Too Much Protein???
DottyLove
Posts: 9
Okay So... Im only allowed 47 protein... I mean... What IS protein? Is it bad for you if you have too much, like fats carbs or calories? I mean what does protein DO anyways???
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Replies
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Thats a bulding block for bulding muscles, among other things.
No, nothing bad can happen if you have too much protein, provided that it is lean.0 -
Protein maintains lean tissue, and if you eat too few carbs, also will be converted to glucose and used for energy. your body can make most of the protein it needs from whatever you eat, all you need to worry about are getting the essential amino acids in. 0.8 grams of protein per kilogram of body weight is the World Health Organization recommendation. There is no real upper limit however, as if you consume way too much, your body just converts the excess to glucose, and, eventually into glycerol (fat.)
Just worry about meeting your calorie goal, don't worry so much about the details. Calories are king, the body has metabolic processes to pretty much convert anything you eat into anything it needs, and as long as you stay at a caloric deficit from your maintenance levels, you will lose fat.0 -
provided that it is lean.
Please expand.0.8 grams of protein per kilogram of body weight is the World Health Organization recommendation.
Such a low recommendation.0 -
Over half of the protein we eat gets converted into sugar. A little protein goes a long way. If you're cutting carbs, you'd be better off to increase good fats instead of protein. Fat cannot be converted into sugar. Too much protein is also harmful to the liver.0
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Too much protein is also harmful to the liver.
*sigh* no.0 -
Not really, protein supplement companies just have very good marketing departments. The only people who need very high levels of protein are elite athletes, the average person does not need any more than the WHO recommendation.provided that it is lean.
Please expand.0.8 grams of protein per kilogram of body weight is the World Health Organization recommendation.
Such a low recommendation.0 -
I'm 250lbs eating 100-150g of protein a day. Is it too much? X0
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Not really, protein supplement companies just have very good marketing departments. The only people who need very high levels of protein are elite athletes, the average person does not need any more than the WHO recommendation.
That's simply not true. Plenty of studies have shown that during a caloric deficit that the RDA amount is simply inferior in every way possible. I think the lowest intake I saw that gains were not seen were around 1.5g/kg and the results were superior in terms of body composition. 0.8g/kg is probably a good starting point if you're sedentary but it's simply inferior for someone who is lifting weights and wants improved results. There is a reason why scientific-minded individuals such as Lyle McDonald and Alan Aragon recommend around 1g/lb LBM and that's because current scientific literature leans in favor of something much better than the low consumption recommended by the RDA. Again, good for sedentary people but pointless otherwise.
My goal isn't to litter you with studies but simply provide two studies coupled with Alan Aragon's comments on it. You can read his work and Lyle McDonald's (two of the most respected and controversial nutrition gurus today) as they provide TONS of studies as well as critical examinations of them and logic:
A randomized trial of a hypocaloric high-protein diet, with and without exercise, on weight loss, fitness, and markers of the Metabolic Syndrome in overweight and obese women.
Meckling KA, Sherfey R.
"A high-protein diet was superior to a low-fat, high-carbohydrate diet either alone or when combined with an aerobic/resistance-training program in promoting weight loss and nitrogen balance, while similarly improving body composition and risk factors for the Metabolic Syndrome in overweight and obese Canadian women."
Note: Protein intake was 0.75g/kg vs 1.5g/kg.
Increased protein intake reduces lean body mass loss during weight loss in athletes.
Mettler S, Mitchell N, Tipton KD. Med Sci Sports Exerc.
"As might be expected, during the hypocaloric phase (60% of maintenance intake) the high-protein treatment consuming 2.3g/kg (180 g/day) preserved lean mass – and thus total mass – significantly better than the control group consuming 1.0 g/kg, (74 g/day), as illustrated below."
"There was no (statistically) significant drop in fat mass in either group, so the significant drop was from lean body mass in the lower protein group.. In contrast, previous research on obese subjects has consistently shown the reverse. That is, higher protein intakes resulted in greater total body mass loss via greater loss of body fat. In addition, obese subjects have consistently greater loss of fat mass than lean mass, regardless of the difference in protein intake between groups. This serves to reinforce the principle that the leaner (and more physically conditioned) you are, the more primed you are to lose lean mass instead of fat mass – particularly if protein intake is insufficient."
In short, 0.8g/kg is pointless. It's almost always used as the comparison to higher dosages and consistently fails in producing similar results as higher intakes.0 -
*sigh* YES!Too much protein is also harmful to the liver.
*sigh* no.
