Questions for people with tattoos

Options
2

Replies

  • cherdan
    cherdan Posts: 162 Member
    Options
    Seriously?! I have a lot of tattoos and am probably quite heavily tattooed compared to most people. But I work in an office, and have worked in very corporate environments, in one of which the manager had full sleeves. It's ridiculous to think that if someone has tattoos it makes them 'lower class' or less able or likely to work in an 'executive' position. You say 'no offence', but I am offended because a lot of my friends have tattoos or are tattoo artists, and I would never consider any of them to be lower class or only service workers?!

    These days tattoos are definately not a sign of lower class... this isn't the 1950s!


    Totally!
    I dunno.. dude sounds like he's drinking the corporate Kool-Aid to me.
    I personally would think an individual with well-done/unique/brilliant ink work to potentially make for a great executive! Innovative, progressive, open-minded, different outlook.. as opposed to the 'Mad Men'-esque monoculture I often tend to view the executive-level world as. Dunno bout y'all.

    The only thing that gets tricky on the job is how this applies to the corporate ladder/hierarchy. I just can't stand when certain higher level individuals take advantage of their position of power, and use this to exact the same discrimination (i.e., "tattoos are low class") against people just like them!! For example, my hellish retail job I had for 3 years, I went on my first earned vacation and came back with a negligible/barely even noticeable nose stud. The assistant manager for my dept speaks to me one day and notices it, as she was thisclose to me. She says, 'You have to get rid of that. Not allowed on the floor." Meanwhile, homegirl has FULL (and I mean FULL- **** was tacky, full colored, gaudy, garish, cliche-ridden with Kanji, the whole 9) fresh sleeve going all the way up her arm. She would wear this out on the floor, sleeveless, full exposed, every day. Can we say, 'hypocrisy'??
  • smiverz
    smiverz Posts: 40 Member
    Options
    ive got 3 including 1 on my bum! i think they are brilliant. as for the pain the 1 across the top of my back hurt when it was on my spine, just felt like painful pins and needles bareable though. just make sure you are 100% happy with what your having.

    p.s thinking about it the worst thing is the noise the tattoo gun makes, orrible!!
  • cobracars
    cobracars Posts: 949 Member
    Options
    Sounds like you've got all your questions answered by people who are knowledgeable and have experienced it.

    I'm just wondering about subject matter in general. Its not easy to find someone who has had the same style haircut or the same shoes or even the same significant other for 30 years...what makes them think 30 years from now they will still be enamored of the design of or choice to get a tatoo?

    Similar thing with marriage. 100% of the people who get married think its gonna be forever. At least 50% of them are wrong. Maybe that's why marriage licenses are made of paper and not done as a tattoo.

    I would wonder how many people at the age of 45-55 look back and say "Man, I WISH I would have got a tatoo when I was 20!" versus the number of 45-55 year old people who say "What the hell was I thinking getting a permanent tatoo when I was only 24 yrs old?"

    I'm over 50 and until recently would not even consider the idea of getting a tattoo. For the last few years I've considered getting a tribute portrait of my mother on one arm and my father on the other. I love and respect them both. Mom was a nurse and Dad is a retired Navy Captain. Mom passed away in 1985 when I was 25 years old and I've been Dad's caregiver the last 4 years. His health is pretty bad and I will probably lose him in the next year or two.
  • smiverz
    smiverz Posts: 40 Member
    Options
    thats a good point. out of my 3 tattoos 2 of them are football related ones. the team i support now i always will til the day i die so i dont see any problem with those 2. and the 1 on my bum was just a drunken laugh at the age of 18. which doesnt matter to me i would get anything tattoo'd there as no one can see it
  • KimmieBrie
    KimmieBrie Posts: 825 Member
    Options
    I have 2 tats - one on my ankle all the way around - one on my lower back.
    My back hurt 100xs more than my ankle.

    I would compare the hurt to someone taking a small exacto or surgical knife and drawing on you. I will say outright - I have a low pain threshold. So to me - it hurt, a lot, but not nearly as much as say when I dislocated my elbow - that caused me to feel nausea and almost pass out - this wasn't near as bad. After a bit when they did my ankle - it felt numb so didn't hurt as much.

