Alternative Day Fasting
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I read this link and don't understand half of what he was saying. This in particular:
"However, whereas calorie restriction improved tissue redox state, food restriction and intermittent feedings did not. In fact, long-term intermittent feeding resulted in largely enhanced tissue release of oxidants."
I you could translate for me I'd be grateful!
ETA: I started IF (leangains) last week and am quickly realising that, though I love it, I know very little about it.
Umm, can't help you I'm afraid.0 -
That was a very interesting read, thank you.0 -
Also while you're on your fasting days take some BCAA's to help your body from using your muscle as a source of energy instead of fat, and I found green tea, and lots of water kept the cravings down when I tried it. I did be a little bit of an a$$hat towards the end of the day though which is the only time I really felt hungry or tired.
Do you have any BCAA supplements you recommend?0 -
Personally, I'm going to try fasting once a week, where I'll eat dinner and then nothing until dinner the next day.0
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Personally, I'm going to try fasting once a week, where I'll eat dinner and then nothing until dinner the next day.
Let me know how it goes.0 -
Bump. I watched this too and found it very interesting as well! Might give it a go..0
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I thought I would round up my first three days of a semi-fast on alternate days. On Wednesday and today I only ate at lunch time. I picked lunchtime as I don't really get hungry in the morning, and my evenings are busy - but felt that I would not manage a whole day at work with no food.
So, on Wednesday morning, I weighed myself. I was surprised to find I had very little hunger that day, apart from a couple of brief pangs. It was very easy to manage, and in a way, not eating made me feel quite strong and in control. There was also a sense of freedom, as I didn't have to think about food - I have found that feeding myself well within a certain calorie count is pretty depressing in the evenings. There is more calorie room in the morning and at lunch.
So, on to Thursday - I weighed myself and there was a 2 1/2 pound weight loss. Lovely. But I knew that I would be eating that day, and would gain back a lot of that weight, maybe all of it.
I had breakfast, and found that afterwards, I still felt a bit empty, so had a lovely large glass of juice. I was due out with friends for an early lunch, and despite my normal mid-morning healthy snacks I was very hungry for lunch, though I did not have a huge meal, as I didn't want to overdo it. I wasn't hungry again until about 8, when I made a healthy meal, which was delicious. I did find that there I slighly overconsumed because I felt I was owed the right to as I had fasted the day before, and I would be fasting the next day. I didn't overeat - it was extra drinks. I had a little cider, and a can of coke. I justified them to myself, but they did mean that I ate more calories than I really wanted to. I am forgiving myself because that was early days in this routine. I didn't exercise on that day - I wanted to break myself gently into fasting.
The next morning I was quite surprised to find I had gained only 1/2 pound.
So, today - I have had more hunger pangs - but again, just the odd pang, not a steady feeling of hunger. When I consider how I feel, it is empty. If it was an eating day, I would welcome a meal, and have a good appetite for it - but I cannot describe myself as hungry. It's not been too hard not to eat.
After work I met up with friends for a drink, and I had a couple of glasses of sparkling water, then a diet coke. I didn't miss having a drink, I didn't mention to my friends that I was dieting, and they didn't seem to notice anything unusual. I enjoyed sitting in the sun, and although people were eating round us, and there were wafts of delicious garlicy prawns - none of us were eating, and it was fine.
Now I am home, and I can convince myself that I have already eaten. I think I will have no problems not eating for the rest of the evening, If I think of food, I think of what to have for breakfast. Realistically I am only dropping one meal at a time - I focus on lunch when I skip breakfast, and focus on the next days breakfast when I miss dinner.
I have to say, I am doing this to drop my risk of cancer, heart disease, diabetes, etc, But the fact that it means that I can go out and eat with friends is a big plus, as that is how I socialise. I am meeting a friend for a coffee tomorrow, and another for an indian tomorrow evening, and I would be really worried about sticking to my calorie allowance if I wasn't on this programme.
So, I'm looking forward to getting weighed in the morning. I had decided to only weigh myself weekly, but found that it is just too tempting to see what is going on. As long as any weight gains don't make me despair, I should be okay.0 -
This is similar to the JUDDD/IF type stuff (if that gives you more specific things to look up). These "diets" are built to end up in maintenance, so as usual... don't listen to the "OMG YOU CAN'T JUST GO UNDER 1200 CALORIES. STARVATION" people. There's research behind this, and specifically JUDDD is built to gradually up your "Down Day" calories until you are in a maintenance mode where you're not ~starving~.
