Don't worry, Big Brother is here!

cannonsky

http://news.yahoo.com/obesity-fight-must-shift-personal-blame-u-panel-123320915--sector.html

This is only the beginning, I expect a harder push for more control over our daily lives in the coming years by the pencil necks in D.C. We should all feel so good knowing that our gov is looking out for us, soon we won't have to make any decisions on our own.

I'm just always amazed that the right-wing foxnews drones are so concerned about the govt taxing a pack of cookies but could care less about corporate influence on the whole political system with limitless money, the reproductive rights of women being compromised by guess who the govt. or kids being able to walk down the street with an ice tea and skittles without getting killed. unbelievable

well you see... if only the skittles were being taxed higher

angryguy77

There are a lot of naive people in the world, and the first sign of it is when a person suggests the government is only trying to help. The government never makes anything easier, cheaper, or more efficient. All they do is bribe the public with the public's money.

There should be no such thing as any kind of subsidy or tax break for producers or consumers of certain products. Any kind of tax policy that attempts to manipulate public behavior is bad tax policy.

Enjoying the internet? That's cool. You're welcome.

Sincerely,
Government of the United States of America.



There really are a lot of naive people in the world.

And that has to do what with the conversation again? You did miss the old standby which is roads and police etc. Obviously we are all advocating against the existence of all government. Seriously, try thinking a bit.

She said the government only steals from people and never provides any services. I corrected her with an example. And you are correct that roads and police are other fine examples of what government provides for it's citizens.

If you need me to explain anything else I can.

Where did she say the government doesn't provide any services? She said it was inefficient, inept, and expensive which is correct.
And maybe you should realize that nobody is saying every government action is bad either. But yet, whenever someone says it's expanding too much or most government programs are not working, those examples are brought up. It's short sighted to paint what we are saying and trying to equate every government action as being equal and justified. It's not, we don't exist in a vacuum, there are differences in these government functions.

If you need me to explain the Constitution I will explain that as well.

stormieweather

...

Dragonwolf

Did you read the part about our kids not walking to school because there aren't enough sidewalks? I thought I didn't let my kids walk to school because of all the creeps out there that could do something to them. I just don't let my kids roam the neighborhood. It's not a safe world. It has notthing to do with sidewalks though. LOL!

...Except for the fact that crime has gone down, across the board since the 90s, and is currently lower than it was in the 60s....and the people that are the most likely to "do something" to your kids are their relatives....and that a person is orders of magnatudes more likely to be injured or killed in a car accident than just about any other threat to their safety.

http://freerangekids.wordpress.com/
http://www.stats.org/stories/2006/Today_missing_kids_mar09_06.htm
http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,1705342,00.html
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-503325/Children-play-unsupervised-turn-fitter-sociable-study-says.html

angryguy77

Let's completely get rid of the FDA and trust the corporations to provide us with safe, healthful food. After all, corporations always have the consumer's best interest at heart and not the almighty dollar. They would never try to deceive us into thinking a product is safe for consumption or healthful when it truly isn't. Why in the world would we want anyone to steer the rampantly obese general public towards better choices? Crazy talk - all of it!

Where did anyone say we should get rid of the FDA?

I love it, corporations are out to kill their customers because they've figured out a way to make money without them. Man, those wall street tycoons are smarter than I thought. Guess I'm going to have to get an extra job so my son can go to Harvard. Clearly they've figured out how to turn lead to gold.

I guess government has never deceived us ever huh? It's always done what's right hasn't it? In fact, throughout human history, only politicians and bureaucrats have been the sole bearers of virtue and good will. They've never tried to incrementally take freedoms away under the guise of it "being for our own good". In fact we should abolish the bill of rights because we clearly don't need it to protect our rights. Those founders who didn't trust government were a bunch of fools and wasted so much time telling us we need to be eternally vigilant against those who wish to control us.

It's arrogance of the highest degree to think that just because we live in the US, we will always be free.

JessieArt

Did you read the part about our kids not walking to school because there aren't enough sidewalks? I thought I didn't let my kids walk to school because of all the creeps out there that could do something to them. I just don't let my kids roam the neighborhood. It's not a safe world. It has notthing to do with sidewalks though. LOL!

