All you heavy lifters out there, can you help!!??

lisamarie2181

Hi everyone!

I have high testosterone levels due to PCOS, and I keep finding conflicting evidence on whether it is bad for women with PCOS to lift heavy because of bulking. I don't think this is true, but I just started lifting about two weeks ago and just want to make sure I am not doing anything I shouldn't. Even ladies that have high testosterone levels without the PCOS, do you feel you have bulked at all? I really don't think it is true, but would be good to hear it from you wonderful people on here.

Also have heard because of the higher testosterone levels, that I will probably gain muscle quicker then a women with a normal level, is this true too or just myth?


I know there are alot of heavy lifters out there, would love your opinions and advice.

wellbert

Just out of curiosity, what is your testosterone level?

lisamarie2181

I am not exactly sure of the number but my doctor called me on this result only and said my testosterone levels are high, if i call back could they give me number? Wasnt sure how that test result is shown

wellbert

Yeah, get the exact number. I'm guessing ithe answer to your concern is "no"

bcf7683

If you do end up getting a number, you could always ask you doctor for their advice. Or talk to a nutritionist/trainer. That's a unique issue to have, so if I were you I'd rather talk to someone who's knowledgeable about it

JustJennie1

I am not exactly sure of the number but my doctor called me on this result only and said my testosterone levels are high, if i call back could they give me number? Wasnt sure how that test result is shown

Not only should you get the number but you should get a copy of your test results. A doctor who calls up and says "They're high" without telling you what the level is and what it should be is bull.

What did he/she recommend you do about it?

JNick77

I am not exactly sure of the number but my doctor called me on this result only and said my testosterone levels are high, if i call back could they give me number? Wasnt sure how that test result is shown

Not only should you get the number but you should get a copy of your test results. A doctor who calls up and says "They're high" without telling you what the level is and what it should be is bull.

What did he/she recommend you do about it?

As an HRT patient, always get a copy of your blood panel.

Either way, why would this prevent you from working out? Remember that to bulk or get massive there's really 3-components for women and they all have to be in-line, Diet in the form of grossly excessive calories, Testosterone level, strength training regimine. I would think that as long as you eat at a deficit or maintenance you should expect to add any substantial mass. On the positive, you should be able to drop bodyfat while maintaining LBM better than most women then. Or am I totally misunderstanding your situation?

Edit: Regarding stength training regimine's: Maximal effort lifting is more likely to build strength and improve neurological adaptation to the training stimulus than support hypertrophy. With the right diet and T level you could easily put on mass with such a program but higher-rep training is usually associated with mass/bulking-up.

lisamarie2181

They said there isnt much they can do but put me on a medication, and i dont want that. Ive heard cutting back on dairy can help but not sure of the validity. I was hoping that with losing weight and exercising would help to lower the level but maybe it just takes more? Normal gynos ive been to never seem to know what to do w pcos, think they would by now, all they ever tell me is to lower the carbs, never anything about exercise i just wasnt sure if other women have issues w lifting heavy having high levels, so people say yes others no, and i cant seem to find real evidence of the truth, just what other people have said in their experience and most of the time they arent heavy lifters so i feel they are just guessing lol

cloe31

I have pcos and lift weights and find I gain muscle fast but I think that is just genetics. I weigh 195lbs, 5'8 and I look like I weigh 30lbs lighter then I am.

JNick77

They said there isnt much they can do but put me on a medication, and i dont want that. Ive heard cutting back on dairy can help but not sure of the validity. I was hoping that with losing weight and exercising would help to lower the level but maybe it just takes more? Normal gynos ive been to never seem to know what to do w pcos, think they would by now, all they ever tell me is to lower the carbs, never anything about exercise i just wasnt sure if other women have issues w lifting heavy having high levels, so people say yes others no, and i cant seem to find real evidence of the truth, just what other people have said in their experience and most of the time they arent heavy lifters so i feel they are just guessing lol

Make sure you see my post about the 3 components of gaining mass for a woman. Definitely check your T-Level, I'd love to know what "high" is for a woman. I know what low, average, high, and excessive, is for men so I wonder where I high woman falls.

ToughTulip

<--- I have been lifting for 4 years
I recently did a 4 month bulk cycle and ate 3000 calories a day while lifting
Do I look bulky?

miranda_mom

Hey everyone, I have the same question. I am glad to hear that some have had success lifting.

To clarify, the issue is that women with PCOS tend to have high testosterone It's one of the symptoms of the illness. My concern is that lifting will cause me to produce even more, which will throw my hormones out of whack even more than they are naturally. The last time my doctor did my bloodwork, he did not even do testosterone because the imbalance is evident in other ways, including the other symptoms. I don't think you really need to know the number so much that it is affecting your body negatively.

MellyGibson

I am on HRT, I have always had higher levels of testosterone, and I lift weights - heavier every time! Yes, I do gain muscle faster, and yes, they tend to be quite noticable. I do not look "bulky" or like She-Ra or the Lady Hulk or anything (I'm neither blonde nor have green skin). Does my muscle size bother me? HELL, NO! I look strong, and who doesn't want to look strong and healthy?

I have cut out dairy from my diet due to lactose issue.

GET THAT BLOOD PANEL! YOU pay THEM for their services, make them earn it!

Besides that, you really should know....just 'cause it's your body.

PM me if you have any questions.

myfitnessval

from my understanding you might a little bit but nothing out of a body building horror movie lol. just keep your diet at a defecit and you'll never be able to gain ungodly amounts of muscle mass. look at jillian michaels. she suffers from pcos too. id kill for her body!

lisamarie2181

I am not exactly sure of the number but my doctor called me on this result only and said my testosterone levels are high, if i call back could they give me number? Wasnt sure how that test result is shown

Not only should you get the number but you should get a copy of your test results. A doctor who calls up and says "They're high" without telling you what the level is and what it should be is bull.

What did he/she recommend you do about it?

As an HRT patient, always get a copy of your blood panel.

Either way, why would this prevent you from working out? Remember that to bulk or get massive there's really 3-components for women and they all have to be in-line, Diet in the form of grossly excessive calories, Testosterone level, strength training regimine. I would think that as long as you eat at a deficit or maintenance you should expect to add any substantial mass. On the positive, you should be able to drop bodyfat while maintaining LBM better than most women then. Or am I totally misunderstanding your situation?

Edit: Regarding stength training regimine's: Maximal effort lifting is more likely to build strength and improve neurological adaptation to the training stimulus than support hypertrophy. With the right diet and T level you could easily put on mass with such a program but higher-rep training is usually associated with mass/bulking-up.

It is definitely not hindering me from working out, but some places on the web say if you have PCOS and high levels you should do cardio and not lifting heavy, and I just don't want to believe that lol I see all the wonderful progress and success everyone has on here with lifting heavy, I just haven't seen any real proof one way or the other, so wasn't sure what to think. I just started a strength training routine two weeks ago, so not really long enough to see for myself. I just want to make sure I that what I am doing is okay. I know PCOS can be tricky because alot of people don't know much about it, but I would think that there are other women that have high testosterone without having PCOS.

erickirb

Even with higher levels of T you will still need a caloric surplus to add any noticeable "bulk" effect of lifting, and even then it takes years to get "bulky".

lisamarie2181

I have pcos and lift weights and find I gain muscle fast but I think that is just genetics. I weigh 195lbs, 5'8 and I look like I weigh 30lbs lighter then I am.

This I agree with, even if it hasn't been proven to me lol I have a low BF% and high LBM for my weight and structure and my trainer said the same to me that because of elevated levels I may gain muscle a bit faster. This I can definitely live with Cloe!! lol

lisamarie2181

I am on HRT, I have always had higher levels of testosterone, and I lift weights - heavier every time! Yes, I do gain muscle faster, and yes, they tend to be quite noticable. I do not look "bulky" or like She-Ra or the Lady Hulk or anything (I'm neither blonde nor have green skin). Does my muscle size bother me? HELL, NO! I look strong, and who doesn't want to look strong and healthy?

I have cut out dairy from my diet due to lactose issue.

GET THAT BLOOD PANEL! YOU pay THEM for their services, make them earn it!

Besides that, you really should know....just 'cause it's your body.

PM me if you have any questions.

Thank you! I definitely do not mind having defined muscles for sure! That is what I want, I don't want to get to goal and be skinny, i want to look healthy, just not body builder style.

I did call to request a copy of my labs, hopefully they get back to me soon!!

lisamarie2181

Even with higher levels of T you will still need a caloric surplus to add any noticeable "bulk" effect of lifting, and even then it takes years to get "bulky".

That makes me feel better! I definitely stay at a deficit with still a bit to lose, so I am no where near maintenance. When I lift light I just feel like I don't get the same workout, I feel like I REALLY got a good workout when I lift heavier!

JNick77

Even with higher levels of T you will still need a caloric surplus to add any noticeable "bulk" effect of lifting, and even then it takes years to get "bulky".

That makes me feel better! I definitely stay at a deficit with still a bit to lose, so I am no where near maintenance. When I lift light I just feel like I don't get the same workout, I feel like I REALLY got a good workout when I lift heavier!

If the only negative to your condition is increased T then you have a big advantage over most women when it comes to fitness. Aside from the strength aspect, your cardio should improve even more because blood-oxygen level should be better due to testosterone increases red blood cell volume. That's why men taking large doses of steroids or even male HRT patients often have to donate blood or get therapeutic blood draws to reduce their hemoglobin level.

lisamarie2181

Hey everyone, I have the same question. I am glad to hear that some have had success lifting.

To clarify, the issue is that women with PCOS tend to have high testosterone It's one of the symptoms of the illness. My concern is that lifting will cause me to produce even more, which will throw my hormones out of whack even more than they are naturally. The last time my doctor did my bloodwork, he did not even do testosterone because the imbalance is evident in other ways, including the other symptoms. I don't think you really need to know the number so much that it is affecting your body negatively.

Can any of you answer this? Can it raise your already high levels? Which would throw our imbalance even more out of whack! Thanks Miranda, didn't think of this!! lol

lisamarie2181

Even with higher levels of T you will still need a caloric surplus to add any noticeable "bulk" effect of lifting, and even then it takes years to get "bulky".

That makes me feel better! I definitely stay at a deficit with still a bit to lose, so I am no where near maintenance. When I lift light I just feel like I don't get the same workout, I feel like I REALLY got a good workout when I lift heavier!

If the only negative to your condition is increased T then you have a big advantage over most women when it comes to fitness. Aside from the strength aspect, your cardio should improve even more because blood-oxygen level should be better due to testosterone increases red blood cell volume. That's why men taking large doses of steroids or even male HRT patients often have to donate blood or get therapeutic blood draws to reduce their hemoglobin level.

It definitely isn't the only negative, but for me my case isn't as severe as other women. Since I have cleaned up my diet and eat very nutrient dense, I have gotten alot of my PCOS symptoms to subside, but not all. There is obviously a bad side to the T because it can cause male pattern hair growth for some, and in my case I have a big fear will cause a problem with fertility because my T level is higher then my female hormones. And as Miranda said, not sure if this level can go even higher with adding muscle (which I hope is not true), I would have thought the leaner and fitter you got it would go back closer to normal, but could be completely mistaken?

wellbert

How about soy?

Soy causes a drop in testosterone and a rise in estrogen. You should talk to your doctor about that.

Soy is not universally considered healthy, and I have no idea if it's an avoid food with PCOS.

Lifting heavy stuff CAN contribute to higher T too.

JNick77

It definitely isn't the only negative, but for me my case isn't as severe as other women. Since I have cleaned up my diet and eat very nutrient dense, I have gotten alot of my PCOS symptoms to subside, but not all. There is obviously a bad side to the T because it can cause male pattern hair growth for some, and in my case I have a big fear will cause a problem with fertility because my T level is higher then my female hormones. And as Miranda said, not sure if this level can go even higher with adding muscle (which I hope is not true), I would have thought the leaner and fitter you got it would go back closer to normal, but could be completely mistaken?

You're right and I apologize because as I re-read my post that is a little insensitive of your condition, it wasn't intended to be rude. Within the confines of training (diabetes, blood pressure, etc aside) it's probably not a bad thing. Here's one thing I found,
"Assays of testosterone are important in the diagnosis and management of a number of clinical conditions in females including precocious puberty, androgen-secreting tumors, and polycystic ovary syndrome (PCOS) (1). There are several limitations to their use, and there is currently no standardized assay in the United States. Moreover, most testosterone assays have poor sensitivity and accuracy in the female ranges (normal range, 20–60 ng/dl), which, even when elevated in conditions such as PCOS, tend to be well below normal male ranges (300–1000 ng/dl) "

How about soy? Soy causes a drop in testosterone and a rise in estrogen. You should talk to your doctor about that

Does Soy have that substantial of an impact on T? Just curious.

lisamarie2181

How about soy?

Soy causes a drop in testosterone and a rise in estrogen. You should talk to your doctor about that.

Soy is not universally considered healthy, and I have no idea if it's an avoid food with PCOS.

Lifting heavy stuff CAN contribute to higher T too.

Yeah I was doing herbalife and my dr told me to stop because I don't know where the soy is coming from and like you said not considered healthy unless I know exactly the source.

So if I don't do anything to try and lower the level and I build muscle it can get worse? Just want to make sure I understood that correctly

FirefitMike

EDIT: Don't know what PCOS is.

wellbert

How about soy? Soy causes a drop in testosterone and a rise in estrogen. You should talk to your doctor about that

Does Soy have that substantial of an impact on T? Just curious.
[/quote]

Studies suggest so. Moreso in women than men.

lisamarie2181

Ok just got my results from the nurse, too busy to send the actual document right now so got the numbers at least.

Normal range for T in women 2-45 Mine is 67

Free Testosterone (not sure what this means)

Normal range 0.1-6.4 Mine is 6.7

Do you guys know what this means? lol I am gonna google to see if I can find out

JNick77

How about soy?

Soy causes a drop in testosterone and a rise in estrogen. You should talk to your doctor about that.

Soy is not universally considered healthy, and I have no idea if it's an avoid food with PCOS.

Lifting heavy stuff CAN contribute to higher T too.

So if I don't do anything to try and lower the level and I build muscle it can get worse? Just want to make sure I understood that correctly

I would say no, it's not that significant. Ideally, talk to your doctor and ask. Also let him know that you talked with a couple women (here on MPF above) that have PCOS lift weights and are doing fine. Either that or just go try it and see how you feel.

wellbert

Ok just got my results from the nurse, too busy to send the actual document right now so got the numbers at least.

Normal range for T in women 2-45 Mine is 67

Free Testosterone (not sure what this means)

Normal range 0.1-6.4 Mine is 6.7

Do you guys know what this means? lol I am gonna google to see if I can find out

For reference, low for a man is under 200.
I'm at 400, can't build muscle for ****
Guys that bulk easy are often over 600.

lisamarie2181

Ok so from the sounds of it don't have to worry about the bulking, but I do need to worry about the levels possibly going up with lifting, do I have that right?