    I like the idea of on your hip better than the other spots, but that's pure opinion. Not sure about the idea of having your boyfriends handwriting on you permanently - what if you broke up??
  • jaynewould
    Options
    I like the idea of on your hip better than the other spots, but that's pure opinion. Not sure about the idea of having your boyfriends handwriting on you permanently - what if you broke up??

    I see your point (and thanks for the heads-up on the back tattoo!), but honestly I'd be more worried about our joint finances, our dog, our house, and our massive collection of XBOX games (who gets which Call of Duty?), than I would be worried about a two-inch bit of ink on my hip reminding me that I had an awesome dude in my life for five years (and hopefully many more). I mean, I don't comment on people's wedding pictures and tell them they might break up - even though they quite likely will - but then I'm an optimistic sort of person :smile: I do appreciate the thought, and I see where you're coming from, but hey - I'm young, and now is the time to do un-adviseable (and easily hidden) things with permanent ink :drinker:

    Thanks to everyone who has answered the questions I asked, I really appreciate your help (and will definitely not start with a foot tattoo, ouch). The thread seems to have veered a bit off-track, so if anyone else has advice, please pretend that I'm planning to get a small tattoo of my Mum's name surrounded by hearts and flowers, or one of those kanji that say "world peace" :flowerforyou:
  • Alachofra15
    Alachofra15 Posts: 117 Member
    Options
    It has veered off track slightly ;-) and uhh to keep it off track, when people ask me "Oh what about when you're 70, aren't you gonna regret getting it done?!"

    I say: "Seriously?! When I'm 70 I plan on not giving a flying **** what I look like!! As far as I'm concerned it'll be a cool reminder of those heady days of my exuberant, impulsive youth"

    (For the record getting one wasn't all that impulsive, I thought about it for weeks before getting it, but I was pretty young - 17.)
  • Sh1tsRainbows
    Sh1tsRainbows Posts: 1,227 Member
    Options
    1) The tattoo I want is in my boyfriend's handwriting. bring a paper copy of my "design" with me? YES

    2) For people with tattoos who've lost a lot of weight, has it affected the tattoo? I HAVE A TATTOO ON THE INSIDE OF MY HIP I GOT WHEN I WAS 19..AFTER 2 KIDS AND MANY POUNDS GAINED AND LOST..YOU CANT TELL WHAT IT IS ANYMORE..STRECH MARKS THROUGH IT UGH!!!!!
    3) If you've used one of those hand-held epilators before - NEVER USED ONE BUT THEY FEEL OF A TATTOO IS INCOMPARABLE (is that a word??lol)

    4) Subjective question: ID GO WITH BACK OF YOUR NECK..EASILY COVERED AND DOESNT HURT AND DOESNT GET SCREWED UP WITYH WEIGHT GAIN/LOSS
  • ejohndrow
    ejohndrow Posts: 1,399 Member
    Options
    It has veered off track slightly ;-) and uhh to keep it off track, when people ask me "Oh what about when you're 70, aren't you gonna regret getting it done?!"

    I say: "Seriously?! When I'm 70 I plan on not giving a flying **** what I look like!! As far as I'm concerned it'll be a cool reminder of those heady days of my exuberant, impulsive youth"

    (For the record getting one wasn't all that impulsive, I thought about it for weeks before getting it, but I was pretty young - 17.)
    I spent years debating what I wanted and thinking of the "what about when I'm older?" deal, then I looked around me and realized; old people look weird already. seriously, who doesn't look weird when they're older-very few people. And at least now I havea cool backpiece to entertain the nurses at the old folks home when I get shoved in there.
  • brookepenni
    brookepenni Posts: 787 Member
    Options
    Yep when I'm old the way my tattoos look will be the least of my problems! I'll be more worried about remembering my keys, remembering my name and holding control of my bladder!!!
  • sarahsmart88
    Options
    So, I'm on track to hit one of my mini-goals later this month, and I promised that I would reward myself with a tattoo! Problem: I have never had a tattoo, and I'm not close friends with anybody who has a tattoo, but I've seen some cool ones in MFP photos. I have a few questions, and I know I should ask the tattoo artist, but I kind of don't want to embarrass myself with really stupid questions before I embarrass myself even more by crying or throwing up as soon as I see the needle/needles/whatever they do tattoos with. (Clearly, I am in the *very* preliminary stages of researching this.)

    However, I have no fear of embarrassing myself in front of the website that already knows I had chocolate for dinner the other night. Questions!

