is starvation mode a myth?

CallmeSbo

Hi everyone,

We have always been told that never go under 1200calories a day or your body will hit starvation mode. My question is, why does the body not behaive the same as those people who have done gastric bypass? They consume between 300calories immediately after the op to around 1200 calories around 8months to a year. I have yet to meet a person who has done this op eat calories more than 1600. Is it possible that all the talk about the body hitting starvation mode is a myth. Why is it ok for those people to eat so much less calories, and the rest of us not?

epona_mus

Starvation mode exists but the manner in which it impacts people is widely misunderstood/misconstrued on MFP. You will NOT go into starvation mode by dipping below 1200 calories.

Here's a good layman's explanation:

http://fattyfightsback.blogspot.com/2009/03/mtyhbusters-starvation-mode.html

CallmeSbo

Thanks alot

LabRat529

The real question is: Why do you WANT to eat less than 1200 calories? Eating less than 1900 is hard for me! 1200 would seriously depress me. I like food.

A moderate calorie deficit is WAY EASIER to sustain. And you're less likely to gain back the weight.

justanotherbrickinthewall

I feel like starvation mode is a myth. Why do anorexics, eating so little calories a day, still lose weight?
I eat, on average, 750-800 a day, and my weight loss hasn't stopped.

Rae6503

Just be aware the people who have had gastric bypass are under the supervision of a doctor, and are obese to begin with.

You body does adjust to large calorie deficits such as might be produced at 1200 calories. It's more appropriately called "famine response". It's a survival mechanism left over from when humans often experienced times of feast and famine. However it takes a long time of eating at lower levels for this to happen, maybe a month or so, and you can push through this and go into full on "starving" like an anorexic does. Additionally, you tend simply move less when you eat less. Fighting and normal movements throughout the day account for a lot of calories burned. If you subconsciously reduces this movement you lower your calories burned each day even more. I don't have exact numbers on how much you are decreasing your daily burned calories.

But yes, especially when we don't have a lot to lose our bodies handle small-moderate calorie deficits much better than they handle large ones. You have more energy, you feel better, you don't feel as restricted and therefore don't give up or binge. This helps maintain muscle mass as you lose (you should also eat plenty of protien, and lift weights to help with this). It also makes the transition to maintenance easier when you reach your goals.

Personally, I never went below 1750 NET when I was losing, eating between 1750 and 2500 due to exercise calories (and well, not always staying under goal).

fxst78

Starvation response is not a myth, but the way "starvation mode" is talked about on MFP is absolute cr@p.

You will not go into any starvation response by going below 1200 every so often. Unless you are 6 foot tall, do alot of exercise and are at around 800 cal or below for an extended perioed of time you will be fine.

IvoryParchment

1200 calories is recommended because it is difficult to get a nutritionally complete diet without eating at least that much. Since everyone has different baseline calorie requirements, they're obviously going to require different amounts of "starvation" before it affects their metabolism.

Your body does adjust to extreme low calorie situations in ways that aren't going to make you feel very good (anemia, swollen legs, loss of sex drive, lightheadedness, bad breath, etc). The idea of MFP is to choose to live like a healthy thin person and have your weight come down to reflect that new lifestyle, not to go on a program that is unsustainable in the long term.

Rae6503

I feel like starvation mode is a myth. Why do anorexics, eating so little calories a day, still lose weight?
I eat, on average, 750-800 a day, and my weight loss hasn't stopped.

There is a difference between "starvation mode" and flat out starving. Anorexics starve themselves, sometimes to death. Like I said you body can adjust to smaller calorie amounts but it reaches a point where it can't anymore than it starts to break down. It'll start burning large amounts of muscle in addition to fat and then when there's nothing else to burn it'll start shutting down organs.

DesertSunsetRain

I feel like starvation mode is a myth. Why do anorexics, eating so little calories a day, still lose weight?
I eat, on average, 750-800 a day, and my weight loss hasn't stopped.

There is a difference between "starvation mode" and flat out starving. Anorexics starve themselves, sometimes to death. Like I said you body can adjust to smaller calorie amounts but it reaches a point where it can't anymore than it starts to break down. It'll start burning large amounts of muscle in addition to fat and then when there's nothing else to burn it'll start shutting down organs.

Yes, yes, yes.

jakejacobsen

I feel like starvation mode is a myth. Why do anorexics, eating so little calories a day, still lose weight?
I eat, on average, 750-800 a day, and my weight loss hasn't stopped.

