Body Weight vs. Actual Weights

dru_howard

I'm just curious to everyone's thoughts on this...is there any specific advantage one way or the other, when it comes to building/maintaining muscle mass and strength to body weight training vs. machine weights?

I have been doing both (randomly) up to this point and have recently switched to doing body weight training only in circuit form a couple of times a week and running the other 3-4 days/week.

Is this enough to maintain the muscle mass I have? Can I continue to increase and build my strength this way?

mfpcopine

I'm just curious to everyone's thoughts on this...is there any specific advantage one way or the other, when it comes to building/maintaining muscle mass and strength to body weight training vs. machine weights?

I have been doing both (randomly) up to this point and have recently switched to doing body weight training only in circuit form a couple of times a week and running the other 3-4 days/week.

Is this enough to maintain the muscle mass I have? Can I continue to increase and build my strength this way?

For me, it's partly a matter of convenience. If I'm not at the gym and don't feel like pulling out my dumbbells, I'll do some body weight with a piece of exercise equipment I bought (I don't think it was worth it, which is why I'm not mentioning the name.). I like to do push ups and triceps dips. Sometimes I'll do push ups on the floor or against the wall. Planks are good for abs.

To build muscles, I prefer weights. I actually find that body weight exercises are more difficult than they appear and sometimes building up a little with weights can help.

I'm not heavily muscled, but that's not my goal.

meshashesha2012

well, since your body weight is limited you wont continue to build muscle or increase strength once your muscles become accustomed to the weight and the motion.

doing body weight only exercises should be enough to maintain muscle, but the only real way to increase and build strength is by adding more weight.

i personally prefer free weights for most of my exercises, but body weight exercises have their place especially for pushups and chin ups. but for something like squats where i'm close to squatting an additional weight that close my own body weight, going to non weighted body weight squats i'd probably lose muscle since my body would realize it could get the new work done with less work

crisanderson27

well, since your body weight is limited you wont continue to build muscle or increase strength once your muscles become accustomed to the weight and the motion.

doing body weight only exercises should be enough to maintain muscle, but the only real way to increase and build strength is by adding more weight.

This is only partially correct. There's ten million ways to change leverage...which changes the stress of the exercise, thus increasing and building strength.

Here's a before and after, roughly 3mos of STRICTLY bodyweight training, 3 days a week, roughly 30 minutes a day...utilizing 3-5 exercises in a 5x5 format:



Oh yes...bodyweight can be quite effective for strength training, you just have to be creative and not limit yourself to the typical 'pushup/situp/pullup' routine most people imagine with bodyweight. By the time I was done and finally broke down for a gym membership...I was doing 5x5 handstand pushups, at 180lbs plus clothing lol.

shaycat

Ok stupid question. What is 5x5?

dru_howard

well, since your body weight is limited you wont continue to build muscle or increase strength once your muscles become accustomed to the weight and the motion.

doing body weight only exercises should be enough to maintain muscle, but the only real way to increase and build strength is by adding more weight.

This is only partially correct. There's ten million ways to change leverage...which changes the stress of the exercise, thus increasing and building strength.

Here's a before and after, roughly 3mos of STRICTLY bodyweight training, 3 days a week, roughly 30 minutes a day...utilizing 3-5 exercises in a 5x5 format:



Oh yes...bodyweight can be quite effective for strength training, you just have to be creative and not limit yourself to the typical 'pushup/situp/pullup' routine most people imagine with bodyweight. By the time I was done and finally broke down for a gym membership...I was doing 5x5 handstand pushups, at 180lbs plus clothing lol.

Okay - first of all, you look great and I have to ask too - what is 5x5 and how do I get your type of results??

crisanderson27

well, since your body weight is limited you wont continue to build muscle or increase strength once your muscles become accustomed to the weight and the motion.

doing body weight only exercises should be enough to maintain muscle, but the only real way to increase and build strength is by adding more weight.

This is only partially correct. There's ten million ways to change leverage...which changes the stress of the exercise, thus increasing and building strength.

Here's a before and after, roughly 3mos of STRICTLY bodyweight training, 3 days a week, roughly 30 minutes a day...utilizing 3-5 exercises in a 5x5 format:



Oh yes...bodyweight can be quite effective for strength training, you just have to be creative and not limit yourself to the typical 'pushup/situp/pullup' routine most people imagine with bodyweight. By the time I was done and finally broke down for a gym membership...I was doing 5x5 handstand pushups, at 180lbs plus clothing lol.