...Except for the fact that crime has gone down, across the board since the 90s, and is currently lower than it was in the 60s....and the people that are the most likely to "do something" to your kids are their relatives....and that a person is orders of magnatudes more likely to be injured or killed in a car accident than just about any other threat to their safety.

http://freerangekids.wordpress.com/

http://www.stats.org/stories/2006/Today_missing_kids_mar09_06.htm
http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,1705342,00.html
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-503325/Children-play-unsupervised-turn-fitter-sociable-study-says.html

One of my daughters was actually approached walking home from the bus. The guy was trying to get her in his car. He followed her several blocks until my Husband showed up. Thank God she had a cell phone. So, quote all the articles you want. I've experienced it first hand.

cannonsky

Let's completely get rid of the FDA and trust the corporations to provide us with safe, healthful food. After all, corporations always have the consumer's best interest at heart and not the almighty dollar. They would never try to deceive us into thinking a product is safe for consumption or healthful when it truly isn't. Why in the world would we want anyone to steer the rampantly obese general public towards better choices? Crazy talk - all of it!

Where did anyone say we should get rid of the FDA?

I love it, corporations are out to kill their customers because they've figured out a way to make money without them.

I guess government has never deceived us ever huh? It's always done what's right hasn't it? In fact, throughout human history, only politicians and bureaucrats have been the sole bearers of virtue and good will. They've never tried to incrementally take freedoms away under the guise of it "being for our own good". In fact we should abolish the bill of rights because we clearly don't need it to protect our rights. Those founders who didn't trust government were a bunch of fools and wasted so much time telling us we need to be eternally vigilant against those who wish to control us.

It's arrogance of the highest degree to think that just because we live in the US, we will always be free.

I'm going to assume you are being serious since you clearly do not recognize sarcasm

angryguy77

Did you read the part about our kids not walking to school because there aren't enough sidewalks? I thought I didn't let my kids walk to school because of all the creeps out there that could do something to them. I just don't let my kids roam the neighborhood. It's not a safe world. It has notthing to do with sidewalks though. LOL!

...Except for the fact that crime has gone down, across the board since the 90s, and is currently lower than it was in the 60s....and the people that are the most likely to "do something" to your kids are their relatives....and that a person is orders of magnatudes more likely to be injured or killed in a car accident than just about any other threat to their safety.

http://freerangekids.wordpress.com/

http://www.stats.org/stories/2006/Today_missing_kids_mar09_06.htm
http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,1705342,00.html
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-503325/Children-play-unsupervised-turn-fitter-sociable-study-says.html

One of my daughters was actually approached walking home from the bus. The guy was trying to get her in his car. He followed her several blocks until my Husband showed up. Thank God she had a cell phone. So, quote all the articles you want. I've experienced it first hand.

You didn't get the memo? We've obviously returned to a society that doesn't have to lock it's doors at night:laugh:

Dragonwolf

Did you read the part about our kids not walking to school because there aren't enough sidewalks? I thought I didn't let my kids walk to school because of all the creeps out there that could do something to them. I just don't let my kids roam the neighborhood. It's not a safe world. It has notthing to do with sidewalks though. LOL!

...Except for the fact that crime has gone down, across the board since the 90s, and is currently lower than it was in the 60s....and the people that are the most likely to "do something" to your kids are their relatives....and that a person is orders of magnatudes more likely to be injured or killed in a car accident than just about any other threat to their safety.

http://freerangekids.wordpress.com/

http://www.stats.org/stories/2006/Today_missing_kids_mar09_06.htm
http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,1705342,00.html
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-503325/Children-play-unsupervised-turn-fitter-sociable-study-says.html

One of my daughters was actually approached walking home from the bus. The guy was trying to get her in his car. He followed her several blocks until my Husband showed up. Thank God she had a cell phone. So, quote all the articles you want. I've experienced it first hand.

That's where teaching awareness of your surroundings and self-defense tactics come in. Teaching fear only increases the likelihood that she will become a victim, and sheltering only teaches fear (because you convey your own fears by sheltering). There are "bad people" out there, yes, but the whole world isn't out to get you or your child(ren). Most people are, in fact, good.

By your logic, my mother should have never taken me anywhere in a car, and I never should have ridden in a car anywhere, because we were in a car accident (other driver's fault) when I was little. Nor should I own or go anywhere near any dog, ever, because I was once bitten.

angryguy77

Did you read the part about our kids not walking to school because there aren't enough sidewalks? I thought I didn't let my kids walk to school because of all the creeps out there that could do something to them. I just don't let my kids roam the neighborhood. It's not a safe world. It has notthing to do with sidewalks though. LOL!

