The starvation mode lie

chris1816

Forget the word "starve"
Nobody starves.
When you restrict calories too much, your metabolism stifles ie slows down.
FACT!
But do whatever you want. Net 200 calories per day, let's see how that works for you.
Good Luck :drinker:

Okay let's consider this for a second please.

Your metabolism encompasses every function of your body. The base, simple function which most people speak of when they talk "metabolism" is to synthesize macro nutrients into glucose (sugar) for cellular production of ATP (hurr durr energy).

If an extremely obese person stops eating, does their "metabolism" slow down slightly? Sure, but not in any amount they would really notice or that would affect anything. At this point the body is starting to consume existing stores of energy (fat) at which an obese person has almost their entire store of required energy in one pound of fat (3600 calories worth). In the absence of glucose being taken into the body in readily available, easily broken down forms (carbohydrates), let the lipolysis begin!

Guess what sunshine? Breaking down fat takes even MORE energy than breaking down all the crap you put in your mouth. In order to get access to that 9 calorie per gram macro-nutrient goodness your body has to do all kinds of kooky sh*it to convert that fat into existing energy. This even takes more oxygen, so your entire body has to work harder just at REST. This doesn't slow down your metabolism Princess Buttercup, this makes it go "Holy crap I can't be lazy about this, this crazy *kitten* stopped eating chik fil a so I better get to work". Your liver begins pumping out all the vitamins you have been storing using that juicy fat you have as a medium for storage and transport. You can be lacking in B Vitamins, Vitamin A etc for months, even years before actually developing a deficiency condition, because you have been pumping yourself full of more than you can use and you have plenty of fat and a big ol liver that has been hanging onto that *kitten* for you.

Now while ALL that sexy activity is occuring; you are still drinking water to piss out all your ketones being produced from that lipolysis process that kicked in right? Your kidneys are still working to filter all that water, your lungs are still inflating and deflating. You probably have some dizziness and headaches at first but after a bit ALL SYSTEMS GO in your brain thingy. The involuntary muscle contraction of your heart is still going, pumping blood all throughout your system. You are still creating new skin cells, synthesizing Vitamin D in the sun, pissing, growing fingernails and hair (though some will likely fall out) and doing all that other exciting nonsense which emcompasses your metabolism.

All of that while you stopped eating for a couple weeks.

So yes, please explain how my metabolism slows down if I stop eating and am classified as obese?

neanderthin

So yes, please explain how my metabolism slows down if I stop eating and am classified as obese?

It's called adaptive thermogenesis.

toysbigkid

bump...thanks

chris1816

So yes, please explain how my metabolism slows down if I stop eating and am classified as obese?

It's called adaptive thermogenesis.

Which is a theory related to supposed genetic set points related to weight gain in those who have lost weight.

I must have missed the pictures of the folks in Auschwitz who held onto all their fat and kept saying the scale just wouldn't budge.

Again, in the extremely obese your bodily functions have set energy costs that cannot be reduced beyond a certain point, period. Starvation mode does not happen unless you have zero excess body fat to consume for energy. Adaptive thermogenesis is a theory that loves to get trumped up by folks who hit weight loss plataeus or just don't have the persistince to keep at it.

Crochetluvr

You won't feel great, but extremely obese people can eat at an extremely low calorie intake or even fast and be metabolically fine.

Unless a person has diabetes(which a lot of obese people develop....and don't even realize they have)....like me. In that event, I go into a diabetic coma and die. I wont temp fate. I'll eat.

Bobby_Clerici

Forget the word "starve"
Nobody starves.
When you restrict calories too much, your metabolism stifles ie slows down.
FACT!
But do whatever you want. Net 200 calories per day, let's see how that works for you.
Good Luck :drinker:

Okay let's consider this for a second please.

Your metabolism encompasses every function of your body. The base, simple function which most people speak of when they talk "metabolism" is to synthesize macro nutrients into glucose (sugar) for cellular production of ATP (hurr durr energy).