Even apes don't eat "three square meals" a day
I'm glad you want to look like an ape.0 -
I had a similar experience in that I was surprised how little the hunger bothered me and that you'd think that not eating would be this big deal but it wasn't. Even though I was hungry and enjoyed breaking my fast I wasn't ravenous and I had no problem sticking to my eating plan later. Like you said, it was very freeing.I thought I would round up my first three days of a semi-fast on alternate days. <snip>
I'm not following an alternative day fasting schedule but it was nice to read about your experience. I plan on fasting Monday into Tuesday again this week so if anything changes from the first time I did it I'll be sure to come back and share.0 -
I was wondering if anyone was interested in starting a group on the 5:2 schedule. I know there is already an IF group, but it seems to be focused on Lean Gains and while I will admit I have not read about it extensively it does not seem like a match.
Any thoughts? I am still debating on whether to start this experiment next week or not (Tuesday/Thursday).0 -
I've been doing the 5:2 fasting for about 5 months - didn't know it was called 5:2 until recently, I just started it after reading an article about the science behind fasting to prevent Alzheimer's. It has worked fine for me, it's part of my regular routine now. It makes perfect sense to me that our bodies would be adapted for it.0
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This is similar to the JUDDD/IF type stuff (if that gives you more specific things to look up). These "diets" are built to end up in maintenance, so as usual... don't listen to the "OMG YOU CAN'T JUST GO UNDER 1200 CALORIES. STARVATION" people. There's research behind this, and specifically JUDDD is built to gradually up your "Down Day" calories until you are in a maintenance mode where you're not ~starving~.
Even apes don't eat "three square meals" a day
I'm glad you want to look like an ape.
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I was wondering if anyone was interested in starting a group on the 5:2 schedule. I know there is already an IF group, but it seems to be focused on Lean Gains and while I will admit I have not read about it extensively it does not seem like a match.
Any thoughts? I am still debating on whether to start this experiment next week or not (Tuesday/Thursday).
I would be keen, if you son;t mind that I might be doing more than the 2 days a week.0 -
Hi, I have been following the ADF plan since Aug 6th 2012.
Willlet you know how I get on, so far so far good.0 -
Bump0
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Was very interesting. Here is the link for anyone who did not see the program (BBC Horizon, so not sure if available outside UK)
http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b01lxyzc0 -
Bump....mainly because there is a link on this topic to the Horizon program which was a real eye opener...For those interested in the 5:2 part of the program it is about half way through that it gets talked about, before that he looks into other ways of eating0
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I had to have 2 low consumption days plus a 24hr fast Mon-Thurs last week for medical reasons..... so having heard a review during the week of the TV programme on the 5:2 way of life I have decided to give it a go. I actually found the 24hr fast nothing like as bad as I thought it was going to be...so I'm thinking 50-600 cals should be a doddle..and so far today...(my first official day) it has been. I was actually working this morning..so decided I ought to have a reasonable breakfast. In the end I've chosen to split most calories morning & evening..and the least midday. All my previous healthy lifestyle calorie reduction efforts are usually sabataged because I can't include as much fruit as I would like within my daily allowance..and I do have a very sweet tooth. No use saying cut it out altogether..I've been down that route..sugarfree for 10 months, 5 stone down..then Wham...allowed myself a treat at a family celebration and could not stop...6 stone on...
This weight has to be lost.....if not then I just know my Dr is going to recommend surgery next.....I want to avoid that so this lifestyle is much less severe than I would have to endure with a bypass..got to be worth a go. I may decide to do 4:3.
I'm also hopeful it will prevent my metabolism dropping any further as years of yo-yo dieting have pretty much wrecked it.0 -
This is similar to the JUDDD/IF type stuff (if that gives you more specific things to look up). These "diets" are built to end up in maintenance, so as usual... don't listen to the "OMG YOU CAN'T JUST GO UNDER 1200 CALORIES. STARVATION" people. There's research behind this, and specifically JUDDD is built to gradually up your "Down Day" calories until you are in a maintenance mode where you're not ~starving~.
