The Paleo Diet (No Gluten) Vs. Clean Eating (whole grains)

littlemili

I don't eat gluten bc I'm intolerant/allergic (don't know which, don't really care either) but one thing I am sure of is no way in hell would I voluntarily go without gluten. That *kitten* is tasty.

neanderthin

According to the Paleo Diet, all grains can cause auto immune disease, that can attack and destroy the body. I originally thought some people were allergic to gluten, but as I read on, it's said that most people can be affected by gluten which can lead to poor digestion at best but the the list goes on as to how destructive gluten can be to the body.

I try to eat fairly clean, but I'm not real strict about it. There are processed foods that I still use and love. But I know for fact that the above quoted statements are not true for the general public.

Some people have problems with gluten. Some people have problems with a lot of different foods. Gluten is also not found in all grains.

Whole grains are good for you. Try reading some article from experts in the field of nutrition to get a better picture.

http://www.hsph.harvard.edu/nutritionsource/what-should-you-eat/health-gains-from-whole-grains/
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2007/05/070509161030.htm
http://www.webmd.com/food-recipes/features/the-whole-truth-about-whole-grains

Yes, this is the evidence that including whole grain into ones diet improves certain markers for metabolic syndrome, lipids, glucose etc and basically improves health. This platform is based on replacing refined grains with whole grain. If you take a very close look at most if not all those studies, including your 3, it's generally compared to the SAD lifestyle. What we need to see are controlled studies that compare whole grain vs no grain on those same health markers, which there isn't any, but you might want to look at something like the med diet compared to a paleo, or even a natural low carb diet vs the med diet. The Kitivan diet lifestyle is also interesting to hypothesis about. Personally I simply don't accept studies that compare the obvious like processed food compared to natural.....**** we would be right 100% of the time with any comparison, forget just the grain aspect.

I didn't post 3 studies, because I believe that would not be helpful. What would 3 studies out of the pool of thousands really tell us? The Science Daily report was on a specific study and the HSPH site does reference several studies, though. These are general medical recommendations based on all currently available medical data. That's the best we can do.

But my response didn't say anything about whether eating whole grains was better than eating no grains. I said that eating whole grains is not bad for the general public. The studies referenced on the sites show hundreds of thousands of people who eat whole grains and are healthy. THAT was my point. Grains are not unhealthy for everyone.

Ok. Those 3 links you posted showed that when compared to refined grain, whole was better, so yes in that sense whole grain is better when compared to the diet that the general puplic normally eats. I find generally speaking, when I try to dig up studies that conflict with my own opinion that is keeps me sharp and makes sure I keep an open mind instead of diging up studies that confirm my opinion.......This to me is more interesting over the course.

bcattoes

According to the Paleo Diet, all grains can cause auto immune disease, that can attack and destroy the body. I originally thought some people were allergic to gluten, but as I read on, it's said that most people can be affected by gluten which can lead to poor digestion at best but the the list goes on as to how destructive gluten can be to the body.

I try to eat fairly clean, but I'm not real strict about it. There are processed foods that I still use and love. But I know for fact that the above quoted statements are not true for the general public.

Some people have problems with gluten. Some people have problems with a lot of different foods. Gluten is also not found in all grains.

Whole grains are good for you. Try reading some article from experts in the field of nutrition to get a better picture.

http://www.hsph.harvard.edu/nutritionsource/what-should-you-eat/health-gains-from-whole-grains/
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2007/05/070509161030.htm
http://www.webmd.com/food-recipes/features/the-whole-truth-about-whole-grains

Yes, this is the evidence that including whole grain into ones diet improves certain markers for metabolic syndrome, lipids, glucose etc and basically improves health. This platform is based on replacing refined grains with whole grain. If you take a very close look at most if not all those studies, including your 3, it's generally compared to the SAD lifestyle. What we need to see are controlled studies that compare whole grain vs no grain on those same health markers, which there isn't any, but you might want to look at something like the med diet compared to a paleo, or even a natural low carb diet vs the med diet. The Kitivan diet lifestyle is also interesting to hypothesis about. Personally I simply don't accept studies that compare the obvious like processed food compared to natural.....**** we would be right 100% of the time with any comparison, forget just the grain aspect.

I didn't post 3 studies, because I believe that would not be helpful. What would 3 studies out of the pool of thousands really tell us? The Science Daily report was on a specific study and the HSPH site does reference several studies, though. These are general medical recommendations based on all currently available medical data. That's the best we can do.