Are you a medical doctor? The human liver cannot break down excessive amounts of protein on a daily basis, ultimately you will start to have liver problems. When protein is ingested, the liver has to work extra hard to maintain the body's homeostasis and to convert the synthesized protein into usable amino acids.This also very taxing on the kidneys as well because the kidneys cannot fliter properly due to high levels of urea being excreted as extra protein is being digested. If you eat more protein than your body needs, it gets converted into fat.0 -
And your second study used athletes, if you'll recall, I said athletes need higher levels of protein. And do you have the links to the studies themselves? Without them, quotes don't really mean anything. I do read Alan Aragon's blog regularly, and he gears most of his information toward his main clientele, athletes. He has a lot of great information, but most of it isn't relevant to the average person who just wants to drop a pant size.Not really, protein supplement companies just have very good marketing departments. The only people who need very high levels of protein are elite athletes, the average person does not need any more than the WHO recommendation.
That's simply not true. Plenty of studies have shown that during a caloric deficit that the RDA amount is simply inferior in every way possible. I think the lowest intake I saw that gains were not seen were around 1.5g/kg and the results were superior in terms of body composition. 0.8g/kg is probably a good starting point if you're sedentary but it's simply inferior for someone who is lifting weights and wants improved results. There is a reason why scientific-minded individuals such as Lyle McDonald and Alan Aragon recommend around 1g/lb LBM and that's because current scientific literature leans in favor of something much better than the low consumption recommended by the RDA. Again, good for sedentary people but pointless otherwise.
My goal isn't to litter you with studies but simply provide two studies coupled with Alan Aragon's comments on it. You can read his work and Lyle McDonald's (two of the most respected and controversial nutrition gurus today) as they provide TONS of studies as well as critical examinations of them and logic:
A randomized trial of a hypocaloric high-protein diet, with and without exercise, on weight loss, fitness, and markers of the Metabolic Syndrome in overweight and obese women.
Meckling KA, Sherfey R.
"A high-protein diet was superior to a low-fat, high-carbohydrate diet either alone or when combined with an aerobic/resistance-training program in promoting weight loss and nitrogen balance, while similarly improving body composition and risk factors for the Metabolic Syndrome in overweight and obese Canadian women."
Note: Protein intake was 0.75g/kg vs 1.5g/kg.
Increased protein intake reduces lean body mass loss during weight loss in athletes.
Mettler S, Mitchell N, Tipton KD. Med Sci Sports Exerc.
"As might be expected, during the hypocaloric phase (60% of maintenance intake) the high-protein treatment consuming 2.3g/kg (180 g/day) preserved lean mass – and thus total mass – significantly better than the control group consuming 1.0 g/kg, (74 g/day), as illustrated below."
"There was no (statistically) significant drop in fat mass in either group, so the significant drop was from lean body mass in the lower protein group.. In contrast, previous research on obese subjects has consistently shown the reverse. That is, higher protein intakes resulted in greater total body mass loss via greater loss of body fat. In addition, obese subjects have consistently greater loss of fat mass than lean mass, regardless of the difference in protein intake between groups. This serves to reinforce the principle that the leaner (and more physically conditioned) you are, the more primed you are to lose lean mass instead of fat mass – particularly if protein intake is insufficient."
In short, 0.8g/kg is pointless. It's almost always used as the comparison to higher dosages and consistently fails in producing similar results as higher intakes.0 -
*sigh* YES!
Are you a medical doctor?
Ah, yes, the beginning of what I already know to be a fairly ignorant comment. Unfortunately a lot of information medical doctors use are based on shoddy studies. Of course, the person is a medical doctor! This type of argument is called an appeal to authority, so let's not start off with such pettiness, yes?The human liver cannot break down excessive amounts of protein on a daily basis, ultimately you will start to have liver problems. When protein is ingested, the liver has to work extra hard to maintain the body's homeostasis and to convert the synthesized protein into usable amino acids.This also very taxing on the kidneys as well because the kidneys cannot fliter properly due to high levels of urea being excreted as extra protein is being digested. If you eat more protein than your body needs, it gets converted into fat.
Yes, this is true but it depends on what constitutes a high intake since this differs from individual to individual and is dosage dependent. To simply say, "too much protein is bad for the kidneys" is a blanket statement. Above the RDA of 0.8g/kg is not damaging to the liver or kidney for many individuals. There are thousands of individuals who have consumed bodyweight in protein with little to no ill effects. Not to mention that this notion of yours has been dismissed many times. I have to head out to the grocery store but I'll be back with a lengthier response. Until then, I'm sure google is your friend and you'll find out that much of what's establish in the medical community in regards to diet is shenanigans. Shock horror! I went there!And your second study used athletes, if you'll recall, I said athletes need higher levels of protein. And do you have the links to the studies themselves? Without them, quotes don't really mean anything. I do read Alan Aragon's blog regularly, and he gears most of his information toward his main clientele, athletes. He has a lot of great information, but most of it isn't relevant to the average person who just wants to drop a pant size.
