Heart Rate Zone

Pebble321

Thanks for all the great info, guys, I'll be back to read this later!

heybales

What my trainer told me is that if we are over our max heart rate, we are not as effective at burning calories and it is more for endurance training. For example:

That is the only way I can explain it, is if you keep your rate above the max zone, you are not AS effective as the Fat Burning Zone which is your Max Heart rate I believe. You are still using energy just not as much energy, it more for building the endurance in your body since you body will try to evolve at that rate and help so next time your run would be easier. Don't quote me on this, but by gathering information from people, this is what I have put together and it makes sense to me.

Good job on the run, and a great method to save the joints.

You need to talk to the trainer again, if what you said is really close to what they said, it is not true and can't make sense either.

Max HR, as the term implies, is your max, can't go above it. Not talking the zones or calculated, but true MHR. And anything near that level is no where near beneficial for endurance training, just the opposite.

You have just enough info to have pieces in there that almost makes sense, but it is not tied together well.

Several posts in this thread have already explained things enough, if you reread them, should help better.

heybales

If you really want to get some good heart rate zones for training at different levels, the best method will be finding your lactate threshold.

Your MHR is genetic and you can't improve that, unless you are just starting working out. And it will slowly decrease with age.
So zones based on that don't really take in to account your own level of fitness.

But lactate threshold is that point where you have stopped being aerobic and supplying enough oxygen for complete glycogen and fat burning, and moved to anaerobic and incomplete glycogen burning and lactic acid can no longer be used for fuel and starts to build up.

So when thinking intervals, that is the point you want to get above.

And you can improve that point to a certain extent. As it goes up, your other ranges go up.
Now, this will be a bigger factor when you are near goal weight, and enjoy exercising so much you want to do longer events, or just go faster, without it feeling like it so much.

And there are zones based on your LT, also called anaerobic threshold (AT), which will help train it higher.

Easy test. Well, easy to do, should feel like coughing up a lung when finished. So you MUST be in shape. Unless you want to test a working LT, which may be close enough for some better training until you feel like doing it again.
And this should follow a rest day, and a good night's sleep.

Pick your activity, treadmill and spin bike are easiest to use, because you can fine tune the speed and resistance.
For spin bike, confirm you are spinning 85-95 rpm, or you will be unfairly testing small part of the quads and being lower than you should be..
For treadmill, you'll use a combo of speed and grade.

The idea is to warm up for about 10 min very slow pace.
Then you need a partner to record data ever 3 min during a 15 min test. So 5 data points.
You'll go real slow again for 10 min to recover.
And do the 15 min again.

During the 15 min you should not be expected to talk, no drinking, no extra movements. You are looking for that fine line of just pushing a tad too much, and boom, over the line. Once you go over, you have to almost drop too much to recover.
Hence doing 2 tests.

So if you have ever paid attention during a workout to that level that just burns, or feels really hard, that's what you want to get up to. No real good way to estimate it to get close first.

So on spin bike, while keeping cadence the same, you increase the tension, and just watch the heart rate go up, try to get it up to that barely comfortable level before the 1st 3min data point. If it feels like you could not do this 20 seconds - too high.
If you could talk if you wanted to in complete sentences - too low. One or two words should be it, because you need all that oxygen.

On treadmill, use a combo of speed (which if too fast could be too pounding) and grade (helps go up quickly) to do the same thing. Breathing should be very heavy and fast.

Each data point should be about the same if you really nailed it. If you finished and seemed to have some strength, you go higher on the next test.
You should be able to go slow and recover now for 10 min, clearing that lactic acid out of legs, using it as fuel. Drink some water, wipe off sweat.

Now do the second test the same way. With better idea of how high to go, and how hard you could really push, do it better.
If there is a big difference in data points, just avg the last test 5 points, if pretty close across the board, avg them all.

Now you have your LT number, or as close without a lab test.
Now you can take it here and get some zones based on that number. And you can retest every 6 months if you feel the zone is changing because of getting in shape. Because you can change that LT number. Use the line for LT % of course.

http://www.3-fitness.com/tarticles/zones.htm

Zone 1: Recovery - Also known as: Overdistance - Intensity: Very Low
% Lactate Threshold: 65%-84%
% Max Heart Rate: 60%-70%

Used for: These are the easiest workouts, used to promote recovery after harder workouts. It is also generally the intensity level used during the recovery period of interval work and long slow distance (LSD) runs.

Zone 2: Endurance - Also known as: Extensive Endurance - Intensity: Moderate
% Lactate Threshold: 85%-91%
% Max Heart Rate: 71%-75%

Used for: Used for long, endurance workouts and easy speed workout; builds and maintains aerobic endurance.