Okay - first of all, you look great and I have to ask too - what is 5x5 and how do I get your type of results??

Thanks!! The results came far easier than I ever would have imagined. I'm out right now, but when I get home I'll be happy to post my workout (which has worked very effectively for women as well). If you are interested, I'll post how I ate as well (the most effective method anyhow).

dru_howard

Yes, very interested. I feel like I'm in the best shape of my life easily and am going to start training for a 1/2 marathon soon, but don't want to just run during this time period because of all the benefits of strength training.

sisierra

well, since your body weight is limited you wont continue to build muscle or increase strength once your muscles become accustomed to the weight and the motion.

doing body weight only exercises should be enough to maintain muscle, but the only real way to increase and build strength is by adding more weight.

This is only partially correct. There's ten million ways to change leverage...which changes the stress of the exercise, thus increasing and building strength.

Here's a before and after, roughly 3mos of STRICTLY bodyweight training, 3 days a week, roughly 30 minutes a day...utilizing 3-5 exercises in a 5x5 format:



Oh yes...bodyweight can be quite effective for strength training, you just have to be creative and not limit yourself to the typical 'pushup/situp/pullup' routine most people imagine with bodyweight. By the time I was done and finally broke down for a gym membership...I was doing 5x5 handstand pushups, at 180lbs plus clothing lol.

Okay - first of all, you look great and I have to ask too - what is 5x5 and how do I get your type of results??

5x5 = 5 sets of 5 reps. he did 5, took a break, did 5 more, etc

tracferg

bump

SammyKatt

bump

lanniemcvern

bump

sanjoparolas

also interested . . .

Nopedotjpeg

Weights are easier to accurately gauge the amount of resistance. As has been said previously in this thread, you can increase resistance by doing different types of bodyweight exercises as your strength progresses. However, with weights you can progressively add resistance more steadily rather than having to make the jump from push-ups on knees to regular push-ups to a different body leverage after that one. Instead you can go from a 65lb. bench press to a 70 lb. bench press etc.

b0t23

something about doing a wide range of body weight exercises feels natural

almost as if I am preparing myself for real world activities I may have to do

Yoga

pushups
crunches/situps
squats
burpees
pullups
chinups
leg raises (hanging or otherwise)
dips
handstands/handstand pushups
and much much more with all sorts of variations

makeitbetter

Great results chrisanderson2! Would you mind sharing your routine? I also do body weight training and I'm ready to increase the difficulty. I like the results I've achieved so far and so does my wife.

Lab2809

well, since your body weight is limited you wont continue to build muscle or increase strength once your muscles become accustomed to the weight and the motion.

doing body weight only exercises should be enough to maintain muscle, but the only real way to increase and build strength is by adding more weight.

This is only partially correct. There's ten million ways to change leverage...which changes the stress of the exercise, thus increasing and building strength.

Here's a before and after, roughly 3mos of STRICTLY bodyweight training, 3 days a week, roughly 30 minutes a day...utilizing 3-5 exercises in a 5x5 format:



Oh yes...bodyweight can be quite effective for strength training, you just have to be creative and not limit yourself to the typical 'pushup/situp/pullup' routine most people imagine with bodyweight. By the time I was done and finally broke down for a gym membership...I was doing 5x5 handstand pushups, at 180lbs plus clothing lol.

Okay - first of all, you look great and I have to ask too - what is 5x5 and how do I get your type of results??

Thanks!! The results came far easier than I ever would have imagined. I'm out right now, but when I get home I'll be happy to post my workout (which has worked very effectively for women as well). If you are interested, I'll post how I ate as well (the most effective method anyhow).

I'd like to see the post with your workout and the one with what you ate for some ideas!

crisanderson27

Ok guys, sorry for the delay...I had a late evening last night and so couldn't get back here as I'd intended. What I'm going to do is make three posts, the first listing my bodyweight workout, the second listing my gym workout (adapted directly from my bodyweight workout), and the third giving a brief overview of my experiences with a couple different eating styles, and how I integrated them.