You said elite athletes and he doesn't only gear it to ELITE athletes but the recreational lifter and your non-elite athletes. I'm actually friends with him, so I know his intentions and have received advice from him first hand for free. I assure you, his protein recommendations aren't just for athletes.
And, yes, it matters for even the average person. If you have read any of Alan's work then you would know this. He even mentions this in a large public domain such as Men's Health (1g/lb of target bodyweight was the recommendation). 0 -
Oh my! Aren't you an angry little man with a fragile male ego! Yes, you expect me to believe your opinions and citationless quotes over countless reports from medical doctors?! Hmmmm.....your opinion OR medical FACTS??? I think I'll believe the PhD holders, thanks.:bigsmile:0
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So... you don't have the actual studies?*sigh* YES!
Are you a medical doctor?
Ah, yes, the beginning of what I already know to be a fairly ignorant comment. Unfortunately a lot of information medical doctors use are based on shoddy studies. Of course, the person is a medical doctor! This type of argument is called an appeal to authority, so let's not start off with such pettiness, yes?The human liver cannot break down excessive amounts of protein on a daily basis, ultimately you will start to have liver problems. When protein is ingested, the liver has to work extra hard to maintain the body's homeostasis and to convert the synthesized protein into usable amino acids.This also very taxing on the kidneys as well because the kidneys cannot fliter properly due to high levels of urea being excreted as extra protein is being digested. If you eat more protein than your body needs, it gets converted into fat.
Yes, this is true but it depends on what constitutes a high intake since this differs from individual to individual and is dosage dependent. To simply say, "too much protein is bad for the kidneys" is a blanket statement. Above the RDA of 0.8g/kg is not damaging to the liver or kidney for many individuals. There are thousands of individuals who have consumed bodyweight in protein with little to no ill effects. Not to mention that this notion of yours has been dismissed many times. I have to head out to the grocery store but I'll be back with a lengthier response. Until then, I'm sure google is your friend and you'll find out that much of what's establish in the medical community in regards to diet is shenanigans. Shock horror! I went there!And your second study used athletes, if you'll recall, I said athletes need higher levels of protein. And do you have the links to the studies themselves? Without them, quotes don't really mean anything. I do read Alan Aragon's blog regularly, and he gears most of his information toward his main clientele, athletes. He has a lot of great information, but most of it isn't relevant to the average person who just wants to drop a pant size.
You said elite athletes and he doesn't only gear it to ELITE athletes but the recreational lifter and your non-elite athletes. I'm actually friends with him, so I know his intentions and have received advice from him first hand for free. I assure you, his protein recommendations aren't just for athletes. And, yes, it matters for even the average person. If you have read any of Alan's work then you would know this. He even mentions this in a large public domain such as Men's Health (1g/lb of target bodyweight was the recommendation).0 -
Oh my! Aren't you an angry little man with a fragile male ego! Yes, you expect me to believe your opinions and citationless quotes over countless reports from medical doctors?! Hmmmm.....your opinion OR medical FACTS??? I think I'll believe the PhD holders, thanks.:bigsmile:
Ah, the classic ad hominem argument. Quite the pleasure to see on here. You're quite mistaken as I am not angry (this is the internet, of course) nor do I have a "fragile male ego." Egoism is for the petty. Also, please save your assumptions about me and keep them to yourself. They're almost always going to be wrong and it detracts from having a conversation like semi-civilized human beings. You should prevent yourself from stooping too low since it isn't very becoming of you.
Anyways, moving on.
You obviously have no comprehension whatsoever over what dictates truth or not. You have to understand that having paper credentials does not mean truth or false. There are plenty of people who are missing paper credentials but are quite intelligent (refer to Leighe Peele). Just because someone with a PhD says something does not make it correct. Consider Lustig for example. He said sugar is toxic. By your logic, he's a PhD therefore he's correct yet his entire premise is based on an absurd study where obese, sedentary individuals were given 150g of fructose a day. Does it take a genius to figure out that he's completely wrong? No, it doesn't, but unfortunately this seems to escape you.