...Except for the fact that crime has gone down, across the board since the 90s, and is currently lower than it was in the 60s....and the people that are the most likely to "do something" to your kids are their relatives....and that a person is orders of magnatudes more likely to be injured or killed in a car accident than just about any other threat to their safety.

http://freerangekids.wordpress.com/

http://www.stats.org/stories/2006/Today_missing_kids_mar09_06.htm
http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,1705342,00.html
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-503325/Children-play-unsupervised-turn-fitter-sociable-study-says.html

One of my daughters was actually approached walking home from the bus. The guy was trying to get her in his car. He followed her several blocks until my Husband showed up. Thank God she had a cell phone. So, quote all the articles you want. I've experienced it first hand.

That's where teaching awareness of your surroundings and self-defense tactics come in. Teaching fear only increases the likelihood that she will become a victim, and sheltering only teaches fear (because you convey your own fears by sheltering). There are "bad people" out there, yes, but the whole world isn't out to get you or your child(ren). Most people are, in fact, good.

By your logic, my mother should have never taken me anywhere in a car, and I never should have ridden in a car anywhere, because we were in a car accident (other driver's fault) when I was little. Nor should I own or go anywhere near any dog, ever, because I was once bitten.

It only takes once for something to change a person's life forever. It's not that you should shelter a child forever, but you also need to be smart as well. From what she said, she did teach her daughter the right thing to do in that situation.

So you would be perfectly fine with letting your child walk through a ghetto and not be worried?

ffffaaatttt

oops

cPT_Helice

I find it so interesting how there are some people on this thread who have started name calling and brought up the abortion issue (in the guise of "women's reproductive rights") and attacked a news channel, all going after who they claim to be "the right", and "drones". Why do those of you who do that have to do that? Why are you not capable of just having a discussion and sticking to the issue?
It's really pathetic.

JessieArt

Did you read the part about our kids not walking to school because there aren't enough sidewalks? I thought I didn't let my kids walk to school because of all the creeps out there that could do something to them. I just don't let my kids roam the neighborhood. It's not a safe world. It has notthing to do with sidewalks though. LOL!

...Except for the fact that crime has gone down, across the board since the 90s, and is currently lower than it was in the 60s....and the people that are the most likely to "do something" to your kids are their relatives....and that a person is orders of magnatudes more likely to be injured or killed in a car accident than just about any other threat to their safety.

http://freerangekids.wordpress.com/

http://www.stats.org/stories/2006/Today_missing_kids_mar09_06.htm
http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,1705342,00.html
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-503325/Children-play-unsupervised-turn-fitter-sociable-study-says.html

One of my daughters was actually approached walking home from the bus. The guy was trying to get her in his car. He followed her several blocks until my Husband showed up. Thank God she had a cell phone. So, quote all the articles you want. I've experienced it first hand.

That's where teaching awareness of your surroundings and self-defense tactics come in. Teaching fear only increases the likelihood that she will become a victim, and sheltering only teaches fear (because you convey your own fears by sheltering). There are "bad people" out there, yes, but the whole world isn't out to get you or your child(ren). Most people are, in fact, good.

By your logic, my mother should have never taken me anywhere in a car, and I never should have ridden in a car anywhere, because we were in a car accident (other driver's fault) when I was little. Nor should I own or go anywhere near any dog, ever, because I was once bitten.

It only takes once for something to change a person's life forever. It's not that you should shelter a child forever, but you also need to be smart as well. From what she said, she did teach her daughter the right thing to do in that situation.

So you would be perfectly fine with letting your child walk through a ghetto and not be worried?

Thank you!

cannonsky

I find it so interesting how there are some people on this thread who have started name calling and brought up the abortion issue (in the guise of "women's reproductive rights") and attacked a news channel, all going after who they claim to be "the right", and "drones". Why do those of you who do that have to do that? Why are you not capable of just having a discussion and sticking to the issue?
It's really pathetic.

shhhh you'll spoil the fun

huntindawg1962

It is not telling us what to eat but it is making healthier foods more accessible. Currently, it is cheaper to buy soda and such than it is to buy juices and milk.