If an extremely obese person stops eating, does their "metabolism" slow down slightly? Sure, but not in any amount they would really notice or that would affect anything. At this point the body is starting to consume existing stores of energy (fat) at which an obese person has almost their entire store of required energy in one pound of fat (3600 calories worth). In the absence of glucose being taken into the body in readily available, easily broken down forms (carbohydrates), let the lipolysis begin!

Guess what sunshine? Breaking down fat takes even MORE energy than breaking down all the crap you put in your mouth. In order to get access to that 9 calorie per gram macro-nutrient goodness your body has to do all kinds of kooky sh*it to convert that fat into existing energy. This even takes more oxygen, so your entire body has to work harder just at REST. This doesn't slow down your metabolism Princess Buttercup, this makes it go "Holy crap I can't be lazy about this, this crazy *kitten* stopped eating chik fil a so I better get to work". Your liver begins pumping out all the vitamins you have been storing using that juicy fat you have as a medium for storage and transport. You can be lacking in B Vitamins, Vitamin A etc for months, even years before actually developing a deficiency condition, because you have been pumping yourself full of more than you can use and you have plenty of fat and a big ol liver that has been hanging onto that *kitten* for you.

Now while ALL that sexy activity is occuring; you are still drinking water to piss out all your ketones being produced from that lipolysis process that kicked in right? Your kidneys are still working to filter all that water, your lungs are still inflating and deflating. You probably have some dizziness and headaches at first but after a bit ALL SYSTEMS GO in your brain thingy. The involuntary muscle contraction of your heart is still going, pumping blood all throughout your system. You are still creating new skin cells, synthesizing Vitamin D in the sun, pissing, growing fingernails and hair (though some will likely fall out) and doing all that other exciting nonsense which emcompasses your metabolism.

All of that while you stopped eating for a couple weeks.

So yes, please explain how my metabolism slows down if I stop eating and am classified as obese?

Fact.
When you restrict calories, your metabolism slows.
That's what I said.
It does. And if you have a better system than MFP, sell it. Make yourself rich.
Good Luck :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:
How's that for condescending?

HeidiHoMom

Who cares if it does or does not exist.

I don't care what you call it but I was NOT losing weight on 1200 calories a day. I tried for over a year and I was not over estimating my food etc. I've been in the weight loss game since I was 12 and have always struggled, including having an ED and not losing then either.

I weigh and measure out all of my food.

As soon as I upped my calories to 1800 I lost 6 lbs. I plateaued again and upped to 2000 and I have started losing again.

I am not alone in this. There are thousands of people on this board who experience the same thing, not losing on 1200 but up the calories and start losing again. How do you explain this?

neanderthin

So yes, please explain how my metabolism slows down if I stop eating and am classified as obese?

It's called adaptive thermogenesis.

Which is a theory related to supposed genetic set points related to weight gain in those who have lost weight.

I must have missed the pictures of the folks in Auschwitz who held onto all their fat and kept saying the scale just wouldn't budge.

Your confusing adaptive thermogenesis with a full stop of fat loss, which doesn't happen, and why we continue to use body fat and why those prisoners eventually lost all their fat stores........try not to think in absolutes and use extreme examples as part of a persona bias.

HeidiHoMom

So yes, please explain how my metabolism slows down if I stop eating and am classified as obese?

It's called adaptive thermogenesis.

Which is a theory related to supposed genetic set points related to weight gain in those who have lost weight.

I must have missed the pictures of the folks in Auschwitz who held onto all their fat and kept saying the scale just wouldn't budge.

Again, in the extremely obese your bodily functions have set energy costs that cannot be reduced beyond a certain point, period. Starvation mode does not happen unless you have zero excess body fat to consume for energy. Adaptive thermogenesis is a theory that loves to get trumped up by folks who hit weight loss plataeus or just don't have the persistince to keep at it.

Starvation mode is different than actual starvation, maybe if people would stop calling it starvation mode and call it something else, then there wouldn't be so much controversy.

Bobby_Clerici

You won't feel great, but extremely obese people can eat at an extremely low calorie intake or even fast and be metabolically fine.

