Reasonable

CJisinShape

When I was in college, I took a biology course from a professor involved in the race to map the human genome. He taught me something I rember to this day: the field of science isn't what it used to be. There was a time when science questioned its own assumptions. Although he was a geneticist on the cutting edge of science, he was troubled by the self-affirming nature of of his field. He said that the theory of evolution had holes in it big enough to throw turkeys through it. This was a shock to me because in high school it was taught to me like it was indisputable fact, and that once we mapped the han genome, we would have unlocked all the secrets of genetic disease.

Fast forward ten years. We've mapped the human genome. They found out that genes were not soley responsible for the expression of inheritable disease. Now, proteins play a part in unlocking the secret of humankind. So, decoding the mystery of the proteins was the big challenge. Studies of twins found that how one grew up played a part. Nutritional deficiencies played a part. So many variables!

There are so many species we know so little about, even though we have been studying them closely. Industrious ant behavior is discussed in a book that is thousands of years old, and yet, we do not have all the answers for this one small creature. We have not cured the common cold. 40% of disease presented at the hospital is iatrogenic, meaning, caused by a doctor' care. Yet, we trust so heavily in science, to the point that some people feel that it is unreasonable to believe in the Bible.

Many doctors also scoffed at the Bible's advice about washing whenever coming into contact with blood or semen. Because at that time germs were UNOBSERVABLE and therefore UNPROVABLE, they considered it to be the practice of ignorant midwives and went from house to house delivering babies just wiping off the blood and spreading disease.

What is it about the arrogance of humankind that some cannot accept that God knows better than they do? Thousands and thousands of years ago, God told Job that Job didn't know the treasures God made when he created
the snow. Many thousands of years would pass before we would have microscopes to capture the amazing beauty, symmatry, and unique design of water.

If we don't know much about how the most studied organism on earth works - the human, or even a smaller creature, the much and long studied ant, then isn't it perfectly reasonable to doubt scientists ruminations of events that they claim occurred before anyone could observe it?

oregonzoo

I have no issues with those who are highly religous or devoutly follow the bible.


But I'm always going to trust science a huge freaking great deal more.

CJisinShape

The question remains, isn't it perfectly reasonable to doubt what scientists say happened millions of years ago when collectively they can't figure out what has been easily observable?

sweetchildomine

We as humans are a bunch of arrogant a-holes that think we know everything. We don't. There could be a God, there might not be. I have my theories and beliefs but NO ONE knows for sure unless they are all knowing. However, I just gotta say...



Its my day off. I'm ready for the madness that is going to ensue in this thread. Let's go! RELEASE THE INTERNET ARMY!!!!

juliecat1

As a person with a science degree I'd first like to apologize if you were taught science was an absolute. It is not. It's theories and ever evolving.
But so is religion. We no longer follow the bible in all the ways it was written. As society has evolved - we've left things out and molded others to fit our needs and agendas.
The pp was right - humans thing we know everything. We haven't a clue. Myself, science minded as i am, believe in a hybrid of sorts. Creationism and evolution. My thoughts and feelings are ever changing as i learn and experience more.

YouAreTheShit

Myself, science minded as i am, believe in a hybrid of sorts. Creationism and evolution. My thoughts and feelings are ever changing as i learn and experience more.

That's where I land also...

CallieM15

If we don't know much about how the most studied organism on earth works - the human, or even a smaller creature, the much and long studied ant, then isn't it perfectly reasonable to doubt scientists ruminations of events that they claim occurred before anyone could observe it?

There are scientifical theorys.
And then there are scientifical facts.

Theorys are not facts. I believe in science. Anyone can doubt a theory. Only facts are proven, overworked, and in no doubt the truth. Evolution is a thoeory. "The theory of evolution". "The big bang theory". It has never been fact, due to not being able to dead on prove the past where we humans did not exist.

So yes, you can doubt or ponder any theory in science.

Edit; apparently I can't spell.

CJisinShape

As a person with a science degree I'd first like to apologize if you were taught science was an absolute. It is not. It's theories and ever evolving.
But so is religion. We no longer follow the bible in all the ways it was written. As society has evolved - we've left things out and molded others to fit our needs and agendas.
The pp was right - humans thing we know everything. We haven't a clue. Myself, science minded as i am, believe in a hybrid of sorts. Creationism and evolution. My thoughts and feelings are ever changing as i learn and experience more.

Thank you for your intellectual honesty.

CJisinShape

If we don't know much about how the most studied organism on earth works - the human, or even a smaller creature, the much and long studied ant, then isn't it perfectly reasonable to doubt scientists ruminations of events that they claim occurred before anyone could observe it?

G

There are scientifical theorys.
And then there are scientifical facts.

Thoerys are not facts. I believe in science. Anyone can doubt a theory. Only facts are proven, overworked, and in no doubt the truth. Evolution is a thoeory. It has never been fact, due to not being able to dead on prove the past where we humans did not exist.

So yes, you can doubt or ponder any theory in science.

Edit; apparently I can't spell.

Well, so here's the thing - the facts keep changing too. How many planets are in our solar system? If the observable facts are always in dispute, then isn't it reasonable to doubt what science has theorized unobserved?