Then you really don't have a grasp on how the the free markets work and why junk, processed, convenient (and tasty) foods are so readily available and "cheaper." Its not some conspiracy from some Wall Street Board Room decision makers that has made junk food cheap - THAT is what the people want so there is lots of willing manufacturers competing for your money driving down costs and distribution. Taxing it alone don't work - look at how much tax is on other things - yet people will buy what they want.

And when you consider the cost of eating clean and being healthy - as opposed to eating cheap and paying higher medical bills, insurance and medication costs, shopping at the big person store (also not as cheap as buying off the rack from the normal people stores) - then tell me how much more it costs to "eat right!"

cannonsky

It is not telling us what to eat but it is making healthier foods more accessible. Currently, it is cheaper to buy soda and such than it is to buy juices and milk.

Then you really don't have a grasp on how the the free markets work and why junk, processed, convenient (and tasty) foods are so readily available and "cheaper." Its not some conspiracy from some Wall Street Board Room decision makers that has made junk food cheap - THAT is what the people want so there is lots of willing manufacturers competing for your money driving down costs and distribution. Taxing it alone don't work - look at how much tax is on other things - yet people will buy what they want.

And when you consider the cost of eating clean and being healthy - as opposed to eating cheap and paying higher medical bills, insurance and medication costs, shopping at the big person store (also not as cheap as buying off the rack from the normal people stores) - then tell me how much more it costs to "eat right!"

no

neverstray

There are a lot of naive people in the world, and the first sign of it is when a person suggests the government is only trying to help. The government never makes anything easier, cheaper, or more efficient. All they do is bribe the public with the public's money.

There should be no such thing as any kind of subsidy or tax break for producers or consumers of certain products. Any kind of tax policy that attempts to manipulate public behavior is bad tax policy.

I want to marry you.

cPT_Helice

I find it so interesting how there are some people on this thread who have started name calling and brought up the abortion issue (in the guise of "women's reproductive rights") and attacked a news channel, all going after who they claim to be "the right", and "drones". Why do those of you who do that have to do that? Why are you not capable of just having a discussion and sticking to the issue?
It's really pathetic.

shhhh you'll spoil the fun

sorry

cPT_Helice

My 18 year old son went to the supermarket last night and came home with a big bag of plantains, 6 huge sweet potatoes, kale, brown rice, bananas, and a few other things and said to me "Who says it's so expensive to eat healthy. I just got all this for $8."
And he did that without the gov't's help. Imagine that!

mrmanmeat

I don't necessarily advocate government intervention but I do agree that obesity isn't a reflection entirely on lack of will power. For one, eating healthy is expensive, working out has costs (even if you don't go to a gym), and one would need a solid amount of leisure time and accurate information (eg time to sift through all of the crap out there) PLUS the will power not to eat delicious food that is often laden with socially pressure (does you MIL drown everything in butter? Too bad, gotta eat it or else be in a fight with her and hubby for the next two weeks). You call them excuses when you overcome them, but they are obstacles everyone faces and some fail to overcome.

Being obese isn't simply about a person's ability to eat or not eat. It's about a lot more underlying social and personal issues. Like I said, I don't believe it's up to the government to address (especially with so many more pressing issues abounding) but I DO agree with the assessment that it will take far more than simply blaming overweight people for lacking self control to improve.

I can think of plenty of other things people spend their money on instead of working out or eating healthy. Like, smoking. Or drinking. Or that new $1500 tv.

Dragonwolf

Did you read the part about our kids not walking to school because there aren't enough sidewalks? I thought I didn't let my kids walk to school because of all the creeps out there that could do something to them. I just don't let my kids roam the neighborhood. It's not a safe world. It has notthing to do with sidewalks though. LOL!

...Except for the fact that crime has gone down, across the board since the 90s, and is currently lower than it was in the 60s....and the people that are the most likely to "do something" to your kids are their relatives....and that a person is orders of magnatudes more likely to be injured or killed in a car accident than just about any other threat to their safety.

http://freerangekids.wordpress.com/

http://www.stats.org/stories/2006/Today_missing_kids_mar09_06.htm
http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,1705342,00.html
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-503325/Children-play-unsupervised-turn-fitter-sociable-study-says.html

One of my daughters was actually approached walking home from the bus. The guy was trying to get her in his car. He followed her several blocks until my Husband showed up. Thank God she had a cell phone. So, quote all the articles you want. I've experienced it first hand.