    1) The tattoo I want is in my boyfriend's handwriting. Do I just get him to write whatever I want clearly on a piece of paper and bring it along? Do I get him to write on my skin? Should I get him to write it on my skin anyway so I get a feel for the size and placement I want before I get it permanently drawn onto my body? (Yes, actually. I will do that last thing.) But again: do I bring a paper copy of my "design" with me?

    *****Yes, bring a paper copy of what you want. My husband got my handwriting on him. We measured the spot on a piece of paper, and I wrote the "tattoo" into the allotted space. The artist traced it and did it perfectly.

    2) For people with tattoos who've lost a lot of weight, has it affected the tattoo? I sort of want it near my hip but I'm worried it will get all distorted as I lose weight (or, god forbid, gain it back).
    ******I have one on my ribcage, I have fluctuated up and down about 5-10 pounds, but not enough to make a difference. I'd say it depends on where you get it.

    3) If you've used one of those hand-held epilators before - the ones with the tiny little rotating tweezers - how does that compare to a tattoo? Similar sensation? More/less painful? What would you, personally, compare it to?
    ******I haven't used those, but I didn't find either of my tattoos painful. I thought on my ribs tickled, but from what I hear from other people, that's supposed to be a very painful spot. I was really nervous and thought I'd cry, but it ended up being fine for me. Just remember to BREATHE. Bring someone with you to talk to.

    4) Subjective question: I'm tossing up between my hip, below one of my collarbones, or the back of my neck. Thoughts? Considerations? Is one of these places epically more painful than anywhere else (which is what I've heard about foot tattoos)?
    ******I want a collarbone one! Back of the neck is easily covered with hair. You'd be surprised how many jobs do not like tattoos to be shown.

    Don't worry, I really will ask the actual tattoo artist all these things, I just wanted to not walk into the tattoo place feeling like a complete noob. Thanks in advance! :D
  • justle
    justle Posts: 275 Member
    Options
    well i have a tatt at the base of my neck - i had it when i was a size 8 then got up to a size 22 and now back at a size 14 and its never changed one bit.

    if you pick the place carefully, you dont have to worry about any further weight gain/loss effecting it.

    a tattoo hurts, its irritating. I went with my sis just a few weeks ago and she had 2 hours worth done and said pain wise it never got over a 6 (on a 1-10 scale).



    re the "what about when your older" jeez, when your that old any tattoos you have will be like a road map of your life, little reminders of times gone past - who would see this as a bad thing?? really??


    get your BF to write it on a peice of paper - maybe more than once, your tattooist will need to make a copy of this, they use special ink which is then put on your skin.

    really you need to speak to your tattooist in advance, i've just booked in mine for Feb 11th, i've sent her a picture and description of changes to the picture i want, she;ll draw it out, make the changes (and i've given her go ahead to make any changes she thinks will make it look better, afterall she is the artist not me) and then she'll call me when its done, i'll go and have a look she'll lay it where i want it and i'll give her the go ahead to get it made up and ready.


    i say go for it, tattoos are for life though and just make sure you choose the right one, have you thought about if you and your bf ever split? honestly ask yourself how would you feel to have his handwriting on your body? would it be better to be yours?
  • yippeeskippee
    Options
    So, I'm on track to hit one of my mini-goals later this month, and I promised that I would reward myself with a tattoo! Problem: I have never had a tattoo, and I'm not close friends with anybody who has a tattoo, but I've seen some cool ones in MFP photos. I have a few questions, and I know I should ask the tattoo artist, but I kind of don't want to embarrass myself with really stupid questions before I embarrass myself even more by crying or throwing up as soon as I see the needle/needles/whatever they do tattoos with. (Clearly, I am in the *very* preliminary stages of researching this.)

    However, I have no fear of embarrassing myself in front of the website that already knows I had chocolate for dinner the other night. Questions!

    1) The tattoo I want is in my boyfriend's handwriting. Do I just get him to write whatever I want clearly on a piece of paper and bring it along? Do I get him to write on my skin? Should I get him to write it on my skin anyway so I get a feel for the size and placement I want before I get it permanently drawn onto my body? (Yes, actually. I will do that last thing.) But again: do I bring a paper copy of my "design" with me?

    2) For people with tattoos who've lost a lot of weight, has it affected the tattoo? I sort of want it near my hip but I'm worried it will get all distorted as I lose weight (or, god forbid, gain it back).