Similarly, the idea that protein is quite damaging to kidneys is based on mostly observational and epidemiological studies. You can theorize such and such but, again, it's dosage dependent. What is excess to Mr. Sedentary is not excess to someone else. Additionally, extra protein for someone with pre-existing kidney issues would be quite detrimental to their health. There really isn't any particularly convincing evidence that an active individual consuming their body weight or above RDA will end up with damaged liver or kidney. Again, it's dosage dependent. "Too much protein" is vague. The average weightlifting male who has a healthy body will do fine on 1g/lb (though I don't necessarily recommend that much). This isn't only my opinion nor is it just one I conjured to support my position.
Anyways, it isn't my job to educate you on such simple matters as how to come to obvious conclusions. Instead, I propose some studies from "PhDs" and the like:
Martin WF et. al. Dietary protein intake and renal function. Nutr Metab (2005) 2: 25.
"We find no significant evidence for a detrimental effect of high protein intakes on kidney function in healthy persons after centuries of a high protein Western diet."
Poortmans JR and Dellalieux O. Do regular high protein diets have potential health risks on kidney function in athletes? Int J Sport Nutr Exerc Metab. (2000) 10(1):28-38.
*This is done on athletes but it's important for one reason: it shows the benefits of activity. Athletes are active and thus they are often immune to many diseases despite consuming copious amounts of fructose, sucrose, and the like. As the people from this study conclude, "it appears that protein intake under 2. 8 g.kg does not impair renal function in well-trained athletes as indicated by the measures of renal function used in this study." 2.8g/kg!!!
That's just two but you get the point. The medical community has been wrong many times (red meat? creatine? meal frequency? Do I need to go on to make my point?). Honestly, your position is that so and so has a PhD and therefore they are right. What happens when two PhDs disagree? Ah, the rub.
Luckily for me, I'm not easily wooed by paper credentials. I examine positions critically quite often and come to my conclusions based on available data.So... you don't have the actual studies?
I'm unsure of why you think the burden of proof is on me. You suggest that you read Alan's blog yet I'm shocked at your responses. Anyways, since I've responded to the above, I'll respond to you as well even though the burden of proof is on YOU, not me.
As a note, some people on here train enough to be comparable to athletes. 6 days a week of cardio plus weight training 4 times a week is quite vigorous. Athletes apply much more easily to the recreational lifter than a sedentary individual to an active person. At least the former contains activity while the latter is endangered by everything. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that many things are complicated when examining only sedentary individuals. Studies done on them do not apply well to someone who lifts weights 3-5 times a week. So your notion that studies done on athletes are not applicable is misguided. Your recommendations based on sedentary individuals is far, far, far worse. If you don't know why then you have google as your friend. That aside, I shall proceed.
High protein diet maintains glucose production during exercise-induced energy deficit: a controlled trial.
Smith TJ, et al. Nutr Metab (Lond). 2011 Apr 28;8(1):26.
*Unfortunately this was only 7 days long but it shows proteins benefits beyond muscle preservation as it helped establish glucose homeostasis.
The influence of higher protein intake and greater eating frequency on appetite control in overweight and obese men.
Leidy HJ, et al. Obesity (Silver Spring). 2010 Mar 25.
*Another study that shows another benefit of protein and that is greater satiety. The 1.4g/kg reported better satiety than the 0.8g/kg.
A randomized trial of a hypocaloric high-protein diet, with and without exercise, on weight loss, fitness, and markers of the Metabolic Syndrome in overweight and obese women.
Meckling KA, Sherfey R.
*I want to mention this one again because the obese women on higher protein (almost double the RDA) benefitted over the RDA group.
Macronutrient content of a hypoenergy diet affects nitrogen retention and muscle function in weight lifters.
*This bad boy is from 1988 and they showed that the lower protein group fell into negative nitrogen balance while the higher did not. This supports a study done by Mettler et al (can't find it for some reason) that showed 2.2g/kg was superior in lean body mass retention than the 1.0g/kg group (that's 0.2g/kg higher than your recommendation). One person contended that LBM =/= muscle mass, which is true, but this study shows that it's not out of the question that the lower protein group in Mettler's study lost more muscle mass than the higher. That's two studies for the price of one.
Dietary protein and exercise have additive effects on body composition during weight loss in adult women.
"This study demonstrated that a diet with higher protein and reduced carbohydrates combined with exercise additively improved body composition during weight loss."
A reduced ratio of dietary carbohydrate to protein improves body composition and blood lipid profiles during weight loss in adult women.
"This study demonstrates that increasing the proportion of protein to carbohydrate in the diet of adult women has positive effects on body composition, blood lipids, glucose homeostasis and satiety during weight loss."
