Polys versus Molys

bazfitness

I've been working on all fronts to improve my cholesterol over past couple of months. I got some very good advice in this thread http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/607973-tackling-cholesterol-issues?hl=tackling+cholesterol.

Part of the advice I got was from a very knowledgeable mfp'er who recommended monounsaturates over polys. I seem to recall reading other articles that said the same around the same time.

Now another mfp pal of mine has pointed me to a different detailed article which suggests polys are better. http://www.scientificpsychic.com/health/cholesterol1.html

So now I'm confused... which one is right?

bazfitness

Reading some more stuff like http://www.nhlbi.nih.gov/guidelines/cholesterol/atp3full.pdf (on page V–10 and V-11 if interested). It seems to be supporting a balance of 2:1 monos: polys so more along the lines of what my mfp pal said in the 'tackling cholesterol thread'.

Looks like it's good to have both in your diet anyway but perhaps to favour monos, but still get some polys in there.

AlabasterVerve

Natural fats are good for you. Things like butter, olive oil, coconut oil and unprocessed animal fats like lard. Fats that are bad for you are the polyunsaturated vegetable oils and the trans fats.

But for the more conventional view that saturated fats are bad and vegetable oils are good the Harvard School of Public Health has a nice article on them:

http://www.hsph.harvard.edu/nutritionsource/what-should-you-eat/fats-and-cholesterol/

bazfitness

Natural fats are good for you. Things like butter, olive oil, coconut oil and unprocessed animal fats like lard. Fats that are bad for you are the polyunsaturated vegetable oils and the trans fats.

But for the more conventional view that saturated fats are bad and vegetable oils are good the Harvard School of Public Health has a nice article on them:

http://www.hsph.harvard.edu/nutritionsource/what-should-you-eat/fats-and-cholesterol/

Thanks for your reply. Preaching to the converted there when it comes to natural fats. Though I think there are still better choices to be made even within the natural unsaturated fats. Butter and coconut oil come in for criticism from what I've read. Anyway in this whole area I'm trying to eat a moderate amount of unsaturated fat. I'm avoiding trans fats. Also have cut back on carbs, especially starchy carbs. Have cut out bread completely (did indulge on holidays I'll admit).

Anyway what I was really intrigued about was the polys versus molys as per OP. My latest thinking is try to make sure I get a bit of both every day but get a higher proportion of monos, but I'm only going on what I've read, which is all I can do!

AlabasterVerve

If you eat meat that's raised on grain you're going to get a higher ratio of polyunsaturated fats and omega6 fatty acids than is natural to begin with. Also, any processed food you might eat with fat is also going to have vegetable oils that are loaded with omgega6's for the most part as well. Which is why, I think at least, eating fish and omega3 fatty acids are pushed so much and proven to be beneficial because it helps to counter that and improve the ratio of fats in the diet.

So long story short, stick with the olive oil. I don't think you need to make any effort to include polyunsaturated fats in your diet.

bazfitness

So long story short, stick with the olive oil. I don't think you need to make any effort to include polyunsaturated fats in your diet.

Thanks once again. I usually eat either hazelnuts or almonds or both each day. Hazelnuts (filiberts) have a high proportion of monos v polys almost 6:1. almonds aren't bad either 2.5:1. Pistachios which I have occasionally are 5:3. Cashews are good also at 3:1 Infos at http://caloriecount.about.com

I bought some walnuts for a change a few days ago but they are the opposite 1:6 monos to polys. I didn't spot this right away. I'm guessing it's ok to have these very occasionally but best to stick to the likes of almonds and hazelnuts. What do you reckon?


also fwiw I keep forgetting to include it in my diary but I take 3 omega-3 fish oil tablets every day.

AlabasterVerve

I bought some walnuts for a change a few days ago but they are the opposite 1:6 monos to polys. I didn't spot this right away. I'm guessing it's ok to have these very occasionally but best to stick to the likes of almonds and hazelnuts. What do you reckon?