MrsT0fu

When I was in college, I took a biology course from a professor involved in the race to map the human genome. He taught me something I rember to this day: the field of science isn't what it used to be. There was a time when science questioned its own assumptions. Although he was a geneticist on the cutting edge of science, he was troubled by the self-affirming nature of of his field. He said that the theory of evolution had holes in it big enough to throw turkeys through it. This was a shock to me because in high school it was taught to me like it was indisputable fact, and that once we mapped the han genome, we would have unlocked all the secrets of genetic disease.

Fast forward ten years. We've mapped the human genome. They found out that genes were not soley responsible for the expression of inheritable disease. Now, proteins play a part in unlocking the secret of humankind. So, decoding the mystery of the proteins was the big challenge. Studies of twins found that how one grew up played a part. Nutritional deficiencies played a part. So many variables!

There are so many species we know so little about, even though we have been studying them closely. Industrious ant behavior is discussed in a book that is thousands of years old, and yet, we do not have all the answers for this one small creature. We have not cured the common cold. 40% of disease presented at the hospital is iatrogenic, meaning, caused by a doctor' care. Yet, we trust so heavily in science, to the point that some people feel that it is unreasonable to believe in the Bible.

Many doctors also scoffed at the Bible's advice about washing whenever coming into contact with blood or semen. Because at that time germs were UNOBSERVABLE and therefore UNPROVABLE, they considered it to be the practice of ignorant midwives and went from house to house delivering babies just wiping off the blood and spreading disease.

What is it about the arrogance of humankind that some cannot accept that God knows better than they do? Thousands and thousands of years ago, God told Job that Job didn't know the treasures God made when he created
the snow. Many thousands of years would pass before we would have microscopes to capture the amazing beauty, symmatry, and unique design of water.

If we don't know much about how the most studied organism on earth works - the human, or even a smaller creature, the much and long studied ant, then isn't it perfectly reasonable to doubt scientists ruminations of events that they claim occurred before anyone could observe it?

OP, I think you articulated your point well. I think one of the major obstacles people face when the observe an alleged faith vs. science perspective is the sheer ignorance people have about the Bible. Generally people's understanding of it is greatly flawed and limited. Unfortunately there's so much that people are resistant to learning because of misconceptions due to deliberate distortions and text out of context, and fear so that they perpetuate their ignorance to themselves and others. Two books that I think are awesome with overcoming the stigma and misunderstanding surrounding the Bible are Lee Strobel's "The case for christ" and Daniel Gruber's "Copernicus and the Jews:the separation of church and faith."

juliecat1

Question all you want... It really comes down to feeling. Do you feel better believing in God, a god, a scientific theory? Then by all means..... Do it. You will never prove with utter certainty any if these things exist. So it's up to you to decide how you feel. Christians, though lumped under one big umbrella, don't feel the same way about their God or religion or even how to do it.

One of the things that actually makes me feel most close to god.... Fottage from the Hubble telescope. It's fascinating. We're a tiny speck in this massive universe. And this is just what we can observe with something our tiny speck of human brains created and can see. There's so much more. It seems impossible to me that that just exoded into existence. That there's not something bigger at work.

ElizabethRoad

If we don't know much about how the most studied organism on earth works - the human, or even a smaller creature, the much and long studied ant, then isn't it perfectly reasonable to doubt scientists ruminations of events that they claim occurred before anyone could observe it?

G

There are scientifical theorys.
And then there are scientifical facts.

Thoerys are not facts. I believe in science. Anyone can doubt a theory. Only facts are proven, overworked, and in no doubt the truth. Evolution is a thoeory. It has never been fact, due to not being able to dead on prove the past where we humans did not exist.

So yes, you can doubt or ponder any theory in science.

Edit; apparently I can't spell.

Well, so here's the thing - the facts keep changing too. How many planets are in our solar system? If the observable facts are always in dispute, then isn't it reasonable to doubt what science has theorized unobserved?

Maybe you just used a bad example, but the number of large bodies in the solar system did not change. We changed the nomenclature; Pluto didn't disappear.

CallieM15

If we don't know much about how the most studied organism on earth works - the human, or even a smaller creature, the much and long studied ant, then isn't it perfectly reasonable to doubt scientists ruminations of events that they claim occurred before anyone could observe it?

G

There are scientifical theorys.
And then there are scientifical facts.

Thoerys are not facts. I believe in science. Anyone can doubt a theory. Only facts are proven, overworked, and in no doubt the truth. Evolution is a thoeory. It has never been fact, due to not being able to dead on prove the past where we humans did not exist.

So yes, you can doubt or ponder any theory in science.

Edit; apparently I can't spell.

Well, so here's the thing - the facts keep changing too. How many planets are in our solar system? If the observable facts are always in dispute, then isn't it reasonable to doubt what science has theorized unobserved?

It is very reasonable to doubt science. If we didnt, we would still be thinking very basic and wouldnt have gotten new theories.
I get what you mean by the planets.

Melanie_RS

religion has evolved so much over time there are huge holes that turkeys could fly through as well. don't think the idea of god has been a constant.

god...counting the hits, ignoring the misses.....

I took my name off that list a long time ago.