But my response didn't say anything about whether eating whole grains was better than eating no grains. I said that eating whole grains is not bad for the general public. The studies referenced on the sites show hundreds of thousands of people who eat whole grains and are healthy. THAT was my point. Grains are not unhealthy for everyone.

Ok. Those 3 links you posted showed that when compared to refined grain, whole was better, so yes in that sense whole grain is better when compared to the diet that the general puplic normally eats. I find generally speaking, when I try to dig up studies that conflict with my own opinion that is keeps me sharp and makes sure I keep an open mind instead of diging up studies that confirm my opinion.......This to me is more interesting over the course.

I think you are missing my point. My post was not about any diet being better or worse than another diet. It was refuting the statements in the section of the OP I quoted about how destructive grains are to our body.

I don't dig up studies to prove or disprove a point, because studies rarely do that. That's why I posted medical sites that present information gathered from all available evidence, rather than specific studies.

I don't believe one has to eat grains to be healthy, but I know that most can eat them and be healthy.

billsica

You really should take everything you read with a grain of salt. Anyone can write a book. Doesn't mean what is contained within the book is factual, backed up by science, or not. Sadly. I can find you a book that says you're not supposed to eat certain foods if you're a certain blood type.

Same thing...

what you meant to say was...

You really should take everything you read with whole grain and salt.

=D

I think high sodium is a bad idea.

Hungry_Tuna

I only eat dinosaurs.

ChrisDavey, you're my hero.

uberrach

read enough books and you'll starve to death.

Or enough MFP threads

edited to say: huffdog: I'm with you; this is pretty much where I'm at now

chrisdavey: I only eat grassfed dinosaurs

I love everything about this lol.

Sp1nGoddess

I am a wannabe nutritionist.. I read lots of books on the subject and each one puts their own spin on it and quotes various studies or success stories. Recently I've read 'Eat to Live' which promotes a plant based diet, 'Wheat Belly' which is of course anti-wheat & "The Primal Blueprint" which is a version of Paleo. Eat to Live quotes a lot from scientists interpretation of the China Study and the conclusions are flawed as there are too many variables. I decided to experiment and see if Paleo/Primal eating was for me. I've been basically grain/sugar free since Sept of last year. I can attest that NOW I have issues with wheat. I can eat a bite of pasta and be ok but a bowl sends my system into fits. I'm not sure if my body has 'forgotten' how to digest wheat or if I had some kind of issue to begin with. I can say that I feel less bloated & less hungry when I don't too many starchy type carbs of any type.

I have heard that dairy can be a cause of seasonal allergies & acne - I've wanted to experiment taking that out of my diet but I love cheese.... yum... cheese............. I do have allergies year round which is not fun.

I think each person has to find what works for them and go with it. You certainly can't go wrong eating lots of veggies, some fruit & quality protein.

mrau719

I try to not eat a lot of gluten b/c I'm sensitive to it....otherwise there is no reason to go gluten-free. It can cause an intolerance later.

BruteSquad

Not on purpose, but as I paid attention to what did what for me, I found I was Paleoesc ..... I don't eat a lot of grain, or a lot of dairy. I DO eat them, they just naturally became a smaller part of my diet as I tried to meet my macro goals. This is what works for me. I do not preach anything other than try things that seem reasonable and find what works for YOU. We are unique snowflakes and all that stuff.....

neanderthin

According to the Paleo Diet, all grains can cause auto immune disease, that can attack and destroy the body. I originally thought some people were allergic to gluten, but as I read on, it's said that most people can be affected by gluten which can lead to poor digestion at best but the the list goes on as to how destructive gluten can be to the body.

I try to eat fairly clean, but I'm not real strict about it. There are processed foods that I still use and love. But I know for fact that the above quoted statements are not true for the general public.

Some people have problems with gluten. Some people have problems with a lot of different foods. Gluten is also not found in all grains.