Notice a distinct lack of "elite" athletes? Even women, who apparently need less protein, succeeded on 1.4g/kg than the 1g/kg group. Anyways, this is a fairly exhaustive list. I could go on for ages but that is more than sufficient. Of course, I know you will have quibbles about the study but I'd be surprised if you didn't. Most studies are quite shaky but we have seen protein consistently come out on top in higher dosages than the RDA. Of course, the dosage is context dependent. If you're sitting around all day then you don't really need a ton of protein. But if you're weight lifting 4 times a week, I see no harm in around 1g/lb of LBM.0 -
Meat has a lot of iron. If you don't eat enough fiber and/or drink enough water you could have some 'irregularity'. If you have hereditary hemochromatosis you'll probably want to keep your iron in check. Other than that, there are some people that eat nothing but animals and some that even eat other people. I wouldn't worry about it too much.0
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Not really, protein supplement companies just have very good marketing departments. The only people who need very high levels of protein are elite athletes, the average person does not need any more than the WHO recommendation.
That's simply not true. Plenty of studies have shown that during a caloric deficit that the RDA amount is simply inferior in every way possible. I think the lowest intake I saw that gains were not seen were around 1.5g/kg and the results were superior in terms of body composition. 0.8g/kg is probably a good starting point if you're sedentary but it's simply inferior for someone who is lifting weights and wants improved results. There is a reason why scientific-minded individuals such as Lyle McDonald and Alan Aragon recommend around 1g/lb LBM and that's because current scientific literature leans in favor of something much better than the low consumption recommended by the RDA. Again, good for sedentary people but pointless otherwise.
My goal isn't to litter you with studies but simply provide two studies coupled with Alan Aragon's comments on it. You can read his work and Lyle McDonald's (two of the most respected and controversial nutrition gurus today) as they provide TONS of studies as well as critical examinations of them and logic:
A randomized trial of a hypocaloric high-protein diet, with and without exercise, on weight loss, fitness, and markers of the Metabolic Syndrome in overweight and obese women.
Meckling KA, Sherfey R.
"A high-protein diet was superior to a low-fat, high-carbohydrate diet either alone or when combined with an aerobic/resistance-training program in promoting weight loss and nitrogen balance, while similarly improving body composition and risk factors for the Metabolic Syndrome in overweight and obese Canadian women."
Note: Protein intake was 0.75g/kg vs 1.5g/kg.
Increased protein intake reduces lean body mass loss during weight loss in athletes.
Mettler S, Mitchell N, Tipton KD. Med Sci Sports Exerc.
"As might be expected, during the hypocaloric phase (60% of maintenance intake) the high-protein treatment consuming 2.3g/kg (180 g/day) preserved lean mass – and thus total mass – significantly better than the control group consuming 1.0 g/kg, (74 g/day), as illustrated below."
"There was no (statistically) significant drop in fat mass in either group, so the significant drop was from lean body mass in the lower protein group.. In contrast, previous research on obese subjects has consistently shown the reverse. That is, higher protein intakes resulted in greater total body mass loss via greater loss of body fat. In addition, obese subjects have consistently greater loss of fat mass than lean mass, regardless of the difference in protein intake between groups. This serves to reinforce the principle that the leaner (and more physically conditioned) you are, the more primed you are to lose lean mass instead of fat mass – particularly if protein intake is insufficient."
In short, 0.8g/kg is pointless. It's almost always used as the comparison to higher dosages and consistently fails in producing similar results as higher intakes.
When I eat too much protein, I have severe kidney pain. Went through all kinds of tests and my doctor told me to lower my protein intake as it was too high and putting too much strain on my kidneys - hence the pain. I have a family history of kidney stones and was told to be careful as too much protein has been linked to kidney stones.
I don't care what anyone else says - I'm going to listen to my doctor and listen to my body. When I go over around 120g of protein for too many days, I have kidney pain. When I stay below that amount, I don't. Logic (and tests and doctor's advice) tells me to be careful with too much protein - my body simply can't handle it. I suspect the ideal amount and what is too much protein varies from person to person. The recommendations I've seen are 1g/per lb of LEAN BODY MASS - and this actually works for me as my LBM is around 110lbs - which makes the 1g per lb of LBM perfect for me. My boyfriend can easily consume 2 times the protein I have and is just fine.0 -
Upping your protiein intake, thereby decreasing fat and carbs, will not build more lean mass, and actually can have stress on the body including kidney, liver and other bodily functions, as ketones will build up which are toxic. Having this build up of ketones causes the kidneys and liver to go into overdrive trying to rid your body of the toxic waste. This in turn leads to dehydration, and tiredness or exhaustion.