So, first my bodyweight workout:

Another Bodyweight Culture article, this one courtesy Cheesedog at:

http://www.bodyweightculture.com/forum/showthread.php?11058-Bodyweight-Strength-Training

Bodyweight Strength Training

People are always asking about strength training using only bodyweight. This is nothing new or revolutionary. I am borrowing HEAVILY from Rippatoe, Bill Starr, and lots of other great authors and trainers. This is your basic 5 x 5 template. (To clarify, 5x5 is 5 reps x 5 sets. The idea is to work at a difficulty level where you could only do maybe 7-8 reps on the first set, and are struggling to finish 5 reps on the last set). You would do strength training 3 times a week, say Monday-Wednesday-Friday with the weekends off. These are done "lazy circuits" style, with about 1 minute rest between each set (I use a heartrate monitor instead, and begin the next set/workout at a specific heartrate...which for me was 140) .

Workout A
1A. Knee dominant - 5 x 5
1B. Horizontal push - 5 x 5
1C. Horizontal pull - 5 x 5
2A. Ab - flexion - 3 x 5
2B. Ab - static 3 x 30 seconds

Workout B
1A. Knee dominant - 5 x 5
1B. Vertical push - 5 x 5
1C. Hip dominant - 5 x 5
1D. Vertical pull - 5 x 5
2A. Ab - rotation - 3 x 5
2B. Grip and neck training - 3 x varies

Exercise Progressions - with regular weight training you can just add weight to the bar. With bodyweight progression its mostly about changing your leverage. These are just a few examples, I'm sure we could come up with dozens more if needed. You can always add resistance in the form of a weighted vest or backpack or resistance bands.

1. Knee Dominant -- squats, lunges, step-ups, bulgarian split squats, unilateral bent leg deadlift, partial one leg squat, one leg squat, box or stair pistols, full pistols.
2. Horizontal Push -- pushups, decline pushups, resistance pushups, side to side pushups, stair one arm pushups, negative one arm pushups, full one arm pushups (my max pushup was called a 90/10 pushup, I felt it was better than 1 arm because I got a full range of motion).
3. Horizontal Pull -- body row, resistance body row, negative one hand row, incline one hand row, full one hand row.
4. Ab - flexion -- crunches, situps, resistance or incline situps, reverse situp, resistance or incline reverse situps, hanging knee or leg raise, hanging pikes, rollout from knees, rollout from feet, dragon flag. Also included are oblique moves like side lying crunches with or without resistance and side lying two leg raise.
5. Abs- static -- 4 point prone bridge, 3 point prone bridge, 2 point prone bridge, 4 point supine bridge, 3 point supine bridge, planks.
6. Vertical Push -- pike pushup, hindu pushup, divebomber pushup, decline pike pushup, decline hindu pushup, decline divebomber pushup, one arm pike pushup, negative handstand pushup, handstand pushup with head touching floor, full handstand pushup.
7. Hip Dominant -- supine hip extension, good morning, one leg stiff leg deadlift, split one leg good morning, one leg supine hip extension, hyperextension, one leg hyperextension, natural glute-ham raise.
8. Vertical Pull -- jumping or assisted pullups, pullups, resistance pullups, side to side pullups, negative one hand pullups, one hand pullups. All these can refer to chinups or neutral grip pullups as well.
9. Ab - rotation -- twist crunches or situps, resistance or incline twist crunches or situps, russian twists, lying windshield wipers, standing rope rotations, hanging windshield wipers.
10. Grip and Neck Training -- for grip you can use handgrippers, deadhangs from a pullup bar (especially a fatbar or gripping a towel). For neck nothing beats wrestlers bridges. If you are involved in a striking martial art or sport, finger and fist pushups are very important also.

None of these lists have to end here. If you get strong enough you can always add resistance to your full range of motion one limb exercise. Or if you can do more than 5 one hand pushups do decline one hand pushups, or start working on one hand hindu and then eventually one hand dive bombers, and so on.

The nice thing about this routine is it scales dramatically depending on your fitness level, from absolute beginner, to extremely advanced. If you can't do even ONE regular pull up, you can scale it down and do assisted pull ups (legs on a chair), or ballistic pullups (where you jump to provide the initial momentum). The negative motion is critical in building the strength to perform the positive motion. It's actually easier to do properly when you're very unfit...because once you're very healthy and strong...you're going to be searching for challenging enough exercises to only allow you 5 reps max by the finish of the 5 sets.