Whole grains are good for you. Try reading some article from experts in the field of nutrition to get a better picture.

http://www.hsph.harvard.edu/nutritionsource/what-should-you-eat/health-gains-from-whole-grains/
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2007/05/070509161030.htm
http://www.webmd.com/food-recipes/features/the-whole-truth-about-whole-grains

Yes, this is the evidence that including whole grain into ones diet improves certain markers for metabolic syndrome, lipids, glucose etc and basically improves health. This platform is based on replacing refined grains with whole grain. If you take a very close look at most if not all those studies, including your 3, it's generally compared to the SAD lifestyle. What we need to see are controlled studies that compare whole grain vs no grain on those same health markers, which there isn't any, but you might want to look at something like the med diet compared to a paleo, or even a natural low carb diet vs the med diet. The Kitivan diet lifestyle is also interesting to hypothesis about. Personally I simply don't accept studies that compare the obvious like processed food compared to natural.....**** we would be right 100% of the time with any comparison, forget just the grain aspect.

I didn't post 3 studies, because I believe that would not be helpful. What would 3 studies out of the pool of thousands really tell us? The Science Daily report was on a specific study and the HSPH site does reference several studies, though. These are general medical recommendations based on all currently available medical data. That's the best we can do.

But my response didn't say anything about whether eating whole grains was better than eating no grains. I said that eating whole grains is not bad for the general public. The studies referenced on the sites show hundreds of thousands of people who eat whole grains and are healthy. THAT was my point. Grains are not unhealthy for everyone.

Ok. Those 3 links you posted showed that when compared to refined grain, whole was better, so yes in that sense whole grain is better when compared to the diet that the general puplic normally eats. I find generally speaking, when I try to dig up studies that conflict with my own opinion that is keeps me sharp and makes sure I keep an open mind instead of diging up studies that confirm my opinion.......This to me is more interesting over the course.

I think you are missing my point. My post was not about any diet being better or worse than another diet. It was refuting the statements in the section of the OP I quoted about how destructive grains are to our body.

I don't dig up studies to prove or disprove a point, because studies rarely do that. That's why I posted medical sites that present information gathered from all available evidence, rather than specific studies.

I don't believe one has to eat grains to be healthy, but I know that most can eat them and be healthy.

I agree, the point was missed.

RockaholicMama

I have celiac. Meaning, I'm allergic to gluten. The affect gluten has on my body is not a pretty one. It can include bloating, diarrhea, and horrible stomach pain. The stomach pain can be so severe it has put me in the hospital. I avoid all types of gluten. I make sure to watch closely that none of my food is cross contaminated when it's prepared. I feel a lot better since going gluten free. No bloating, no stomach pain (unless some how unwillingly I've been cross contaminated.) My over all digestive health has improved. If you want to know more about celiac and how it affects a person, check out the University of Chicago who has an entire dept dedicated to the study and finding a cure. Since my mother, brother and me have all been diagnosed, they have been a wonderful help.

Iluvchopsticks

I say figure out what works for you. Cut out grains and dairy for a while and see how you feel. Some people are sensitive to these things, others are not. I use a lot of paleo recipes and tried paleo for a while but found it wasn't necessary for me to be on such a strict diet. I do fine with dairy and some grains. I eat 100% oats and rice a few times a week without issue. Strict paleo was way too boring for me and I knew I couldn't sustain it. I have friends who swear by it and many like myself that tried it but couldn't stick with it. I say find something you can maintain without difficulty and don't worry too much about following one diet or another. There is no perfect diet out there for everyone so it can take some experimentation to figure out what is best for you.

StevLL

I have read The Paleo diet and The Athlete's guide to Paleo eating. I've read several food/diet related books over the past year and honestly there is not one way for all, as each person has different metabolic makeups. So far the best one I have read is the Happiness diet which really talks plainly and responsibly about the Modern American Diet or MAD diet for short. (I'll let you make your own inferences)

They really put down processed foods and rightfully so, because we can't strip nutrients form our food and effectively put them back in as well as mother nature can.

My wife and I have gone Gluten free because she has MS and I am gluten intolerant. Without doing anything else I lost 11 lbs in the beginning. It's been a long proccess of slowly cutting out foods and finding, Fresh, Whole, alternatives. We picked one thing at a time, because you really are addicted to a lot of the foods that are manufactured. We now are making our own peabut butter and have made our own almond milk etc. There are a bunch of whole grain non-gluten products out there to continue to get your whole grains, even gluten free oats. It sounds daunting at first but it gets easier with time and now its almost automatic, because as you learn it gets easy to plan and stay focused. We recently started toying with giving up the heavier cheeses like jack, cheddar, mozzerlla etc. Were are sticking to Feta and Goat cheese for now and don't plan to nix those. We have pretty much stopped using processed (foods with non-food ingrediants) with the exception of feta and goat cheese, salad dressings and Gluten free pasta/bread (which we use sparingly)

I just would ask those of you who do want to explore and experiment are not put off by folks who are put everything out the ordinary down. Get to know your body, inform yourself and try new things. It's how we learn and understand. Good luck!

