Does anyone on MFP actually understand studies?

Matt_Wild

I'm finding it increasingly frustrating on MFP that people do not seem to understand the difference between science, anecdotal, epidemiological research and the whole correlation/causation problem?

I find people bleating on saying that XYZ may be dangerous and use a piece by a research scientist who says they XYZ may cause ABC but needs further research then completely seem to see this is not proof but merely a suggestion by someone who is probably looking for a research grant rather than anything else?

You cannot compare actual real world results that show proof one way against a suggestion by a researcher - they are not the same thing!

Kai85

who's paying for the study is always interesting...

ZeroWoIf

I'm finding it increasingly frustrating on MFP that people do not seem to understand the difference between science, anecdotal, epidemiological research and the whole correlation/causation problem?

I find people bleating on saying that XYZ may be dangerous and use a piece by a research scientist who says they XYZ may cause ABC but needs further research then completely seem to see this is not proof but merely a suggestion by someone who is probably looking for a research grant rather than anything else?

You cannot compare actual real world results that show proof one way against a suggestion by a researcher - they are not the same thing!

I don't care about studies and never read them. People in here are obviously obsessed with them, and completely rely on them as some golden rule. I don't bother anyone about obsessing about them because that is their problem. Research at times has been known to curb information in the wrong way from time to time.

taylor5877

Yeah, as a person with a doctorate in toxicology, I'd say I have a pretty good grasp on what a study says and how to interpret it.

That's not to say I've read everything about anything in my field.

And as the first reply says it is vital who funds it, as you design a lot of experiments to make them say what you want.

HendersonDavid

I'm in the medical field for school, so I have to, so I may inform thousand of people that Dr.Oz is a huge broscience leader and is out to make money not make people and women happy.

AngryDiet

Studies are easy.

I just wait for someone here who has undisclosed credentials (if any) to summarize it very briefly for me.

Problem solved.

_the_feniks_

who's paying for the study is always interesting...

Very valid point.

spade117

I don't like to study.

BAMFMeredith

Cool story, bro.

EyeLikeTacos

I'm finding it increasingly frustrating on MFP that people do not seem to understand the difference between science, anecdotal, epidemiological research and the whole correlation/causation problem?

I find people bleating on saying that XYZ may be dangerous and use a piece by a research scientist who says they XYZ may cause ABC but needs further research then completely seem to see this is not proof but merely a suggestion by someone who is probably looking for a research grant rather than anything else?

You cannot compare actual real world results that show proof one way against a suggestion by a researcher - they are not the same thing!

Good Post Matt...the old XYZ happens because ABC is used a lot here on MFP...What gets me really bothered is that they will take one researchers findings and run that ish to the ground...even though there is opposing research on the other side of the argument....

I personally love reading, hearing about, and reviewing peoples arguments of causation and their backup research to prove their point...I would humbly change my point of view from one side to neutral IF I can see a point on both sides...If I do not agree with that person argument or findings...it's usually because I defer to personal experience to trump it all...

I hope that made sense.

Long_and_Lean

OP, I do scientific research for a living and feel your pain. With that in mind, I think you'll enjoy the following:

taylor5877

:laugh:p=0.56...

I love PHD comics...

EyeLikeTacos

Long_and_Lean!

:laugh:

sarahharmintx

who's paying for the study is always interesting...

Very valid point.

True. My favorites are the "we study 49 women over 2 years". Really? Those 49 women are enough to tell you about the population?

EyeLikeTacos

who's paying for the study is always interesting...

Very valid point.

True. My favorites are the "we study 49 women over 2 years". Really? Those 49 women are enough to tell you about the population?

WELLL....LOL! Good one...I guess you could say if they picked one woman from the top 49 states? I don't know...but yea...that's one small *kitten* sample size.

taylor5877

Really? Those 49 women are enough to tell you about the population?

depending on what they are looking for...yeah...

PETA people stop reading NOW!...

I found a correlation strong enough to get published in groups with just 6 animals. I was testing a treatment for arsenic that was intended to be used in a human population, so please don't hate me.

EyeLikeTacos

Really? Those 49 women are enough to tell you about the population?

ugh, depending on what they are looking for...yeah...

a vagina?...yea I am sure those results will be hard to argue with.

taylor5877

Helloitsdan

It's funny how everyone whos "By the numbers" can never make the numbers properly work for them.

They post Pubmed this and Pubmed that but in their use of the info cannot make the research actually work.

Take for instance this "Cut 1000cals from each day and youll lose 2lbs a week."
So far I have never seen this pan out but damn if I dont get 15-20 Pubmeds thrown at me about VLCDs and how they work!

recoiljpr

Wenchilada

who's paying for the study is always interesting...

Yup. That's generally one of the first pieces of information I look for. Who's sponsoring the study, and who else supports the sponsor?

AggieCass09

:laugh:p=0.56...

I love PHD comics...

hahaha!

iieee

I am a medical statistician and have published a few papers based on different clinical trials, in peer reviewed journals no less. :glasses:

My advice is be a duck. Let it wash over you.

NormalSaneFLGuy

As my brother who does bio research says "a study is as dependable as the person reporting the data, because by omitting elements they deem unfit, a study can look as good or bad as they desire."

bcattoes

I find people bleating on saying that XYZ may be dangerous and use a piece by a research scientist who says they XYZ may cause ABC but needs further research then completely seem to see this is not proof but merely a suggestion by someone who is probably looking for a research grant rather than anything else?

If they are saying it "may" be dangerous based on preliminary evidence showing it may, indeed, cause ABC (assuming ABC is something undesirable such as disease), then how is their statement incorrect?

Wenchilada

A peek into the average "scientific research" lab mentioned on daytime TV and/or the internet:

zombilishious

A study is going to prove what it was funded to prove. Didn't the Vioxx litigation teach us anything?

Long_and_Lean

A study is going to prove what it was funded to prove. Didn't the Vioxx litigation teach us anything?

Erm, not quite. But the *published* studies only prove what they were designed to prove. And therein lies the problem. Nobody can publish negative results anymore, which not only wastes time of other researchers attempting something similar (not knowing someone else already did it and it didn't work), but it holds back scientific progress. Ya first gotta figure out what doesn't work before you can know what does. 99.99% of the crap I do ends up being completely worthless, but it's that 0.01% that does that makes a big difference.

taylor5877

LOL...the grad students in our program joked about starting a journal titled "The Journal of Negative Results".

It was pep up talk for those of who inevitably struggle trying to get the results our PI's demand...

Long_and_Lean

LOL...the grad students in our program joked about starting a journal titled "The Journal of Negative Results".

It was pep up talk for those of who inevitably struggle trying to get the results our PI's demand...

The whole system is seriously f*cked up (man, am I ever the disgruntled postdoc!).

taylor5877

Postdoc...if the general public knew how much work these people do for very little pay and so little credit, they'd be outraged.