Even apes don't eat "three square meals" a day
I'm glad you want to look like an ape.0 -
Another update - on my second semi-fast day I did 25 minutes of pilates - and didn't really have any issues doing it. I have read a few blogs where people talk about regular fasting, and it appears that your body gets used to it, so to a large extent you get over feeling weaker, which is good news, not that I have felt particularly weak. Starting my third day of semi-fasting today.
I have had two days of eating unrestrictedly, and so far I have planned it that those days are my social meet people to eat days. That has worked really well, but I have not found that I am having blowouts on those days. I still check the menu and look for a meal that is satisfying, but not a calorie fest. For instance I was out for dinner last night, and we both fancied desert, so I had a lemon sorbet, which was what I wanted, as I do particularly like it, but also because I knew it was the healthier choice. So, fasting has not turned me into an uncontrollable eating machine on the days that I eat freely.
I was looking at the Intermittent Fasting group - who fast 16:8, 14:10, 19:5 (fast 16, 14 or 9 hours, then eat in the next 8, 10 ot 5 hours). This made me curious about how long I was actually fasting, and over a couple of days it mostly goes like this:
Fast from 8.30pm (ish) to 12pm (15.5 hours)
Eat 12 to 13.00pm (1 hour)
Fast from 13.00pm to 7am (18 hours)
Eat from 7am to 8.30pm (13.5 hours)
which equates to an average per day of 17 hours fasting and 7 hours eating. On weekends, I would maybe eat later at night, but I would also break my fast later in the morning.
This way of eating really suits me, as the feeling of deprivation is my worst enemy. Nothing worse than going out to eat and eating something you deslike just becasue the calorie value is low. This way of eating gives me a lot more freedom that a traditional diet to attend and enjoy a range of social events, but when I add the four days calories together, the average per day is just under my calorie goal, which is exactly what I am aiming for - I am certainly not aiming for starvation! So I am much more likely to continue with this - in fact I see no reason not to continue it indefinitely, which should make maintenace, the thing I am hopeless at, easy.
Today for instance, a fast day, I have 25% of my maintenance level calories to use at lunch. That is 522 calories. I can eat the same lunch today - peppered mackrel salad - as I did yesterday. I really enjoyed it yesterday, so shall today as well. No feeling of deprivation there.
Added to that of course I am giving my body more chance to repair, which it cannot do when it is busy digesting, and I'm 48, starting to see friends suffer with illnesses I don't want. That is a huge big plus to me.
The only downsides are that I may miss on eating at some social events when they clash with a fasting period - though I can always switch days. And on my semi-fast days I will get occassional hunger pains. Those are tiny compared to the upsides.0 -
Results Update:
This was my second week fasting. I'm doing something a little different in that I don't eat all day Monday and break my fast with dinner on Tuesday -- which is probably 40ish hours fasting depending on when I ate last Sunday night. The first week I lost 1.8 lbs (which is normal for me) and the second week I lost 4.6 lbs which is way more than normal -- I haven't lost that much in one week since January when I first started.
Those two numbers are pretty extreme so I'm interested in seeing what next week brings. Summary:
Week 1 - 1.8 lbs
Average Calories - 1,192
(1774, 1347, 1199, 1288, 1953, 0, 787)
Average Calories Burned - 136
(0,127,0,0,127,421,281)
Week 2 - 4.6 lbs
Average Calories - 1,155
(1187,1396,1531,1432,1622,0,922)
Average Calories Burned - 160
(281,281,281,281,0,0,0)
Is anyone else still doing this or getting good results?0 -
I'm waiting to see how you do next week before trying. :bigsmile: I have to admit when I saw your number this week I was impressed but I think this would be really hard for me to do so I'm still on the fence. I would like to see more science on it too, I mean they said that to much protein would ruin the health benefits didn't they?Is anyone else still doing this or getting good results?0 -
Pu, thank you for translating!
OP - I'm glad things are going well for you. I couldn't imagine doing a 40hr fast! My little weenie 16hr fasts are working beautifully. I certainly haven't seen the weight loss results you have though. It's been 3-ish weeks of IF for me and I've lost 5lbs. This is after a 1 month stall and raising my cals to 1700 so I'm more than happy. My favorite thing so far is the freedom. I can enjoy a spur of the moment dinner without a day of prior planning to save the cals. I can eat a bunch of tiny things, 2 big meals or anything else I feel like at that moment. The morning and mid-day slumps have disappeared but I haven't been able to lift while fasted. I wonder if I wasn't in deficit if I'd be able to pull it off? I'll keep doing this as long as I can.