    3) If you've used one of those hand-held epilators before - the ones with the tiny little rotating tweezers - how does that compare to a tattoo? Similar sensation? More/less painful? What would you, personally, compare it to?

    4) Subjective question: I'm tossing up between my hip, below one of my collarbones, or the back of my neck. Thoughts? Considerations? Is one of these places epically more painful than anywhere else (which is what I've heard about foot tattoos)?

    Don't worry, I really will ask the actual tattoo artist all these things, I just wanted to not walk into the tattoo place feeling like a complete noob. Thanks in advance! :D

    #1. Get it written on paper and have it written wherever you are getting it. If the artist doesn't want the writing already on he or she can just wash it off and use the paper. People who get autographs tattooed usually have their skin signed first, but it just depends on your artist's comfort zone.

    #2 I've gained and I've lost with my tattoos. They have not changed one bit. They are still the same they were when I got them 3 years ago (of course, after healing). It depends on how your skin is and you the ink absorbed into your skin.

    #3. You will feel your tattoo. It will either feel great or it will hurt. I got my first one on my forearm. It felt great, that is one of the best spots to get a tattoo for a beginner. It took about 4 hours, no break in between. Just an FYI if you're worried about pain get it in a comfortable spot.

    #4. The back of your neck or your hip would be best of the places you are considering.

    Don't psych yourself out. Remember, millions of people have gotten tattoos. If it was horrible, most of us wouldn't go through it over and over. And don't worry about "this is going to be with me forever." One day you will die, we all will. You only have one life and you might as well live it up. I haven't had a problem with my tattoos and I'll never get a non-visible one until I run out of room on my arms and legs. Perk of the military, I guess. :)

    Good luck!
  • MoonShadow_1au
    MoonShadow_1au Posts: 149 Member
    Options
    Happy to throw in my 2c :)

    1) The tattoo I want is in my boyfriend's handwriting. Do I just get him to write whatever I want clearly on a piece of paper and bring it along? Do I get him to write on my skin? Should I get him to write it on my skin anyway so I get a feel for the size and placement I want before I get it permanently drawn onto my body? (Yes, actually. I will do that last thing.) But again: do I bring a paper copy of my "design" with me?

    Definitely get him to do it on paper. The neater the better. I drew mine in Photoshop and provided both a coloured and outline version ACTUAL SIZE. They simply photocopied it to a special ink that transfers to your skin and they draw over that. The coloured version was good to show the transitions from one colour to the next and used as a guide.

    2) For people with tattoos who've lost a lot of weight, has it affected the tattoo? I sort of want it near my hip but I'm worried it will get all distorted as I lose weight (or, god forbid, gain it back).

    Agree with others comments (choose the place). I have tried to get my arms bigger but no luck yet ;)

    3) If you've used one of those hand-held epilators before - the ones with the tiny little rotating tweezers - how does that compare to a tattoo? Similar sensation? More/less painful? What would you, personally, compare it to?

    Tattoo was less painful. BUT I got mine on my arm, some spots are really painful (or so I hear). My sister does not recommend the top of the foot !! Also I hear the stomach and sides under the arms are for those not advers to pain.

    4) Subjective question: I'm tossing up between my hip, below one of my collarbones, or the back of my neck. Thoughts? Considerations? Is one of these places epically more painful than anywhere else (which is what I've heard about foot tattoos)?

    Friend got one on the back of her neck, hair down hidden, hair up visible. To me this sounds like a great place for a woman to get a tattoo. Just my pref on a woman.