Lvgirl25

I personally think the paleo diet is scary. I also think that people don't give the human body enough credit for adaptation. I'm not hunting and gathering my food and not running from big scary mammoths personally so i don't agree with eating like i am. I keep it modern...run from a heart attack not a ptarodactyl. ; )

BruteSquad

I just would ask those of you who do want to explore and experiment are not put off by folks who are put everything out the ordinary down. Get to know your body, inform yourself and try new things. It's how we learn and understand. Good luck!

I agree. Don't let the "my way is the only way" people prevent you from finding out about what is best for YOU. As much as any of us know, we don't know your body....... that sounded more stalker talk than I intended so listen to what I mean, not what I type.

Cindy_Fit4Life

Thanks everyone for your feedback! :flowerforyou:

bcattoes

One question from those that follow Paleo. This thread makes it sound as if Paleo promotes no gluten, but others I've read say it promotes no grains at all. Of course, no grains = no gluten. But, no gluten =/= no grains.

Does the Paleo diet allow grains without gluten? (I'm not knocking either, just trying to learn).

neanderthin

One question from those that follow Paleo. This thread makes it sound as if Paleo promotes no gluten, but others I've read say it promotes no grains at all. Of course, no grains = no gluten. But, no gluten =/= no grains.

Does the Paleo diet allow grains without gluten? (I'm not knocking either, just trying to learn).

No grain in it's purest form. The gluten arguement was just some proof of human adaption, genetics blah, blah, blah, much like dairy, legumes, nightshade etc. quite a few paleo sites do what's necessary to find followers. MDA for example sells protein powder with sugar in it.......and coffee, potato's, tomatoes, rice are ok if people find they haven't any ill effects.......most plans are quite bastardized. there's many off the rails examples.

StevLL

One question from those that follow Paleo. This thread makes it sound as if Paleo promotes no gluten, but others I've read say it promotes no grains at all. Of course, no grains = no gluten. But, no gluten =/= no grains.

Does the Paleo diet all. ow grains without gluten? (I'm not knocking either, just trying to learn).

I know one of the stricter proponents of Paleo says you should not eat anything you can't get in the middle of the Sahara desert naked with just a sharp stick. I think in it's strictest form grains that require any mechanized processing are a no-no. That being said like anything I think we have to look at where we are today vs when our paleolithic cousins were scrounging for food. I think balance is the key and if you don't have ill effects from grains go for it. I missed pasta for a long time, but find I don't anymore. But now I make a mean polenta lasagna so again it's balance. That uses corm meal, but that would not be ok in a strict paleo diet as far as I can tell. Some of the other paleo authors are more forgiving. I think it's Rob Wolff who is a strict one who says no grains, no coffee, he lost me at the no coffee.

nuviag

I read up on Paelo at one stage and thought I might try it, I did for a few days and found it not too bad....I try to stay away from too many grainy type foods only because they do have an affect on me, can make me feel sluggish or bloated....having said that I don't think I would eliminate them altogether, I think every type of food has its purpose.....eating clean like you have been doing sounds great to me, anything as close to its natural state as possible can't be bad for you in my eyes! I also think everyone's body reacts differently to different food groups....I think its good to get to know your body as much as possible and see what your energy levels etc are like and as long as you feel good that's really all that matters..:o)

Agreed

nuviag

Bum

nuviag

Bump i meant

blu_meanie_ca

I gained weight eating a "clean" diet (whole grains and un processed foods). I still eat "clean" due to food allergies (my children and myself), but, I do watch my macros and calories.
My parents lost a great deal of weight on Atkins. My step dad has since gained it all and more back (my mom lost weight to the point that she looks like an aged skeletor.. but, that's her thing).
One of my friends is a morbidly obese paleo eater. It turns out you can eat too much fat and meat.

In the end too many calories are too many calories. Spike your blood sugar daily like a frat party punch, and see what happens to your body. Starve out vitamins and minerals, reap the benifits of weight loss when your hair and teeth fall out. Eat a good variety of foods in reasonable amounts and live healthy.