If you up your protein, and up your cals, your body will put on equal amounts of fat and lean mass, as you're taking in too many cals.
Most Americans eat entirely enough protein in their diets,, and the RDA actually recommends .36 grams per pound, or about 15% of your total allowance. When working out and losing weight, people do need a bit more, which is why 20% is recommended.0 -
You can never have too much protein.
Well you CAN, but I wouldn't stress if you go over on it, not even if you go over on it most days.
Protein rules
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When I eat too much protein, I have severe kidney pain. Went through all kinds of tests and my doctor told me to lower my protein intake as it was too high and putting too much strain on my kidneys - hence the pain. I have a family history of kidney stones and was told to be careful as too much protein has been linked to kidney stones.
I don't care what anyone else says - I'm going to listen to my doctor and listen to my body. When I go over around 120g of protein for too many days, I have kidney pain. When I stay below that amount, I don't. Logic (and tests and doctor's advice) tells me to be careful with too much protein - my body simply can't handle it. I suspect the ideal amount and what is too much protein varies from person to person. The recommendations I've seen are 1g/per lb of LEAN BODY MASS - and this actually works for me as my LBM is around 110lbs - which makes the 1g per lb of LBM perfect for me. My boyfriend can easily consume 2 times the protein I have and is just fine.
You consume 1g/lb of LBM? That's considered a very high protein diet. You have to realize that a high protein diet in medical terms is 1.4g/kg, which is only 0.7g/kg higher than the RDA. 1g/lb of LBM is much higher than what is medically considered "high." So, really, you are consuming a high protein diet any way you slice it.
As a side note, my contention wasn't that someone should eat their bodyweight or more. Rather that high protein has been shown to be vastly superior to the RDA amount of 0.8g/kg.
Also, please do not let your person experiences get in the way of what I'm trying to convey. This is quite common on MFP and it really dilutes what I'm trying to say. Whatever I say is in reference to healthy individuals, not someone who is diabetic or has a history of kidney issues.Most Americans eat entirely enough protein in their diets,, and the RDA actually recommends .36 grams per pound, or about 15% of your total allowance. When working out and losing weight, people do need a bit more, which is why 20% is recommended.
Read my post above. One meta-analysis found that a high protein, American diet isn't damaging to the kidneys. The RDA recommendation is too low for active individuals seeking body recomposition and lean muscle tissue gain. Furthermore, satiety, glucose homeostasis and a plethora of other factors are improved while consuming a higher protein diet while attempting to lose weight. This has been chronicled extensively.0 -
When I eat too much protein, I have severe kidney pain. Went through all kinds of tests and my doctor told me to lower my protein intake as it was too high and putting too much strain on my kidneys - hence the pain. I have a family history of kidney stones and was told to be careful as too much protein has been linked to kidney stones.
I don't care what anyone else says - I'm going to listen to my doctor and listen to my body. When I go over around 120g of protein for too many days, I have kidney pain. When I stay below that amount, I don't. Logic (and tests and doctor's advice) tells me to be careful with too much protein - my body simply can't handle it. I suspect the ideal amount and what is too much protein varies from person to person. The recommendations I've seen are 1g/per lb of LEAN BODY MASS - and this actually works for me as my LBM is around 110lbs - which makes the 1g per lb of LBM perfect for me. My boyfriend can easily consume 2 times the protein I have and is just fine.
You consume 1g/lb of LBM? That's considered a very high protein diet. You have to realize that a high protein diet in medical terms is 1.4g/kg, which is only 0.7g/kg higher than the RDA. 1g/lb of LBM is much higher than what is medically considered "high." So, really, you are consuming a high protein diet any way you slice it.
As a side note, my contention wasn't that someone should eat their bodyweight or more. Rather that high protein has been shown to be vastly superior to the RDA amount of 0.8g/kg.
Also, please do not let your person experiences get in the way of what I'm trying to convey. This is quite common on MFP and it really dilutes what I'm trying to say. Whatever I say is in reference to healthy individuals, not someone who is diabetic or has a history of kidney issues.Most Americans eat entirely enough protein in their diets,, and the RDA actually recommends .36 grams per pound, or about 15% of your total allowance. When working out and losing weight, people do need a bit more, which is why 20% is recommended.
Read my post above. One meta-analysis found that a high protein, American diet isn't damaging to the kidneys. The RDA recommendation is too low for active individuals seeking body recomposition and lean muscle tissue gain. Furthermore, satiety, glucose homeostasis and a plethora of other factors are improved while consuming a higher protein diet while attempting to lose weight. This has been chronicled extensively.