IF was a stall buster for me. Are you following the ADF method primarily for the health benefits? If you stall out with ADF would you go back to your old meal timing to break it?0 -
@theartichoke
You should be happy! You've had such amazing success in such a short time, congratulations.
@Pu
I'm obese, losing weight as fast as possible is in my best interests for my overall health. I do appreciate the concern but I eat :laugh: and I don't think there's anything wrong or unhealthy about my eating patterns or diet. But since my health is my primary concern, not weight loss in and of itself, I'm not worried about developing an eating disorder at this late date and I'm perfectly willing to make changes to my diet if anything I'm doing starts to be a problem.More isn't always better. I mean you want to meet the kings of fasting talk to people with ED's. Follow the directions.
@Stacy
Last weeks higher than normal weight loss could have just been a fluke so I wouldn't rush off to try it expecting to lose tons of weight but it was surprisingly easy for me to fast -- not hard at all. I thought I would be hungry all the time and obsessed with food but that just wasn't the case. I think that's because I cut the junk food out of my diet a long time ago and eat low carb now but maybe that doesn't have much to do with it? Not sure.
I'm waiting to see how you do next week before trying. :bigsmile: I have to admit when I saw your number this week I was impressed but I think this would be really hard for me to do so I'm still on the fence. I would like to see more science on it too, I mean they said that to much protein would ruin the health benefits didn't they?Is anyone else still doing this or getting good results?
If you're interested you can always try it and see how you respond -- if you don't respond well or you're preoccupied with food it's easy to stop fasting and eat your next meal like normal.
The protein does concern me because the reason why I'm fasting at all is for the health benefits. Someone said Michael Mosley said 60g of protein max on Twitter but I wonder if that was for his weight and lean body mass or a general recommendation for everyone?
I am looking into figuring out how much protein you actually need though for this to potentially -- none of this has been proven yet I know -- be effective for disease prevention. It's hard to figure out because you have all of these people guzzling protein shakes every time they move and swearing by it so that's what most of my searches are turning up. I can find articles telling you how to calculate your protein needs but I haven't been able to find the source for those recommendations. I've also found articles stating that if you're dieting you need more protein than normal to help maintain lean body mass but again I haven't found the source for that either.
So it might be that until I get down to the body fat percentage I want it actually would be more beneficial to keep my protein high, even if I'm fasting, and then drop it back down during maintenance? I'll probably start a thread about it and see if I can get some opinions and links from the usual suspects and see if that helps -- either way I'll make sure you see it or know what I find out.0 -
Cool. I'm interested but not in any hurry so waiting for more information is fine by me.I'll probably start a thread about it and see if I can get some opinions and links from the usual suspects and see if that helps -- either way I'll make sure you see it or know what I find out.0 -
kk, Will do. 0
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I too watched this program. It sounds great to me and the science behind it totally makes sense, its pretty exciting. I will be trying it soon but doing the alternate day fast, im just not sure yet what I should be eating for the one meal on the fast day......?
500 calories with 30g of protein, or thereabouts.
Here's some meals from a related study on alternate days at reduced calories
http://www.ajcn.org/content/90/5/1138/T1.expansion.html
...and it's all cool for pre/peri menopausal women as well? i hope so, because i love this idea!0 -
I'm starting the ADF today after watching the Horizon programme and doing some research of my own. My aims are to reduce my risk of heart disease and cancer and to lower my blood glucose.
I'll let you all know how I'm getting on next Monday 0 -
I have just finished 2 weeks of 3 restricted calorie days per week. I started it because i had to fast before a medical procoedure and then heard about the Horizon programme. as i had found it relatively easy to go 'cold Turkey' on clear fluids only for 36hrs it seemed a shame to waste it.
I eat between 5-600 cals on my restricted days and whatever I want (within reason) on my normal days. I am 60yrs old, Obese and have joint problems (inflammation), high blood pressure and sugar cravings!!
What have I found?, in two weeks...I have
6lbs weight loss
Reduced blood pressure by 10 points
Cut my sugar cravings by a ton
On normal days found that I am eating substantially less & much healthier choices.
I don't get 'hungry. anymore. even on restricted days
I'm not picking at food or grazing like i used to do.
I am sleeping better at night because I have less joint pain.
I have more energy and am walking, gardening etc more.
Will I continue with this experiment..you bet I will!!!0
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