Cris

One nice thing about the bodyweight stuff as well...is that if you aren't familiar with an exercise, you can find examples of every one of them on YouTube. Also...I found the grip and neck exercises complicated...and honestly didn't use them as much as I probably should have.

crisanderson27

Now my weight training workout. I borrowed heavily from the proven bodyweight (all the results in the pictures above were bodyweight) workout...and was very happy with the results. My home/bodyweight workout took about 30 minutes or so (it may take you longer...but short rest periods are important to keep your heart rate up), wheras the gym takes me 40 minutes to an hour, of actual exercise time.

Ok, here's your simple routine!

You will lift 3 days a week, preferably Monday, Wednesday, and Friday. You should be able to complete this workout in roughly an hour. There are two routines...called 'Workout A' and 'Workout B'. You will do Workout A on your first Monday, and Workout B on your first Wednesday. After that you will simply alternate, A, B, A, B etc. So on your first week, you'll do Workout A twice, second week, Workout B twice. You will use a 5x5 format...meaning 5 sets of 5 reps, with no more than a minute rest between. I rest FAR less than that...30 seconds tops (I now use a heartrate monitor, and begin my next set/exercise at a specific heartrate). In order to decide on a weight (this goes for all exercises), you'll need to find a weight you can do only 6 or 7 reps with on your first set. This should make it properly challenging for your last set.

Now, the exercises:

Workout A:
1 - Weighted Squats/Lunges - Using either dumb bells, kettlebells, or a smith machine, do 5 sets of 5 squats, or 5 sets of 10 lunges (5 each leg)
2 - Dumb Bell Press - Lay back on a bench, and using a 'bench press' motion, press up your matched dumb bells, twisting them so the sides touch at the top. Again, 5 sets of 5.
3 - Horizontal Row - Using the lat pull down machine, lay backwards as far down as you can, and using the bar with a shoulder width grip...pull the weight until the bar touches your chest (a slight gap is fine). 5 sets of 5.
4 - Ab Work Flex - I perfer to do leg lifts for this workout. Using the ab stand (similar to a dip bar, but with handles), lift your legs straight forward, bending at the hips...return to lowered, then lift them towards the left side, return, then towards the right, and return. That is one rep. Do 3-5 sets of 5 reps. If you cannot lift your legs with your knees straight, bend them however much is necessary to allow you to complete the workout.
5 - Ab Work Static - Forward Planks. Get in pushup position, only resting on your elbows. Hold your body straight as a board from shoulders to toes for 30 seconds to 1 minute. Do this 3-5 times. (I do my planks in Tabata format)

Workout B:
1 - Weighted Squats/Lunges - Using either dumb bells, kettlebells, or a smith machine, do 5 sets of 5 squats, or 5 sets of 10 lunges (5 each leg)1B. Vertical push - 5 x 5
2 - Dumb Bell Shoulder Press - Using dumb bells, sit on a bench, then press your weights upward from your shoulders, to above your head. Do 5 sets of 5 reps.
3 - Weighted Extensions - Utilizing the extension stand, place a dumb bell of appropriate weight on the ground. Lock your ankles under the pads, and brace your hips against the stand. Bend down, pick up the dumb bell, then straighten your body, until your back is perpendicular to the ground...bringing the weight slightly forward. Then, lower yourself down, letting the weight touch the floor. That is one rep. Do 5 sets of 5 reps.
4 - Pullups - 5 sets of 5 reps. If you cannot complete that many regular pullups, use the assisted machine, and a level of assistance that allows you to do only 7 reps on the first set. Worst case, use the lat pull down machine, and use a pullup motion with it.
5 - Ab Work Rotation - Using the ab station, lift your legs straight outward, as if you were leg lifting, then, twisting your hips side to side, sweeping your legs side to side in a 'windshield wiper' type motion. Do 10 reps (each sweep in one direction is a rep, so left, right, left would be 3 reps), 3 sets minimum, 5 sets maximum.

That's it! This is my EXACT workout at the gym, currently. It's simple, quick, targets your entire body, and since you're lifting the heaviest weight you can...the workout is extreme. Each successive workout, try to add 5lbs to your weight. If you have to stop in the middle and lower the weight to complete the exercise, that's fine as well. The next time you do that exercise, start with the same weight, until you can complete the entire 5x5 at that weight...at which point you'll move up 5lbs again.

