es as well as skinny- who wouldn't be irritable on a diet like that!

:laugh: :laugh: :drinker:

weesel80

I read the book and found it entertaining, but for me personally, not a meal plan I would follow. I think you need a healthy balance of all food groups in your diet. And exercise at a moderate level for at least 30 minutes a day. If you do these 2, you should lose weight, or for those who don't need to lose weight, maintain it. Funny, isn't what they were saying back in the 1950s?? LOL...:laugh:

AJCM

Recently, on the Martha Stewart show, Dr. Andrew Weil said that the main group in North America who promotes dairy as "healthy" is the dairy council/industry!!! So just be aware.

Most of the vitamins in the processed milk that appears in the grocery stores has had the vitamins/minerals (cal, mag, D) added back in liquid form.

I agree that you have to do your own research, and make up your own mind about what works for you body and what doesn't.

The Blood Type diet would dictate that I be a vegetarian and not consume dairy (as a type A), and sure enough, avoiding those things, in general, works for me. It's just another piece of information to inform the big picture.

The natural health community does not advocate dairy, and advocates only moderate consumption of meats (or none).

The study that was published on the correlation between weight loss and dairy had its results replicated with a calcium/magnesium/vit D supplement, confirming that the weight loss was actually enhanced by the vitamins/minerals, not the dairy itself.

The health stats on North Americans indicate that vegetarians and vegans (as a group) have the lowest incidence of obesity, heart disease, and type 2 diabetes.

Good luck to everyone at finding what works for you!
:flowerforyou:

Phoenixflame

Ehh...parts of the book made me laugh, but others just mademe eyeroll. I guess I've always hated the "you're eating a rotting carcass!" argument against meat. Makes me want to reply, "Damn straight, how's that rotting broccoli you're eating?"

And what's this about America being the only culture to consume milk past infancy? Um, no. Go to Israel, India, Greece, or virtually any other country and chat up the locals.

I have nothing against vegans, but parts of Skinny B!tch are just plain uneducated.

wannaBme

wannaBme,

I happened to skim through your original question, and went to Borders tonight with my husband. I saw the book so I was curious to see what they said about meat. Funny thing is that I took my newborn to the pediatrician this week and long story short, she does not recommend any milk once the child stops breastfeeding. She said that there are plenty of studies that prove that animal protein does leach calcium from bones, thus inducing osteoporosis, and it also worsens chronic diseases. And what's worse, for kids it can cause early chronic diabetis etc. I'm a carnivore myself as so is everyone in my family, but I'm always eager to learn more and if that's truly the case I'll definitely curb our animal protein eating habits.

She gave me a few referrals for reading so I'll pass it along to you and anyone else who may be interested. The main authors are Dean Ornish MD, and Mark Hyman MD. Dr Hyman has a website called www.ultrawellness.com that I haven't quite investigated, but it looks really good. Dr. Ornish was a physicial advisor to Pres. Clinton during his administration, so I would say they are pretty proficient in the subject.

Thank you very much for the website address. I am always interested in learning new things.

My husband and I read "Fit For Life" by Dr. H and M Diamond many years ago. They were they first ones to shed some light on possible effects that dairy products could have on human bodies.

We immediately stopped feeding milk to our 3 children ... ages 6 months, 2 and 4 years old. We did continue to feed them limited quanities of yogurt and cheese. They used soy milk on their cereal and when he was 1, the youngest had it in his bottle. My children NEVER had an ear infection or a sinus problem since we took them off milk. They had had many ear, nose and throat issues previous to this change.

As a possible bonus, their teeth were so cavity free that the dentist asked what kind of diet we were feeding them. It might or might not have been due to the "no milk drinking" but when you mentioned how dairy can leach calcium ... it could have been be the different. The calcium leaching qualities of dairy are mentioned in the Skinny B*tch book as well.

Today, my kids are very strong, healthy active adults. One is playing top end Junior hockey.

DjBliss05

I didn't read everyone's posts because I am off to bed in a few, but I did read the book and wanted to add my 2 cents. Well, I read 75% of it and stopped because I was done with it at that point!

I would have appreciated a disclaimer on this book! I am not a vegan and have no plan to become one. I was looking for more nutritional info and figured a book that wouldn't read like a textbook would be more fun. I was wrong!

I heard some of what they were saying, but mostly I was just so turned off by being called so many different names by the authors and the really biased way they presented their info that I couldn't take it seriously. I have tried to take some of it into consideration, but I am a big believer in balance. As long as I am balancing out everything that I eat with a variety of different types of food, then I will be just fine! I am at MFP because of this philosophy and choose to stick with what I am doing rather than change how I do things because of lame scare tactics. I think being vegan would be a good idea for some people and for various reasons, but it isn't for me.

HOWEVER, the cook book is kind of cool! They don't give nutritional info for their recipes and it is really hard to add up some of the random ingredients, but I tried the vegan pad thai and it was yummy.

I'm going to stick with my balanced approach to eatting, despite having to avoid meat for a few days after reading this book! I say skip it and get you info elsewhere - if for no other reason than because they are so darn rude! :explode: