Orthorexia Nervosa (obsessed with health foods)?
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I'm asking these questions because someone said something that completely knocked me off my confidence horse. Before my activity on the forums, I was a healthy, happy individual. But every day I'm on here, someone new is critiquing me saying that I'm unhealthy, disorderly, and overall a rotten person. I don't know what to believe any more...
OMG!!! Don't let STRANGERS get to you! Who gives a flying *kitten*? That said...if you put yourself out there SOMEONE is going to have something rude to say about it....you just have to ignore. IGNORE...seriously.
I had to close my Facebook account because I can't just Ignore. HSP's take everything personally because a person wouldn't say something that wasn't true right? My wife says I lack common sense. I think the real problem is I lack confidence and skepticism. But wouldn't the world be better if people who wear rose colored glasses like me didn't have to take the glasses off and see the world for what it seems to REALLY be?
I don't use Facebook either. People say stuff ALL THE TIME that isn't true. Rule of thumb...take everything that EVERYONE says with a grain of salt. You have to decide for yourself what works and what doesn't and ignore what people think. I'm similar and therapy has helped a lot.0 -
I'm asking these questions because someone said something that completely knocked me off my confidence horse. Before my activity on the forums, I was a healthy, happy individual. But every day I'm on here, someone new is critiquing me saying that I'm unhealthy, disorderly, and overall a rotten person. I don't know what to believe any more...
OMG!!! Don't let STRANGERS get to you! Who gives a flying *kitten*? That said...if you put yourself out there SOMEONE is going to have something rude to say about it....you just have to ignore. IGNORE...seriously.
Much more eloquent than my response! Ditto.0 -
Yes, it is a problem. It is an eating disorder just the same as anorexia, bulimia, BED, or EDNOS. It's not normal; it's an unhealthy obsession. Those with orthorexia eat only what they deem healthy and have no sense of moderation with 'junk' foods. They often cut entire food groups out of their diets. Many are also excessive exercisers. It's a mental disorder and should never be taken lightly. When food and exercise gets in the way of friends, family, and what YOU enjoy, then there's something wrong.
YES! This. You said it much better than I ever could have.
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I think you have to follow whatever is right for you. Short of actually harming yourself, why is it anyone else's business? And even then, it would be your immediate family's business.
I have gone veggie over the last few months. And if you'd told me at any time ever in my life that I would go veggie, I would have laughed.
But I became deathly ill with a gastrointestinal infection during a trip to Peru two years ago and continued to have a lot of GI problems after. I saw specialist after specialist as they ruled out all sorts of things and finally came up with a diagnosis of post-infectious motility disorder. I told them I'd tried everything under the sun diet-wise and they said a hallmark of PIMD is not being able to find a diet-related cure and to not bother trying - that I'd just drive myself crazy. They said it would take up to 5 years for my body to return to normal.
Anyway. Fast forward almost 2 years and it was making me so miserable that I spent 24/7 feeling awful.
I had got to a point where every time I put a piece of meat in my mouth I would instantly - and I do mean instantly - have heartburn, reflux, my chest seizing up tight, etc, so I thought, fine, I'm just going to cut out meat. Let's see if anything happens. One full day passed and when I went on my next morning's walk, I felt a little better, less like I was going to throw up. And the next day got even better, so on and so on, until I couldn't imagine why I would ever want to have another bite of meat if I could feel that good without it.
I'd forgotten what it felt like to feel normal, to be without pain, and I don't know if the intensity of your symptoms was anything like that, but if it was, I don't blame you at all for clinging to your restrictions so strictly. You have to do what works for you.0 -
Yes, it is a problem. It is an eating disorder just the same as anorexia, bulimia, BED, or EDNOS. It's not normal; it's an unhealthy obsession. Those with orthorexia eat only what they deem healthy and have no sense of moderation with 'junk' foods. They often cut entire food groups out of their diets. Many are also excessive exercisers. It's a mental disorder and should never be taken lightly. When food and exercise gets in the way of friends, family, and what YOU enjoy, then there's something wrong.
Well luckily I don't exercise so that means I'm good right?
But seriously though, I just cook at home meals for all 3 meals. We can't afford to eat out and I'd rather avoid fast food if I can. So I don't see myself as "obsessed" with eating healthy as much as I am maybe "obsessed" with learning what is healthy and what isn't. I mean, shouldn't every calorie count?0 -
I have ADHD as well, so I'm speaking from experience when I say that diet can't necessarily control everything. ADHD can be a crippling problem and while I understand that many parents don't want to medicate, medication is not necessarily a bad thing. Medication that helps is something to be sought out rather than avoided.I'm not sure what the original post was before editing, so I'm kind of reacting to gwenr for the context.
I saw that sort of behavior when I was a kid with my best friend's dad. The whole family was healthy, no issues with health or weight, but my friend's dad was very weird about food restriction. He would not allow fat or sugar in the house. We'd go to bake cookies (as 10-year old girls will do) and every container that was supposed to have sugar in it would be crammed with artificial sweetener packets. The fridge was stocked with fat-free products to replace oils, butter, cheese, etc. My friend would crave the stuff so bad that she'd grab mayonnaise packets off the salad bar at school and just eat the whole thing (not on a sandwich or something, mind you, just sucked it right out of the packet).
He did it in the interests of health (and was very thin as a result) and was a nice guy, but the behavior was certainly harmful in some ways (probably more than the ways in which it was beneficial).
I'm worried about my daughter being this way. She is a sugar hog and the reason I restrict her and my son is because they have ADHD symptoms as well. So rather than dope them up on Ritalin, I control their sugar. But the cravings are there and fruit just isn't enough to make her happy. On some days I give in. But I'm worried about them having gluten issues too. Since being on a restricted diet, both kids are performing in school very well; but is that my diet's fault or is it just maturity? Who knows... I wanna take credit, but like which diet to follow, one can never be for certain.
What sort of restricted diet do you have your kids on? You mentioned that you don't have insurance, but have you had a pediatrician give you the thumbs-up on it? Children's dietary needs are very different from adults' and restricting their diet without making sure it's a healthy option for them isn't a good idea. Don't think that they will do well on what you do well on. Definitely contact a health professional about the kids' dietary needs.0 -
I think you have to follow whatever is right for you. Short of actually harming yourself, why is it anyone else's business? And even then, it would be your immediate family's business.
I have gone veggie over the last few months. And if you'd told me at any time ever in my life that I would go veggie, I would have laughed.
But I became deathly ill with a gastrointestinal infection during a trip to Peru two years ago and continued to have a lot of GI problems after. I saw specialist after specialist as they ruled out all sorts of things and finally came up with a diagnosis of post-infectious motility disorder. I told them I'd tried everything under the sun diet-wise and they said a hallmark of PIMD is not being able to find a diet-related cure and to not bother trying - that I'd just drive myself crazy. They said it would take up to 5 years for my body to return to normal.
Anyway. Fast forward almost 2 years and it was making me so miserable that I spent 24/7 feeling awful.
I had got to a point where every time I put a piece of meat in my mouth I would instantly - and I do mean instantly - have heartburn, reflux, my chest seizing up tight, etc, so I thought, fine, I'm just going to cut out meat. Let's see if anything happens. One full day passed and when I went on my next morning's walk, I felt a little better, less like I was going to throw up. And the next day got even better, so on and so on, until I couldn't imagine why I would ever want to have another bite of meat if I could feel that good without it.
I'd forgotten what it felt like to feel normal, to be without pain, and I don't know if the intensity of your symptoms was anything like that, but if it was, I don't blame you at all for clinging to your restrictions so strictly. You have to do what works for you.
That's what Gluten does for me. After eating a meal with it, my stomach feels like pins and needles in it. I get bloated. I have acid reflux. My intestines feel inflamed. I can't think straight. I get double vision. If I had too much, I MUST throw it up or else the acid in my stomach makes me eat more to "cool it down". It's terrible!
And the thing is, I've been eating bread, buns, doughnuts, and the such my entire life! Coincidentally, I've had ADHD, anxiety, and a failure to thrive my whole life too.0 -
Yes it most definitely is a disorder. I am 90% sure I had this during my later years in high school, although my parents thought that I was anorexic. I was eating, just a very select few things. I only allowed myself low calorie, low fat vegetables and non-starchy fruits like apples and MAYBE an orange. I only drank water or soy milk (almond milk was not big yet). If I was forced to eat something, I would remove bread, scrape of sauces and JUST eat the vegetables. I even stopped eating cereal, and got to the point where I think I did become anorexic. But it definitely started out cutting out fatty starchy foods in a desperate attempt to lose weight.
How did this start? Teasing, which tore my already low self esteem to shreds. I thought becoming thin was the only way I could be happy with myself, my appearance, and the only way I would gain much desired attention from boys. Something just switched in my brain, and I became obsessed with researching which foods were the lowest in calories and fat. I verbally abused myself if I thought I had gone off track. I kept a food diary logging my calories with a daily limit of about 600 calories or so. (I now struggle to limit myself to 1400 calories, haha)
Ultimately, I think Orthorexia is a gateway to anorexia. Thank god I smartened up and am no longer in that state of mind. What a horrible place it was to be there.
Anyways! Carry on. My apologies for the wall of text. :flowerforyou:0 -
I have ADHD as well, so I'm speaking from experience when I say that diet can't necessarily control everything. ADHD can be a crippling problem and while I understand that many parents don't want to medicate, medication is not necessarily a bad thing. Medication that helps is something to be sought out rather than avoided.I'm not sure what the original post was before editing, so I'm kind of reacting to gwenr for the context.
I saw that sort of behavior when I was a kid with my best friend's dad. The whole family was healthy, no issues with health or weight, but my friend's dad was very weird about food restriction. He would not allow fat or sugar in the house. We'd go to bake cookies (as 10-year old girls will do) and every container that was supposed to have sugar in it would be crammed with artificial sweetener packets. The fridge was stocked with fat-free products to replace oils, butter, cheese, etc. My friend would crave the stuff so bad that she'd grab mayonnaise packets off the salad bar at school and just eat the whole thing (not on a sandwich or something, mind you, just sucked it right out of the packet).
He did it in the interests of health (and was very thin as a result) and was a nice guy, but the behavior was certainly harmful in some ways (probably more than the ways in which it was beneficial).
I'm worried about my daughter being this way. She is a sugar hog and the reason I restrict her and my son is because they have ADHD symptoms as well. So rather than dope them up on Ritalin, I control their sugar. But the cravings are there and fruit just isn't enough to make her happy. On some days I give in. But I'm worried about them having gluten issues too. Since being on a restricted diet, both kids are performing in school very well; but is that my diet's fault or is it just maturity? Who knows... I wanna take credit, but like which diet to follow, one can never be for certain.
What sort of restricted diet do you have your kids on? You mentioned that you don't have insurance, but have you had a pediatrician give you the thumbs-up on it? Children's dietary needs are very different from adults' and restricting their diet without making sure it's a healthy option for them isn't a good idea. Don't think that they will do well on what you do well on. Definitely contact a health professional about the kids' dietary needs.
Just no sugar and they eat the grains that I do (no wheat, rye, barley, or oats). They have lots of healthy fats, lots of fruits, veggies, and lean meats. I gave them cereal one morning for breakfast and had a note from the teacher the same day (ADHD moment from 6 year old).0 -
I restrict our 2 youngest's childrens sugar intake for good reason. We are a blended family and their other parents (1 girl whose father is the culprit and 1 boy whose mother is the culprit) simply DO NOT watch what they eat. They do what's easy for them when it comes to food and that means pizzas, fast foods, frozen dinners, donuts for breakfast, cookies for lunch and as much cake as can fit in their bowl simply because the parent had a sweet tooth craving and felt somewhat justified in eating out of control portions and the kids were too. Now, the girl understands why I mostly say NO, you cannot have any more sugar today. The boy, well, he's not my biological child and he thinks I'm restricting him to be mean. He also professes his love to me on the occassions I do allow him sugar. :huh:
Food has to be moderated or ALL things will be imbalanced. I know I over compensate by restricting sugar and I am ok with it. I am 1 person in these kids lives who sees the big picture and one day I will no longer be the Sugar Nazi.
Do what you are already doing if you are seeing positive results and positive changes in behavior.0 -
Yes it most definitely is a disorder. I am 90% sure I had this during my later years in high school, although my parents thought that I was anorexic. I was eating, just a very select few things. I only allowed myself low calorie, low fat vegetables and non-starchy fruits like apples and MAYBE an orange. I only drank water or soy milk (almond milk was not big yet). If I was forced to eat something, I would remove bread, scrape of sauces and JUST eat the vegetables. I even stopped eating cereal, and got to the point where I think I did become anorexic. But it definitely started out cutting out fatty starchy foods in a desperate attempt to lose weight.
How did this start? Teasing, which tore my already low self esteem to shreds. I thought becoming thin was the only way I could be happy with myself, my appearance, and the only way I would gain much desired attention from boys. Something just switched in my brain, and I became obsessed with researching which foods were the lowest in calories and fat. I verbally abused myself if I thought I had gone off track. I kept a food diary logging my calories with a daily limit of about 600 calories or so. (I now struggle to limit myself to 1400 calories, haha)
Ultimately, I think Orthorexia is a gateway to anorexia. Thank god I smartened up and am no longer in that state of mind. What a horrible place it was to be there.
Anyways! Carry on. My apologies for the wall of text. :flowerforyou:
You sound like a fellow HSP. But thank you for your input. Luckily I haven't hit the point of reducing my calories too low, I'm just having a hard time finding foods that are affordable and are variety enough for the palate of my families taste requirements (did that make sense or just gibberish?). Anyways, thank you again for your reply.0 -
i guess its an obsession of some kind, so no its not healthy because of the mental impact it has on you.... and that has a domino impact on a lot of aspects of life.0
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You sound like a fellow HSP. But thank you for your input. Luckily I haven't hit the point of reducing my calories too low, I'm just having a hard time finding foods that are affordable and are variety enough for the palate of my families taste requirements (did that make sense or just gibberish?). Anyways, thank you again for your reply.
I hear ya! Healthy foods can be expensive. BUT- I still am obsessed with healthy foods, just not to the point where it's damaging my health like it was before. Some of the cheapest foods I've been able to use on a regular basis are:
Dried beans and legumes (Mexican dishes FTW!... And hummus, nom)
Oats
Go to Costco and get a giant bag of Quinoa
Canned tomatoes
Fresh vegetables (small grocers sell these items for CHEAP)
Tofu
I am Vegan, but if you aren't eggs and cottage cheese tend to be cheap as well.
You can seriously cook almost everything with what I have stated above as the base.
Go to the grocery store with several meals that you plan to make in bulk, and then buy only those items.
Breakfast for me is usually just oatmeal (canned pumpkin with spices and honey is delicious and cheap as well).
Perhaps if different tastes are the issue, ask everyone to write down what they would prefer having for dinner etc. If you can't compromise, try giving everyone 'turns' with their favorite meals. One week you can do chilli, the next week do a big curry etc.
Just what I have gathered from my own experience, anyways! Good luck to you!0 -
You sound like a fellow HSP. But thank you for your input. Luckily I haven't hit the point of reducing my calories too low, I'm just having a hard time finding foods that are affordable and are variety enough for the palate of my families taste requirements (did that make sense or just gibberish?). Anyways, thank you again for your reply.
I hear ya! Healthy foods can be expensive. BUT- I still am obsessed with healthy foods, just not to the point where it's damaging my health like it was before. Some of the cheapest foods I've been able to use on a regular basis are:
Dried beans and legumes (Mexican dishes FTW!... And hummus, nom)
Oats
Go to Costco and get a giant bag of Quinoa
Canned tomatoes
Fresh vegetables (small grocers sell these items for CHEAP)
Tofu
I am Vegan, but if you aren't eggs and cottage cheese tend to be cheap as well.
You can seriously cook almost everything with what I have stated above as the base.
Go to the grocery store with several meals that you plan to make in bulk, and then buy only those items.
Breakfast for me is usually just oatmeal (canned pumpkin with spices and honey is delicious and cheap as well).
Perhaps if different tastes are the issue, ask everyone to write down what they would prefer having for dinner etc. If you can't compromise, try giving everyone 'turns' with their favorite meals. One week you can do chilli, the next week do a big curry etc.
Just what I have gathered from my own experience, anyways! Good luck to you!
I wonder if I can make lentils taste like chocolate for my 6 year old lol0 -
MTV actually did a documentary on Othorexia Nervosa, where they took two females and one male and filmed their eating habits.
One was a raw foodist vegan who could not eat raw nuts or seeds locally, she had to have them all shipped from somewhere outside of the US. She purposefully distanced and separated her food from other food from fear of "contamination". she obsessed about her next meal, and planned vigorously when people came to her home to eat. She was discriminating against her husbands eating habits and was influencing her son. She wasn't afraid of calories or fat, she was afraid of the kind of food going into her body.
To me, yes, this is disordered eating. Just because she wasn't concerned with calories or weight loss didn't mean her actions and thought patterns weren't disordered...
This is an extreme example, but after I saw it, I believe that disorders range a very wide, and sometimes vague definition/description.
Here's a link to the episode I'm talking about if you're interested since this disorder is fairly "new":
http://www.mtv.com/videos/true-life-i-have-orthorexia/1683486/playlist.jhtml0 -
I'm asking these questions because someone said something that completely knocked me off my confidence horse. Before my activity on the forums, I was a healthy, happy individual. But every day I'm on here, someone new is critiquing me saying that I'm unhealthy, disorderly, and overall a rotten person. I don't know what to believe any more...
OMG!!! Don't let STRANGERS get to you! Who gives a flying *kitten*? That said...if you put yourself out there SOMEONE is going to have something rude to say about it....you just have to ignore. IGNORE...seriously.
^^ THIS, seriously! If you are not totally obsessing over it to the point that it interferes with your daily life, then it's simply conscientious eating.0 -
I would say it probably is a disorder. But then it depends on the extent of the 'obsession'. I mean about 90% of people on MFP strive to be as healthy as possible, just as many strive to reduce calories to lose weight. To one point the latter is to lose weight in an acceptable fashion, to an extreme it is anorexia nervosa, the same could be argued with orthorexia nervosa, only when it is to an extreme does it become a problem.
I remember seeing an episode of supersize v superskinny where the 'superskinny' was horribly underweight and would not take the doctors advice. She was eating 'healthily' but in such a restrictive fashion that she was missing out on key nutrients.
I think one of the problems that could make orthorexia dangerous is that different advice comes out every week; eggs are good, then they're bad, red meat is good, then it's bad, beansprouts are good, then they're bad etc etc. Someone reading conflicting arguements may think that they don't want to risk it and cut out a lot of nutritious foods that may once have had a bad rep, and therefore may miss out key nutrients, vitamins etc.
well, thats what I think anyway.0 -
People with an obsessive disorder (which is not the same as dedication, despite what some MFPers seem to think!) may apply that obsession to any area of their lives. If the area they focus on happens to be health, then they will get what is called 'orthorexia nervosa'. If someone isn't naturally obsessive, they are unlikely to get this. Personally, I don't see it as a disorder in itself, but a specific application of a wider disorder.
It's important to be aware that there is a difference between dedication and obsession, and obsession is not healthy - even if it's an obsession with health!0 -
Also, part of ADHD is hyperfocus (see here: http://www.additudemag.com/adhd/article/612.html), which means focusing on one thing intently for a long time and having difficulty switching to something else. This is also true of autism - I'm on the autism spectrum, and I know for myself I have to be very careful not to become hyperfocused on health. I've done this a few years ago, and it wasn't healthy.
Also, hypersensitivity, which you say you have, is part of both ADHD and autism, and happens because the brain lacks the ability to automatically filter out the unnecessary and so you don't automatically prioritise what is important and what is not. So every little detail can become important. It's important to take a step back and look at the broader picture, or you will obsess about every little possible unhealthy aspect of your food. This is really not a healthy state of mind to be in - it's exhausting and draining and keeps you constantly worried and tense.0 -
If you're talking about the Gluten. I was diagnosed with ADHD, GERD, and before I lost my insurance I was tested for Rheumatoid Arthritis and they said it was non-conclusive (early stages or was Fibromyalgia). Anyways, I did research and people have had success on a GF diet and it helped reverse ADHD, GERD, and Fibromyalgia issues; so since I have no health insurance, I gave it a try since it's cheaper than seeing the doctor and getting a Celiac test. Turns out, it was a step in the right direction. But now that limits a great deal of foods for me because of this Gluten intolerance potential. And I do notice my ADHD, GERD, and Fib symptoms come back when I have something that is contaminated with Gluten, it only makes my concerns more valid.
Some people have so much faith in the health care system that they think I am being Orthorexia about my restriction; but I feel that since it's working, I should follow it and just find other ways to get those nutrients. But not everyone can agree with me and we live in a world where NO ONE keeps their opinions to themselves... And since I take everyone's opinions personally (even strangers) it's hard to get back up when you don't have the support of your peers...
Plenty of people eliminate foods that aren't healthy, and that doesn't mean they're obsessed. There is nothing particularly nutritious about grains. If you have found that being gluten free helps your health issues, then stick with it. Whether it was the gluten or other additives that exacerbated your ADHD, by eating less processed foods you reap the benefits, along with way less sugar and sodium. Fibromyalgia is also often improved after eliminating gluten because it relates to inflammation and auto-immune issues, both fueled by gluten intolerance in many people. And, even if you never noticed intolerance before, most people find that when they eliminate gluten, they definitely have gut issues when they eat it again. I eliminated it by choice and very clearly pay for my "treats" the next day. That make the list of things I'm willing to treat for smaller and smaller. That doesnt mean I'm obsessed if I go to a restaurant and order very carefully. It means I'm deciding if a dish is worth diarrhea and cramps the next day. Usually not.
Maybe you need to make some friendly GF-friendly pals. I think there a few GF groups on here, and the Paleo/Primal crowd will support you.0
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