CyndiKramer

I can tell you from experience... I actually put ON 10 pounds eating Paleo. The issue I have is that I am a quantities eater.. So when I eat quantitates of fat, and meat.. SURPRISE!!! I gain. But when I weigh and measure clean food ( including GASP grain) I lose. I can't speak to the "science" behind the claims. I do know people for whom it's " working".. But I also knew folks with really bad breath in the mid to late 90's , who were thin doing Atkins, and then a few years later.. The Zone, and then a few years later, South Beach, then the 4 hour Body, and blah, blah, blah..... The point is , for me, if you FEEL great, are getting the results you want, and aren't starving then it's the right thing for you.. If NOT, reset button, try something else. For ME, the only thing that has ever worked long term is.. NO flour, No sugar, weigh and measure food.. have a sponsor, and now I'm adding this forum to the mix. But that's just my story. Good Luck

CyndiKramer

Paleo does say no grain.. I find it to be silly, for me.. I need whole grain ( non gluten) Or I can't poop. ( sorry, gross) which can't possibly be what my Paleolithic cousins were going for. Can you imagine.. Stuck behind a rock for an hour , straining.. along comes a T-Rex.. I'd be a goner.

neanderthin

Paleo does say no grain.. I find it to be silly, for me.. I need whole grain ( non gluten) Or I can't poop. ( sorry, gross) which can't possibly be what my Paleolithic cousins were going for. Can you imagine.. Stuck behind a rock for an hour , straining.. along comes a T-Rex.. I'd be a goner.

lol. No T-REX, wrong timeline, but lots of sabre tooth tigers.:happy:

HotrodsGirl0107

Those with certain medical problems such as pcos, insulin resistance or gluten allergies seem to benefit well from paleo. I have family members who have completely turned their lives and health around by eating this way. My cousin has recently (well 6 months now) started eating paleo when she was diagnosed with ms. She is slowly feeling better and she getting to where she can be more active. Of course there is no cure for ms but in some cases the progression may be slowed through certain changes in diet usually paleo is recomended as a starting point. It is too early to tell since she was so sick in the begining but I hope it works for her.


That being said if you are uneffected by grains then clean eating seems to be a very healthy way to eat. We all know that processed food is really not the best for us. The only thing I find when I eat a strictly clean diet I end up feeling deprived and binge on junk. I eat clean as much as possible but a little junk here and there keeps me sane.

pastryari

I don't like restricting any foods unless there is a medical/allergy reason to do so.

subconscious_ink

I understand everyone on MFP has different ideas as to what is a successful and healthy diet (Lifestyle change) to follow. I've been eating clean for some time now and I just started reading Robb Wolf "The Paleo Diet" and I'm finding out that everything I was thought was healthy is actually incredibly bad for us. This includes our morning oatmeal, multi-grains, whole wheat, Rye, bread, rice, ect. You get the idea.

According to the Paleo Diet, all grains can cause auto immune disease, that can attack and destroy the body. I originally thought some people were allergic to gluten, but as I read on, it's said that most people can be affected by gluten which can lead to poor digestion at best but the the list goes on as to how destructive gluten can be to the body.

I would like to know which diet you prefer and why? Are you an advocate of the Paleo Diet? Tell me what you like and don't like to the diet. Are you a clean eater and incorporated whole grains? How has this worked for you?

Thanks for you feed back!

I try to eat paleo-ish, but mostly because I've noticed grains tend to make me feel a bit bloated and slow. I feel a lot better eating like this. Cutting out grains also made me increase my intake of fruits and veggies, since my carbs have to come from somewhere.

I don't know whether grains or gluten actually irritate things in most people or cause auto-immune diseases. It's easy to find studies to back up a lot of different diets; I imagine the human body is actually quite adaptable to most foods, as long as you don't have an allergy or sensitivity.

Basically, if it seems sound, try it and see if it works for you. That's what I did and I'm happy with it, but not everyone wants or probably even needs to eat Paleo or "clean". Just, if you try paleo or primal (paleo + dairy) beware of the "carb flu" you might get in the first week or two. Also, remember a Paleo diet isn't a free pass to scarf all the meat and bacon you want -- you should have lots of fruits and veggies (I'm still working on that part :embarassed: )

Oh, and eating out on a primal/ paleo diet IS annoying. That is the only part I really have a problem with.

bcattoes

Oh, and eating out on a primal/ paleo diet IS annoying. That is the only part I really have a problem with.

Why is eating out hard? The type of fat typically used?