Zone 3: Lactate Threshold - Also known as: Intensive Endurance - Intensity: Moderate Plus
% Lactate Threshold: 92%-95%
% Max Heart Rate: 76%-80%

Used for: Used for Tempo workouts, training in Zone 3 is usually done in the preparation and base phases. Generally, in the later phases you want to bump up to Zone 4.

Zone 4: VO2 Max Intervals - Also known as: Anaerobic Threshold, Race/Pace - Intensity: Race/Pace
% Lactate Threshold: 96%-100%
% Max Heart Rate: 81%-90%

Used for: Intervals, hill work, and tempo work. Intervals in this zone generally have work-to-rest ratio of 3:1 or 4:1. Training at or slightly below your Lactate Threshold (a.k.a. Anaerobic Threshold) helps your body lean to "recycle" the lactic acid during high intensity work.

Zone 5a: Threshold Endurance - Also known as: Superthreshold
% Lactate Threshold: 100%-102%
% Max Heart Rate: 91%-93%

Used for: Intervals, hill work, and tempo work; typically used after some Zone 4 time has already been done. Zone 5 workouts are very short because it is difficult to maintain this level for any length of time.

Zone 5b: Anaerobic Endurance - Also known as: Speed Endurance
% Lactate Threshold: 103%-105%
% Max Heart Rate: 94%-98%

Used for: Intervals and hill work to improve anaerobic endurance. Intervals in this zone generally have work-to-rest ratio of 1:1, for example, a 20 second sprint followed by 20 seconds of easy recovery (Zone 1).

Zone 5c: Anaerobic Capacity - Also known as: Power
% Lactate Threshold: 106%+
% Max Heart Rate: 98%-100%

Used for: Short-term Sprinting. Intervals in this zone have a work to rest ratio of 1:2 or more.

sixisCHANGEDjk

Well those figures put me at MHR - 180 -186. When I run which is about all I do I'm consistently at 160-170 bpm based on the treadmill pulse monitor. I guess I should train in other zones at times?

[/quote]

Well from my figures (whether they are correct or not) I have used the Londeree and Moeschberger method: MHR = 206.3 - (0.711 × Age) and compared that to the basic MHR = 220 - Age and also used Miller et al method: MHR = 217 - (0.85 x Age)

All these give me a Max Heart Rate of between 178-180 BPM.... So 80-90% of my max HR is 145-162..... So I am pretty sure I am close to these zones.......
[/quote]

2fit4fat

Bump

jbinga

Ha! Love that "wanna stop wanna stop wanna stop". Don't we all know that feeling occasionally?

jbinga

did you do any tests to determine your max heart rate or did you just use the default zones? there are a few different ways to find your max heart rate.. I had testing done at my gym & my zones are way higher than the standard charts said they should be. My resting heart rate is around 60, but my zones that I use while exercising are as follows:

zone 1 166-176 (easy)
zone 2 176-184 (medium)
zone 3 184- 192 (hard)
zone 4 192 - 202 (very hard)
zone 5 202 - peak (extremely hard)

If you can talk a few words at a time and are mouth breathing, I would guess you are either in middle/high zone 3 or low 4. When I'm in 4, all I can think is "wanna stop wanna stop wanna stop". I've never made it to zone 5.

here is a link to a pdf chart that my gym uses. I did the "gold" measurement, but it was pretty much just the "silver" while hooked up to a computer. http://www.lifetimefitness.com/modules/heart_rate/heart_rate_training_chart.pdf

I hope that helps.

That was supposed to be a quote. May bad!

Ha! Love that "wanna stop wanna stop wanna stop". Don't we all know that feeling occasionally?

jbinga

Wow...so much info here. And now I'm definitely overwhelmed. I did plug all of the info into my HRM correctly but what I've gotten from all of this is that it could be wrong. I'm going to try and use some of these resources to find out what my true MHR is and go from there. I guess I brought this complication on myself when I decided I wanted a new gadget.

Thanks so much for all of the great responses! It's so appreciated!

jsjlandy

bump

Azdak

If you really want to get some good heart rate zones for training at different levels, the best method will be finding your lactate threshold.

Your MHR is genetic and you can't improve that, unless you are just starting working out. And it will slowly decrease with age.
So zones based on that don't really take in to account your own level of fitness.

But lactate threshold is that point where you have stopped being aerobic and supplying enough oxygen for complete glycogen and fat burning, and moved to anaerobic and incomplete glycogen burning and lactic acid can no longer be used for fuel and starts to build up.

So when thinking intervals, that is the point you want to get above.

And you can improve that point to a certain extent. As it goes up, your other ranges go up.
Now, this will be a bigger factor when you are near goal weight, and enjoy exercising so much you want to do longer events, or just go faster, without it feeling like it so much.