    Good luck with it. Remember to make an appointment (they will probably want to discuss first and then get you to come back later to get it done unless you have the art work ready to go and it is not that big). I walkied in to Illustrated Man in Sydney and said can you do this, was out 60 min later with a tattoo. When I went for my second I ended up with multiple appointments and due to bad timing still have not gotten it started :(
  • Harlequinrequiem
    Harlequinrequiem Posts: 7 Member
    Options
    I have six tattoos: One on each hip, back of the neck, on top of my hand near my thumb, my right shoulder blade, and my right calf. My most painful was my shoulder blade because it's on the bone. Anything near on a bone hurts the worst (according to a tattooist that I know). I have shoulder length hair so the one on my neck doesn't show unless I wear my hair up. Tattoos have become more accepted but you still should watch your placement. I have a rule for myself and I know a lot of others that have tattoos that have the same rule....no names (unless its your children), and always be something personal. I don't think tattoos in general are low class anymore, but it's a matter of taste. I'm getting another for my girls, haven't decided what yet, but it is better for women, for some reason, to have them where they aren't usually seen. I will tell you this...my husband is an Officer in the Navy. We went to a dining out with other officers and the wives had more tattoos then the military men. Oh, if you like his handwriting have him write whatever it is on a piece of paper so the tattoo artist can get it on transfer paper. I always draw on myself when designing mine so that I can see size and placement. I have lost and gained weight over the years...i've had most of mine for eleven years now....and it hasn't effected my tattoos. I think if it was on my stomach, it probably would...but there isn't a lot of weight around the neck and collarbone, so you should be fine in those places.
  • kb455
    kb455 Posts: 679 Member
    Options

    4) Subjective question: I'm tossing up between my hip, below one of my collarbones, or the back of my neck. Thoughts? Considerations? Is one of these places epically more painful than anywhere else (which is what I've heard about foot tattoos)?

    I have one on the back of my neck and one on my foot. I personally thought the neck hurt a lot more than the foot. But, either way the pain is temporary and its worth it.
  • KittyExpress
    KittyExpress Posts: 8 Member
    Options
    The tattoo I want is in my boyfriend's handwriting.
    Sweet idea :)

    Do I just get him to write whatever I want clearly on a piece of paper and bring it along?
    Yes, that's the easiest way of doing it and they'll want to refer to it a couple of times

    Do I get him to write on my skin?
    The tattoo artist may actually allow him to do the temporary part that they trace with his own hand so that they're just going over it themselves. It's as close to getting him to do the actual tattoo as possible without him holding the gun ;) That's up to the artist though, some will do the tatt by sight and some will trace a temporary ink line.

    Should I get him to write it on my skin anyway so I get a feel for the size and placement I want before I get it permanently drawn onto my body?
    I would simply so that you can see how it would look. But keep in mind that it will end up looking slightly different anyway because the artist may say that the position you've got it on is too hard to do (over a tricky part of bone etc).

    For people with tattoos who've lost a lot of weight, has it affected the tattoo?
    It hasn't. I got mine on my upper shoulder when I was overweight and even the extra skin from having bat wings hasn't changed it. Location, location, location though. Hips, thighs, tummy, ribcage... They're all places that you're gambling with skin stretching.

    If you've used one of those hand-held epilators before - the ones with the tiny little rotating tweezers - how does that compare to a tattoo? Similar sensation? More/less painful? What would you, personally, compare it to?
    Honestly for me it felt like the tip of a piece of white hot wire being dragged over my skin. It hurt, but not more than I could cope with. I only had to ask him to stop once and that was when he was right over the top of the shoulder joint and very close to the bone. It was a relief when he went back to the other parts to finish up! Haha.


    Subjective question: I'm tossing up between my hip, below one of my collarbones, or the back of my neck. Thoughts? Considerations?
    I know someone that has one on her collarbone. It's a simple written tatt and quite pretty but she's getting laser removal because she can't hide it with a normal collar. She said she loves it, but it's got to go because of work.

    Back of neck... Ugh. I don't know how to say this without offending people that have a neck tatt, but I look at neck tatts as the new age tramp stamp. They're the new 'it' place for young females who want a pretty design. I KNOW someone will take offense to that and to be honest I seriously don't mean to offend! It's just the most popular place for young women at the moment.

    Hip? I think it's a nice idea if you want to be able to hide it, but at the same time if you wanted to be able to show it off it could be tough *chuckle*. Also potentially a darn painful place, depending on how much 'padding' you do have. I've known skinny girls with lots of padding there who it didn't bother, and larger girls who had none on their hips and found it extremely painful.

    BUT when all is said and done, your body is YOUR body. Where you get it, what you get, how big, whether it's a skull and crossbones or a naughts and crosses grid... It's entirely up to you and no-one else's opinion should be a judging factor.