It's so funny you mentioned walnuts because I just ate them last night and noticed the same thing. I bought them for the omega3's (my usual nut of choice is pistachios just because they're salty and delicious) but then started wondering if they really were good for you.

But overall I still think they're nutritious and we do need polyunsaturated fats just not the quality or quantity you'd get from the vegetable oils. I'm just making this stuff up as I go along, to be honest, but for me personally I'll keep eating them along with the almonds and pistachios I already eat. These two things eased my mind:

Tons of nutrients
http://nutritiondata.self.com/facts/nut-and-seed-products/3138/2

And this guy eats them who's on the extreme end of LCHF diets and careful about his fat ratios
http://eatingacademy.com/nutrition/what-i-actually-eat

bazfitness

I'm just making this stuff up as I go along, to be honest, but for me personally I'll keep eating them along with the almonds and pistachios I already eat. These two things eased my mind:

Tons of nutrients
http://nutritiondata.self.com/facts/nut-and-seed-products/3138/2

And this guy eats them who's on the extreme end of LCHF diets and careful about his fat ratios
http://eatingacademy.com/nutrition/what-i-actually-eat

lol I admre your honesty. Tbh sounds like you're just trying to inform yourself as best as possible, just like i'm doing, that's all we can do really.

That guy's diet actually isn't a million miles away from the stuff i eat. I do have more carbs though and eating about half the cals he does. 4000+ cals sounds a massive amount. No doubt there' method to the way he's doing it.

Hopefully what I'm currently doing will bring the results in anyway. Have done a fairly major overhaul as it is of my diet.

AlabasterVerve

I do have more carbs though and eating about half the cals he does. 4000+ cals sounds a massive amount. No doubt there' method to the way he's doing it.

Don't try that at home! LOL The guy is extremely athletic with a punishing (well, it sounds punishing to me) training regimen.

bazfitness

Don't try that at home! LOL The guy is extremely athletic with a punishing (well, it sounds punishing to me) training regimen.

LOL - Don't worry had absolutely no intention of doing so - certainly not in the short term. If I was to eat anything like those type of cals a number of other factors would have to be involved. The amount of exercise I do would have to go up a lot for starters and it'd be for weight gain and muscle building rather than my current priority of fat shredding/cholesterol busting, personally I'd be eating higher percentage of protein than what he's doing I imagine if and when I switch it up.

Anyway meant I'm sure what he does works for him!

theMightyAnt

Really interesting reads, thanks for the share. Sadly the contradiction in the first few articles is all too common. For every study that says one thing there is another that says the complete opposite. We are on the edge of scientific understanding here, it's currently theory, and the truth is there is as yet no consensus. (For an extreme example just look at the twinkie diet - http://edition.cnn.com/2010/HEALTH/11/08/twinkie.diet.professor/index.html , not recommending it BTW ;-)

However some of these bloggers are really pushing the boundaries and testing it out but if it works for them doesn't always mean it will work for us. Find what works for you.

theMightyAnt

Oh and regarding walnuts balance out with some Macadamia's 59g mono - 1.4g poly per 100g ;-)

bazfitness

Oh and regarding walnuts balance out with some Macadamia's 59g mono - 1.4g poly per 100g ;-)

Wow missed that one. Must get some. They are expensive here though I think. Yeah and I agree there is some contradictory info. Basically though if you read between the lines I think a modest amount of saturated fat and a decent amount of monos and polys. I've come down on the side of monos as just have seen a bit mroe to back it up, but not going to avoid polys either. Will try to keep it at about 2 to 1 in terms of nuts anyway It is subjective alright I agree, but to me it's clear a cut back on carbs especially starchy processed foods is the way to go. i'll find out in a couple of months i guess!

AlabasterVerve

Hi baz I found a few blog posts at Mark's Daily Apple that I thought were pretty interesting and fell under this topic. Here are some links:

More on Omega
http://www.marksdailyapple.com/omega-3-fatty-acid/#axzz20tvm6Amo

Dear Mark: Nuts and Omega-6s
http://www.marksdailyapple.com/nuts-omega-6-fats/#axzz20tvm6Amo