What absurdity.....Does this sound like fun to anybody?
No wonder people fail so miserably on crash diets.
Smarten up!
Think 1 lb per week, and for those of you on the fence here? Wondering?
The fast path always looks like the easy route until you get on it.
When it comes to weight loss, those in a race with nature finish last.
Follow the MFP recommendations for steady, lasting and healthy fat loss.
For those interested in leaning the truth about how to win this fight, go here:
Read this: http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/23912-links-in-mfp-you-want-to-read-again-and-again
And this"
http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/10589-for-those-confused-or-questioning-eating-your-exercise-calo
Learn all you can.
Track your diet and exercises - again simple.
You will do fine - ALL IS POSSIBLE:flowerforyou:

HeidiHoMom

Also, on 1200 calories I was losing hair, not sleeping, had chronic constipation (regardless of eating 35 grams of fibre a day), was hungry and miserable.

Now I eat 2000 calories, I'm losing more weight than on 1200, mot importantly the chronic constipation is gone (after 15 years of dealing with it and relying on laxatives)...I now go every day without assistance, I am sleeping better and deeper, I am happier and stronger, my workouts are so much better.

In general the quality of my life has vastly improved.

chris1816

You won't feel great, but extremely obese people can eat at an extremely low calorie intake or even fast and be metabolically fine.

What absurdity.....Does this sound like fun to anybody?
No wonder people fail so miserable on crash diets.
Smarten up!
Think 1 lb per week, and for those of you on the fence here? Wondering?
The fast path always looks like the easy route until you get on it.
When it comes to weight loss, those in a race with nature finish last.
Follow the MFP recommendations for steady, lasting and healthy fat loss.
For those interested in leaning the truth about how to win this fight, go here:
Read this: http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/23912-links-in-mfp-you-want-to-read-again-and-again
And this"
http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/10589-for-those-confused-or-questioning-eating-your-exercise-calo
Learn all you can.
Track your diet and exercises - again simple.
You will do fine - ALL IS POSSIBLE:flowerforyou:

You mistake clarification of facts with me advocating voluntary anorexia.

My issue with starvation mode being thrown around is that it is just that; thrown around freely without anyone wanting to actually have an even basic understanding of biology or physics.

I think crash diets are stupid, cleanses are crap, and all it takes is persistence/focus/calorie restriction/exercise.

HOWEVER.

People look at folks who "net" 200 calories, or fast for a day, or skip breakfast and are immediately like, "GURL YOU GONNA GO INTO DAT STARVATION MODE". The point I am trying to make is that people need to understand even just a little bit how the body works, how "metabolism" actually functions and what happens in certain situations with x or y factors in play. To say that the metabolism is "stifled" (which is what you emphasised before staying simply slowed down) in the case of an extreme calorie deficit is simply wrong.

You can eat almost nothing, you can fast intermittantly, and you will not starve, your body will not consume 2lbs of muscle in a day.

It becomes one more thing to freak people out on if they are just not hungry, or panicking about eating back exercise calories. I am eating at a 1000 calorie deficit every day. Most days I increase that deficit by heavy weight lifting and cardio, once a week I do martial arts. Being an obese person I have plenty of reserve energy to use. Simple as that.

Di3012

It's not a lie. Yes, when you are excessively overweight your body will compensate for short periods of time of very low calorie intake by consuming body fat and some muscle. That is the whole reason for your body storing body fat. However the key is SHORT TERM. As this period of very low calorie intake continues, your body reacts and starts trying to store most calories as fat and slowly limiting bodily functions.

I agree this term gets thrown around very loosely and improperly here. It takes a good amount of time to drop into starvation mode as long as you haven't completely stopped eating and some time to climb back out of it.

It cannot store most calories as fat, because those on low calorie diets use up their calories, it stores nothing.

kmm7309

I think there is some truth to it *provided* that you are starving for weeks at a time. If it's a day or two at a time, I don't think it'll kick in that quickly. Besides, I think everyone's "minimum" calorie needs are going to be different at different weight intervals. I think they probably did several studies that concluded that the average starvation mode for most people was 1200, but somebody's could be much lower or higher.

I also think that the biggest issue with starvation mode is that if you lose your weight starving, then when you start to eat again, you might gain some of it back, which is an undesirable result.