That's where teaching awareness of your surroundings and self-defense tactics come in. Teaching fear only increases the likelihood that she will become a victim, and sheltering only teaches fear (because you convey your own fears by sheltering). There are "bad people" out there, yes, but the whole world isn't out to get you or your child(ren). Most people are, in fact, good.

By your logic, my mother should have never taken me anywhere in a car, and I never should have ridden in a car anywhere, because we were in a car accident (other driver's fault) when I was little. Nor should I own or go anywhere near any dog, ever, because I was once bitten.

It only takes once for something to change a person's life forever. It's not that you should shelter a child forever, but you also need to be smart as well. From what she said, she did teach her daughter the right thing to do in that situation.

So you would be perfectly fine with letting your child walk through a ghetto and not be worried?

That's a straw man, and you know it. As you said, you need to be smart, as well.

Part of being smart is knowing your actual risks versus your perceived risks. If you do, in fact, live in the ghetto, then yes, it may be smart to not allow your child to go outside unsupervised. The problem is that most of the people who are afraid to let their kids out of the house without hovering aren't in ghettos, but in suburban, good urban, or other relatively safe areas. Ironically, there are often more kids running around in the areas a lot of people consider "bad" or "ghetto" than in the suburbs.

If I were in the original commenter's place, I would praise my child for having done the right thing, and then yes, I would have continued to allow her to walk to school. I may walk with her for a week or two to make sure the person doesn't come back if we didn't know what happened to the stalker, but I'm not going to let that person deny my child the freedom and independence that walking to school grants her, because if I do, they've won, anyway. If any of us see that person again, we would (and we'd teach our child to) promptly call the cops (if we hadn't the first time, or they didn't do anything). In this kind of situation, not only does hovering harm the child and teaches them to fear otherwise generally benign situations (see "helicopter parenting" and "teacup children", especially when this type of reaction is more than just a one-off in a single situation), but it doesn't do anything about the actual threat. If you've called the cops or the threat has been otherwise taken care of, then the threat is gone, and any fear of harm becomes a perceived threat.

Yes, there might be someone else out there, on your child's way to school. There might also be someone out there, on your way to work. There might be someone watching your home, waiting to break in. A bridge might collapse with you on (or under!) it (this actually happened to a friend of mine's brother in an earthquake a few years ago). Your plane might fall out of the sky. Someone might wreck into you on the highway. If we live in fear of what might happen, then the bad guys have already won, and we'd be too terrified to actually live our lives. Weigh the actual threats, not the perceived ones.

Dragonwolf

It is not telling us what to eat but it is making healthier foods more accessible. Currently, it is cheaper to buy soda and such than it is to buy juices and milk.

Then you really don't have a grasp on how the the free markets work and why junk, processed, convenient (and tasty) foods are so readily available and "cheaper." Its not some conspiracy from some Wall Street Board Room decision makers that has made junk food cheap - THAT is what the people want so there is lots of willing manufacturers competing for your money driving down costs and distribution. Taxing it alone don't work - look at how much tax is on other things - yet people will buy what they want.

And when you consider the cost of eating clean and being healthy - as opposed to eating cheap and paying higher medical bills, insurance and medication costs, shopping at the big person store (also not as cheap as buying off the rack from the normal people stores) - then tell me how much more it costs to "eat right!"

One of the underlying problems (among many) is that our (US) economy is not a truly free market. It's a botched....thing....somewhere in between a free market economy and a socialistic economy (note, I'm not crying "communist Russia," here. Communism/socialism are legitimate economic policies; which one works best is a different conversation altogether).

Corn sugar is in everything that undergoes just about any kind of large-scale processing (even simple baking) and made for sale in the US, because corn is cheap as hell to grow (it's also why it's the most common stock for Ethanol fuel, despite the fact that it has one of the worst oil yeilds). It's cheap as hell, because the government pays the farmers to grow it, so the farmers grow it, and grow a royal ton of it. In fact, they grow so much of it that people have started burning it directly as a fuel source ( http://www.cornflame.net/why_corn.html ).

Wheat, rice, and soy are the same way, though not to the extent that corn is ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Agricultural_subsidy#United_States ). This makes grain-based products cheaper to make, and thus, to sell.

Getting rid of the subsidies would go a long way to bringing grain prices in line with non-grain foods, but it would raise prices pretty much across the board (additionally, animal product prices would skyrocket, as well, because the big farms that supply most of these products use corn as a main staple in the feedstock).