I did read the post above. And I agree that when losing weight one needs more protiein, or rather, more than the RDA. Which is why the recommended of 15% is upped to 20% or even a bit higher for elite athletes. However, there is such a thing as too much protiein, and I simply want to convey that very reputable scientific fact, so that people don't begin to think that having more and more is always a better way. Just like lowering your cals too much is bad, eating in the wrong proportions is not good either.0 -
A gram per pound sounds awfully arbitrary. A gram is metric and pound is imperial.0
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protein gives u energy and great 4 bones stamina GREAT 4 the blood0
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When I eat too much protein, I have severe kidney pain. Went through all kinds of tests and my doctor told me to lower my protein intake as it was too high and putting too much strain on my kidneys - hence the pain. I have a family history of kidney stones and was told to be careful as too much protein has been linked to kidney stones.
I don't care what anyone else says - I'm going to listen to my doctor and listen to my body. When I go over around 120g of protein for too many days, I have kidney pain. When I stay below that amount, I don't. Logic (and tests and doctor's advice) tells me to be careful with too much protein - my body simply can't handle it. I suspect the ideal amount and what is too much protein varies from person to person. The recommendations I've seen are 1g/per lb of LEAN BODY MASS - and this actually works for me as my LBM is around 110lbs - which makes the 1g per lb of LBM perfect for me. My boyfriend can easily consume 2 times the protein I have and is just fine.
You consume 1g/lb of LBM? That's considered a very high protein diet. You have to realize that a high protein diet in medical terms is 1.4g/kg, which is only 0.7g/kg higher than the RDA. 1g/lb of LBM is much higher than what is medically considered "high." So, really, you are consuming a high protein diet any way you slice it.
As a side note, my contention wasn't that someone should eat their bodyweight or more. Rather that high protein has been shown to be vastly superior to the RDA amount of 0.8g/kg.
Also, please do not let your person experiences get in the way of what I'm trying to convey. This is quite common on MFP and it really dilutes what I'm trying to say. Whatever I say is in reference to healthy individuals, not someone who is diabetic or has a history of kidney issues.Most Americans eat entirely enough protein in their diets,, and the RDA actually recommends .36 grams per pound, or about 15% of your total allowance. When working out and losing weight, people do need a bit more, which is why 20% is recommended.
Read my post above. One meta-analysis found that a high protein, American diet isn't damaging to the kidneys. The RDA recommendation is too low for active individuals seeking body recomposition and lean muscle tissue gain. Furthermore, satiety, glucose homeostasis and a plethora of other factors are improved while consuming a higher protein diet while attempting to lose weight. This has been chronicled extensively.
You're coming across as very know it all, when in reality what you know is what may work for you or what you've read in a book.
If we all worked the same way, there'd be no need for different 'diets'. We (my doctor and I - whom I trust completely) have concluded that with my work and workout routine, 1g of protein per lb of LBM is perfect (as I said, this puts me around 110g of protein a day).
I will mention that I also consume around 250-300g of carbs, so I am in no way a low carb person.
What I do works for my body and that is really what matters to me. I know that for me too much protein = kidney pain for me. I've learned the boundaries and I stay within them in ensure I get adequate protein, but do not overwhelm my system.
And my personal experience is what matters to me - not what you are trying to convey. I care about what works for me not everyone else or what some study says should be right for everyone.0 -
i've been eating 1g of protien per lb of body weight for a while now, im still alive and had zero issues with my body, im sure if you ate some rediculous number like 400g a day for weeks striaight you would have problems0
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There is never. never. never. and I do repeat, NEVER too much protein.
It's just the source that sometimes you might have a bit too much of.0 -
There is never. never. never. and I do repeat, NEVER too much protein.
It's just the source that sometimes you might have a bit too much of.
There can be a time when there's too much - I've experienced it. My doctor said I was consuming too much protein when I was trying to get over 200g a day of it.
You can have too much of just about anything - from water to sugar to protein. It is about what is a healthy balance for you and your body.0 -
Based on the fact that I lift weights, my doctor wants me eating 1g/per LBM of protein and I do just fine with it, thank you. As I stated already, anything over a certain amount for too many days and I have issues.
What's with the tone? You're completely misreading what I'm saying. I never said what your doctor recommended was right or wrong nor did I say you would badly on it. I don't get this portion of your message at all. I never said anything that even warrants it.I appreciate you thinking you know what's right for everyone though.