HeidiHoMom

But you're eating like 2400 calories a day which is a reasonable amount of food.

When someone is netting 200 calories do you really think that isn't going to have a negative impact on their weight loss and overall well being?

Di3012

Okay, someone in starvation mode will continue to lose weight. But it will be a very slow process and it will probably cause rapid weight gain once they end calorie-restriction. Why are those desirable outcomes, people who think starvation mode is silly?

FWIW, I do actually know two people who were overweight *because* they were not eating enough. They had eating disorders, and when they were put by their dietitians on a diet they felt was way too much food, the pounds dropped off.

They were overweight BECAUSE they were not eating enough?? This defies all logic and physics.

Those eating disorders and the way the doctors dealt with it would have been to put them on more calories than they needed in order that their weight went ON, not came OFF. No doctor in his/her right mind would ever put somebody with a genuine ED on a weightloss diet - ever!

neanderthin

It's not a lie. Yes, when you are excessively overweight your body will compensate for short periods of time of very low calorie intake by consuming body fat and some muscle. That is the whole reason for your body storing body fat. However the key is SHORT TERM. As this period of very low calorie intake continues, your body reacts and starts trying to store most calories as fat and slowly limiting bodily functions.

I agree this term gets thrown around very loosely and improperly here. It takes a good amount of time to drop into starvation mode as long as you haven't completely stopped eating and some time to climb back out of it.

It cannot store most calories as fat, because those on low calorie diets use up their calories, it stores nothing.

Somehow people can't get this fact through their heads.

chris1816

Also, on 1200 calories I was losing hair, not sleeping, had chronic constipation (regardless of eating 35 grams of fibre a day), was hungry and miserable.

Now I eat 2000 calories, I'm losing more weight than on 1200, mot importantly the chronic constipation is gone (after 15 years of dealing with it and relying on laxatives)...I now go every day without assistance, I am sleeping better and deeper, I am happier and stronger, my workouts are so much better.

In general the quality of my life has vastly improved.

And yet at 380+lbs I ate 1000 calories a day for six months, medically supervised, supplementing only B Vitamins, potassium, but eating 1200 balanced calories, and I lost weight fast. I felt fine, didn't poop as much, which is expected. Slept fine, had a lot of energy (though I was not exercising). I lost about 40lbs. Was it unrealistic? Absolutely. I gained it back, and have since lost it again through eating 2500 calories a day and exercising.

Honestly your case sounds like there were some other issues there (especially 15 years relying on laxatives), sorry but that's not normal. Plenty of folks eat at that calorie level or slightly around it and do fine.

Di3012

So yes, please explain how my metabolism slows down if I stop eating and am classified as obese?

It's called adaptive thermogenesis.

Which is a theory related to supposed genetic set points related to weight gain in those who have lost weight.

I must have missed the pictures of the folks in Auschwitz who held onto all their fat and kept saying the scale just wouldn't budge.

Again, in the extremely obese your bodily functions have set energy costs that cannot be reduced beyond a certain point, period. Starvation mode does not happen unless you have zero excess body fat to consume for energy. Adaptive thermogenesis is a theory that loves to get trumped up by folks who hit weight loss plataeus or just don't have the persistince to keep at it.

The bolded bit above, this ^!!

I'm with you on this one, it's a wonder there are any starving people in the world really, all these third world countries whereby they have no food. BandAid, LiveAid, none of that was necessary really was it, after all, those that are starving in the third world countries, all they really needed to do was restrict their calories, they would have put on their weight and been absolutely fine!

NOW does all those that profess about starvation mode see? Or not?

BeckaT79

I haven't read all the posts so if I repeat someone I'm sorry. Every year at work we do a biggest loser competition and we have 3 ladies who always win. Let me just tell you that they always win because when we are done with the competition they go back to eating the same foods that they used to eat before and they put back on all of their weight plus some. I feel it is because they were depriving their bodies. "Starvation Mode" aside why not just eat at a semi normal calorie range and exercise. If you want to eat less to get the desired results and increase your calorie intake by 1000-2000 more a day when you finally hit your ultimate goal you may keep those results for very long. Eat sensibly and exercise.