There is a difference between "starvation mode" and flat out starving. Anorexics starve themselves, sometimes to death. Like I said you body can adjust to smaller calorie amounts but it reaches a point where it can't anymore than it starts to break down. It'll start burning large amounts of muscle in addition to fat and then when there's nothing else to burn it'll start shutting down organs.

Including your heart muscle

LabRat529

Just be aware the people who have had gastric bypass are under the supervision of a doctor, and are obese to begin with.

You body does adjust to large calorie deficits such as might be produced at 1200 calories. It's more appropriately called "famine response". It's a survival mechanism left over from when humans often experienced times of feast and famine. However it takes a long time of eating at lower levels for this to happen. Maybe a month or so, and you can push through this and go into full on "starving" like an anorexic does. Additionally, you tend simply move less when you eat less. Fighting and normal movements throughout the day account for a lot of calories burned. If you subconsciously reduces this movement you lower your calories burned each day even more. I don't have exact numbers on how much you are decreasing your daily burned calories.

But yes, especially when we don't have a lot to lose our bodies handle small-moderate calorie deficits much better than they handle large ones. You have more energy, you feel better, you don't feel as restricted and therefore don't give up or binge. This helps maintain muscle mass as you lose (you should also eat plenty of protien, and lift weights to help with this). It also makes the transition to maintenance easier when you reach your goals.

Personally, I never went below 1750 NET when I was losing, eating between 1750 and 2500 due to exercise calories (and well, not always staying under goal).

Yes, this!

PepeGreggerton

It really doesn't take effect until you are at or below a certain body fat (5% men 10% women). Most people can live just fine off 800-900 calories a day for weeks on end and their metabolism will not slow down and will not catabolize muscle as long as they are doing resistance training.

But I would think it would make you grumpy!

justanotherbrickinthewall

When would you consider that point to be when your body starts breaking down? Just wondering.

IvoryParchment

Personally, I never went below 1750 NET when I was losing, eating between 1750 and 2500 due to exercise calories (and well, not always staying under goal).

Yes, this!

If I ate 1750, I would gain weight. My maintenance calories are 1640 due to my age, size, and sedentary job. It isn't theoretically possible for me to lose a pound a week just with diet respecting the 1200 kcal limit. (I'm a hyper person so I'm actually losing faster, but another person might even lose slower -- the factors used to estimate activity are just averages.) And yeah, I like food too, so I can see I'm going to be spending my retirement doing lots of cardio.

SheilaSisco

I feel like starvation mode is a myth. Why do anorexics, eating so little calories a day, still lose weight?
I eat, on average, 750-800 a day, and my weight loss hasn't stopped.

Aside from what the other guy said (which is all very true), when you're eating that little it's a pretty sure thing that you're losing more muscle than fat... I myself would rather be a slightly larger 'fit' than to be 'skinny fat'. The point of this website is to learn to obtain and maintain a HEALTHY lifestyle.... which means being healthy... not just fitting into the smallest size possible without literally killing yourself.

jakejacobsen

When would you consider that point to be when your body starts breaking down? Just wondering.

I started doing only cardio and lost muscle in a month I am a large guy and also have physically demanding job

PepeGreggerton

I fast 2-3 days a week on those days when I break the fast I eat 500-700 calories. Other days I eat between 1100-1500 and I am not starving or hungry. Keeping hydrated is important.

justanotherbrickinthewall

I feel like starvation mode is a myth. Why do anorexics, eating so little calories a day, still lose weight?
I eat, on average, 750-800 a day, and my weight loss hasn't stopped.

Aside from what the other guy said (which is all very true), when you're eating that little it's a pretty sure thing that you're losing more muscle than fat... I myself would rather be a slightly larger 'fit' than to be 'skinny fat'. The point of this website is to learn to obtain and maintain a HEALTHY lifestyle.... which means being healthy... not just fitting into the smallest size possible without literally killing yourself.

I have ednos, I can't help it.
But I do agree that having muscle mass is better than just being fat.

Rae6503

When would you consider that point to be when your body starts breaking down? Just wondering.

So you are trying to plan out when to stop eating at dangerous levels? It doesn't work that way. I suggest you talk to a doctor, a counsel, your parents or anyone that can help you get into a healthy relationship with food and your body.

PepeGreggerton

I feel like starvation mode is a myth. Why do anorexics, eating so little calories a day, still lose weight?
I eat, on average, 750-800 a day, and my weight loss hasn't stopped.