And there are zones based on your LT, also called anaerobic threshold (AT), which will help train it higher.

Easy test. Well, easy to do, should feel like coughing up a lung when finished. So you MUST be in shape. Unless you want to test a working LT, which may be close enough for some better training until you feel like doing it again.
And this should follow a rest day, and a good night's sleep.

Pick your activity, treadmill and spin bike are easiest to use, because you can fine tune the speed and resistance.
For spin bike, confirm you are spinning 85-95 rpm, or you will be unfairly testing small part of the quads and being lower than you should be..
For treadmill, you'll use a combo of speed and grade.

The idea is to warm up for about 10 min very slow pace.
Then you need a partner to record data ever 3 min during a 15 min test. So 5 data points.
You'll go real slow again for 10 min to recover.
And do the 15 min again.

During the 15 min you should not be expected to talk, no drinking, no extra movements. You are looking for that fine line of just pushing a tad too much, and boom, over the line. Once you go over, you have to almost drop too much to recover.
Hence doing 2 tests.

So if you have ever paid attention during a workout to that level that just burns, or feels really hard, that's what you want to get up to. No real good way to estimate it to get close first.

So on spin bike, while keeping cadence the same, you increase the tension, and just watch the heart rate go up, try to get it up to that barely comfortable level before the 1st 3min data point. If it feels like you could not do this 20 seconds - too high.
If you could talk if you wanted to in complete sentences - too low. One or two words should be it, because you need all that oxygen.

On treadmill, use a combo of speed (which if too fast could be too pounding) and grade (helps go up quickly) to do the same thing. Breathing should be very heavy and fast.

Each data point should be about the same if you really nailed it. If you finished and seemed to have some strength, you go higher on the next test.
You should be able to go slow and recover now for 10 min, clearing that lactic acid out of legs, using it as fuel. Drink some water, wipe off sweat.

Now do the second test the same way. With better idea of how high to go, and how hard you could really push, do it better.
If there is a big difference in data points, just avg the last test 5 points, if pretty close across the board, avg them all.

Now you have your LT number, or as close without a lab test.
Now you can take it here and get some zones based on that number. And you can retest every 6 months if you feel the zone is changing because of getting in shape. Because you can change that LT number. Use the line for LT % of course.

http://www.3-fitness.com/tarticles/zones.htm

Zone 1: Recovery - Also known as: Overdistance - Intensity: Very Low
% Lactate Threshold: 65%-84%
% Max Heart Rate: 60%-70%

Used for: These are the easiest workouts, used to promote recovery after harder workouts. It is also generally the intensity level used during the recovery period of interval work and long slow distance (LSD) runs.

Zone 2: Endurance - Also known as: Extensive Endurance - Intensity: Moderate
% Lactate Threshold: 85%-91%
% Max Heart Rate: 71%-75%

Used for: Used for long, endurance workouts and easy speed workout; builds and maintains aerobic endurance.

Zone 3: Lactate Threshold - Also known as: Intensive Endurance - Intensity: Moderate Plus
% Lactate Threshold: 92%-95%
% Max Heart Rate: 76%-80%

Used for: Used for Tempo workouts, training in Zone 3 is usually done in the preparation and base phases. Generally, in the later phases you want to bump up to Zone 4.

Zone 4: VO2 Max Intervals - Also known as: Anaerobic Threshold, Race/Pace - Intensity: Race/Pace
% Lactate Threshold: 96%-100%
% Max Heart Rate: 81%-90%

Used for: Intervals, hill work, and tempo work. Intervals in this zone generally have work-to-rest ratio of 3:1 or 4:1. Training at or slightly below your Lactate Threshold (a.k.a. Anaerobic Threshold) helps your body lean to "recycle" the lactic acid during high intensity work.

Zone 5a: Threshold Endurance - Also known as: Superthreshold
% Lactate Threshold: 100%-102%
% Max Heart Rate: 91%-93%

Used for: Intervals, hill work, and tempo work; typically used after some Zone 4 time has already been done. Zone 5 workouts are very short because it is difficult to maintain this level for any length of time.

Zone 5b: Anaerobic Endurance - Also known as: Speed Endurance
% Lactate Threshold: 103%-105%
% Max Heart Rate: 94%-98%

Used for: Intervals and hill work to improve anaerobic endurance. Intervals in this zone generally have work-to-rest ratio of 1:1, for example, a 20 second sprint followed by 20 seconds of easy recovery (Zone 1).

Zone 5c: Anaerobic Capacity - Also known as: Power
% Lactate Threshold: 106%+
% Max Heart Rate: 98%-100%

Used for: Short-term Sprinting. Intervals in this zone have a work to rest ratio of 1:2 or more.

After I figured all that out, I didn't have any time left to work out.