    And my two cents worth. Just be aware that whether it's right or fair people will still judge you based on ink. And before the "It's more socially acceptable now... blah blah blah... People shouldn't judge me for my ink" brigade start up IT HAPPENS WHETHER WE WANT IT TO OR NOT.
    It's not yet socially acceptable to be covered in ink, it's just not politically correct to say it! I'm in the military where the boss literally cannot say a darn thing about ink because it's just the culture. But you can be damn sure that the next tatt I get will be easily covered by long sleeves when I'm in service dress because I don't want your average civilian judging me for my tattoo and bringing judgement on myself or my service.
    Is it right? No. But burying heads in the sand and pretending it doesn't happen won't change that it does.
  • KittyExpress
    KittyExpress Posts: 8 Member
    Options
    The tattoo I want is in my boyfriend's handwriting.
    Sweet idea :)

    Do I just get him to write whatever I want clearly on a piece of paper and bring it along?
    Yes, that's the easiest way of doing it and they'll want to refer to it a couple of times

    Do I get him to write on my skin?
    The tattoo artist may actually allow him to do the temporary part that they trace with his own hand so that they're just going over it themselves. It's as close to getting him to do the actual tattoo as possible without him holding the gun ;) That's up to the artist though, some will do the tatt by sight and some will trace a temporary ink line.

    Should I get him to write it on my skin anyway so I get a feel for the size and placement I want before I get it permanently drawn onto my body?
    I would simply so that you can see how it would look. But keep in mind that it will end up looking slightly different anyway because the artist may say that the position you've got it on is too hard to do (over a tricky part of bone etc).

    For people with tattoos who've lost a lot of weight, has it affected the tattoo?
    It hasn't. I got mine on my upper shoulder when I was overweight and even the extra skin from having bat wings hasn't changed it. Location, location, location though. Hips, thighs, tummy, ribcage... They're all places that you're gambling with skin stretching.

    If you've used one of those hand-held epilators before - the ones with the tiny little rotating tweezers - how does that compare to a tattoo? Similar sensation? More/less painful? What would you, personally, compare it to?
    Honestly for me it felt like the tip of a piece of white hot wire being dragged over my skin. It hurt, but not more than I could cope with. I only had to ask him to stop once and that was when he was right over the top of the shoulder joint and very close to the bone. It was a relief when he went back to the other parts to finish up! Haha.


    Subjective question: I'm tossing up between my hip, below one of my collarbones, or the back of my neck. Thoughts? Considerations?
    I know someone that has one on her collarbone. It's a simple written tatt and quite pretty but she's getting laser removal because she can't hide it with a normal collar. She said she loves it, but it's got to go because of work.

    Back of neck... Ugh. I don't know how to say this without offending people that have a neck tatt, but I look at neck tatts as the new age tramp stamp. They're the new 'it' place for young females who want a pretty design. I KNOW someone will take offense to that and to be honest I seriously don't mean to offend! It's just the most popular place for young women at the moment.

    Hip? I think it's a nice idea if you want to be able to hide it, but at the same time if you wanted to be able to show it off it could be tough *chuckle*. Also potentially a darn painful place, depending on how much 'padding' you do have. I've known skinny girls with lots of padding there who it didn't bother, and larger girls who had none on their hips and found it extremely painful.

    BUT when all is said and done, your body is YOUR body. Where you get it, what you get, how big, whether it's a skull and crossbones or a naughts and crosses grid... It's entirely up to you and no-one else's opinion should be a judging factor.

    And my two cents worth. Just be aware that whether it's right or fair people will still judge you based on ink. And before the "It's more socially acceptable now... blah blah blah... People shouldn't judge me for my ink" brigade start up IT HAPPENS WHETHER WE WANT IT TO OR NOT.
    It's not yet socially acceptable to be covered in ink, it's just not politically correct to say it! I'm in the military where the boss literally cannot say a darn thing about ink because it's just the culture. But you can be damn sure that the next tatt I get will be easily covered by long sleeves when I'm in service dress because I don't want your average civilian judging me for my tattoo and bringing judgement on myself or my service.
    Is it right? No. But burying heads in the sand and pretending it doesn't happen won't change that it does.
  • KittyExpress
    KittyExpress Posts: 8 Member
    Options
    Whoa, double post! Sorry about the wall of text folks! Hahaha.
  • jhardenbergh
    jhardenbergh Posts: 1,035 Member
    Options
    The sun that's on my arm in the picture I got when I was a lot heavier about 16 years ago, it's faded some, but I think it looks alrights still with regards to the weight I lost. The Phoenix I got when I was down 100 lbs and now I am down 180 lbs and it hasn't changed too much. I think it looks better cause it fills up more of my arm.