Aside from what the other guy said (which is all very true), when you're eating that little it's a pretty sure thing that you're losing more muscle than fat... I myself would rather be a slightly larger 'fit' than to be 'skinny fat'. The point of this website is to learn to obtain and maintain a HEALTHY lifestyle.... which means being healthy... not just fitting into the smallest size possible without literally killing yourself.

I disagree. If you are lifting weights and have fat to burn your body will burn the fat before the muscle.

LabRat529

I have ednos, I can't help it.
But I do agree that having muscle mass is better than just being fat.

Of course you can help it. Go get the counseling you need. There are a ton of fabulous women and men on this site that have overcome their eating disorders. It may never go away 100%, but you can learn to control it.

justanotherbrickinthewall

When would you consider that point to be when your body starts breaking down? Just wondering.

So you are trying to plan out when to stop eating at dangerous levels? It doesn't work that way. I suggest you talk to a doctor, a counsel, your parents or anyone that can help you get into a healthy relationship with food and your body.

No, I'm not. I have ednos and am meeting with psychologists and nutritionists to help me recover. I was just wondering what you thought.

PepeGreggerton

When would you consider that point to be when your body starts breaking down? Just wondering.

There's a difference between creating a deficit and starving yourself you need to eat every day.

justanotherbrickinthewall

I have ednos, I can't help it.
But I do agree that having muscle mass is better than just being fat.

Of course you can help it. Go get the counseling you need. There are a ton of fabulous women and men on this site that have overcome their eating disorders. It may never go away 100%, but you can learn to control it.

I am trying to, it's hard to recover and the process isn't very quick for me.

LabRat529

I have ednos, I can't help it.
But I do agree that having muscle mass is better than just being fat.

Of course you can help it. Go get the counseling you need. There are a ton of fabulous women and men on this site that have overcome their eating disorders. It may never go away 100%, but you can learn to control it.

I am trying to, it's hard to recover and the process isn't very quick for me.

Sorry, my comment sounded way more harsh than I meant it to sound. I was going for a supportive 'you can do it!' vibe and it came out critical I'm glad you're working on recovery. And I hope you get well sooner rather than later.

Rae6503

When would you consider that point to be when your body starts breaking down? Just wondering.

So you are trying to plan out when to stop eating at dangerous levels? It doesn't work that way. I suggest you talk to a doctor, a counsel, your parents or anyone that can help you get into a healthy relationship with food and your body.

No, I'm not. I have ednos and am meeting with psychologists and nutritionists to help me recover. I was just wondering what you thought.

Sorry. I didn't mean to be rude. I'm glad you are getting help. I'm not an expert so I don't know. I think BMI is generally a good thing to go by in terms of getting too thin (it's horrible for telling muscular people they are overweight though). Anything less than 17 is pretty bad.

IvoryParchment

When would you consider that point to be when your body starts breaking down? Just wondering.

MFP is about living a healthy lifestyle, not abusing yourself to reach a numeric goal. You should feel stronger, more energetic, more like bouncing and dancing when you move. Your body should be functioning well. If you were obese and are coming to normal, you may notice your periods becoming more regular.

To determine if you are overshooting your healthy weight:
Are you feeling tired instead of energetic?
Are your wounds healing more slowly? Do paper cuts last for days?
Are you getting bruises you don't remember?
Is your skin dry or finely wrinkled? Are your lips chapped?
How much hair is in the drain after you wash your hair?
How's your sex drive? How are your periods?
Are your eyes looking sunken because you're losing the fat that cushions your eyeballs?
Are you getting fuzzy hair on your skin?
Have a lot of people stopped saying how great you look and started making Karen Carpenter jokes?

justanotherbrickinthewall

ah, it's fine. Thank you for the support though

marujita

I think it has to do with slowing down your metabolism. If you starve yourself, lose weight, and then try to go back to a normal calorie amount, you'll gain it all back. At least that's what I feel like that's what my body would do.

honeysprinkles

The real question is: Why do you WANT to eat less than 1200 calories? Eating less than 1900 is hard for me! 1200 would seriously depress me. I like food.

A moderate calorie deficit is WAY EASIER to sustain. And you're less likely to gain back the weight.

I think this is the answer. I don't know so much about the science behind it, but sure you can lose weight by eating less than 1200 calories, your body might not automatically plateau and hold onto every last calorie for dear life, but it does make sense that it at least slows down your metabolism. And it also makes sense that it's not going to work for you in the long run if it's not something that's sustainable. But I'm just looking at the issue with common sense without the science behind it, so maybe I'm wrong? (Not said sarcastically, because I realize it seems like it could be).