Care to share where I even implied such a thing? What I said was referred to healthy individuals without a history of health problems, which automatically excludes you. At the same time, I never made one clear cut recommendation for everyone. I'm not particularly sure why you're being so snarky.0 -
There is never. never. never. and I do repeat, NEVER too much protein.
It's just the source that sometimes you might have a bit too much of.
if you can back this up with any amount of scientific evidence, I"ll concede my earlier point.
However, since the evidence is overwhelmingly against what you're saying, I don't think I"ll hold my breath.0 -
Some I think Aeolian already posted and ::poof::
Protein and amino acids for athletes. J Sports Sci. 2004 Jan;22(1):65-79.
www.uni.edu/dolgener/Advanced_Sport.../protein_intake.pdfSince there is evidence that protein intakes above the RDA may be beneficial to athletes, a risk–benefit analysis may be useful. An important consideration is the potential harm that may arise from elevated protein intakes. There is little research into the maximum tolerable protein intake in healthy individuals. It has been suggested that excessive protein intakes may increase calcium loss, thus affecting bone health. However, since a major portion of bone is protein, excessive protein does not appear to influence bone health. High protein intakes have been suggested to pose a risk for the kidneys but, in healthy individuals with no underlying kidney disease (presumably most elite athletes), there is no evidence for harm to kidneys with higher intakes. Certainly, it would be detrimental for an athlete to consume excess protein at the expense of other nutrients required to support the necessary level of training and competition. There is a suggestion that intakes greater than 40% of total energy intake might be the upper limit. Protein intakes greater than 40% may limit intake of fat and/or carbohydrates, thus compromising the benefits of these nutrients. However, given the high energy intakes of most elite athletes, protein intakes higher than 40% are unlikely in most. Even a small female restricting energy intake and consuming only 1500 kcal would need to consume 150 g of protein to reach 40%.
High-Protein Weight Loss Diets and Purported Adverse Effects: Where is the Evidence? Journal of the International Society of Sports Nutrition 2004, 1:45-51 doi:10.1186/1550-2783-1-1-45
http://www.jissn.com/content/1/1/45#B4Indeed, the recent study Dawson-Hughes et al. did not confirm the perception that increased dietary protein results in urinary calcium loss.[36] According to Dawson-Hughes et al., "Theconstellation of findings that meat supplements containing 55 g/d protein, when exchanged for carbohydrate did not significantlyincrease urinary calcium excretion and were associated withhigher levels of serum IGF-I and lower levels of the bone resorption marker, N-telopeptide, together with a lack of significant correlationof urinary N-telopeptide with urinary calcium excretion in thehigh protein group (in contrast to the low protein) point tothe possibility that higher meat intake may potentially improvebone mass in many older men and women."
Finally, the cross-cultural and population studies that showed a positive association between animal-protein intake and hip fracture risk did not consider other lifestyle or dietary factors that may protect or increase the risk of fracture.[35] It is of some interest that the author of the most cited paper favoring the earlier hypothesis that high-protein intake promotes osteoporosis no longer believes that protein is harmful to bone.[34] In fact, he concluded that the balance of the evidence seems to indicate the opposite.Despite its role in nitrogen excretion, there are presently no data in the scientific literature demonstrating the healthy kidney will be damaged by the increased demands of protein consumed in quantities above the Recommended Dietary Allowance (RDA). Furthermore, real world examples support this contention since kidney problems are nonexistent in the bodybuilding community in which high-protein intake has been the norm for over half a century.[3] Recently, Walser published comprehensive review on protein intake and renal function, which states: "it is clear that protein restriction does not prevent decline in renal function with age, and, in fact, is the major cause of that decline. A better way to prevent the decline would be to increase protein intake. there is no reason to restrict protein intake in healthy individuals in order to protect the kidney."[4]
Dietary protein intake and renal function. Nutrition & Metabolism 2005, 2:25 doi:10.1186/1743-7075-2-25
http://www.nutritionandmetabolism.com/content/2/1/25Conclusion
Although excessive protein intake remains a health concern in individuals with pre-existing renal disease, the literature lacks significant research demonstrating a link between protein intake and the initiation or progression of renal disease in healthy individuals. More importantly, evidence suggests that protein-induced changes in renal function are likely a normal adaptative mechanism well within the functional limits of a healthy kidney. Without question, long-term studies are needed to clarify the scant evidence currently available regarding this relationship. At present, there is not sufficient proof to warrant public health directives aimed at restricting dietary protein intake in healthy adults for the purpose of preserving renal function.[0 -
Oh my GOD.
I swear people on these forums are insane.0
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