Here's a couple pictures of the results of the strength training. Keep in mind, I'm a GUY!! As a woman you won't be bulking up...your body lacks the testosterone to do so:




Clearly the gym helped me put on muscle...but the bodyweight stuff did a more than sufficient job as well. I just wanted faster results to be honest, and the bodyweight results slow down somewhat once you reach the upper ends of the workouts listed.

ninerbuff

I'm just curious to everyone's thoughts on this...is there any specific advantage one way or the other, when it comes to building/maintaining muscle mass and strength to body weight training vs. machine weights?

I have been doing both (randomly) up to this point and have recently switched to doing body weight training only in circuit form a couple of times a week and running the other 3-4 days/week.

Is this enough to maintain the muscle mass I have? Can I continue to increase and build my strength this way?

Well put it this way: if you're losing weight, then the resistance of body weight exercise is also reducing. Strength increase comes from overloading the muscle, not under loading it.

A.C.E. Certified Personal & Group FitnessTrainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 28+ years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition

crisanderson27

I'm just curious to everyone's thoughts on this...is there any specific advantage one way or the other, when it comes to building/maintaining muscle mass and strength to body weight training vs. machine weights?

I have been doing both (randomly) up to this point and have recently switched to doing body weight training only in circuit form a couple of times a week and running the other 3-4 days/week.

Is this enough to maintain the muscle mass I have? Can I continue to increase and build my strength this way?

Well put it this way: if you're losing weight, then the resistance of body weight exercise is also reducing. Strength increase comes from overloading the muscle, not under loading it.

A.C.E. Certified Personal & Group FitnessTrainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 28+ years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition

This is very true...and eventually was part of the reason I switched to weight training. I wanted additional muscle, and even with a 20lb vest, the workouts were becoming too easy. If, however...I'd wanted to simply maintain what I'd already built (which would be more than sufficient for most women in my experience), or continue to slowly build...the bodyweight stuff would have been more than enough.

JNick77

I think it depends on how you incorporate each. Weights, in general, are your best means of building strength. To Niner's point, you need to overload the muscle. However, doing things like Chin-Ups and Dips are EXCELLENT bodyweight exercises for building strength as well and any decent strength training program should incorporate both. Although some people with shoulder issues may have trouble with Dips. Just to be clear, I'm talking about Dips on a horizontal or "V" bar, not on a bench with your feet in front of you.

I think push-ups, burpees, jump-squats have their place in strength training but I would approach them more from a cardio perspective by combining sets of exercises.

Something like...

A1 - 10 Pushups
A2 - 5 Chin-ups
A3 - 10 Burpees
A4 - 10 Jump Squats
A5 - 10 Medicine Ball Slams

- Do each exercise consecutively, that's one set
- Rest 60 seconds and do it again
- Do as many sets as you can
- Increase intensity by adding reps, sets, or reducing rest time

I would consider that more of a cardio day than a strength training day.

zoedallas

Bump

indrani1947

bump

marbly

Bump

Helloitsdan

well, since your body weight is limited you wont continue to build muscle or increase strength once your muscles become accustomed to the weight and the motion.

doing body weight only exercises should be enough to maintain muscle, but the only real way to increase and build strength is by adding more weight.

This is only partially correct. There's ten million ways to change leverage...which changes the stress of the exercise, thus increasing and building strength.

Here's a before and after, roughly 3mos of STRICTLY bodyweight training, 3 days a week, roughly 30 minutes a day...utilizing 3-5 exercises in a 5x5 format:



Oh yes...bodyweight can be quite effective for strength training, you just have to be creative and not limit yourself to the typical 'pushup/situp/pullup' routine most people imagine with bodyweight. By the time I was done and finally broke down for a gym membership...I was doing 5x5 handstand pushups, at 180lbs plus clothing lol.

Truth!
=D

Nice work BTW.

I just installed a pull up bar in my basement.

crisanderson27

Truth!
=D

Nice work BTW.

I just installed a pull up bar in my basement.

Thanks Dan!

And for the rest of you...here's a link to some information on how I eat. Dan, I saw you posted in that thread already...good stuff!

~Edit - Guess you need the link lol:

http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/551347-has-anyone-tried-intermittent-fasting

bk0626

bump

LastMinuteMama

This is exactly what I've been looking for since I'm without the gym for the summer.

Thank you Cris Anderson for posting this!!!

lisa_e2012

Bump. Chris Anderson you are my new hero!

adamsanders

your body doesnt know the difference from machine to body to cable, as long as the muscles are being challenged at different intensities you can always get results, things like tempo of exercise/rest is what makes the biggest difference,